Go for the B.S. or drop to B.A.

[Happensinvegas]

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Hey y'all I am weighing two options now: Do I get 1) a B.S. in Biochemistry or 2) a B.A. in Chemistry
(There is no B,A in biochem)

I know adcoms don't care about B.s./B.a. but I was wondering if they do consider difficulty of science classes taken.

Pros of B.S:
-More "impressive" difficult classes
-2 more levels of biochem
-Must take 2 P-chem classes (opposed to none for BA)
-Must take diff E.Q. (don't have to for BA)
-Lab experience: BS requires 3 more labs than BA
-Provides a solid backup degree should I not get in med school
-Possibly higher MCAT score due to more in-depth classes on chemistry and biochem
-Classes are smaller (3o people) and easier to connect with professors for LOR

Cons of B.S:
- Will probably have a lower GPA due to harder classes
-Cannot take psych101 (that would help with MCAT)
-Must take more science classes per semester = lower GPA

Pros of B.A:
-Easier thus higher GPA
-Less classes to take which means I can take lighter course loads
- I can also take other classes like psych 101 for MCAT
-definitely a much higher sGPA

Cons of B.A:
-Possibly screwed with this degree if I don't get into med school
-Possible lower MCAT score on the bio/chem sections
-Has easier classes which might not impress adcomms
-Large class sizes (lecture halls) so hard to connect with professors

Here are the curriculums for each degree:

BA: https://advising.unc.edu/files/2012/11/CHEMBA-2014-2015.pdf
BS: https://advising.unc.edu/files/2012/11/CHEMBSBiochem-2014-2015.pdf

Your advice would be appreciated. Feel free to add any pros and cons you see as well.

 

[Lawpy]

No one cares about BS/BA, majors/minors etc. What is important is that you do well in classes.

The rigors of science courses are assessed by the prereqs. An upper level biology course is generally inferior and easier compared to an upper level humanities course. The MCAT can be self-studied using prep books.

It sounds like the BS route is better for you, but you are mistaken if you think the BA route filled with humanities electives is easier.

 

[deleted577188]

No one cares about BS/BA, majors/minors etc. What is important is that you do well in classes.

The rigors of science courses are assessed by the prereqs. An upper level biology course is generally inferior and easier compared to an upper level humanities course. The MCAT can be self-studied using prep books.

It sounds like the BS route is better for you, but you are mistaken if you think the BA route filled with humanities electives is easier.

Uh, no. That's not "generally" true.

To answer your question OP, no one cares.

 

[Cardboard101]

Do the B.S \o/
I've have some friends who are 2st year med students. They keep telling me biochemistry/gross anatomy were some of the hardest classes. Learn biochem in college so its easier when you get to med school. Plus it'll get you more used to how much work you're going to have in med school.

 

[deleted577188]

I wouldn't weight my potential MCAT score on having harder courses either.
Do you really not have to take P Chem for a BA in chem? Like not even a physical biochemistry or life science P Chem course? That's really weird. (No one will care that you didn't take PChem tho. Just pointing it out)

One more thing: a BS doesn't really give you any leg up. For example if you pursued a graduate degree in chem or biochem I've heard from most of my professors that no one would care about BS or BA degree.

 

[Lawpy]

Uh, no. That's not "generally" true.

Um yes it is in basically all regards. But let's not dissolve this thread into another debate where I discuss facts only to be undermined by fierce opinions.

 

[drjay16]

Do whichever one gives you the higher GPA


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[deleted577188]

Um yes it is in basically all regards. But let's not dissolve this thread into another debate where I discuss facts only to be undermined by fierce opinions.

How are upper level HUMANITIES harder than upper level bio courses? HOW?

And this can't be fact. This is opinion.

 

[The Real SVB]

Way overthinking. Do whatever. No one cares

 

[Lawpy]

How are upper level HUMANITIES harder than upper level bio courses? HOW?

And this can't be fact. This is opinion.

Unless you think analyzing the works of Romantic authors is somehow easier than memorizing biochemical pathways, humanities is harder than biology. There's a reason why humanities majors do better on the MCAT than biology majors, despite having a science disadvantage.

But take this conversation elsewhere, since I'm not interested in discussing facts against opinions.

 

[gyngyn]

We really don't care which degree.
We do care about your grades.

 

[paradoctor1]

Do whatever you think you will have a higher GPA in. That is what is most important for medical school with regard to your major. Having A's in slightly easier classes is much better than B's in harder classes

 

[tar_heel]

Same undergrad. Do the BA if you're set on med school; literally no one cares about your major or BS/BA, but everyone cares about your GPA.

 

[CaliforniaDreamer]

Lol I have taken both upper division humanities and sciences, there are definitely some easy upper div sciences, but there is no way that humanities classes are harder. They were always my low priority classes because I could skim the readings and crank out the papers in the day or to before the due dates. That was not possible with harder science classes, falling behind the material was usually a death sentence.

Unless you think analyzing the works of Romantic authors is somehow easier than memorizing biochemical pathways, humanities is harder than biology. There's a reason why humanities majors do better on the MCAT than biology majors, despite having a science disadvantage.

But take this conversation elsewhere, since I'm not interested in discussing facts against opinions.

 

[Lawpy]

Lol I have taken both upper division humanities and sciences, there are definitely some easy upper div sciences, but there is no way that humanities classes are harder. They were always my low priority classes because I could skim the readings and crank out the papers in the day or to before the due dates. That was not possible with harder science classes, falling behind the material was usually a death sentence.

Well congrats on having a knack for humanities courses and deal with subjective evaluation on your papers. Curiously, I hardly see being behind on "harder" biology courses ever being a problem since it requires rote memorization as opposed to critical analysis and synthesis of information (though some very very good universities saw this discrepancy and corrected it so kudos to them). Memorizing is easy; analysis isn't.

Hence why humanities is generally harder than biology and why humanities majors do better on MCAT and in medical school. I put humanities on the same difficulty scale as physical sciences (though it could be a tad lower). Biology, however, is no where close (biochemistry and neuroscience are separate from biology due to their interdisciplinary states).

But really, we can discuss this elsewhere since it is an interesting topic, but not worthwhile to the main topic at hand.

 

[deleted577188]

Lol I have taken both upper division humanities and sciences, there are definitely some easy upper div sciences, but there is no way that humanities classes are harder. They were always my low priority classes because I could skim the readings and crank out the papers in the day or to before the due dates. That was not possible with harder science classes, falling behind the material was usually a death sentence.

There's no way in hell man.



And I'm not even a bio major.

 

[Cardboard101]

We really don't care which degree.
We do care about your grades.

Wait, I thought adcoms looked more favorably towards an Engineering major compared to an English major assuming the same GPA.

 

[chocoholicsoxfan]

Well congrats on having a knack for humanities courses and deal with subjective evaluation on your papers. Curiously, I hardly see being behind on "harder" biology courses ever being a problem since it requires rote memorization as opposed to critical analysis and synthesis of information (though some very very good universities saw this discrepancy and corrected it so kudos to them). Memorizing is easy; analysis isn't.

Hence why humanities is generally harder than biology and why humanities majors do better on MCAT and in medical school. I put humanities on the same difficulty scale as physical sciences (though it could be a tad lower). Biology, however, is no where close (biochemistry and neuroscience are separate from biology due to their interdisciplinary states).

But really, we can discuss this elsewhere since it is an interesting topic, but not worthwhile to the main topic at hand.

Sorry but you can't objectively say that critical thinking is harder than memorization. For me it is actually easier just based on my background. I'm getting a BA in humanities (French literature) and a BS in Genetics, so yes I have seen both sides. I've never gotten below an A in an upper level humanities course, and I've gotten Bs aplenty in my science courses.

Also, humanities majors who take the MCAT are a lot more self-selecting than science majors who do it. That could in part explain the higher scores.

 

[Lawpy]

Sorry but you can't objectively say that critical thinking is harder than memorization. For me it is actually easier just based on my background. I'm getting a BA in humanities (French literature) and a BS in Genetics, so yes I have seen both sides. I've never gotten below an A in an upper level humanities course, and I've gotten Bs aplenty in my science courses.

Also, humanities majors who take the MCAT are a lot more self-selecting than science majors who do it. That could in part explain the higher scores.

Sigh... discussing general trends with anecdotes. Real fun. Like I said constantly but people are intentionally ignoring, we can carry this conversation elsewhere if it really matters that much.

 

[CaliforniaDreamer]

Also since when are upper div bio classes just memorization? It could be true if your prof is a poor test maker.

Edit: also why can you just split off biochem and neuro? What about genetics? That doesn't count as bio either? What about population dynamics? If they don't count then I declare that you can't count history or English as humanities classes because they have their own particularities!

 

[chocoholicsoxfan]

Sigh... discussing general trends with anecdotes. Real fun. Like I said constantly but people are intentionally ignoring, we can carry this conversation elsewhere if it really matters that much.

OK fine. Post maybe TWO sources that support what you're saying and I believe you. You cannot just say "I'm stating fact but you people just have opinions" without backing it up, which is why the burden of proof is on you.

 

[CaliforniaDreamer]

OK fine. Post maybe TWO sources that support what you're saying and I believe you. You cannot just say "I'm stating fact but you people just have opinions" without backing it up, which is why the burden of proof is on you.

Humanities majors doing better on the MCAT /= humanities classes are harder than science classes anyways

 

[Lawpy]

OK fine. Post maybe TWO sources that support what you're saying and I believe you. You cannot just say "I'm stating fact but you people just have opinions" without backing it up, which is why the burden of proof is on you.

The burden of proof is always with me when I have to deal with anecdotes. Yet the burden of the thread lies on being on-topic, which means the rest of the conversation has to be discussed elsewhere, be it PM/VM/social thread etc.

And I'm not the one doing it since I don't care much about the topic 😉

Also since when are upper div bio classes just memorization? It could be true if your prof is a poor test maker.

Edit: also why can you just split off biochem and neuro? What about genetics? That doesn't count as bio either? What about population dynamics? If they don't count then I declare that you can't count history or English as humanities classes because they have their own particularities!

Humanities majors doing better on the MCAT /= humanities classes are harder than science classes anyways

Gee, if you're this impatient to know what my stances are, maybe you should do OP a favor by carrying the conversation elsewhere like I said before. Especially since OP doesn't care about this topic (only which degree is better) and the controversy emerged from a minor detail in my post that only served to reject the notion that BA is easier than BS.

 

[Cardboard101]

OK fine. Post maybe TWO sources that support what you're saying and I believe you. You cannot just say "I'm stating fact but you people just have opinions" without backing it up, which is why the burden of proof is on you.

Ah, the good old Hitchen's Razor.

Can't we all just agree that some classes may be harder for some people and some may be harder for others?

 

[chocoholicsoxfan]

Can't we all just agree that some classes may be harder for some people and some may be harder for others?

Which is PRECISELY what I said in an earlier post, if you look up. I said different people have different skills. For some, memorization is easier. For some, analysis is easier.

 

[chocoholicsoxfan]

Humanities majors doing better on the MCAT /= humanities classes are harder than science classes anyways

That's what I said. Pretty sure humanities majors taking it are a much more self-selecting bunch.

 

[The Cheat]

Shouldn't class difficulty ultimatley lie with the prof that teaches the class? A prof can give out hardly any A's or can give an A to over half the class if they want to( except at a few institutions)

 

[Cardboard101]

Shouldn't class difficulty ultimatley lie with the prof that teaches the class? A prof can give out hardly any A's or can give an A to over half the class if they want to( except at a few institutions)

I've attended a few undergrad universities sometimes taking the same class for grade replacement and the difficulty seems to be consistent at least for STEM classes among 4 year colleges.

 

[gyngyn]

Wait, I thought adcoms looked more favorably towards an Engineering major compared to an English major assuming the same GPA.

Not in my experience.

 

[gannicus89]

Um yes it is in basically all regards. But let's not dissolve this thread into another debate where I discuss facts only to be undermined by fierce opinions.

I majored in Biology and in English. The Biology major required 2-3x more effort. My gpa in just English is a 3.9. I don't want to talk about my gpa in just Biology.

 

[ChrisMack390]

I say do the BS in biochem, because what the hell is a Bachelor's of the Arts in Chemistry? What do you learn about, the civil rights violations against electrons in lower molecular orbitals?

 

[Banco]

Unless you think analyzing the works of Romantic authors is somehow easier than memorizing biochemical pathways, humanities is harder than biology. There's a reason why humanities majors do better on the MCAT than biology majors, despite having a science disadvantage.

But take this conversation elsewhere, since I'm not interested in discussing facts against opinions.

Decent point, but then again every pre-med and their mother is a bio major, while there are very few humanities applicants - I can't help but think the humanities majors that apply to medical school are self selected in some way. You can see in your own link that there are 27k bio majors, but 2k humanities.

 

[deleted577188]

I say do the BS in biochem, because what the hell is a Bachelor's of the Arts in Chemistry? What do you learn about, the civil rights violations against electrons in lower molecular orbitals?

You have this all wrong. You should literally be embarrassed if you are serious right now.

 

[deleted577188]

Decent point, but then again every pre-med and their mother is a bio major, while there are very few humanities applicants - I can't help but think the humanities majors that apply to medical school are self selected in some way. You can see in your own link that there are 27k bio majors, but 2k humanities.

Exactly. Lawper has some absurd points of view.

 

[Banco]

Honestly though it depends on the person. Humanities courses have been harder for me than science courses, including orgo/biochem etc. Some people just do better in different classes. But what I've also noticed is that most of the time the professor ends up being the deciding factor in terms of how difficult or easy a course is.

 

[Lawpy]

Exactly. Lawper has some absurd points of view.

You have the time to attack me but too scared to continue the conversation elsewhere. Nice work champ

Decent point, but then again every pre-med and their mother is a bio major, while there are very few humanities applicants - I can't help but think the humanities majors that apply to medical school are self selected in some way. You can see in your own link that there are 27k bio majors, but 2k humanities.

That is a fair point but like i said (and to those who are keep dragging me here) we can continue the conversation elsewhere. Or create a thread and i'll discuss freely

 

[ChrisMack390]

You have this all wrong. You should literally be embarrassed if you are serious right now.

No hate on humanities intended - I would think a B.S. in English Lit was equally stupid.

 

[CaliforniaDreamer]

Honestly though it depends on the person. Humanities courses have been harder for me than science courses, including orgo/biochem etc. Some people just do better in different classes. But what I've also noticed is that most of the time the professor ends up being the deciding factor in terms of how difficult or easy a course is.

Sometime I feel like humanities courses have felt like more work, and I felt like I enjoyed science classes more, but I have never gotten less than an A in any course that wasn't a science course, so they must not have been harder?

 

[efle]

My .02/experience

A single upper level bio = Prereqs >>> Humanities > all other upper level bio

 

[Lawpy]

My .02/experience

A single upper level bio = Prereqs >>> Humanities > all other upper level bio

Now that is something that we can agree on

Not really 😛

 

[deleted577188]

No hate on humanities intended - I would think a B.S. in English Lit was equally stupid.

It's not about the humanities. It's about BA vs BS not differing in the humanities, but instead in the actual science courses. (At 99% of colleges)

 

[deleted577188]

You have the time to attack me but too scared to continue the conversation elsewhere. Nice work champ



That is a fair point but like i said (and to those who are keep dragging me here) we can continue the conversation elsewhere. Or create a thread and i'll discuss freely

You'll do the same thing you did for physics. Tell me you don't care to continue conversation elsewhere because you're right and I'm wrong. So where is this "elsewhere" you speak of?

 

[ChrisMack390]

It's not about the humanities. It's about BA vs BS not differing in the humanities, but instead in the actual science courses. (At 99% of colleges)

I work with someone with a B.A. in Biology. She somehow got a degree in biology without ever taking organic chemistry or physics.

That is NOT a degree in biology.

 

[Lawpy]

You'll do the same thing you did for physics. Tell me you don't care to continue conversation elsewhere because you're right and I'm wrong. So where is this "elsewhere" you speak of?

Are you serious? I'm being respectful to the OP and abiding by the sticky saying to avoid derailing threads with off-topic posts. Such conversations can be done in a social thread, by PMs, in a separate thread discussing this topic etc. Since i have no obligation to defend myself because commenters only responded to a single sentence of my post, they should discuss this matter with me elsewhere rather than extending this off-topic conversation and dragging me here for fun.

 

[LilKangaroo]

I don't think med schools really look too hard into the difficulty of science courses taken, mostly because it varies by school.
Personally, I say go with the BA, take the med school pre-reqs, and get the good GPA.

 

[Happensinvegas]

I wouldn't weight my potential MCAT score on having harder courses either.
Do you really not have to take P Chem for a BA in chem? Like not even a physical biochemistry or life science P Chem course? That's really weird. (No one will care that you didn't take PChem tho. Just pointing it out

One more thing: a BS doesn't really give you any leg up. For example if you pursued a graduate degree in chem or biochem I've heard from most of my professors that no one would care about BS or BA degree.

I just wanted to respond to your shock. The BA in chem you have to do CHEM 481 or CHEM 480. The former is P-Chem while the later is Biophysics. So P-chem isn't required if you choose to do biophysics instead. If you are wondering what the course-codes mean for the BA heres the break down:

Chem 241/L - Analytical Chemistry and its lab
Chem 251 - Inorganic Chemistry (Mostly transition metals ****)
Chem 261 - Orgo 1 [We dont have an orgo 1 lab]
Chem 262/L - Orgo 2 and lab
Chem 430 - Biochemistry 1
Chem 550L - Synthetic Chemistry Lab

Here are the Course-Codes for BS
Chem 431 - Biochemistry 2
Chem 432 - Biochemistry 3
Chem 481/L - P-chem 1 and its lab
Chem 482 - P-chem 2 without lab
Chem 530L - Biochemistry Lab
Math 383 - Differential Equations

 

[deleted577188]

Are you serious? I'm being respectful to the OP and abiding by the sticky saying to avoid derailing threads with off-topic posts. Such conversations can be done in a social thread, by PMs, in a separate thread discussing this topic etc. Since i have no obligation to defend myself because commenters only responded to a single sentence of my post, they should discuss this matter with me elsewhere rather than extending this off-topic conversation and dragging me here for fun.

You said the exact same thing about physics. You offered to talk about physics elsewhere and then did not want to PM because you were not open to hearing what anyone else thought. I'm not trying to demean you or derail this thread. I just disagree with over half of your opinions and will comment on them when I do find inconsistencies.

This is a place where people take the advice they are given very seriously, and telling people your "absolutely correct in all regards" opinions is absurd. Physics or humanities may be your favorite things in the world, but algebraic physics is fine for the MCAT and for understanding physics overall, just as there are many blow off upper level humanities courses that are easier than upper level biology courses. I only intervene when one treats their n=1 experience as the absolute way things are or as the only way the world works. I think you should seriously consider ending every one of your posts regarding giving advice with "this is just my personal experience/opinion". Simply presenting opinion based arguments as absolute truth is, as I've stated twice before, absurd.

(Nothing I've said is out of spite or comes from an ill-heart. I want the best for everyone on here, but giving bad advice anonymously, is in my opionion, just as bad as a trolling by asking stupid questions.)

Good luck to you, Lawper.

 

[deleted577188]

I just wanted to respond to your shock. The BA in chem you have to do CHEM 481 or CHEM 480. The former is P-Chem while the later is Biophysics. So P-chem isn't required if you choose to do biophysics instead. If you are wondering what the course-codes mean for the BA heres the break down:

Chem 241/L - Analytical Chemistry and its lab
Chem 251 - Inorganic Chemistry (Mostly transition metals ****)
Chem 261 - Orgo 1 [We dont have an orgo 1 lab]
Chem 262/L - Orgo 2 and lab
Chem 430 - Biochemistry 1
Chem 550L - Synthetic Chemistry Lab

Here are the Course-Codes for BS
Chem 431 - Biochemistry 2
Chem 432 - Biochemistry 3
Chem 481/L - P-chem 1 and its lab
Chem 482 - P-chem 2 without lab
Chem 530L - Biochemistry Lab
Math 383 - Differential Equations

Ahh, I see. I'm not totally familiar with your schools requirements for each degree but I can assure you that not a single adcom gives a single **** about whether you complete a BS degree (see above posts, by actual adcoms, not spiteful pre-meds who give bad advice). And yes, a BA, even with more humanities courses (in your schools case apparently), would probably be easier than a BS. This is just how college works. I can't think of a single instance where a BA would be harder than a BS. No one cares after all is said and done. Do what you want.

 

[deleted577188]

I work with someone with a B.A. in Biology. She somehow got a degree in biology without ever taking organic chemistry or physics.

That is NOT a degree in biology.

That moment when you realize organic chemistry or physics are not humanities courses, which I was referring to in my post.

 

[Lawpy]

You said the exact same thing about physics. You offered to talk about physics elsewhere and then did not want to PM because you were not open to hearing what anyone else thought. I'm not trying to demean you or derail this thread. I just disagree with over half of your opinions and will comment on them when I do find inconsistencies.

This is a place where people take the advice they are given very seriously, and telling people your "absolutely correct in all regards" opinions is absurd. Physics or humanities may be your favorite things in the world, but algebraic physics is fine for the MCAT and for understanding physics overall, just as there are many blow off upper level humanities courses that are easier than upper level biology courses. I only intervene when one treats their n=1 experience as the absolute way things are or as the only way the world works. I think you should seriously consider ending every one of your posts regarding giving advice with "this is just my personal experience/opinion". Simply presenting opinion based arguments as absolute truth is, as I've stated twice before, absurd.

(Nothing I've said is out of spite or comes from an ill-heart. I want the best for everyone on here, but giving bad advice anonymously, is in my opionion, just as bad as a trolling by asking stupid questions.)

Good luck to you, Lawper.

I didn't know physics is the topic of this thread. And why are you so hesitant to PM me what you feel? I honestly don't care what you think, because i know for certainty what i say when i give academic-related advice. Is it absurd? No. I know what it is and can back up easily. The issue lies when detractors disrespect the OP and stubbornly refuse to take the discussion elsewhere.

Listen, what you say about physics is misguided and inaccurate. Plain and simple. What you say about humanities is insulting to those who had to slog through difficult, subjective essays involving complicated analyses of short, vague poems.

I am happy to discuss this matter further and justify my stance, but you need to end your stubborness to PMs, and stop derailing threads when i tell you to stop for courtesy for OP.

Good luck to you as well

EDIT: perhaps if you really care about the topic that should be open for discussion, create a thread and tag me over. I will ensure to respond with ample evidence and dispel any and all myths that will harm the applicants academically