Grade of W

[smoknjoe44]

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I want to withdraw from my world history class because I'm afraid that it will mess up my GPA. It is a gen-ed requirement taught as if it were for history majors, and I'm just not interested in the class. However, I am applying to vet school next year (UGA, MS, Colorado, and Tufts) with pre-requisites. Even though these schools require a certain amount of humanities/ social sciences, would a grade of W affect my chances of getting in? I have a 4.0 right now as I am finishing up my sophomore year and I don't want a class like this to mess it up. I will have 14 hours left if I withdraw...

 

[Angie09]

Not being on an adcomm, this is only my personal opinion. But if I were on an adcomm, I would rather see someone who challenged himself academically, than someone afraid to "ruin" his GPA. Especially since you have a 4.0 right now -- I would look at a W and think, "What a weenie. He dropped the class when he knew he wouldn't get an A". It's ONE CLASS. You'd have to fail it to do any serious damage to your GPA. On the other hand, college is not merely about getting into vet school. If you're genuinely not interested in the class, why punish yourself?

My $0.02.

 

[TurboVet]

dude, if you've got a 4.0, a B is gonna do what? make it 3.99? Do NOT withdraw!!! As someone with 2 or 3 W's from thinking I was going to get a B one time, and then withdrawing for organic chem for sane reasons, i got SCREWED because some schools count W's as 0.00 or an F in your GPA calc. it is really not worth taking that chance. and if you've got a 4.0, you will do fine. If i can get into places with a 3.4, you will do fine.

 

[VETleigh]

On the topic of withdrawing from classes...

I just finished my first year applying and did not get accepted to any of the three schools I applied to. I'm currently in my fourth year, and could graduate this semester if I keep the courses I have no. The problem? As of today, I am severely failing an upper division cell biology class that is needed for my degree, but not for vet school. I have a couple of W's already, but I don't know if my gpa can take another C, I have two already (or dare I say a D or F)!! Advice? Please, be kind.

 

[seaturtlegirl]

Hey smokinjoe - I agree with the others...Your GPA is awesome, and one B isn't going to make any difference! I had 2 B+ in history, and though I wasn't happy about it, I think that it will look better for you to take the B than the W anyday!

Vetleigh - I think your situation is different. If you really are doing that poorly, I would consider dropping the class (though this is just my opinion). There are times when you have to choose the lesser of evils, as it were. True, there are some schools that will average a W into your cumulative GPA as an F, but there are some that won't. Come interview time, if asked about why you withdrew, you can explain then! The application/interview process is very stressful and time consuming, and many people miss classes to attend an interview, so the adcoms may understand! Conversely, they may not. However, this is a decision you must make for yourself. Is there any chance to bring up your grade? Also, I know at my school, we have until almost the end of april to actually withdraw, so maybe you could stick it out for a little longer and see if you can bring the grade up!

my advice - talk to your prof and see if it is possible for you to salvage your grade. If not, personally, I would take the W over the F (are you sure it really would be an F?) If you can get a C, then maybe staying in would be better...It's a tough decision, but look at your application as a whole, and think about which the adcoms would rather see. It is important to demonstrate that you can handle a heavy course load, but if an F is going to totally kill your GPA...

good luck!

 

[sambone]

I've never heard of anyone getting an F / 0.0 calculated into their GPA for a withdrawal, and have read a lot of threads about withdrawing because I'm thinking about the same thing. And several other people on this forum have gotten in with Ws. (although I gotta say the GPA reason is pretty flimsy)

Still, that totally freaks me out TurboVet!!!! Are you sure that's why you're having so much trouble? Did adcomms actually say that to you?

I have to choose between an awesome clinical experience (I don't have any at all) or Ochem2 before I apply this fall. So Im pretty sure Im taking the experience. Getting one in the first place took me forever! I just cant handle volunteering + Ochem 2 + Ochem1 lab (insanely labor intensive at my school) + working full time to pay for all these classes!

 

[seaturtlegirl]

You can get in with W's. I have two, from my first undergrad attempt, eons ago!

As for the W getting calculated in, I believe the U of I does this. (they show a breakdown on your application, complete with W's, which give you 0 points!!! ugh. ) However, even with W's I got an interview there. Still, the less W's the better, that's for sure!

 

[Emio]

smoknjoe, i hope you're not serious. suck it up, work your ass off and get *another* A, or suck it up, be a gracious loser, and have some color on your transcript.

on second thought... you have a 4.0. do whatever you want! 👍

On the topic of withdrawing from classes...

I just finished my first year applying and did not get accepted to any of the three schools I applied to. I'm currently in my fourth year, and could graduate this semester if I keep the courses I have no. The problem? As of today, I am severely failing an upper division cell biology class that is needed for my degree, but not for vet school. I have a couple of W's already, but I don't know if my gpa can take another C, I have two already (or dare I say a D or F)!! Advice? Please, be kind.

hmmm... on the assumption that an F is imminent, i'd take the W. make sure you can come up with a good explanation story though; you'll most likely have to explain why you choose classes that you ultimately didn't finish.

its easier said that done, i know, but what are your chances of salvaging this course? in my experience, working with the prof to show you're honestly working your ass off has done more for improving my grades than actually working my ass off. weekly meetings, even just plenty of questions during/after class (while trying not to be "that kid") have worked wonders for me. but that could just be my profs! again, easier said than done, but no one said vet school would be easy 😉

VETleigh, i'm sorry you didnt get in this year... better luck next year!

EDIT: well i finally read all those long posts, and it looks like i just copied seaturtlegirl, lol. just listen to her... she sounds smart!

 

[ri23]

I actually disagree with most of the advice so far. A W is really not going to hurt your transcript. If the class is not enjoyable to you and is just a GEC (especially being its not a science or math course) then I don't see the point of "pushing" your way through it. I don't think you should compromise your GPA if you don't have to. It plays a huge role in vet school admissions as most schools give you an objective grade and subjective grade. Your objective grade is usually given based on GPA/GRE while your subjective is from interviews/recommendations. The more points you can get the better!
Also, I don't think adcomms assume that if you drop a class its because you fear getting a low grade. There are a lot of reasons people withdraw from classes.

 

[anc84]

I only skimmed the other responses so far, so I hope I'm not repeating someone else's answers. Are you sure you will get a W if you drop the class at this point? At my school, we get a while to drop the class before it appears as a W. I think our date this semester is March 9. I'd ask an advisor or call your asa office to make sure you would actually get a W. I've dropped tons of classes after sticking with them for a while but have never received a W. If, however, the date is past, I would say it's best to stick it out and endure a miserable class. It's not worth having something like that on your record for one class.

 

[mistifical]

You can get in with W's. I have two, from my first undergrad attempt, eons ago!

As for the W getting calculated in, I believe the U of I does this. (they show a breakdown on your application, complete with W's, which give you 0 points!!! ugh. ) However, even with W's I got an interview there. Still, the less W's the better, that's for sure!

I calculated my GPA based on what they had on the status page and even though they put 0 points in for a W, it doesn't seem like they included it in the GPA. When I calculated it I made sure to use all the points they had, except for when I had W's and I got the same thing as what they reported on my status page.

 

[smoknjoe44]

For the tests you have to answer 3 identifications that have to be at least half a page each and one long essay that has to be at least 2 pages long. The essay counts 70% and the ID's count 10% each. This has to be completed in 50 minutes and he says that you should come out feeling like you could have written more because that means you studied...

Anyway, I am somewhat of a slow test taker, and a slower writer. I can't write a good full blown essay in 50 minutes, much less answer the ID's fully. This is really the main problem, other than the prof. being ridiculously boring, that I have with the class, and I'm not sure it is a good enough reason (according to vet schools) to drop the class.

 

[abr]

What do you think you can get as a grade in that class?

I HATE gen. ed. history requirements. One of those stupid classes ruined my 4.0 because I got an A-. The teacher said I had a solid A the whole course, but he didn't "like" my final essay, even though he could tell I knew what I was talking about. (Exactly what he said. Ridiculous.)
😡

I do not think W's look good. If you think you can pull off a pretty good grade, I would not drop..

 

[wildfocus]

For the tests you have to answer 3 identifications that have to be at least half a page each and one long essay that has to be at least 2 pages long. The essay counts 70% and the ID's count 10% each. This has to be completed in 50 minutes and he says that you should come out feeling like you could have written more because that means you studied...

Anyway, I am somewhat of a slow test taker, and a slower writer. I can't write a good full blown essay in 50 minutes, much less answer the ID's fully. This is really the main problem, other than the prof. being ridiculously boring, that I have with the class, and I'm not sure it is a good enough reason (according to vet schools) to drop the class.

smokinjoe - i'm sorry to be a big fat purple meanie, but i'm sure i'm not the only one tempted in this forum to say "suck it up." i know b's aren't ideal, and that it may hurt your overall gpa (probably by such a small amount, the adcomms won't blink an eye); however, not all your classes in vet school are going to be memorization - you are going to need to synthesize and think through loads of info (and by your past performance, i'm sure you'll be stellar). maybe it's b/c of my humanities background, but writing is essential to a successful career. this could also be something you can talk about in your interviews, essays, etc. for vet school. it shows character and maturity (and that you are a mere human) to say that you were not the best in something, and that you tried anyway. it just seems that no one should drop a class because of a grade unless said grade is a c or below. the b may stand out, but it will give you something to talk about. sorry if i am being harsh, but if you are getting such a high gpa already, you will likely get in where you want anyway. why not take this opportunity to grow from the experience?

btw - i have three Ws (one due to family crisis, one due to decision not to take the class, the other due to poor performance) - no one ever asked about them at any of my interviews. i think there are good reasons for them, but should be used with prudence.

 

[mom2jnc]

I agree with wildfocus...I think one of the biggest challenges for straight A students going to vet school is accepting the fact that they will no longer get straight A's. At least having a B on your transcript will show that, hey, you're a hell of a student but you won't freak out as a vet student for not getting all A's all the time. Hope this makes sense & stick out the class...you may be surprised!

 

[anc84]

yeah, don't worry that much about your gpa. i got in with a 3.3 this year. lots of schools are looking to see a reasonable gpa that shows you can handle courses, but to many schools, animal experience plays a much bigger role in getting accepted.

 

[smoknjoe44]

What do you think you can get as a grade in that class?

I HATE gen. ed. history requirements. One of those stupid classes ruined my 4.0 because I got an A-. The teacher said I had a solid A the whole course, but he didn't "like" my final essay, even though he could tell I knew what I was talking about. (Exactly what he said. Ridiculous.)
😡

I do not think W's look good. If you think you can pull off a pretty good grade, I would not drop..

I got a C on my first test (20% of grade). I have one more test, a final, and a paper. I'm not too sure I can do much better on the tests than I did on this first one...

 

[bakaduin]

I dont think W's look good. If you end up going through all the rest of college with a 4.0 and send in your vet app Im sure they will look at that W and say, "I guess he couldnt handle a challenging class and gave up". Not to say that this will in any way keep you out of vet school because heck a 4.0 is still a 4.0.

 

[wildfocus]

I dont think W's look good. If you end up going through all the rest of college with a 4.0 and send in your vet app Im sure they will look at that W and say, "I guess he couldnt handle a challenging class and gave up". Not to say that this will in any way keep you out of vet school because heck a 4.0 is still a 4.0.

on the other hand, i've heard of 4.0s not getting in because of lack of experience, extracurriculars, maturity, etc. grades are not everything (take it from someone who has been more or less continuously in college for 15 years)!

 

[bakaduin]

on the other hand, i've heard of 4.0s not getting in because of lack of experience, extracurriculars, maturity, etc. grades are not everything (take it from someone who has been more or less continuously in college for 15 years)!

Thats true.

 

[ri23]

I got a C on my first test (20% of grade). I have one more test, a final, and a paper. I'm not too sure I can do much better on the tests than I did on this first one...

Again, I know I'm in the minority here, but drop the class. There is no point in stressing over a history class, and neglecting other classes. Also all of that extra time you are dedicating to the history class could be spent improving other areas of your app (volunteering, working etc.). That way you'll have a great looking application EC wise and a 4.0. One W will really not be looked on that negatively by an adcomm in my estimation. If you look at the pre-med boards this issue is addressed all of the time, and it seems the general consensus is its not that big of a deal. Getting into vet school is stressful enough, and stressing yourself out over a meaningless class and risking your GPA just doesn't seem worth it.

 

[wildfocus]

stressing yourself out over a meaningless class and risking your GPA just doesn't seem worth it.

good points about being able to use time on other things and, like i said, adcomms haven't even mentioned my W's, BUT i truly take issue with saying world history is meaningless!!!

 

[Tsuki]

I may have the most Ws - 6 total. All from my first undergrad school ('01-'03). 1 W in freshman year, 1 in sophomore year, 4 from junior year when I dropped out of school mid semester. The Ws never came up during my interviews, but I assume that my personal statement, where I addressed my poor performance during those years, explained everything. Since 4 of the Ws were from classes I was taking for a Communications major, I doubt they even cared. Of course, when I hit 'submit' on my VMCAS app I felt like such a loser..

Anyway, the point I'm trying to make is that if you decide to withdraw, it won't ruin your chances of getting into vet school. Neither would getting a B/C in a gen-ed class. When you are competing with other people with GPAs in the 3.8-4.0 range, the adcoms have to look at other aspects of your app in order to make a decision. So make sure you get some diverse animal experience. Do stuff that makes you stand out...

 

[Pennymare]

W's good or bad? I don't think that it is that simple....

Think of it as a tactical decision:

It's probably true that a couple or lot of W's may hurt you, unless you can give good reasons (other than I wasn't going to get an A).

However, if you are having trouble in a certain area of science/study, or if you are close to falling below 3.0--3.4 GPA, or an unnecessary class is making your life hell, then drop it.

It is possible to get into vet school with Ws and less than 4.0s. As several folks have pointed out: it's important to be well rounded, and you probably will have to get used to B's in vet school. 😉

Drop moderately or if you really need to, chill out a little, and go in peace,

Alex

 

[InfiniVet]

Beat ya - I have like 8 W's =)
It never came up during the interviews, and since interviews are offered off of your GPA calculations -- I'm preeeeetttty sure that they don't calculate them in as "0"'s...at my undergrad all the prof's actually encouraged us to drop if we feel like we weren't going to do well, they said it wouldn't affect our grade. Horrible advice in hindsight, but I never explained it on my essays or anything, it never came up in open profile interviews, and we'll see if I get in this cycle.
Thats my .02 cents =)

 

[ri23]

good points about being able to use time on other things and, like i said, adcomms haven't even mentioned my W's, BUT i truly take issue with saying world history is meaningless!!!

Sorry, meaningless was a little harsh 😳 . It's just never been my area of interest, and though I know they're important, I'm sick of having to take all of these upper level humanities courses above and beyond gen-ed requirements to fulfill my honors contract.

 

[mistifical]

I may have the most Ws - 6 total. All from my first undergrad school ('01-'03). 1 W in freshman year, 1 in sophomore year, 4 from junior year when I dropped out of school mid semester. The Ws never came up during my interviews, but I assume that my personal statement, where I addressed my poor performance during those years, explained everything. Since 4 of the Ws were from classes I was taking for a Communications major, I doubt they even cared. Of course, when I hit 'submit' on my VMCAS app I felt like such a loser..

I dunno... I might have that many Ws too! I just don't want to count! Also during my first few years of school from when I thought being a fashion designer or a lawyer were my ultimate goals... and quickly realized I must have been crazy!

Nobody asked about it, and my grades since then, although they are not 4.0, have been excellent.