General chem question from a UCSD premed

[gree]

UCSD has a very different system from other schools in that they won't let you take any classes deemed fulfilled by AP or CC credits.
As a result, I won't be able to take the first of a 3-quarter honor general chem sequence. The advising people told me that it's sufficient with just chem 6BH and chem 6CH. Is this something that is well understood and accepted by other medical schools and not just UCSD med school?
I have similar issue in math and biology. For math, I cannot take the first two of the Calculus sequence, but since there are enough introductory math classes like 11, 20C, 20D, 20E, and 20F, I think I'm alright. For biology, I cannot take any of the introductory biology sequence but since I major in biology, I think I'm fine there as well.

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[BluntSurgeon]

I just graduated from UCSD (also heading there for med school in the fall) and the ONE universal truth of our school is that every. single. adviser you will come across knows absolutely NOTHING. They will often give you advice that is COUNTERPRODUCTIVE to your school and career goals. Please please please promise me that you will never ever approach one of their WORTHLESS advisers ever again.

Now for your specific question: You have two options. You could either petition to have them remove that credit so you can take it over (cite some bull**** about how you want to make sure that you have a solid chemistry foundation before progressing to B and C or w hatever you can come up with) or take a quarter of Inorganic (I think thats the 112 series?).

Honestly you should do everything you can to try to take Chem 6A. My experience at UCSD taught me that there is ALWAYS somebody higher up and you really just have to fight your way to the top until you get to somebody who doesn't give two ****s and approves it without batting an eye. The UCs are a very "sink or swim" sort of environment and I guarantee you nobody is there to help you out, ESPECIALLY the advisers and the ******s who staff the administrative buildings.

Lastly, why the **** are you taking the Honors series? I know in high school "honors" makes everybody go "ooh and aah" but every kid I know who took the H series chemistry had their GPAs massacred. It does NOT look better for medical school, you will have to work SO much harder, and you will most likely come out of it with Bs or even Cs.

Example: Fall quarter (I was a revelle student) I would roll out of bed 5 minutes before class, walk to york, sleep through chemistry, and spent a total of ONE HOUR studying for the first midterm. I did the same for the second midterm. Our professor was so lazy/easy that he made our final completely out of questions from our previous two finals (exactly the same questions, numbers, wording everything). I finished a 40 question chem final within 10 minutes. Walked away with an A+ for only a total of basically 3 hours of work the entire quarter. Now on the other side of the equation, my friend took 6AH, busted his nuts studying and doing homework just about every week, and barely managed to scrape by with a solid B. Needless to say he "dropped" into 6B (not honors) next quarter.

If you want some anecdotes, I took Chem 6a-c (not honors) and interviewed at 7 of the top ten medical schools in the country. I am now accepted at UCSD. It does not matter. Trust me man, do NOT take the honors series unless you do not value your free time during your freshman year (arguably the best year of college).

 

[dirtymike03]

UCSD has a very different system from other schools in that they won't let you take any classes deemed fulfilled by AP or CC credits.
As a result, I won't be able to take the first of a 3-quarter honor general chem sequence. The advising people told me that it's sufficient with just chem 6BH and chem 6CH. Is this something that is well understood and accepted by other medical schools and not just UCSD med school?
I have similar issue in math and biology. For math, I cannot take the first two of the Calculus sequence, but since there are enough introductory math classes like 11, 20C, 20D, 20E, and 20F, I think I'm alright. For biology, I cannot take any of the introductory biology sequence but since I major in biology, I think I'm fine there as well.

So you should really try to take chem 6a because many med schools (especially the uc's) do not accept ap credit. if you don't take chem 6a you will end up having to take it later which will be a pain. plus, you definitely want a firm foundation in chem before you take 6bl. i'm sure you can take 6a, just talk to the right people.

math you will be ok because you only need a year. i took 20c-f and was fine.

many med schools want you to have taken bio 1 and 2 (bild 1 & 2 at ucsd). i would advise that you take those courses because like i said many med schools (uc's as mentioned above) won't accept ap credit. maybe you would be fine with bio, i'm not certain. ask some admissions office at different med schools to be sure. hope that helps.

 

[BluntSurgeon]

many med schools want you to have taken bio 1 and 2 (bild 1 & 2 at ucsd). i would advise that you take those courses because like i said many med schools (uc's as mentioned above) won't accept ap credit. maybe you would be fine with bio, i'm not certain. ask some admissions office at different med schools to be sure. hope that helps.

OP, you are fine for bio. You will end up taking BICD 100, some BIBCs, and maybe a BIPN here or there. Point is you will have plenty of biology courses that will fulfill your bio requirement. DO NOT TAKE bild one and two.

 

[Richzz89]

Sorry to kind of hijack this thread. But I'm also a premed student at UCSD, finishing my first year. Ideally I am planning to take the MCAT's the summer after my sophomore year because I will be done with my pre-req classes, general chem, organic chem, physics, and biology. The issue is that I have AP credit for biology, so I AP'ed out of BILD 1,2, and 3. What I'm wondering is what upper division biology classes were the most useful and helpful for the MCAT's?

For this coming fall I'm planning on taking:
Organic Chemistry (140A)
Physics (1A and 1AL)
An Upper Division Biology class (Planning on Mam Phys)
G.E.

I've heard that Metabolic Biochemistry (I believe its BIBC 102), Mammalian Physiology (BIPN 100) and Genetics are useful but some people have told they are and others have said they are not. Is their a specific order that I should take these Upper-Division biology classes to maximize their usefullness for the MCAT's?

Also, who would you recommend for Organic Chem, the professors for the fall are Ternansky, Whitesell, and Perrin. The Mammalian Physiology professers are French and Kristan. And the Genetics professor is Soowal.

 

[go lakers]

I'd advise against the Honors series if you're pre-med too.

 

[gree]

The bio and chem advising people told me in no uncertain terms that becasue of my AP scores, I cannot take chem 6A, 6B, 6C, 6AH, BILD 1, BILD 2, and BILD 3. They said if I really insist, I can enroll with no credits and no grades.

This policy, which is kind of lacking common sense, is opposite to that in Berkeley and other schools. In Berkeley, many incoming freshmen with AP scores of 5 get slaughtered in Math 1A, Chem 3A, Bio 1B etc. Can you imagine what will happen if everyone who has passing AP scores is forced to take the more advanced classes?

Thank god I didn't take AP Physics BC, otherwise I'll have to take Physics 4D, 4E etc. and compete with physics major on relativity and quantum mechanics.

Blunt, thanks for the heads up. UCSD premed advising says completion of the college writing sequence, which I believe is only 2 quarters of "intensive" writing, satisfies the one year premed english requirement. Is that correct or should I take another quarter of writing to have all my bases covered? Also, how many quarters of lab do you need for physics, bio, chem, and ochem? They suggest 2 for physics 2, one for chem, one for ochem, and unknown for bio.

And finally, Blunt, do you have any insight into why UCSD undergrad med school admission rate is so low?

 

[cappie]

i had 2 required classes for writing and i took and extra english course pass/no pass just in case to fulfill the english requirement...i agree with the above statement that advisors are useless...go to the chem dept and ask them if you can petition to be in chem6 series or worse comes to worse take it at a community college, dont take honors its a a waste of time

also for mcat i recommend mammalian physiology as an upper div course to take beforehand and i think a little mol bio would help

 

[cappie]

sorry...but to add when you take physics there is a concurrent lab, well at least for the easiest series, and for inorganic and organic you only need one lab each, and for bio i took 2 labs and was fine...btw i graduated from ucsd and am headed to the midwest for med school and have had no problems with any courses i have taken...good luck!

 

[BluntSurgeon]

Sorry to kind of hijack this thread. But I'm also a premed student at UCSD, finishing my first year. Ideally I am planning to take the MCAT's the summer after my sophomore year because I will be done with my pre-req classes, general chem, organic chem, physics, and biology. The issue is that I have AP credit for biology, so I AP'ed out of BILD 1,2, and 3. What I'm wondering is what upper division biology classes were the most useful and helpful for the MCAT's?

For this coming fall I'm planning on taking:
Organic Chemistry (140A)
Physics (1A and 1AL)
An Upper Division Biology class (Planning on Mam Phys)
G.E.

I've heard that Metabolic Biochemistry (I believe its BIBC 102), Mammalian Physiology (BIPN 100) and Genetics are useful but some people have told they are and others have said they are not. Is their a specific order that I should take these Upper-Division biology classes to maximize their usefullness for the MCAT's?

Also, who would you recommend for Organic Chem, the professors for the fall are Ternansky, Whitesell, and Perrin. The Mammalian Physiology professers are French and Kristan. And the Genetics professor is Soowal.

For organic chem I would recommend Perrin (lol I actually work for his wife in another lab haha). Ternansky is pretty difficult and I know nothing about whitesell. Personally, I would NOT take mamphys this early in the game. It's a difficult upper div despite being a 100-level class and a majority of your classmates will be juniors who have completed ochem etc. I would take genetics (BICD 100), metabolic (BIBC 102), structural (BIBC 100) before tackling mamphys and mol bio (another HILARIOUSLY difficult upper div bio class.. I took it senior year). Tell you the truth, I wouldn't touch mamphys or mol bio without having completed ochem either, but that's just me. You seem like a smart cat so you can probably handle it.

However, I do recommend you hammer all five of these classes out before you take your MCAT. They provide an EXCELLENT foundation and as an n=1, they helped me score fantastically on that test. Again though, this is my personal opinion. Do as you please or whatever you think you are capable of.

Also that genetics teacher is miserable (soowal). Never take anything with him/her. All my friends have been murdered by his/her accent and ridiculously difficult tests. Stay far far far away.

As an aside: doing well at UCSD simply comes down to picking the right teachers and classes. You can be the most ******ed pike frat piece of ****, and still pull out of UCSD with an amazing GPA if you carefully plan who your teachers are and when you take your classes. Looking back at my time there, I just laugh at the disparity between teachers FOR THE SAME CLASS. Take Chem 140A for example. I had O'connor and another friend of mine had ternansky. I studied for probably a FOURTH of the time he did and still performed better than him at the end of the class. This had nothing to do with him or me being smarter, simply the material that was required by both teachers was DRASTICALLY different. IIRC, ternansky even had required homework, which for a college class I think is bull****.

 

[BluntSurgeon]

OP, what college are you in? Also, how many units/credits/whatever are your two writing courses. These answers will help me tailor my answer.

Also if anybody else has ANY UCSD questions please please PM me or post them here. I absolutely love answering questions on how to "beat the system" at UCSD since it's run by the lowest form of human, if you can even call them that. I had to fight through so much to make it as a premed at that school (this is part of the reasoning why they have such a low admission rate... I'll flesh out a more thorough answer later though.. I have to go take care of some gels).

 

[rHinO1]

OP, what college are you in? Also, how many units/credits/whatever are your two writing courses. These answers will help me tailor my answer.

Also if anybody else has ANY UCSD questions please please PM me or post them here. I absolutely love answering questions on how to "beat the system" at UCSD since it's run by the lowest form of human, if you can even call them that. I had to fight through so much to make it as a premed at that school (this is part of the reasoning why they have such a low admission rate... I'll flesh out a more thorough answer later though.. I have to go take care of some gels).

I know UCSD puts out the 7th most medical school applicants nationally, but what is the admission rate? You said it is low, but low relative to what schools? I don't doubt you, I have just never heard that about UCSD.

 

[gree]

Blunt, I'm in ERC. There are 2 MMW courses that are supposed to be writing intensive. I wasn't planning to come to SD initially and so didn't pay any attention to college and major selection. I picked the college with the best dorm and a major(bioengineering) for which SD is well known. Let me preempt you guys from hitting me on the head by saying that I'm switching to biochem & cell bio.

rHinO1: Here is the SD chart http://career.ucsd.edu/sa/PMedHis.shtml
The numbers include seniors and n-year-out students. Let's hope that the numbers for seniors only are significantly better.
For comparison purpose, here is the chart for Berkeley:
https://career.berkeley.edu/MedStats/national.stm

 

[BluntSurgeon]

Gree, I don't have too much time right now to post (heading to the gym, dinner with friends, will post when I get back), but I just want to say that I am a bioengineer too and I honestly think it was the BEST DECISION I ever made in terms of "building an application" for medical school. Bioengineering is by far the best MCAT prep and it looks freaking awesome to adcoms. Every interview I went on, I spent a good deal of time talking about my bioengineering ECs and how bioengineering relates much more to medicine than any other UCSD worthless bio major. But hey that's, again, just my opinion.


edit: it is, however, really ****ing hard and if you're think you're no good at math and physics, then you should probably drop.

 

[coffeeeandtea]

This policy, which is kind of lacking common sense, is opposite to that in Berkeley and other schools. In Berkeley, many incoming freshmen with AP scores of 5 get slaughtered in Math 1A, Chem 3A, Bio 1B etc. Can you imagine what will happen if everyone who has passing AP scores is forced to take the more advanced classes?

as a graduating undergrad from Berkeley (and as a former orientation counselor who watched freshmen choose their courses), I can tell you that this is SO true of incoming freshmen - they think that just because they rocked the APs they'll instantly rock Math 1A and Chem 3A. every year the counselors advise them to take it easy and ramp up the difficulty if they really feel like they're not being challenged, but honestly, sometimes you just have to learn the hard way...

 

[rHinO1]

Blunt, I'm in ERC. There are 2 MMW courses that are supposed to be writing intensive. I wasn't planning to come to SD initially and so didn't pay any attention to college and major selection. I picked the college with the best dorm and a major(bioengineering) for which SD is well known. Let me preempt you guys from hitting me on the head by saying that I'm switching to biochem & cell bio.

rHinO1: Here is the SD chart http://career.ucsd.edu/sa/PMedHis.shtml
The numbers include seniors and n-year-out students. Let's hope that the numbers for seniors only are significantly better.
For comparison purpose, here is the chart for Berkeley:
https://career.berkeley.edu/MedStats/national.stm

Gree, thanks for the info. You're right it does seem a little on the low side. However, I think the stats at Berkley are a little funny. If you go to the site you posted,and look at the total applicants from berk who applied (about 117) and compare it to the amount listed on the amcas statistics site (http://www.aamc.org/data/facts/2008/race.htm), the numbers don't match up (amcas says 700+). It may be that the group of students who released their acceptance info to berkley were the best applicants.