General Questions about applying to FM

[MeganRose]

This is my first post on this forum-- I applied to the AF for Ob-Gyn with FM as a second choice and found out yesterday morning that I was assigned to Family Medicine civillian. I felt a bit knowlegable about the residency process as it applied to OB-Gyn, but I am a bit lost about FM. I've been doing searches of past posts since 2004 but I wanted to make sure that some of my conclusions are correct. Anybody's help, (esp Sophie and Kent) would be deeply appreciated.

1. Number of interviews/Length of ROL
- How many interviews should I do?
-How many programs should I rank? One post said that the average AMG will get into their number one choice unless something went horribly wrong. Is there any truth to this?
It seems that the general rule for AMG is 5-6 programs for the ROL. I only have 5 scheduled, 2 of which I think I could be happy at (bc I did 3rdy rotations there.) Should I schedule more interviews? (Steps were 208/222, middle of class, very good recs/3rdy performance)

2. Things to think about in selecting a program-- Beyond the more standard issues of call schedules, intern happiness, etc. It seems that other things specific to family are to find an unopposed program. With Obgyn, looking at number of surgical cases/delivery was a great way to quanitatively evaluate a program. Is there any such measuring stick in FM that I should be looking at to evaluate programs?

Any advice about the application process/selecting a good residency would be greatly appreciated.

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[F@milyMed]

You say that you have 5 interviews.....2 of the places you rotated through.

How many programs did you apply to?

Are you MD or DO?

I have heard that the magic number is near 10. Meaning you should shoot for 10 or so interviews. An important consideration however, as I have asked above is number of programs applied to. This is important since, if you have applied to 5 programs and got 5 interviews your chances of matching at one of those programs is extrememly high, when compared to...........for example...having those 5 interviews but having applied to 50 programs. Do you see what I am getting at.

So, I am not trying to scare you or judge you.....5 interviews is a good number. It would be more useful however, to give advice if you supply interview number AND applied to number.

The other thing to consider, is that programs that you have rotated in almost always give interviews as a courtesy, so that could skew the situation a bit.

The best advice for # to rank is.
ONLY RANK A PROGRAM THAT YOU WOULD BE HAPPY MATCHING AT. In other words, if you they were the only program to offer you a spot (like med school admissions) would you take it? You should ask youself that question. There is no magic number. Thats just nasty competitive gunner scare tactics!

As far as which questions to ask..the trick is not to sound smart by asking questions.....rather....think about it for yourself...not what other people on this forum would ask.. WHAT IS IMPORTANT TO YOU WHEN YOU ARE SERIOUSLY CONSIDERING ONE PROGRAM OR ANOTHER. For me, call schedule, fellowhips or other placement after they complete are very important. I always asked how many of the most recent graduating class got the fellowships of their choice. Did anyone not get a fellowship that wanted one. Is their career placement support. Procedures are also important to me...so I always ask to see a typical residencts procedure log. I am a skeptic and dont trust them...so I ask to see the log.

You have to find out what are you most interested in learning about a program and ASK IT! Dont worry about what questions make you sounds smart. If lunch is really important to you........(like me) ask about meal tickets....why not! I would however, stay away from focusing the whole interview on meals, vacations and call schedule! That will probably make you sound like this resident in my previous program whom everyone knew would rather be fishing!

Good luck!

 

[Doc Oc]

If you wanted to do OB but now are pursuing Family, you can find programs where you get quite a bit of OB training. Remember you can still deliver babies and do basic women's health care, and tailor your practice to make that a large part.

All of my questions were specific to what I think I might want to do with my future practice, and trying to determine where I would get the best training for that. Thinking of it that way might help. Call schedules and resident happiness are important, but if you think you might want to do colonoscopies, for example, you need to think of that ahead of time and include it in your questioning because you are unlikely to find out specific information by happenstance.

 

[MeganRose]

You say that you have 5 interviews.....2 of the places you rotated through.

How many programs did you apply to?

Are you MD or DO?

The other thing to consider, is that programs that you have rotated in almost always give interviews as a courtesy, so that could skew the situation a bit.

There is no magic number. Thats just nasty competitive gunner scare tactics!

As far as which questions to ask..the trick is not to sound smart by asking questions.....rather....think about it for yourself...not what other people on this forum would ask.. WHAT IS IMPORTANT TO YOU WHEN YOU ARE SERIOUSLY CONSIDERING ONE PROGRAM OR ANOTHER.


Good luck!

Hey FM,
I appreciate the fast response. So are you saying that the magic number ten mean that one must attend 10 interviews to find ~5 programs that they like or is ten the number that needs to be ranked in order to match? Looking for the magic number isn't just scare tactics-- I know that statistically for ObGyn there was a magic number, if you rank ten programs you will get in somewhere-- I saw a link to this data on SDN's OBGyn forum a few months back. My best friend is applying to surgery and I think she said her magic number was like 13 or something. I would just hate not to match.

I applied to 5 programs, got 5 interviews all within a few days of submitting my application. I attend an allopathic school where I did required 3rd year rotations (not subI) at two of the programs I'm interviewing at (UTHSCSA and Christus Santa Rosa) I'm sure that does skew things a bit.

Anywho, I'm not looking for questions that make me look smart, rather questions that can give a more quantitative measure of the quality of the program. i.e., number of beds, number of patients seen-- something like that. But your point is well taken, maybe bc of the diversity of FM there is no standard metric to look at, that it would be best to look specifically at the numbers that interest me (OB, procedures, etc). Thanks again for your advice, I appreciate it!
M

 

[Faebinder]

Hey FM,
I appreciate the fast response. So are you saying that the magic number ten mean that one must attend 10 interviews to find ~5 programs that they like or is ten the number that needs to be ranked in order to match? Looking for the magic number isn't just scare tactics-- I know that statistically for ObGyn there was a magic number, if you rank ten programs you will get in somewhere-- I saw a link to this data on SDN's OBGyn forum a few months back. My best friend is applying to surgery and I think she said her magic number was like 13 or something. I would just hate not to match.

I applied to 5 programs, got 5 interviews all within a few days of submitting my application. I attend an allopathic school where I did required 3rd year rotations (not subI) at two of the programs I'm interviewing at (UTHSCSA and Christus Santa Rosa) I'm sure that does skew things a bit.

Anywho, I'm not looking for questions that make me look smart, rather questions that can give a more quantitative measure of the quality of the program. i.e., number of beds, number of patients seen-- something like that. But your point is well taken, maybe bc of the diversity of FM there is no standard metric to look at, that it would be best to look specifically at the numbers that interest me (OB, procedures, etc). Thanks again for your advice, I appreciate it!
M

Rank 5....

Attend.... whatever number you think you need to find 5 that you like..

Apply to .... X depending on how competitive you are... sounds like you should apply to 10...

Because you are going to go into FM, you will need to make sure you find a good quality program because there are so many out there... so... before you apply to 10... find THE PERFECT 10. Websites like FREIDA, SCUTWORK.COM... call the programs.. find the perfect 10 for you that are within your competitive range... apply to 10.. you will get interviews with all of them I bet.... and find the perfect 5 amongst those 10 to interview at. You only need to rank 5 really... according to the nrmp statistics that is... If your record has issues then apply to more and interview at more.

 

[deleted87716]

Choosing a residency program is like choosing a mate...no one program is right for everyone, "beauty" is in the eye of the beholder, and when you find the right one...somehow, you just know it.

Interview at as many places as you're comfortable with. I don't think there's any "magic number" that will ensure that you don't end up in the scramble, but if you're a U.S. grad with no red flags on paper or in person, you would probably be safe interviewing at somewhere around a half-dozen or so. If you have no geographic limitations or any other reason to narrow your choice of programs, interview as many places as you can stand/afford to.

If you're interested in doing OB, you should look at places with a strong OB experience, or those that offer an OB fellowship. That will probably narrow things down somewhat. Most of these programs will be West of the Mississippi.

As for other desirable features, that depends on you. Personally, I tend to recommend "unopposed" programs where there aren't a lot of other specialty residencies competing with you for cases. You'll have a lot better experience, and will likely learn more. Ideally, a program will have a strong academic affiliation, as well. Many people don't realize that there are programs like that out there...they think you're either going to be at a big, academic medical center or out in the boondocks. Not so.

I also recommend you look for a program that uses an Electronic Medical Record (EMR). A well-implemented EMR is a good sign that a program isn't stuck in the dark ages, and you might as well get some experience using one, as that's where everything's headed.

Make sure your program offers a good balance between inpatient and outpatient training. Inpatient experience is an extremely important part of learning how to take care of patients in the outpatient setting, but ambulatory care is deceptively simple, requiring plenty of practice in order to get good at it. Ideally, your inpatient experience should include longitudinal care of patients from door-to-door, including the ED, ICU/CCU, as well as adult and pediatric medical floors. Many programs include inpatient peds rotations at a a local children's hospital, which is very helpful, especially if a community hospital's peds census is relatively low.

That's all I can think of off the top of my head. Hope this helps!

 

[Doc Oc]

In addition to the "how many deliveries"-type questions for OB, you'll want to be sure to ask about how many continuity patients the seniors have delivered. Alot of programs may have no trouble getting delivery numbers up, because you work with all the local OBs and basically have free reign to deliver most patients on the floor. However, some places have trouble getting patients to go to the Fm clinic for their prenatal care. In some communities, there is this perception that one must go to an OB.

In addition, in some communities, there are not good relations between the local OBs and the FP residency. You'll want to ask specifically about this, or you won't find it.

Some places will train you to do c-sections. Yes, without a fellowship. Duluth is one that comes to mind.

Some places have a very high volume, but you don't do as much labor management or triage because you are constantly running "from perineum to perineum", as one PD put it. Ask about this too.

Some Catholic institutions don't teach you how to do IUD insertions - you need to take an additional elective elsewhere to get that training. Same goes for vasectomies. If you are procedure-oriented, you'll want to ask that too.