GPA/DAT Isn't everything

[RSalha17]

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Hey guys,

I just want to give a little bit of confidence and insight to those who applied (or are planning on applying in the future) who don't have a stellar GPA or killer DAT scores. Contrary to popular belief, you don't need amazing stats to get interviews at great schools. My stats are at/below average, and I have received 4 interviews so far, 2 pre-dec and 2 post-dec (stats/interviews are below). Don't get me wrong, gpa/dat scores are an integral part of your application, and a quick way to get an adcom's attention, but once your application is initially reviewed, gpa/dat are NOT everything.

My EC's, work/volunteer experience, research experience, etc. played a VERY important role in making my application stand out. I have spent hundreds of hours in dentists office and volunteering in my community, and have SHOWED the adcoms that i want to be a dentist and that I am committed to my community rather than just telling them. They want to see that you are dedicated to the profession and serving others, and shadowing at a couple dentist offices or volunteering for a few months before you send in your apps is not going to get their attention.

What WILL get their attention is showing how you cope with and overcome adversity, and that you have a strong understanding of the problems in dentistry and how you will help fix them. Referencing personal experiences and connecting them to these ideas is the best way to SHOW them that you understand these problems. For example, instead of just SAYING that I have shadowed in a community clinic and understand that we need more dentists willing to serve in underserved areas, you can SHOW them how volunteering in a community clinic has taught you that we need to change this problem by giving a short anecdote or story about how this has personally effected you. I made a cognitive effort to focus on this in my AADSAS app and secondaries and I really think it helped me stand out.

Please don't get the wrong idea from this post, I am not trying to gloat about my interviews or toot my own horn, I am simply offering some advice/support to those like me that don't have amazing stats. You don't need amazing stats to get noticed, but you do need to SHOW the adcoms that you want this career.

Good luck to everyone and like always, feel free to PM me with any questions or comments. Happy thanksgiving!

 

[KittySquared]

The few folks I've interacted on this forum all seem to think applicants like myself should have more interviews than 3, but 3 are all I have, despite having clinical experience, publication and hundreds of EC hours. I'm convinced that dental school application is more of a crap shoot than anything else. During last years or maybe next year's cycle, you may be sitting on 7 interviews or none at all.

 

[Zbtb7]

It's too early to discuss how successful our application cycles have been and why. Save this thread for December 3rd when schools show their cards.

 

[Destiny11]

The few folks I've interacted on this forum all seem to think applicants like myself should have more interviews than 3, but 3 are all I have, despite having clinical experience, publication and hundreds of EC hours. I'm convinced that dental school application is more of a crap shoot than anything else. During last years or maybe next year's cycle, you may be sitting on 7 interviews or none at all.

All you need is 1.

 

[KittySquared]

All you need is 1.

1 interview or 1 acceptance? Plenty of applicants from last year had 2 or 3 interviews and didn't get in anywhere.

 

[tomhrxbfg]

1 interview or 1 acceptance? Plenty of applicants from last year had 2 or 3 interviews and didn't get in anywhere.

...made me nervous😡

 

[RSalha17]

I'm not saying that I am guaranteeing that I get accepted, but as we all know an interview is needed for a chance at an acceptance. With the increasing competitive nature of dental school applications, your gpa/dat is not the only thing schools want. Also, some may have tons of ECs, but again it is how you show what you've learned from those experiences that is really what matters. Just my opinion.

 

[BruinDentist]

The few folks I've interacted on this forum all seem to think applicants like myself should have more interviews than 3, but 3 are all I have, despite having clinical experience, publication and hundreds of EC hours. I'm convinced that dental school application is more of a crap shoot than anything else. During last years or maybe next year's cycle, you may be sitting on 7 interviews or none at all.

With the thousands of applications each school handles every year, luck is a major factor.

 

[DentalHopeful28]

It's too early to discuss how successful our application cycles have been and why. Save this thread for December 3rd when schools show their cards.

Well said👍

 

[wcombs]

I've had a completely different experience. Speaking of overcoming adversity, I failed out of my first year due to my father's suicide. I took a year off and have maintained a 4.0 GPA since. I rocked the DAT and have plenty of club involvement including a leadership position. I've shadowed dentists and volunteered as a youth tennis coach. I'm writing an honors thesis. I thought my application was strong but I didn't receive a single interview.

After I failed out, I took prerequisites at community college because everyone and their mom told me it would be fine. I'd like to see anyone get back into a university with a 1.6 GPA, and not to mention my family was living in absolute poverty without my dad's income. The classes I took at a community college are the same classes that lead me to score in the 99.6th percentile on those subjects on the DAT, but I guess that wasn't enough to show schools that I received a solid foundation at the CC. I've since worked my way back into a respected university and I've made straight A's even with very intense science course loads.

Nope. Not enough. They want more and I don't know what to give them. I'm so beyond bitter about the whole thing and I'm frustrated that not one school would even give me a freaking chance. I'm so sick of seeing these intellectually average kids just coasting their way through college with an easy major and not focusing on getting into dental school until their senior year, only to receive multiple interviews because they did it the conventional way. Meanwhile I've been busting my ass off just to be noticed and my application is just completely ignored because I had to do things differently.

Sorry, I meant to provide constructive insight and ended up venting. I know I still have a decent chance of interviewing this cycle. I'm just really disappointed that no schools saw potential in me. Congrats to everyone with interviews and good luck come December 3rd 🙂

 

[sun228]

My story is very different from everyone else out here, my life is interwoven with surviving cancer and poverty. Despite many challenges in life, I came out strong. I battled with cancer in undergrad school years therefore my grades suffered. In order to compensate the damage, I entered into the grad program and maintained 3.6 GPA by doing 58 credits of work. This is my fourth time applying to dental programs and this cycle is empty like last few times. I have two scientific publications, working full-time since the age of 16, >1000 volunteer hours, >600 shadowing hours, >5000 hours of research and >20k working hours. Some people are just not lucky. Good luck to those who have interviews 😀

 

[Destiny11]

1 interview or 1 acceptance? Plenty of applicants from last year had 2 or 3 interviews and didn't get in anywhere.

1 interview and ace it. A lot of people that got in only had 1 or 2 interviews.

 

[LaughingGas]

OP congrats on your interviews.

wcombs and sun228. I am nowhere close to what you guys had to deal, but I understand how it can be frustrating. After learning that I can do well hard science classes, gives me a more reason to not want to give up, but also very irritating because wish for what I was dealing, I was more mature to handle so I wouldn't have done postbac for almost 3 years and be a graduating dental student by now. I hope you best luck.

 

[RSalha17]

I've had a completely different experience. Speaking of overcoming adversity, I failed out of my first year due to my father's suicide. I took a year off and have maintained a 4.0 GPA since. I rocked the DAT and have plenty of club involvement including a leadership position. I've shadowed dentists and volunteered as a youth tennis coach. I'm writing an honors thesis. I thought my application was strong but I didn't receive a single interview.

After I failed out, I took prerequisites at community college because everyone and their mom told me it would be fine. I'd like to see anyone get back into a university with a 1.6 GPA, and not to mention my family was living in absolute poverty without my dad's income. The classes I took at a community college are the same classes that lead me to score in the 99.6th percentile on those subjects on the DAT, but I guess that wasn't enough to show schools that I received a solid foundation at the CC. I've since worked my way back into a respected university and I've made straight A's even with very intense science course loads.

Nope. Not enough. They want more and I don't know what to give them. I'm so beyond bitter about the whole thing and I'm frustrated that not one school would even give me a freaking chance. I'm so sick of seeing these intellectually average kids just coasting their way through college with an easy major and not focusing on getting into dental school until their senior year, only to receive multiple interviews because they did it the conventional way. Meanwhile I've been busting my ass off just to be noticed and my application is just completely ignored because I had to do things differently.

Sorry, I meant to provide constructive insight and ended up venting. I know I still have a decent chance of interviewing this cycle. I'm just really disappointed that no schools saw potential in me. Congrats to everyone with interviews and good luck come December 3rd 🙂

Wcombs and Sun228:

I really respect the both of you for the adversity you have faced in your lives and I can only imagine how much you guys have gone through and how difficult it was to overcome your struggles. You are both inspirational individuals. I am really surprised that you guys haven't gotten an interview yet, because I feel that adcoms want to see people like you guys who have overcome everything to be in the place you are.

In no way am i trying to compare my situation to yours, but I want you guys to know that I have faced my own adversities that have had a significant impact on my life. I will PM you guys with more details but I basically had to raise myself since I was thirteen years old, and haven't really had family to back me up since then.

I was under the impression that the adcoms took my story and found it unique and one that stood out over others, and that is why I got an interview... but maybe I am mistaken and just got lucky with a few adcoms that connected with my application, and wanted to give me a chance.

Anyways, the reason for this post was only to give some insight and confidence to others in my position and let them know that interviews ARE possible even if you don't have amazing stats. I think that sometimes people over/mis interpret these posts. I am by no means bragging, or guaranteeing an acceptance, I am simply trying to help some others that feel down about not having the best grades/test scores, because before I applied I felt like I had a very VERY slim chance at getting into d school.

How many schools did you guys apply to? I should have also mention that I applied to 20 schools, so I think that was definitely a factor in increasing my chances of an adcom luckily connecting with my app.

Take a look at this thread for a little inspiration:

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=244523

 

[predentalguy20]

I've had a completely different experience. Speaking of overcoming adversity, I failed out of my first year due to my father's suicide. I took a year off and have maintained a 4.0 GPA since. I rocked the DAT and have plenty of club involvement including a leadership position. I've shadowed dentists and volunteered as a youth tennis coach. I'm writing an honors thesis. I thought my application was strong but I didn't receive a single interview.

After I failed out, I took prerequisites at community college because everyone and their mom told me it would be fine. I'd like to see anyone get back into a university with a 1.6 GPA, and not to mention my family was living in absolute poverty without my dad's income. The classes I took at a community college are the same classes that lead me to score in the 99.6th percentile on those subjects on the DAT, but I guess that wasn't enough to show schools that I received a solid foundation at the CC. I've since worked my way back into a respected university and I've made straight A's even with very intense science course loads.

Nope. Not enough. They want more and I don't know what to give them. I'm so beyond bitter about the whole thing and I'm frustrated that not one school would even give me a freaking chance. I'm so sick of seeing these intellectually average kids just coasting their way through college with an easy major and not focusing on getting into dental school until their senior year, only to receive multiple interviews because they did it the conventional way. Meanwhile I've been busting my ass off just to be noticed and my application is just completely ignored because I had to do things differently.

Sorry, I meant to provide constructive insight and ended up venting. I know I still have a decent chance of interviewing this cycle. I'm just really disappointed that no schools saw potential in me. Congrats to everyone with interviews and good luck come December 3rd 🙂

I am surprised you did NOT get any interviews yet. If it is because CC prereqs then I am pretty much fuxxxx big time. My DAT is much lower than yours. Have you gotten rejections?
FYI, plenty of kids did the CC route and got in. How many schools did you apply to?

 

[Bis-GMA111]

as others have said, this app process is a crap shoot, and a good amount of luck is required in the process. realize that even though your application stats may have gotten you this far, it may/may not work for everyone else bc everyone's story is different. for all you know, maybe your interview invitations were for waitlist spots? heck, maybe my interviews are for waitlist spots? no one outside of the admissions committee bubbles really know.

so does that mean that anyone with a 20+ DAT, a high gpa and publications, etc. is entitled to at least an interview? by no means. no one is entitled to anything. you work hard and you put the best possible application into the system and see what happens. but from a mathematical standpoint, the probability is in your favor with higher stats.

in any case, congrats to you on your interviews and i wish you nothing but the best of luck.

 

[KittySquared]

With the thousands of applications each school handles every year, luck is a major factor.

Yup. That is very very true.

1 interview and ace it. A lot of people that got in only had 1 or 2 interviews.

And there are just as many, if not more, who aced that 1 or 2 interview(s) and still didn't get in anywhere. It's better to mentally prepare for the worst so you don't get thoroughly and mind crushingly disappointed when things don't pan out.

I've had a completely different experience. Speaking of overcoming adversity, I failed out of my first year due to my father's suicide. I took a year off and have maintained a 4.0 GPA since. I rocked the DAT and have plenty of club involvement including a leadership position. I've shadowed dentists and volunteered as a youth tennis coach. I'm writing an honors thesis. I thought my application was strong but I didn't receive a single interview.

After I failed out, I took prerequisites at community college because everyone and their mom told me it would be fine. I'd like to see anyone get back into a university with a 1.6 GPA, and not to mention my family was living in absolute poverty without my dad's income. The classes I took at a community college are the same classes that lead me to score in the 99.6th percentile on those subjects on the DAT, but I guess that wasn't enough to show schools that I received a solid foundation at the CC. I've since worked my way back into a respected university and I've made straight A's even with very intense science course loads.

Nope. Not enough. They want more and I don't know what to give them. I'm so beyond bitter about the whole thing and I'm frustrated that not one school would even give me a freaking chance. I'm so sick of seeing these intellectually average kids just coasting their way through college with an easy major and not focusing on getting into dental school until their senior year, only to receive multiple interviews because they did it the conventional way. Meanwhile I've been busting my ass off just to be noticed and my application is just completely ignored because I had to do things differently.

Sorry, I meant to provide constructive insight and ended up venting. I know I still have a decent chance of interviewing this cycle. I'm just really disappointed that no schools saw potential in me. Congrats to everyone with interviews and good luck come December 3rd 🙂

wcombs, you have my sincere condolences. I've dealt with some deaths in the family myself, during my college years. It wasn't easy keeping focused in school, let alone doing well. Your DAT score and the fact that you persevered through your hardships are more than proof that you are capable of succeeding in dental school. I'm assuming you're a Florida resident? If so, PM me.

it is how you show what you've learned from those experiences that is really what matters. Just my opinion.

Nobody gives a hoot about that until they read your personal statement, and they won't read it until you are in the "to be considered" pile on the adcoms' desks, and to be considered, it's all about the stats. If you think adcoms read thousands of essays first, prior to even looking at GPA/DAT scores, then I think you're mistaken. Correct me if I'm wrong, however.

 

[gumdrop16]

Nobody gives a hoot about that until they read your personal statement, and they won't read it until you are in the "to be considered" pile on the adcoms' desks, and to be considered, it's all about the stats. If you think adcoms read thousands of essays first, prior to even looking at GPA/DAT scores, then I think you're mistaken. Correct me if I'm wrong, however.

+1 lolololll hahahaha agreed.

 

[UCSFx2017]

Nobody gives a hoot about that until they read your personal statement, and they won't read it until you are in the "to be considered" pile on the adcoms' desks, and to be considered, it's all about the stats. If you think adcoms read thousands of essays first, prior to even looking at GPA/DAT scores, then I think you're mistaken. Correct me if I'm wrong, however.

An admissions dean did tell me that he looked at the entire application when choosing who to invite so you could be mistaken. They will likely not read your personal statement as if it were a textbook but they'll probably skim through it quickly. Always start your statement with a hook and wrap up your statement at the end by referencing the hook. It helps the reader better remember you.

 

[gumdrop16]

An admissions dean did tell me that he looked at the entire application when choosing who to invite so you could be mistaken. They will likely not read your personal statement as if it were a textbook but they'll probably skim through it quickly. Always start your statement with a hook and wrap up your statement at the end by referencing the hook. It helps the reader better remember you.

thats not what kitty means. what kitty meant was adcoms do not read everybodys personal statement who applies to their dental school (thousands of personal statements), most likey. they scan for GPA and dat, and once that scan is done and minimum criteria in those areas are met, then YES im sure they read select PS's after that.

 

[Msmouth]

I envision a bingo machine loaded with applications and once they get their 300 or so applications they start reading.....

 

[UCSFx2017]

thats not what kitty means. what kitty meant was adcoms do not read everybodys personal statement who applies to their dental school (thousands of personal statements), most likey. they scan for GPA and dat, and once that scan is done and minimum criteria in those areas are met, then YES im sure they read select PS's after that.

I know exactly what she (most likely a she 🙂) meant and I'm saying that at this particular school, the admissions dean said he read the entire application, which includes the personal statement. Obviously, schools that have stringent academic cut-offs will not consider applicants with 2.5 GPA and 16 DAT.
She uses the phrase "to be considered" to describe the pile of applications worth reading; this pile includes all applicants who meet the minimum criteria but not those who are below the school's anticipated averages. We are all speculating but I am saying that it is more appropriate to assume that schools will read the entire application for all students above or below the anticipated averages, so long as they meet the minimum prerequisite GPA, courses, and DAT. How else can you explain those few outliers who are admitted to schools that have averages well above the outliers' own scores. It is incredibly unfair and unprofessional for schools to not consider the whole application, of everyone who meets the minimum cut-offs, after the applicants each pay the $70 fee.

Both RSalha17's and KittySquared's comments represent two opposite extremes. One claims that it's only experiences, extracurriculars, and the conveying of those experiences that matters. The other claims that the interview selection is a numbers-only game. Obviously, both factors are considered.

 

[UCSFx2017]

When asked what it means to be granted an interview, Dr. David Wofsy, Associate Dean of Admissions at UCSF medical school said,

"You are in the driver's seat, when you are an applicant. I don't think it feels that way. Right? You go into an interview and you feel like you're being judged and you feel like all the power is on the other side of the table. But that's not the truth. Schools are only interviewing people they're very interested in. Everybody we interview is somebody we are very impressed by and somebody we are quite convinced that would be an outstanding student at UCSF. And so we interview 500 people and if our class size was 500, we would have no trouble in accepting all of them. So our attitude is 'These are terrific people who have succeeded in coming through a very highly-demanding, competitive process to be among the handful of people we interview. We will want them. That's not just here, that's everywhere. The people that all medical schools are inviting to the interview are people they are really interested in. So, the first thing for an applicant to realize in, is you have some power in this interaction. And you should relax, and be confident, and be yourself. The school has already decided that it's yourself they're interested in. So I think that's the first thing and [that] is to recognize that the school is being judged as you're being judged and to take that part seriously. And I think the second piece of general advice is don't over-rehearse. I think one of the thing that plays badly in an interview is that it sounds like there is a little tape recorder in your head of the things you think you should say but really they're not being responsive to the question or to the flow of conversation. So I think it's important to do a little practicing and a little rehearsing with people and to get comfortable with the interview setting. Some people are really good at that as virtue of their personalities and for other people it's a struggle. We recognize that so a little practice is fine. But I actually think that the people who come in over-practiced and over-rehearsed look over-practiced and over-rehearsed and it doesn't work to their advantage."​

Listen to the entire conversation on episode 407 of Radio Rounds at https://itunes.apple.com/itunes-u/radio-rounds-radio-rounds/id428372384

 

[Member902507]

When asked what it means to be granted an interview, Dr. David Wofsy, Associate Dean of Admissions at UCSF medical school said,

"You are in the driver's seat, when you are an applicant. I don't think it feels that way. Right? You go into an interview and you feel like you're being judged and you feel like all the power is on the other side of the table. But that's not the truth. Schools are only interviewing people they're very interested in. Everybody we interview is somebody we are very impressed by and somebody we are quite convinced that would be an outstanding student at UCSF. And so we interview 500 people and if our class size was 500, we would have no trouble in accepting all of them. So our attitude is 'These are terrific people who have succeeded in coming through a very highly-demanding, competitive process to be among the handful of people we interview. We will want them. That's not just here, that's everywhere. The people that all medical schools are inviting to the interview are people they are really interested in. So, the first thing for an applicant to realize in, is you have some power in this interaction. And you should relax, and be confident, and be yourself. The school has already decided that it's yourself they're interested in. So I think that's the first thing and [that] is to recognize that the school is being judged as you're being judged and to take that part seriously. And I think the second piece of general advice is don't over-rehearse. I think one of the thing that plays badly in an interview is that it sounds like there is a little tape recorder in your head of the things you think you should say but really they're not being responsive to the question or to the flow of conversation. So I think it's important to do a little practicing and a little rehearsing with people and to get comfortable with the interview setting. Some people are really good at that as virtue of their personalities and for other people it's a struggle. We recognize that so a little practice is fine. But I actually think that the people who come in over-practiced and over-rehearsed look over-practiced and over-rehearsed and it doesn't work to their advantage."​

Listen to the entire conversation on episode 407 of Radio Rounds at https://itunes.apple.com/itunes-u/radio-rounds-radio-rounds/id428372384

+1

I actually had some health issues that I overcame after a veryyy long time, and someone from in a dental school's adcom advised me to not write about that, because he thought then it may seem as if the problem might come back. I actually went ahead and still wrote about overcoming the problem (could be why i havent heard from that school, haha) but i felt it was important. He was saying that if I wrote about that, then it might either look like I'm whining, or that I will just fall ill again...it all depends on how the "story" is written, and as everyone else has said, you don't know what that person is looking for on that day, to have your application strike them as interesting.

I thought the bingo idea that someone posted above was hilarious though, and I could totally imagine that too.

Good luck to everyone though, and hopefully we all will succeed in what we desire to do/become.

 

[UCSFx2017]

Personal Statement

Dr. Wofsy's comments on the personal statement:

"People agonize over the personal statement more than they're worth. Very few people will get into medical [or dental] school because of what they wrote in the personal statement. Some people will get out of medical [or dental] school because of what they wrote in the personal statement. So be careful and be careful with the personal statement. And remember that it is more likely to hurt than help. Write a good personal statement that shows that you can string thoughts in a logical way and you can write clearly and that you can talk about something that is relevant to this experience of applying to medical school, whether it's some activity you've been involved in or why you want to be a doctor [or dentist], or who knows what. It's not that important. What's important is that it's clear. So I tell people not to take risks for the personal statement. It's not what's going to get you in. And we follow that approach in our evaluation, that is, it's not a major determining factor. We know that a lot of different things go into the writing of the personal statement. Some people are the child of an admissions dean and they show their draft to their father and their father says 'No, no, no. Let's do it this way.' And some people have no such help. So we try to recognize that those statements are coming from many different environments and that they probably how we should decide in the end."​

Listen to the entire conversation on episode 407 of Radio Rounds at https://itunes.apple.com/itunes-u/radio-rounds-radio-rounds/id428372384

How To Highlight Your Extracurriculars

Dr. Wofsy's comments on extracurricular activities:

"We and most [other] places are looking for people who have done something in-depth and have done it well and really care about it because when medicine [or dentistry] is what you do then you'll do it in-depth and really care about. We're not looking for people who can check every box. I think that's a common misconception. If research isn't your thing, don't do three months in a work research lab and think you've checked that box off. It'll just look like something superficial that you didn't take seriously. Do what's really important to you and it will show in your application and it's going to be different for different people."​

Listen to the entire conversation on episode 407 of Radio Rounds at https://itunes.apple.com/itunes-u/ra...ds/id428372384

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?p=13340084#post13340084

 

[KittySquared]

An admissions dean did tell me that he looked at the entire application when choosing who to invite so you could be mistaken. They will likely not read your personal statement as if it were a textbook but they'll probably skim through it quickly. Always start your statement with a hook and wrap up your statement at the end by referencing the hook. It helps the reader better remember you.

You meant to tell me every admissions officer looks at every single application that they receive? I really doubt that's the case. I'm actually pretty chummy with an admissions person as well - he told me verbatim that some applicants unfortunately will not be looked at because the GPA and DAT didn't meet the school's requirement. There are some computer programs that most schools uses that plug and chugs all of the applicants' stats from AADSAS automatically and screens patients through several factors. Each school also has its own formula in calculating the "worth" of an applicant. Sounds cruel, but it's true. Jeffity had a pretty extensive research done on this matter. We're all just a number here, until we survive through several layers of computerized and automatic screenings.

thats not what kitty means. what kitty meant was adcoms do not read everybodys personal statement who applies to their dental school (thousands of personal statements), most likey. they scan for GPA and dat, and once that scan is done and minimum criteria in those areas are met, then YES im sure they read select PS's after that.

Thank you. That's exactly what I meant.

 

[doc toothache]

Would someone inform Dr. Wofsy that physicians do not have exclusive claim for the word "doctor".

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=943474
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=942453

 

[RSalha17]

Hey guys,

I just want to give a little bit of confidence and insight to those who applied (or are planning on applying in the future) who don't have a stellar GPA or killer DAT scores. Contrary to popular belief, you don't need amazing stats to get interviews at great schools. My stats are at/below average, and I have received 4 interviews so far, 2 pre-dec and 2 post-dec (stats/interviews are below). Don't get me wrong, gpa/dat scores are an integral part of your application, and a quick way to get an adcom's attention, but once your application is initially reviewed, gpa/dat are NOT everything.

My EC's, work/volunteer experience, research experience, etc. played a VERY important role in making my application stand out. I have spent hundreds of hours in dentists office and volunteering in my community, and have SHOWED the adcoms that i want to be a dentist and that I am committed to my community rather than just telling them. They want to see that you are dedicated to the profession and serving others, and shadowing at a couple dentist offices or volunteering for a few months before you send in your apps is not going to get their attention.

What WILL get their attention is showing how you cope with and overcome adversity, and that you have a strong understanding of the problems in dentistry and how you will help fix them. Referencing personal experiences and connecting them to these ideas is the best way to SHOW them that you understand these problems. For example, instead of just SAYING that I have shadowed in a community clinic and understand that we need more dentists willing to serve in underserved areas, you can SHOW them how volunteering in a community clinic has taught you that we need to change this problem by giving a short anecdote or story about how this has personally effected you. I made a cognitive effort to focus on this in my AADSAS app and secondaries and I really think it helped me stand out.

Please don't get the wrong idea from this post, I am not trying to gloat about my interviews or toot my own horn, I am simply offering some advice/support to those like me that don't have amazing stats. You don't need amazing stats to get noticed, but you do need to SHOW the adcoms that you want this career.

Good luck to everyone and like always, feel free to PM me with any questions or comments. Happy thanksgiving!

"Both RSalha17's and KittySquared's comments represent two opposite extremes. One claims that it's only experiences, extracurriculars, and the conveying of those experiences that matters."

Everyone needs to read my WHOLE post before they start pointing fingers. I DID NOT say that only experiences/ec's matter, I simply said that it is a big part of your application AFTER you make it through the DAT/GPA review.

As stated before, I am not gloating, nether am I saying that I am guaranteed an acceptance, I am simply trying to give some confidence to those who don't think they have a chance at even getting an interview. As you guys stated, it is a crap shoot and it also involves a lot of luck, this is VERY TRUE and i do not disagree with this point, however I applied to 20 schools to increase my chances at this crap shoot. Please read my whole post before you post comments responding, it is very frustrating when I am simply trying to offer a helping hand and then it gets turned around on me and I look like a douche.

 

[KittySquared]

As stated before, I am not gloating, nether am I saying that I am guaranteed an acceptance, I am simply trying to give some confidence to those who don't think they have a chance at even getting an interview. As you guys stated, it is a crap shoot and it also involves a lot of luck, this is VERY TRUE and i do not disagree with this point, however I applied to 20 schools to increase my chances at this crap shoot. Please read my whole post before you post comments responding, it is very frustrating when I am simply trying to offer a helping hand and then it gets turned around on me and I look like a douche.

Using yourself as the exemplary "I succeeded so you can too" story isn't exactly helping. This is your second thread about how many interviews you've gotten. While I think a lot of people do need inspirations, I still can't help but to see this thread as more of a self fulfilling and validating thread rather than an actual helpful thread. You really could've held your horses and waited til after December 3rd before acting like you've got it all figured out.

I've been preparing for 2 years now, for this cycle, and I still don't have dental school application processes figured out.

 

[Davermz450]

Using yourself as the exemplary "I succeeded so you can too" story isn't exactly helping. This is your second thread about how many interviews you've gotten. While I think a lot of people do need inspirations, I still can't help but to see this thread as more of a self fulfilling and validating thread rather than an actual helpful thread. You really could've held your horses and waited til after December 3rd before acting like you've got it all figured out.

I've been preparing for 2 years now, for this cycle, and I still don't have dental school application processes figured out.

If you don't like it stop coming back to the thread! The kid is pumped for his fourth interview and still people on this site bring him down. I'm over it. Be kind or just don't say anything. The big picture is the dude is doing well and has a couple of interviews and will probably get accepted to one, he worked hard for it! Stats are important blah blah blah, we get that but to hear that good ECs made a difference is refreshing

 

[asdfray]

Throughout the cycle, I also thought the same thing since I received 10 interviews with mediocre stats. However, I will hold my comments and remarks till AFTER dec 3.

 

[sun228]

Throughout the cycle, I also thought the same thing since I received 10 interviews with mediocre stats. However, I will hold my comments and remarks till AFTER dec 3.

What are your stats asdfray? Do you mind sharing 😀

 

[Gomsemari]

I really don't get why ppl on this thread is being harsh to RSalha17.
He's simply tryin to give hope to others and offer help. i dont see any other intention besides that.
I feel like u guys r just being jealous or something.
jeez/ cant anyone just post a thread about his/hers opinion? there are hundreds out there.
why the hate here?

 

[RSalha17]

Using yourself as the exemplary "I succeeded so you can too" story isn't exactly helping. This is your second thread about how many interviews you've gotten. While I think a lot of people do need inspirations, I still can't help but to see this thread as more of a self fulfilling and validating thread rather than an actual helpful thread. You really could've held your horses and waited til after December 3rd before acting like you've got it all figured out.

I've been preparing for 2 years now, for this cycle, and I still don't have dental school application processes figured out.

The point of this thread wasn't to brag about how many interviews I have it was to attempt to offer friendly advice to others, which is what SDN is about. Anyways I'm done defending myself, think what you want and we will see how things turn out come December 3rd.

As always, good luck to everyone and please PM me if I can help anyone in any way.

-RSalha

 

[doc toothache]

Contrary to popular belief, you don't need amazing stats to get interviews at great schools. My stats are at/below average, and I have received 4 interviews so far, 2 pre-dec and 2 post-dec (stats/interviews are below). Don't get me wrong, gpa/dat scores are an integral part of your application, and a quick way to get an adcom's attention, but once your application is initially reviewed, gpa/dat are NOT everything.

My EC's, work/volunteer experience, research experience, etc. played a VERY important role in making my application stand out.
What WILL get their attention is showing how you cope with and overcome adversity, and that you have a strong understanding of the problems in dentistry and how you will help fix them.

With o-gpa placing you in the top 43% of the applicant pool, the s-gpa approaching 50% and AA at 38%, it hardly makes your metrics qualify for a Cinderella story, albeit, sans the slippers. While your EC/other items mentioned may have played a role in your obtaining interviews, you might be exaggerating their relevance to the admission process. GPA and DAT are and do remain king and queen even after an interview.


http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=943474
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=901073

 

[free99]

With o-gpa placing you in the top 43% of the applicant pool, the s-gpa approaching 50% and AA at 38%, it hardly makes your metrics qualify for a Cinderella story, albeit, sans the slippers. While your EC/other items mentioned may have played a role in your obtaining interviews, you might be exaggerating their relevance to the admission process. GPA and DAT are and do remain king and queen even after an interview.


http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=943474
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=901073

When you refer to his GPAs, I assume you're referring to the #'s that includes +/-?

 

[HSorathia92]

I think I'm a pretty good example of GPA/DAT not being "everything". Unfortunately, throughout undergrad I believed GPA and DAT would be my key to dental school so my clinical and volunteer experience is lacking compared to many others on here. I think that's why most schools ignored me. Long story short, GPA/DAT wasn't enough for me.

 

[clcrdh08]

The point of this thread wasn't to brag about how many interviews I have it was to attempt to offer friendly advice to others, which is what SDN is about. Anyways I'm done defending myself, think what you want and we will see how things turn out come December 3rd.

As always, good luck to everyone and please PM me if I can help anyone in any way.

-RSalha

You keep doing you. People on this forum continue to hate instead of congratulating on your success. Bottom line the committee looks at the applicant as a whole not just numbers. If you have nothing positive to say keep it moving.

 

[RSalha17]

With o-gpa placing you in the top 43% of the applicant pool, the s-gpa approaching 50% and AA at 38%, it hardly makes your metrics qualify for a Cinderella story, albeit, sans the slippers. While your EC/other items mentioned may have played a role in your obtaining interviews, you might be exaggerating their relevance to the admission process. GPA and DAT are and do remain king and queen even after an interview.


http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=943474
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=901073

You are talking about the applicant pool as a whole, not those who get interviews/acceptances. Let's take a look at enrollees instead, to give a completely unbiased look, rather than only showing the applicant pool as a whole.

IF i get accepted, and again this is a big IF, my DAT/GPA is significantly low in comparison to other enrollees. My 18 TS will be in the 37th percentile, my 3.2 sGPA will be in the 25th percentile, and my 3.38 oGPA will be in the 30th percentile. These are not exactly competitive when you look at the field of enrollees. How can you deny that there must be something else contributing as a major factor? Hence, my EC's, work experience, volunteer experience, and research. I respectfully disagree with you Doc. When/if I get an acceptance, I will post here to validate my point(s) from above. I understand that this post is premature, but I didn't want others to be persuaded only by the stats you provided, I wanted others to see both stats.

 

[doc toothache]

You are talking about the applicant pool as a whole, not those who get interviews/acceptances. Let's take a look at enrollees instead, to give a completely unbiased look, rather than only showing the applicant pool as a whole.

Not much of a point in talking about enrollees since you do not fit the bill yet. Besides, that's what the link is for. Your post might have been inspirational if you were part of the Under 3.0 Club or had an AA of 17.

 

[RSalha17]

Not much of a point in talking about enrollees since you do not fit the bill yet. Besides, that's what the link is for. Your post might have been inspirational if you were part of the Under 3.0 Club or had an AA of 17.

Enough speculation. We will see each other back here on Dec 3rd or later. Hopefully my attempt at inspiration will have some support in combatting the distaste of this post. Good luck to all, only a few more days until the 3rd.

 

[shulk]

Enough speculation. We will see each other back here on Dec 3rd or later. Hopefully my attempt at inspiration will have some support in combatting the distaste of this post. Good luck to all, only a few more days until the 3rd.

I really hope you do receive an acceptance on the 3rd, otherwise this thread will have quite the opposite effect you intended. Good luck!

 

[bellos]

Thanks for the positive words!🙂

I am compelled to comment on your stats though, they are not stellar but they certainly are not below average. I can see why you are getting interviews and if you are as personable and charming as you come across on the web, you'll get accepted.

 

[bluesprite13]

Rooting for you Rsalha17! You are so positive on this forum and it's great to have your optimism on here! Good luck!! 😀

 

[LaFleur]

I've had a completely different experience. Speaking of overcoming adversity, I failed out of my first year due to my father's suicide. I took a year off and have maintained a 4.0 GPA since. I rocked the DAT and have plenty of club involvement including a leadership position. I've shadowed dentists and volunteered as a youth tennis coach. I'm writing an honors thesis. I thought my application was strong but I didn't receive a single interview.

After I failed out, I took prerequisites at community college because everyone and their mom told me it would be fine. I'd like to see anyone get back into a university with a 1.6 GPA, and not to mention my family was living in absolute poverty without my dad's income. The classes I took at a community college are the same classes that lead me to score in the 99.6th percentile on those subjects on the DAT, but I guess that wasn't enough to show schools that I received a solid foundation at the CC. I've since worked my way back into a respected university and I've made straight A's even with very intense science course loads.

Nope. Not enough. They want more and I don't know what to give them. I'm so beyond bitter about the whole thing and I'm frustrated that not one school would even give me a freaking chance. I'm so sick of seeing these intellectually average kids just coasting their way through college with an easy major and not focusing on getting into dental school until their senior year, only to receive multiple interviews because they did it the conventional way. Meanwhile I've been busting my ass off just to be noticed and my application is just completely ignored because I had to do things differently.

Sorry, I meant to provide constructive insight and ended up venting. I know I still have a decent chance of interviewing this cycle. I'm just really disappointed that no schools saw potential in me. Congrats to everyone with interviews and good luck come December 3rd 🙂

wcombs, I cannot for the life of me understand how you have no interviews to this date. It boggles my mind. 😱 You are a phenomenal applicant!

How many semesters have you spent at the 4 year university so far?

 

[predentalguy20]

Salha. These people are just jealous that you still can get interviews with average stats. Long live people with average stats!!!!

 

[timmytim]

yo i saw your unlv post
good luck dude

 

[Zbtb7]

OP-An update would be nice.

 

[howaminow]

Personally I think this thread could be a problem. It is possible to get a interview if you are atleast somewhere in the ballpark, I'll just throw out 3.35 as a chance. If you get a 20/20/20 DAT then odds go up as well a bit since I think that is the average for students accepted or maybe it is 19, don't remember quite exactly.

The issue here is if the OP doesn't get in this year some people will be all over him saying he had no clue what he is talking about, but the issue is we have no clue how he interviewed at all. His interviews might have gone terrible, which causes him to be rejected or he might have the greatest interview ever that just amazes the adcoms. There are too many variables and some luck involved to give a clear answer.

 

[Toofly01]

At this point all I care about is getting an interview, and RSalha's post makes me see it is possible. There are many variables, of course, but at least as far as numbers go I know that it could happen this cycle.

And congrats on your interviews RSalha, whether or not you get accepted is a different issue and I wish you luck there. But for the interviews themselves, good job.