Financial situation

[RAlec114]

Hello I'm a new member and I'm probably doing a ton of things wrong. There are so many things I don't know about the process of becoming a dentist, so I'll probably come off as really naive or stupid. But that's exactly why I'm here, so I can get a better grasp on things .

This first thing I want to know more about is the financial aspect of becoming a dentist...

I'm wondering. My family has 80k saved up for me for college. I am interested in Penn's 7year program for highschoolers, specifically the 3 years Penn CAS --> 4 years Penn dental.

Student loans will pile up like crazy... Idk how much scholarship I'll get but I'll probably have loans of like 400k - 500k (not considering the interest). Is this normal? Would going through with this be really stupid? Are there ways to avoid it? Please tell me about this process...

Also, how much money does it take to buy your own practice?

Thanks...

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[RAlec114]

bump......

 

[teh dentist]

Do you want to become a dentist?

If so, how could investing 350k in the process be a waste or stupid?

 

[RAlec114]

Do you want to become a dentist?

If so, how could investing 350k in the process be a waste or stupid?

Yes I do want to become a dentist of some sort.

I really don't know much about economics, but I don't want to have to pay off debt that is constantly compounding from interest after I'm like 40 years old...

 

[somethinpositiv]

My family has 80k saved up for me for college.

Are you from Pennsylvania? 80K will probably pay all your expenses at Penn State. And 90% of American's don't know the difference between Penn and Penn State lol, and it hardly matters where you go to undergrad anyways after you finish dental school. Then if your grades/DAT are good, you can get a $100K Dean's Scholarship from Penn Dental. Your total debt would be about $250K, vs $450K if you do 7 year program at Penn. 1 extra year of undergrad is worth $200K less in debt, in my opinion.

 

[xhamburgersamx]

Are you from Pennsylvania? 80K will probably pay all your expenses at Penn State. And 90% of American's don't know the difference between Penn and Penn State lol, and it hardly matters where you go to undergrad anyways after you finish dental school. Then if your grades/DAT are good, you can get a $100K Dean's Scholarship from Penn Dental. Your total debt would be about $250K, vs $450K if you do 7 year program at Penn. 1 extra year of undergrad is worth $200K less in debt, in my opinion.

It depends on a number of factors. First it sounds like he's going to UPENN for undergrad for 3 years and then UPENN dental school for 4 years.

Looking at Penn's website for undergraduate tuition + cost of living for 3 years. This is assuming no increases in tuition which obviously will occur.
Year 1 : $55,250
Year 2 : $55,250
Year 3 : $55,250
Total: $165,750

UPENN's Dental School for 4 years.

$86,724​

$87,367​

$89,925​

$87,122​

Total : $355,138

Total for undergrad and dental (7 year program): $516,888 + interest

Well, in undergrad you can get a combination of grants and help from your parents to pay for everything so basically the only debt you were have is from dental school. You might be able to get a scholarship but why limit yourself to upenn dental school when their sim lab is in a dungeon and a lot of their students are forced into GPRs and AEGDs? There are a lot of better and cheaper schools out there. The 1 year sooner you graduate does save you $55k from tuition and a 6 figure salary when you graduate.

So the breakdown is that you'll probably benefit from the 7 year program if it's guaranteed admissions which saves on the process of applying/stressing over DAT. Check into UOP's 5 year program which is by the far the best,very best program out there!!!!

 

[browncrack]

If you want to save some serious money - go to Universidad De La Salle Bajio for predental and dental then practice in California. You'll probably want to take some Spanish in high school.

 

[RAlec114]

If you want to save some serious money - go to Universidad De La Salle Bajio for predental and dental then practice in California. You'll probably want to take some Spanish in high school.

This idea is VERY interesting to me. Why Universidad de la salle bajio though? What about UCF's direct entry program? I would love to live in california, for the babes and the weather. lol

I am taking spanish in highschool, and excelling.

 

[RAlec114]

It depends on a number of factors. First it sounds like he's going to UPENN for undergrad for 3 years and then UPENN dental school for 4 years.

Looking at Penn's website for undergraduate tuition + cost of living for 3 years. This is assuming no increases in tuition which obviously will occur.
Year 1 : $55,250
Year 2 : $55,250
Year 3 : $55,250
Total: $165,750

UPENN's Dental School for 4 years.

$86,724​

$87,367​

$89,925​

$87,122​

Total : $355,138

Total for undergrad and dental (7 year program): $516,888 + interest

Well, in undergrad you can get a combination of grants and help from your parents to pay for everything so basically the only debt you were have is from dental school. You might be able to get a scholarship but why limit yourself to upenn dental school when their sim lab is in a dungeon and a lot of their students are forced into GPRs and AEGDs? There are a lot of better and cheaper schools out there. The 1 year sooner you graduate does save you $55k from tuition and a 6 figure salary when you graduate.

So the breakdown is that you'll probably benefit from the 7 year program if it's guaranteed admissions which saves on the process of applying/stressing over DAT. Check into UOP's 5 year program which is by the far the best,very best program out there!!!!

thank you for this post. My parents have 80k - half of undergrad. Can you explain more about grants and stuff? I don't know a lot of the financial aid stuff. GPRs and AEGDs? Translate to english please haha.

Reason why I am bent on trying to get Penn's program is because I really want to go to a prestigious school, have direct entry, and accelerated. The thought of working extremely hard in highschool and then end up in some other non-prestigous school with a program just sounds nightmarish to me.... like I don't want to go to a school with people whose SAT scores are 600 points lower (like going to Stony brook's program or something. I really want a prestigious under/grad school). And I love Penn lol.

 

[shedara2008]

it is the University of Pennsylvania that has a dental school.

 

[browncrack]

This idea is VERY interesting to me. Why Universidad de la salle bajio though? What about UCF's direct entry program? I would love to live in california, for the babes and the weather. lol

I am taking spanish in highschool, and excelling.

This is the only foreign school you may graduate from and still practice in the US with the same license requirements as if you graduated from a foreign dental school, although you can only practice in the state of California. All other foreign trained basically need to repeat dental school in a US school if they want to practice dentistry in the US.

Alternatively- you can graduate from a foreign dental school and do a US perio residency and work as a periodontist in some states, although I've never verified this with someone in perio.

 

[Demeter]

There is something to say about having a prestigious undergrad diploma, but with the increased debt you take on its not worth it if you are seeking a position in Health care. For law school or business it may carry more weight but for dental school its basically your GPA, and DAT scores that matter.

My boss went to Community College, then Dental School and Pedo in Houston. His debt was minimal.
His office produces 300,000$/ month. He probably takes home 1 Million/year. Not bad for someone that graduated from a Harvard on the highway school. Do you think he cares about not having an Ivy diploma hanging on the wall?

The #1 and #2 in our class went to Abilene Christian University and some school in Oklahoma. Our East coast Ivy League grad was not even in the top 20 of our class.

 

[Streetwolf]

like I don't want to go to a school with people whose SAT scores are 600 points lower (like going to Stony brook's program or something. I really want a prestigious under/grad school).

A handful of my classmates went to SB undergrad. While I do think there are plenty of more "prestigious" undergrad programs out there, the dental school at SB is an EXCELLENT program to be in. If you had your foot in the door at this dental school, it really doesn't matter where you went to undergrad.

I'm not saying we're better than all other dental schools out there but in my opinion we're near the top of the list. I've read tons of posts on this site where people tend to agree.

 

[RAlec114]

A handful of my classmates went to SB undergrad. While I do think there are plenty of more "prestigious" undergrad programs out there, the dental school at SB is an EXCELLENT program to be in. If you had your foot in the door at this dental school, it really doesn't matter where you went to undergrad.

I'm not saying we're better than all other dental schools out there but in my opinion we're near the top of the list. I've read tons of posts on this site where people tend to agree.

I guess you're all right.. maybe it'll take time for it to sink in.. just hard for me to accept going to a lower level university after working so hard..

 

[DrReo]

I had similar ambitions to attend a prestigious undergraduate (Cornell, Hopkins, etc) in high school. I applied to them... But I decided to go to the state college. Looking back, and at the amount of loans I'll have to pay, I'm so glad I did.

 

[omaralt]

to spend 180K on under grad education is ******ed IMO. Forget the 7 ur program, go to a cheap state university and then apply to different dental schools. You should finish everything with around 250k in debt. If u graduate with 500K in debt your going to hate ur life. You'll be working ur butt off just to pay your monthly debt. Not worth it

 

[RAlec114]

to spend 180K on under grad education is ******ed IMO. Forget the 7 ur program, go to a cheap state university and then apply to different dental schools. You should finish everything with around 250k in debt. If u graduate with 500K in debt your going to hate ur life. You'll be working ur butt off just to pay your monthly debt. Not worth it

word. I've been getting this almost across the board. unless if I get the dean's scholarship..... no Penn.

thanks.... more responses would be helpful

 

[xhamburgersamx]

word. I've been getting this almost across the board. unless if I get the dean's scholarship..... no Penn.

thanks.... more responses would be helpful

you get federal or state grants depending on what school you attend. Grants are usually only given to people who are not so well off or parents are very good at hiding income on their tax forms. Assuming your parents have saved 80K only for your college really indicates that your family is pretty well off.

If you want to do a traditional 8 year track undergrad+dental school then I would personally suggest you go to the cheapest but well respected public school. Penn state sounds like it's a public school and should be relatively cheap I'm assuming? You can probably get by with 80K for 4 years in a public undergrad. If you want to go to a prestigious dental school based solely on "name" then you are going to be royally screwed when you realize the price you pay is for an education equal to or not better than a state university.

There are a lot of specifics you should look into when picking a dental school to attend (assuming you are accepted). I'm not going to go into that since you are still in H.S. lol

Anyway, look into UOP's 5 year or 6 year program. That is def. worth it despite the cost. FYI: that's 5 years to get a dental degree, 2 year undergrad + 3 year accelerated program. Getting a DDS at age 23 is rare

 

[anishannayya]

This post just makes me mad. I know that I've critiqued you already about your idea of "glamourous", but hear me out...

Are you seriously complaining about debt when you are fortunate enough to have parents that slaved away to save 80k for your college? Seriously, be thankful and stop whining. Most people don't have parents that can foot the bill for their undergraduate education.

Secondly, 500k in debt to go to dental school? What! Tell me of a single dental school that is that expensive. If you work hard enough, you will be able to attend an instate dental school or get a partial scholarship and spend ~150k. 350k max if you decide to attend an expensive school.

Just think about it for a moment. If you really think paying out ~$800-2000 a month is too hard when your after tax income is >100-250k, then you have very expensive tastes. It is VERY easy to live extremely comfortably off of 90k a year. Making that much money when you are just 26 is amazing. Most make that less than half that and still manage to pay off their debt.

Stop b***hing and just buckle down and work hard. Don't be ungrateful for all that you have been given.

If money is the sole reason why you are choosing dentistry, then you aren't going to be satisfied. Sure, finances should play a role in your career choice, but it shouldn't be your deciding factor.

On a different tone, I live in the Bay Area; trust me the girls in SF don't look any better than the chicks anywhere else. You need to go to SoCal for that.

 

[RAlec114]

This post just makes me mad. I know that I've critiqued you already about your idea of "glamourous", but hear me out...

Are you seriously complaining about debt when you are fortunate enough to have parents that slaved away to save 80k for your college? Seriously, be thankful and stop whining. Most people don't have parents that can foot the bill for their undergraduate education.

Secondly, 500k in debt to go to dental school? What! Tell me of a single dental school that is that expensive. If you work hard enough, you will be able to attend an instate dental school or get a partial scholarship and spend ~150k. 350k max if you decide to attend an expensive school.

Just think about it for a moment. If you really think paying out ~$800-2000 a month is too hard when your after tax income is >100-250k, then you have very expensive tastes. It is VERY easy to live extremely comfortably off of 90k a year. Making that much money when you are just 26 is amazing. Most make that less than half that and still manage to pay off their debt.

Stop b***hing and just buckle down and work hard. Don't be ungrateful for all that you have been given.

If money is the sole reason why you are choosing dentistry, then you aren't going to be satisfied. Sure, finances should play a role in your career choice, but it shouldn't be your deciding factor.

On a different tone, I live in the Bay Area; trust me the girls in SF don't look any better than the chicks anywhere else. You need to go to SoCal for that.

I just wanted to know how much 400k+ debt is relative to average debt. I'm planning on trying to get into a program that is direct-entry, so I want to be sure that I know the ups and downs of dentistry; one of the biggest downsides is debt. I want to know how "bad" 400k+ is, because I didn't know if that was normal, or just crazy. Now I know it's pretty bad... and am looking for cheap schools. That's all. I did not mean to come out as ungrateful, or spoiled, that's just your own bias.

The 500k I was referring to was penn undergrad+penn grad+specializing. I have abandoned this idea.

Working hard is implied... I don't know where you got the idea that I'm not (perhaps your bias against me). I have made no intimation that I'm not. I'm here to get a taste/information for my very likely future career in dentistry

 

[dentalman]

I would advise you to go to the least expensive school possible.

I did not realize until I started making money, that you have to pay taxes on that money. Since you are making money, you will probably be in a higher tax bracket (let's say 30%, for simplicity's sake). So if you have $500,000 in debt, you actually have to earn %714,285 to pay that off. That does not include a single penny of interest. Let's say that half (250,000) of that debt accumulates at 6.5% for four years while you are in dental school. 250,000 x1.065x1.065x1.065x1.065 = $321,616. That is just an example, and the interest would likely be more. And, of course, you are paying interest after school as well. I'll let you look that up. In other words, the more debt you have, the more it compounds at an exponential rate.

Look at it this way. If you were on a game show where you would win $100,000, how excited would you be? You should be just as excited by saving $100,000 in tuition. Twice as excited as saving $200,000.

Thats just my two cents.

 

[browncrack]

I would advise you to go to the least expensive school possible.

Look at it this way. If you were on a game show where you would win $100,000, how excited would you be? You should be just as excited by saving $100,000 in tuition. Twice as excited as saving $200,000.

If I saved $100K in tuition I would literally cream my shorts. It would probably take a few minutes if I saved $200K.