Financial Aid/Planning when attending a Non-funded Program

[deleted176373]

I'll make a slight correction to this one. The Army guarantees (requires) the post doc fellowship year at the same MTF where you did your internship. This is a new policy this year. You MUST stay on until you accumulate the required hours to sit for the EPPP before you are considered fully trained and deployable. Also new, as part of the same policy change is that you do not start you payback until you are licensed. This is because the Army USED to let people finish their PhD, and then go out into the "real Army" (A MEDCEN is not the real Army) while trying to get the hours and pass the test. They also started their payback at this time, which created a situation where there was a bunch of un-licensed psychologists who were just biting their time until they could get out, and get licensed where/when/ and how they want to. They were out in situations where they were the only psychologist for 100's of miles with no supervision and could never complete the hours even if they wanted to. The Army got wise to it, and said "no more." I do not think the Navy or the Air Force have implemented this, but be sure--they probably will.

You are correct. I did not hear that a post-doc was required however we were briefed on the rest of the policy changes while at USUHS a few months ago. Navy traditionally has not had the problems with this that the Army has, BUT they still are considering changing the policy and it's equally likely that the USAF may as well.

Yes, the army got tired of having "non-deployable" psychological assets, which is what led to this policy shift.

Mark

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[codetype4/9]

I imagine there is a push then for interns to get licensed in states with less stringent requirements such as WA.

 

[73BARMYPgsp]

I imagine there is a push then for interns to get licensed in states with less stringent requirements such as WA.

That is acutally a very astute comment, but it remains to be seen. Good eye there.

 

[deleted176373]

I imagine there is a push then for interns to get licensed in states with less stringent requirements such as WA.

Yep, LA is a popular one too. There is no reason though that you cannot get the hours you need to get licensed in most states. I think the move was made to get rid of the dead weight who thought they could get over on the system.

They might suggest the easier states, but from the discussion I was privy too, it was a matter of people who were intentionally not getting licensed to avoid deployment and not a matter of allowing interns to select more stringent states.

Mark

 

[biogirl215]

Does military psych. have any physical requirements for acceptance?

 

[deleted176373]

Does military psych. have any physical requirements for acceptance?

Yes, you have to be qualified as fit for full duty. In other words, even something like High Cholesterol or Lasik Surgery can be disqualifying (waivers are often available.) Some medical conditions are not waiverable, heart conditions, certain eye issues, hearing problems and so forth.

One person who had gotten accepted to my program lost that acceptance because they tore their ACL playing sports prior to actually commissioning in the Navy. So unless that is repaired to the satisfaction of the Navy this person would not be able to serve.

Mark

 

[biogirl215]

Yes, you have to be qualified as fit for full duty. In other words, even something like High Cholesterol or Lasik Surgery can be disqualifying (waivers are often available.) Some medical conditions are not waiverable, heart conditions, certain eye issues, hearing problems and so forth.

One person who had gotten accepted to my program lost that acceptance because they tore their ACL playing sports prior to actually commissioning in the Navy. So unless that is repaired to the satisfaction of the Navy this person would not be able to serve.

Mark

Thanks for the response. Guess that's one more non-option for me.

 

[paramour]

Yes, you have to be qualified as fit for full duty. In other words, even something like High Cholesterol or Lasik Surgery can be disqualifying (waivers are often available.) Some medical conditions are not waiverable, heart conditions, certain eye issues, hearing problems and so forth.

One person who had gotten accepted to my program lost that acceptance because they tore their ACL playing sports prior to actually commissioning in the Navy. So unless that is repaired to the satisfaction of the Navy this person would not be able to serve.

Mark

On the other hand, if they want you desperately enough, then they may be more willing to waive certain conditions that usually disqualify individuals (says a person who received a # of waivers for "unfavorable" things once upon a time). This will, of course, vary by the condition, the severity of said circumstance, and the individuals & branch with which you are dealing.

 

[biogirl215]

On the other hand, if they want you desperately enough, then they may be more willing to waive certain conditions that usually disqualify individuals (says a person who received a # of waivers for "unfavorable" things once upon a time). This will, of course, vary by the condition, the severity of said circumstance, and the individuals & branch with which you are dealing.

I doubt they would include massive neuromuscular brain damage in there, though. Good info for others, though--thanks for posting!

 

[paramour]

I doubt they would include massive neuromuscular brain damage in there, though. Good info for others, though--thanks for posting!

Probably not--but I wasn't really directing my post at any one particular individual.

I know many others who don't consider the military as an option because they assume they won't qualify for whatever reason. Although there are definitely certain things that will likely rule all people out, others are sometimes "negotiable" and people should talk to the powers that be if they are truly interested.

 

[deleted176373]

I doubt they would include massive neuromuscular brain damage in there, though. Good info for others, though--thanks for posting!

Yes, but something to remember is that other programs exist. Indian reservations (I talked to someone who was happy with this option), VA hospitals, and other public opportunities exist that may give preference to those who qualify under the ADA as disabled.

Mark

 

[biogirl215]

Yes, but something to remember is that other programs exist. Indian reservations (I talked to someone who was happy with this option), VA hospitals, and other public opportunities exist that may give preference to those who qualify under the ADA as disabled.

Mark

Yeah, I've looked into the IHS before, as that's the area/population I hope to one day work with. The money for behavioral health seems somewhat limited, but it looks like it could be a great opprotunity if the stars align, so to speak.

 

[vcpsych]

I feel like I'm in a similar situation. I'm not married, nor do I have crazy loans to pay at this point in my life, but like sarahkristy, I'm struggling with this lack of graduate funding issue. Here's my story: I have only one Clinical PhD offer to a school that I really do like, but zero funding. I also have the possibility of doing a Master's program this fall, working as an RA at a nearby hospital for two years, and re-applying to grad school then with the hope of gaining admittance to a funded program. I do realize I'd be a paying pretty penny for the MA, but at least it would get me started, and it would overall be less than if I had to pay for 5 years in a doctoral program. I'm 22, so realistically it's not the end of the world if I have to put off the PhD, but I am also a huge overachiever and just want to get started!

The thought of being in such huge debt from this doctoral program when so many people *do* receive some sort of funding (whether it be partial/full tuition remission, a stipend, or assistantship) is daunting at the very least. I find all of this information about the military very interesting, but it feels extreme to me. I also think that these loan repayment/forgiveness programs are pretty sweet, but the thought of not being eligible until *after* I've accrued a million dollars of debt is scary. Is it possible that if I just devote a lot of time to applying to fellowships, I could find some way to fund at least some of our graduate education? Has anyone secured funding outside of their university?

Is it dumb to take a nonfunded PhD offer when it's your only one? I really really want this and am reluctant to say that maybe this just isn't the right overall package for me. Part of me thinks that maybe even if the program is a good fit, sometimes it comes down to money. Any feedback would be helpful, as I am way past the point of rational thinking.

 

[amy203]

I feel like I'm in a similar situation. I'm not married, nor do I have crazy loans to pay at this point in my life, but like sarahkristy, I'm struggling with this lack of graduate funding issue. Here's my story: I have only one Clinical PhD offer to a school that I really do like, but zero funding. I also have the possibility of doing a Master's program this fall, working as an RA at a nearby hospital for two years, and re-applying to grad school then with the hope of gaining admittance to a funded program. I do realize I'd be a paying pretty penny for the MA, but at least it would get me started, and it would overall be less than if I had to pay for 5 years in a doctoral program. I'm 22, so realistically it's not the end of the world if I have to put off the PhD, but I am also a huge overachiever and just want to get started!

The thought of being in such huge debt from this doctoral program when so many people *do* receive some sort of funding (whether it be partial/full tuition remission, a stipend, or assistantship) is daunting at the very least. I find all of this information about the military very interesting, but it feels extreme to me. I also think that these loan repayment/forgiveness programs are pretty sweet, but the thought of not being eligible until *after* I've accrued a million dollars of debt is scary. Is it possible that if I just devote a lot of time to applying to fellowships, I could find some way to fund at least some of our graduate education? Has anyone secured funding outside of their university?

Is it dumb to take a nonfunded PhD offer when it's your only one? I really really want this and am reluctant to say that maybe this just isn't the right overall package for me. Part of me thinks that maybe even if the program is a good fit, sometimes it comes down to money. Any feedback would be helpful, as I am way past the point of rational thinking.

You know, I think this is really an issue that you need to discuss with an "adult" who knows you well. Debt is just such a personal thing - some people deal with it better than others. "Time off" is also a personal thing. I know I was told that the extra year I took to improve my application would feel like nothing in the long run, but you may need to hear that from someone you trust.

Talk with your parents, a teacher, or a friend, preferably someone over the age of, say, 45. Explain the situation, making sure to tell them that psyc programs are NOT like law or med school: there are plenty of funded programs out there and you will likely have a much harder time paying off your loans once you graduate. But also tell them what you just wrote. See what they say.