irishking33

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I interviewed at a medical school for the 2016/17 cycle, then got waitlisted and was never taken off. Does that mean my chances of getting an interview invite at that school again for this cycle are less? Is it uncommon for schools to send an II to the same student for two years in a row after rejecting them the first time around? My GPA and MCAT have not changed but I've done about 400 additional hours of clinical volunteering and about 100 hours of math tutoring.
 

md-2020

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Correct, it is rare especially if your app has not improved significantly.
 
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Wouldn't 400 extra clinical hours be considered a significant improvement?
It depends on whether that was why you got denied (EDIT: Whoops you didnt get denied) in the first place.

If you used a different personal statement and rewrote your activities, then that could be beneficial to you as well.
 
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gonnif

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Lets clear up terms here. you were on the waitlist which means you had passed acceptable standards to start medical school but were lower priority and simply not enough seats to fit you into class. You were not rejected for being unwualified

I will have to strongly disagree @md-2020 as reapplicant who are previously WL would stand a higher chance of being offerred an interview, especially if they have enhanced their record. Essentially a school had already said yes to a waitlisted student and a little push should get them a seat
 
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Terror Billy

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Yeah also disagree with initial thought that you having interviewed last cycle will hurt you this cycle, if anything quite the opposite if you've improved areas that you thought were weaker in your app. I think if you look at school specific discussions across MDs and DOs you'll see numerous examples of people interviewing a second time after a previous cycle WL or post II rejection
 
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CyrilFiggis

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I applied two cycles in a row, got interviews and offers from the programs that waitlisted me the year prior. I had feedback from each program as to what they felt were the factors for the waitlist and not acceptance. Fortunately, I had been working on those during the first cycle and were not listed on the first app.
 
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Goro

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Lets clear up terms here. you were on the waitlist which means you had passed acceptable standards to start medical school but were lower priority and simply not enough seats to fit you into class. You were not rejected for being unwualified

I will have to strongly disagree @md-2020 as reapplicant who are previously WL would stand a higher chance of being offerred an interview, especially if they have enhanced their record. Essentially a school had already said yes to a waitlisted student and a little push should get them a seat
I'll disagree with my colleague here...sometimes interviewees are not qualified, but not enough of us on the Adcom can muster the votes to get that reject into action. So onto the wait list they go.
 
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irishking33

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I'll disagree with my colleague here...sometimes interviewees are not qualified, but not enough of us on the Adcom can muster the votes to get that reject into action. So onto the wait list they go.
If an interviewee was not qualified, why would they get an interview invite in the first place?
 

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Correct, it is rare especially if your app has not improved significantly.
Lets clear up terms here. you were on the waitlist which means you had passed acceptable standards to start medical school but were lower priority and simply not enough seats to fit you into class. You were not rejected for being unwualified

I will have to strongly disagree @md-2020 as reapplicant who are previously WL would stand a higher chance of being offerred an interview, especially if they have enhanced their record. Essentially a school had already said yes to a waitlisted student and a little push should get them a seat
I'll disagree with my colleague here...sometimes interviewees are not qualified, but not enough of us on the Adcom can muster the votes to get that reject into action. So onto the wait list they go.
.... so the answer is: it depends?
 
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Lawper

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If an interviewee was not qualified, why would they get an interview invite in the first place?
Because for some reason, their application managed to persuade a reviewer to grant an interview invite. The competition to get acceptance is much more intense than competition to get an interview.
 
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Goro

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If an interviewee was not qualified, why would they get an interview invite in the first place?
I'm talking about "qualified to be one of our students" after we've talked to the candidate.
 
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irishking33

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I'm talking about "qualified to be one of our students" after we've talked to the candidate.
Don't stats and the overall application play a role in the final admissions decision after the interview? Not just how well the interview went?
 
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Goro

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Don't stats and the overall application play a role in the final admissions decision after the interview? Not just how well the interview went?
Interviews will make or break you.

At our school, borderline candidates (stats-wise) have been saved by a great interview performance.

My school (and others) have rejected 4.0 GPA/40 MCAT interviewees on the basis of terrible interviews.
 
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irishking33

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Interviews will make or break you.

At our school, borderline candidates (stats-wise) have been saved by a great interview performance.

My school (and others) have rejected 4.0 GPA/40 MCAT interviewees on the basis of terrible interviews.
Wow. I wasn't aware all medical schools were like that. So you're saying stats don't matter at all once the interview starts?
 
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I interviewed at a medical school for the 2016/17 cycle, then got waitlisted and was never taken off. Does that mean my chances of getting an interview invite at that school again for this cycle are less? Is it uncommon for schools to send an II to the same student for two years in a row after rejecting them the first time around? My GPA and MCAT have not changed but I've done about 400 additional hours of clinical volunteering and about 100 hours of math tutoring.
Wayne State?
 

gonnif

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Wow. I wasn't aware all medical schools were like that. So you're saying stats don't matter at all once the interview starts?
They still matter but pre interview all the weight is on stats/application. Post interview you have now cut the stats/application from 100% to anywhere from 25% to 75% of the final decision (I am using percents conceptually here; there isnt a formula)
 
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gonnif

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I'm talking about "qualified to be one of our students" after we've talked to the candidate.
To expand, not simply qualified academically but considered qualified in all aspects of potential physician: academic, motivation, committment and social skills, the last one in the being what interviews tell an adcom
 
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gonnif

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I'll disagree with my colleague here...sometimes interviewees are not qualified, but not enough of us on the Adcom can muster the votes to get that reject into action. So onto the wait list they go.
I dislike schools that dont do a "cleanup" at the end for these kind of waitlists spots. But having been in my share of meetings, I have seen the social dynamics of adcoms at play. as the an old saying goes, those who respect the law and like good sausage should never watch either being made
 
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DokterMom

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I applied two cycles in a row, got interviews and offers from the programs that waitlisted me the year prior. I had feedback from each program as to what they felt were the factors for the waitlist and not acceptance. Fortunately, I had been working on those during the first cycle and were not listed on the first app.
This is how it's done Cyril --

Presumably you were good enough to get wait-listed, but not, at that time, great enough to make the cut. If your application is better now -- if you identified and fixed your weaknesses -- you'll be in a stronger position next year.

Of course @Goro has a good point. Schools with lots of 'noise' on the waitlist (so everyone who wasn't outright rejected) probably won't start with the presumption that you're "pretty good or better" if their waitlists were full of "only OK" applicants. Schools with "ranked" or "tiered" waitlists can short-cut your evaluation.
 
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gonnif

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This is how it's done Cyril --

Presumably you were good enough to get wait-listed, but not, at that time, great enough to make the cut. If your application is better now -- if you identified and fixed your weaknesses -- you'll be in a stronger position next year.

Of course @Goro has a good point. Schools with lots of 'noise' on the waitlist (so everyone who wasn't outright rejected) probably won't start with the presumption that you're "pretty good or better" if their waitlists were full of "only OK" applicants. Schools with "ranked" or "tiered" waitlists can short-cut your evaluation.
But this my point. The applicant has already been ranked as better than both pre and post interview direct rejects. That's top 10%-15% at most schools.
 

gyngyn

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But this my point. The applicant has already been ranked as better than both pre and post interview direct rejects. That's top 10%-15% at most schools.
If the school screens well, and the interview was the reason for a waitlist/reject decision, the odds that an applicant will "fix" the deficit in a year is quite small, in my experience. We very rarely re-interview for this reason.
 

gonnif

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If the school screens well, and the interview was the reason for a waitlist/reject decision, the odds that an applicant will "fix" the deficit in a year is quite small, in my experience. We very rarely re-interview for this reason.
And that goes to my constantly reposting the re-applicant info. It also goes to telling all my advisees that from the moment they apply, they should assume they will be a reapplicant, as 60% will be rejected and, therefore, should continue to enhance their record from the start

****************************************************
Many medical schools offer specific pages of advice for reapplicants, something I find few students look into. This would be true whether or not you are a specific reapplicant to that school. Below are links to a few and please note most say the most common mistake among reapplicants is applying again too soon

Should I do a Masters in my gap year / WAMC / advice please

University of Miami Miller School of Medicine
Reapplicants - Miller School of Medicine Admissions
Roughly 20% of the students who apply to the University of Miami Miller School of Medicine in any given year are reapplicants. Data that we have collected indicate they have a lower acceptance rate than do first time applicants

University of Wisconsin School of Medicine and Public Heath
http://www.med.wisc.edu/education/md/admissions/reapplying/31716
(emphasis in the original)
There should be significant improvements in your application before reapplying. This might mean not reapplying the very next year. The most common error made by reapplicants is that they submit their next application too soon.

The Ohio State University College of Medicine
The Ohio State University College of Medicine - Tips & Advice
To maximize the chances of giving off this perception, you must allow enough time before reapplying. This will undoubtedly be the hardest part of the process, but be patient; if you rush it, you may join the ranks of those who are applying for a third time.

University of Minnesota Medical School
Re-Applicant
Though you can submit a second application immediately after your first application, you may want to consider waiting a year if you feel you need more experiences that help you demonstrate the essential and desired qualities of an ideal medical student.

University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill
Reapplicants — admit
Our Ideal Candidate — admit

Virginia Tech Carilion School of Medicine
http://medicine.vtc.vt.edu/admissions/re-applicants/

LSU Health Shreveport
Re-Applicants

University of Missouri
http://medicine.missouri.edu/admissions/nontraditional.html

East Carolina University, Brody School of Medicine
whatif

Texas College of Osteopathic Medicine (UNTHSC)
https://www.unthsc.edu/texas-college-of-osteopathic-medicine/admissions-and-outreach/reapplicants-home/common-mistakes-made-by-applicants/

Michigan State University College of Osteopathic Medicine
http://www.com.msu.edu/Admissions/Guidelines_For_Success/Reapplication.htm
 

efle

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Wait did it ever get answered whether this is a school that waitlists everyone, or whether they only waitlist a small group that were good but not quite good enough? If the latter then you must not have bombed interview that badly. If the former then you really have no idea what they thought of you.
 

CyrilFiggis

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This is how it's done Cyril --

Presumably you were good enough to get wait-listed, but not, at that time, great enough to make the cut. If your application is better now -- if you identified and fixed your weaknesses -- you'll be in a stronger position next year.
For what it's worth, of the 4 programs that interviewed me the first go-around, 3 of them all gave different reasons for not offering me outright - more recent community service, more grades, more clinical. I really got to see the nuance that each program brings to its decision making process. It was actually more frustrating to hear that rather than hearing the same thing from all.
 
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