Foreign clinical experience

[Geo16]

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Going to work in a South Korean Veteran hospital starting next year. This job will be 21 months in length.
Won't be performing medical procedures like puncturing a patient with a needle but will be put to move patients around and take care of their needs.
How does it look on an application? 🙂

 

[Engrailed]

Going to work in a South Korean Veteran hospital starting next year. This job will be 21 months in length.
Won't be performing medical procedures like puncturing a patient with a needle but will be put to move patients around and take care of their needs.
How does it look on an application? 🙂

From what I read on SDN
US clinical experience >>>> Foreign clinical experience

 

[Catalystik]

Going to work in a South Korean Veteran hospital starting next year. This job will be 21 months in length.
Won't be performing medical procedures like puncturing a patient with a needle but will be put to move patients around and take care of their needs.
How does it look on an application? 🙂

International patient experience won't hurt your application, but should not supercede US or Canadian patient experience if you plan to apply to US med schools.

 

[907914]

From what I read on SDN
US clinical experience >>>> Foreign clinical experience

Being that OP will be doing something that anyone with arms and legs could do, then his presence as a foreigner doing the job is likely not needed.

However, this is not always the case.If OP were to be performing skilled work (ie. nursing, lab tech, so on) in an area where they could communicate with the patient then the clinical experience would be viewed as neutral. In certain situations, it could be viewed as a positive to have foreign skilled clinical experience if the story is unique and domestic clinical experience is in excess of necessary (ie. A military Medical deployment or humanitarian mission, things of that nature)

 

[Geo16]

International patient experience won't hurt your application, but should not supercede US or Canadian patient experience if you plan to apply to US med schools.

Would you suggest giving it a positive spin on my app? Just as a side of fries next to the US clinical experience. 🙂

 

[Catalystik]

Would you suggest giving it a positive spin on my app? Just as a side of fries next to the US clinical experience. 🙂

What did you have in mind?

 

[Geo16]

What did you have in mind?

Well, volunteering in the states was very flexible. I was able to skip days and leave whenever I wanted. However, this is my first time entering with a real committment in a hospital. There will be dire consequences for missing days or performing poorly at the site. It will decide for me if medicine, with mandatory commitment, is the right path for me.

 

[907914]

Well, volunteering in the states was very flexible. I was able to skip days and leave whenever I wanted. However, this is my first time entering with a real committment in a hospital. There will be dire consequences for missing days or performing poorly at the site. It will decide for me if medicine, with mandatory commitment, is the right path for me.

Medicine with mandatory commitment = ...a job?

 

[Geo16]

Medicine with mandatory commitment = ...a job?

As a career and a job.
I failed the Physical Exam in the South Korean Military draft and will be placed to do community service instead. The Seoul Veteran Hospital is always short staffed and will take anyone who applies to this site. Wanted to fill in here for as to why I am going to work in a hospital in South Korea for 21 months 🙂

 

[Catalystik]

I failed the Physical Exam in the South Korean Military draft and will be placed to do community service instead. The Seoul Veteran Hospital is always short staffed and will take anyone who applies to this site. Wanted to fill in here for as to why I am going to work in a hospital in South Korea for 21 months 🙂

Isn't this an obligatory service requirement due to your South Korean citizenship? Won't you get a salary or stipend to pay living expenses?

 

[Geo16]

Isn't this an obligation service requirement due to your South Korean citizenship? Won't you get a salary or stipend to pay living expenses?

Yeap. Holding dual citizen between the states and South Korea. And also yes, it is kind of considered "being hired" rather than "volunteering." There are public institutes that require extra hands and Social Service Agents fill those spots!

 

[Catalystik]

Yeap. Holding dual citizen between the states and South Korea. And also yes, it is kind of considered "being hired" rather than "volunteering." There are public institutes that require extra hands and Social Service Agents fill those spots!

I'd label it as Employment-Medical/Clinical, in that case, rather than community service. But you can explain in what way it is a social service, if you like.

 

[Geo16]

I'd label it as Employment-Medical/Clinical, in that case, rather than community service.

Got it! I will certainly do that when it is time to apply. Thank you very much! 🙂

 

[Geo16]

I'd label it as Employment-Medical/Clinical, in that case, rather than community service. But you can explain in what way it is a social service, if you like.

Another quick question.
This is a paid job (stipends are given around $300 usd) and I was just wondering about of this difference in the international settings-- volunteering vs employment. Just curious about this after your comment.

 

[Catalystik]

Another quick question.
This is a paid job (stipends are given around $300 usd) and I was just wondering about of this difference in the international settings-- volunteering vs employment. Just curious about this after your comment.

Could you clarify your question? I'm not sure what you want to know.

 

[Geo16]

Could you clarify your question? I'm not sure what you want to know.

Meant to ask if working overseas is viewed differently than volunteering overseas. I guess my question stems from the fact that adcoms become wary when applicants engage in a medical procedure overseas. What if they are qualified (i.e. CNA in South Korea) to do those procedures over there?

 

[Catalystik]

Meant to ask if working overseas is viewed differently than volunteering overseas. I guess my question stems from the fact that adcoms become wary when applicants engage in a medical procedure overseas. What if they are qualified (i.e. CNA in South Korea) to do those procedures over there?

If one is qualified/certified, providing skilled-level care abroad is not a potential negative with US med school adcomms. Will the South Korean government provide you with CNA training or something similar?

 

[Geo16]

If one is qualified/certified, providing skilled-level care abroad is not a potential negative with US med school adcomms. Will the South Korean government provide you with CNA training or something similar?

It'll be through a private school. I thought it would be a good thing to get certified. It'll be beneficial for my own personal skills (when I come back to the U.S., I will be a CNA again) and if I tell them that I am a CNA, they'll allow me few more responsibilities in the hospital.

 

[LizzyM]

Being required to serve your country for 21 months and doing that service in a hospital is a different kettle of fish than most volunteer activities done abroad that one sees on the typical application. You will stand out from the novelty of it, if nothing else. It doesn't substitute for clinical experience in the US but it is a nice experience and if I have the opportunity to interview you someday, I'd ask about comparisons of the US and S.Korean systems based on first hand experience.

 

[Geo16]

Being required to serve your country for 21 months and doing that service in a hospital is a different kettle of fish than most volunteer activities done abroad that one sees on the typical application. You will stand out from the novelty of it, if nothing else. It doesn't substitute for clinical experience in the US but it is a nice experience and if I have the opportunity to interview you someday, I'd ask about comparisons of the US and S.Korean systems based on first hand experience.

This is actually flattering!
Thank you very much for your response! Also big thanks to @Catalystik for answering me with full attention.
Hope to see you back in the states!! I'll work hard till I am there!

 

[Geo16]

It'll be through a private school. I thought it would be a good thing to get certified. It'll be beneficial for my own personal skills (when I come back to the U.S., I will be a CNA again) and if I tell them that I am a CNA, they'll allow me few more responsibilities in the hospital.

Update:
Just signed up for an CNA class in South Korea. Cost me around $2000, but it'll pay back due to paid intern.
I guess it's just an employment overseas like you've said. It clarified so much! Thank you very much @Catalystik! You've been my guru mentor!
Right now, I'm overseas and I don't know what to do. Should I take Online courses for pre-reqs? I've got Bio1, Org chem 1&2 and Bio-chemistry left.
Other courses in sight are Anatomy, Physiology, Microbiology.
Also possibly in the future-- Immunology, Pathophysiology, Genetics, Molecular Biology, Histology,Pharmacology.

 

[Moko]

Right now, I'm overseas and I don't know what to do. Should I take Online courses for pre-reqs? I've got Bio1, Org chem 1&2 and Bio-chemistry left.

Take the pre-reqs in-person. Online classes are not viewed with the same weight at most schools.

 

[Geo16]

Take the pre-reqs in-person. Online classes are not viewed with the same weight at most schools.

Yeah, thought that was the case. Guess I have to do a post-bacc program that mimics medical school curriculum when I come back! Time to work and just study!

 

[Catalystik]

Update:
Just signed up for an CNA class in South Korea. Cost me around $2000, but it'll pay back due to paid intern.
I guess it's just an employment overseas like you've said. It clarified so much! Thank you very much @Catalystik! You've been my guru mentor!

Right now, I'm overseas and I don't know what to do. Should I take Online courses for pre-reqs? I've got Bio1, Org chem 1&2 and Bio-chemistry left.
Other courses in sight are Anatomy, Physiology, Microbiology.
Also possibly in the future-- Immunology, Pathophysiology, Genetics, Molecular Biology, Histology,Pharmacology.

You can take online classes that are not med school prerequisites, but take care as some med schools require some upper-level Bio classes. Histology, Pharmacology, Immunology, Embryology, Virology, and Anatomy should be safe, meaning I don't recall any school specifically naming them as a prerequisite (though you should do your own research if you know what schools you'll eventually target). Be sure the school is accredited in the US so that the GPA earned will "count." Recall that foreign transcripts are not accepted by US med school application services.

 

[Geo16]

You can take online classes that are not med school prerequisites, but take care as some med schools require some upper-level Bio classes. Histology, Pharmacology, Immunology, Embryology, Virology, and Anatomy should be safe, meaning I don't recall any school specifically naming them as a prerequisite (though you should do your own research if you know what schools you'll eventually target). Be sure the school is accredited in the US so that the GPA earned will "count." Recall that foreign transcripts are not accepted by US med school application services.

Oh I just added them on the list because of Goro's advice(take courses that mimic med school curriculum).
I'm thinking of post-bacc programs that provide those courses! Right now, I'm jut gonna just study for 2 years and take online courses that interests me (possibly a macro econ class or Literature etc.).
Edit: the courses I'm taking are from an accredited community college. Going to take one more composition course, Native American studies..

 

[Catalystik]

Oh I just added them on the list because of Goro's advice(take courses that mimic med school curriculum).
I'm thinking of post-bacc programs that provide those courses! Right now, I'm jut gonna just study for 2 years and take online courses that interests me (possibly a macro econ class or Literature etc.).
Edit: the courses I'm taking are from an accredited community college. Going to take one more composition course, Native American studies..

As long as you have one year of in-classroom English already to cover the usual prerequisites, it's fine to take online Composition.

 

[Geo16]

As long as you have one year of in-classroom English already to cover the usual prerequisites, it's fine to take online Composition.

Couldn't find a Literature course so I had to just take another composition. Also I've got a year covered 🙂
Macro econ, Eng composition, Native American studies, Kinesiology(not PE), Material Engineering.

 

[Geo16]

As long as you have one year of in-classroom English already to cover the usual prerequisites, it's fine to take online Composition.

Another question.
I don't have a bachelor yet. I've been going back and forth about whether I should go back to California and obtain a bachelor...
OR, another option came up: applying to a nursing school in South Korea with an CNA advantage. Then obtain RN, and BSN, then take NCLEX and work as a nurse in the States. Errr, am I being stupid? Or is it a valid pathway? Let me know. I've been going crazy for two weeks about how to return to the states. Help me please lol
Also: dropping Kinesiology to go half-time student.

 

[907914]

Another question.
I don't have a bachelor yet. I've been going back and forth about whether I should go back to California and obtain a bachelor...
OR, another option came up: applying to a nursing school in South Korea with an CNA advantage. Then obtain RN, and BSN, then take NCLEX and work as a nurse in the States. Errr, am I being stupid? Or is it a valid pathway? Let me know. I've been going crazy for two weeks about how to return to the states. Help me please lol

South Korean nursing degree is not a very effective path towards USMD schools.

 

[Geo16]

South Korean nursing degree is not a very effective path towards USMD schools.

Just wanted a bachelor and work my way into nursing in the states. Just a thought!

 

[Catalystik]

Another question.
I don't have a bachelor yet. I've been going back and forth about whether I should go back to California and obtain a bachelor...
OR, another option came up: applying to a nursing school in South Korea with an CNA advantage. Then obtain RN, and BSN, then take NCLEX and work as a nurse in the States. Errr, am I being stupid? Or is it a valid pathway? Let me know. I've been going crazy for two weeks about how to return to the states. Help me please lol
Also: dropping Kinesiology to go half-time student.

Sorry, I'm not familiar with international nursing degrees and a possible path to licensure in the USA.

 

[Geo16]

Sorry, I'm not familiar with international nursing degrees and a possible path to licensure in the USA.

Even US Nursing degrees in general are not a good path to MD/DO. Specialized health major, which would include nursing have the worst acceptance rate. If your goal is a US medical school, get your bachelors in US
https://www.aamc.org/download/321496/data/factstablea17.pdf

Thanks @Catalystik and @gonnif !
Guess my path would be returning to my home school and getting a diploma.
Just been going nuts on things I shouldnt worry about yet. Sorry guys.

 

[RNthenDoc]

Even US Nursing degrees in general are not a good path to MD/DO. Specialized health major, which would include nursing have the worst acceptance rate. If your goal is a US medical school, get your bachelors in US
https://www.aamc.org/download/321496/data/factstablea17.pdf

So I'm looking at these data, and see that the acceptance rate is 1:2.7 for specialized healthcare, and 1:2.4 for Bio.

The mean MCAT for specialized health science applicants is 502, vs. 505 for biological sciences.

Mean MCATs for matriculants are 509 (specialized science) vs. 511 (biological sciences).

It seems that while the rate of acceptance for the specialized health science is slightly lower, the average stats are also lower to a similar magnitude. I feel like this indicates that similarly-qualified candidates experience similar outcomes, no?

 

[LizzyM]

So I'm looking at these data, and see that the acceptance rate is 1:2.7 for specialized healthcare, and 1:2.4 for Bio.

The mean MCAT for specialized health science applicants is 502, vs. 505 for biological sciences.

Mean MCATs for matriculants are 509 (specialized science) vs. 511 (biological sciences).

It seems that while the rate of acceptance for the specialized health science is slightly lower, the average stats are also lower to a similar magnitude. I feel like this indicates that similarly-qualified candidates experience similar outcomes, no?

The applicant data says to me that specialized health science applicants perform, on average, a little less well on the MCAT than bio science majors.

What that admissions data says to me is that on average specialized health science degree holders get spotted 2 points on their MCATs when compared to biology majors. It is a very, very tiny bump that might be attributed to greater practical experience. On average, they accomplish what the bio majors accomplish but with a lower average MCAT.

 

[907914]

The applicant data says to me that specialized health science applicants perform, on average, a little less well on the MCAT than bio science majors.

What that admissions data says to me is that on average specialized health science degree holders get spotted 2 points on their MCATs when compared to biology majors. It is a very, very tiny bump that might be attributed to greater practical experience. On average, they accomplish what the bio majors accomplish but with a lower average MCAT.

My guess would simply be increased clinical exposure and, thus, a more “holistic” applicant in spite of the lower MCAT.

 

[RNthenDoc]

The applicant data says to me that specialized health science applicants perform, on average, a little less well on the MCAT than bio science majors.

What that admissions data says to me is that on average specialized health science degree holders get spotted 2 points on their MCATs when compared to biology majors. It is a very, very tiny bump that might be attributed to greater practical experience. On average, they accomplish what the bio majors accomplish but with a lower average MCAT.

That was exactly my interpretation as well; there doesn’t seem to be a huge benefit or detractor between one or the other major.

 

[Geo16]

Update: Had to choose my work site.
Sent two applications to Seoul Veteran's Hospital.
The competition is around 5:1 ish. It's all lottery. Hopefully I'll get in. (Dear god, please let me in.)
Dropped all my classes though. No college credits this fall.