Harvard and Yale Med School

[sunshine02]

What would be a "good" GPA for prestigious med schools? 3.7? 3.6? Or is anything below a 4.0 looked down upon?

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[UrshumMurshum]

I think the key strategy to getting into these schools is being absolutely perfect in everything.

Probably anything less than a 3.8 is looked down upon, but it probably doesn't start steeply falling off until you get below a 3.7

 

[Beekachu]

That's a big gap between a 4.0 and a 3.6 or 3.7... But if I remember right, the average GPA for accepted applicants is between 3.8 and 3.9

 

[sector9]

The key is to have some type of a stand-out hook in addition to an excellent GPA, MCAT, and other standard ECs. Your GPA target is fine but you should be worrying about the other things as well

 

[protonate]

What would be a "good" GPA for prestigious med schools? 3.7? 3.6? Or is anything below a 4.0 looked down upon?

Got accepted to Yale and rejected post interview at Harvard. Even though GPA and MCAT are important, it can only take you so far. These schools want to train future leaders in medicine, and you need to prove to them with your EC's that you have potential. For numbers, at long as you are 3.8+ and 35+ you are on the equal playing field with all candidates when it comes to stats. Other than that, focus on research and leadership opportunities (i.e being a T.A, etc...) in addition to the expected EC's (volunteering, etc...)

Hope this helps

 

[dbeast]

This thread hurts my eyes.

 

[Thego2guy]

What would be a "good" GPA for prestigious med schools? 3.7? 3.6? Or is anything below a 4.0 looked down upon?

I pray to god you're a freaking troll, because if you are asking this question, then you have no chance at making those schools. I am not going to give you the typical SDN crap lecture about how you should search the forum, because the problem is a lot more primitive than that. I guarantee you, that you know NOTHING about either Harvard or Yale schools of medicine. I bet you don't even know where Yale is located. Why am I being so harsh on you? Well for starters, how about you stop being lazy, and learn crucial research skills. Check it out, it is very easy, go to www.google.com then search for "Harvard Medical School Admissions" and later for "Yale School of Medicine Admissions Statistics", navigate a few screens, and BAM. Absorb the information.

No one is going to spoon feed you. Time to grow up and do things for yourself.
Now to make up for my ****ty mood and attitude (which does have solid basis) I will paste you the links directly here, for the first and last time.

http://facts.med.yale.edu/education/index.aspx This is Yale, in case you didn't notice.

http://hms.harvard.edu/content/class-statistics This is Harvard.

Seriously man, I am not trying to be a dick, but I am doing you a favor. If you're a pre-med, don't expect for things to come to you on a silver platter. You are going to have to bite, scratch, and crawl your way through to have a fighting chance at ANY medical school. Good luck.

 

[jevo]

^

 

[drizzt3117]

What would be a "good" GPA for prestigious med schools? 3.7? 3.6? Or is anything below a 4.0 looked down upon?

 

[el poblano]

I pray to god you're a freaking troll, because if you are asking this question, then you have no chance at making those schools. I am not going to give you the typical SDN crap lecture about how you should search the forum, because the problem is a lot more primitive than that. I guarantee you, that you know NOTHING about either Harvard or Yale schools of medicine. I bet you don't even know where Yale is located. Why am I being so harsh on you? Well for starters, how about you stop being lazy, and learn crucial research skills. Check it out, it is very easy, go to www.google.com then search for "Harvard Medical School Admissions" and later for "Yale School of Medicine Admissions Statistics", navigate a few screens, and BAM. Absorb the information.

No one is going to spoon feed you. Time to grow up and do things for yourself.
Now to make up for my ****ty mood and attitude (which does have solid basis) I will paste you the links directly here, for the first and last time.

http://facts.med.yale.edu/education/index.aspx This is Yale, in case you didn't notice.

http://hms.harvard.edu/content/class-statistics This is Harvard.

Seriously man, I am not trying to be a dick, but I am doing you a favor. If you're a pre-med, don't expect for things to come to you on a silver platter. You are going to have to bite, scratch, and crawl your way through to have a fighting chance at ANY medical school. Good luck.

Dude. You are being a dick, and no it doesn't help anybody.

Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk 2

 

[gettheleadout]

Honestly, schools like Harvard and Yale take you if they want you. Good GPA or bad GPA, your grades aren't going to be the factor to get you in or out. If you get rejected with a 3.6, you'd probably get rejected with a 4.0 as well. At their level, the competition is more than high-performing students, it's people who are special even in comparison to qualified, competitive applicants in the whole pool.

 

[Knocked Up]

Would everyone just chill out already.

Listen kid, the ONLY and I mean ONLY ONLY ONLY thing that matters is the MCAT. They don't even look at GPAs anymore, so chill out.


Anyways, how about the single most moving image of the week. This is probably the most powerful image I have ever seen, what a great man:

 

[chronicidal]

Is it possible to get it back up to a 4.0? Not quite sure how GPA works.

Step 1 - Figure out how averages work
Step 2 - Think about prestigious med schools.
...
Step 4 - Get into Yale?

 

[BurntFlower]

Would everyone just chill out already.

Listen kid, the ONLY and I mean ONLY ONLY ONLY thing that matters is the MCAT. They don't even look at GPAs anymore, so chill out.

I would think GPA is just as important as the MCAT.

 

[Ismet]

Listen kid, the ONLY and I mean ONLY ONLY ONLY thing that matters is the MCAT. They don't even look at GPAs anymore, so chill out.

Um...nope

 

[StoicJosher]

That's a big gap between a 4.0 and a 3.6 or 3.7... But if I remember right, the average GPA for accepted applicants is between 3.8 and 3.9

I hope you mean for Yale and Harvard accepted students. The average GPA for all matriculated MD students is ~3.67.

I pray to god you're a freaking troll, because if you are asking this question, then you have no chance at making those schools. I am not going to give you the typical SDN crap lecture about how you should search the forum, because the problem is a lot more primitive than that. I guarantee you, that you know NOTHING about either Harvard or Yale schools of medicine. I bet you don't even know where Yale is located. Why am I being so harsh on you? Well for starters, how about you stop being lazy, and learn crucial research skills. Check it out, it is very easy, go to www.google.com then search for "Harvard Medical School Admissions" and later for "Yale School of Medicine Admissions Statistics", navigate a few screens, and BAM. Absorb the information.

No one is going to spoon feed you. Time to grow up and do things for yourself.
Now to make up for my ****ty mood and attitude (which does have solid basis) I will paste you the links directly here, for the first and last time.

http://facts.med.yale.edu/education/index.aspx This is Yale, in case you didn't notice.

http://hms.harvard.edu/content/class-statistics This is Harvard.

Seriously man, I am not trying to be a dick, but I am doing you a favor. If you're a pre-med, don't expect for things to come to you on a silver platter. You are going to have to bite, scratch, and crawl your way through to have a fighting chance at ANY medical school. Good luck.

Thank you! I am surprised at how much, people need spoon feeding.

And to the guy that called you a dick - good luck when you wake up and find yourself in the real world.

 

[GeorgiadisMD]

Dude. You are being a dick, and no it doesn't help anybody.

Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk 2

Why are you calling someone that if all he is being is very blunt about the facts? Why sugar coat anything? It won't help OP in the long run...

Sent from my VM670 using SDN Mobile

 

[itsMileyCyrus]

For all the people who think the admission process into Harvard is random:

The members of Harvard medical and law schools are actually relatives and children of the Illuminati. During the interview, certain passphrases must be said at certain times to confirm the identity of these people. Once all passphrases are said, "applicants" are taken to another room where they are inducted in a secret ritual, and nano particles that can be detonated at any time are injected into the bloodstream in order to ensure faith to the Illuminati. These individuals go through medical school and/or law school and become set to control everything in modern society (from the adminstering of HIV to the assassination of scientists who come up with cures for cancer). Every applicant is scanned, and a few people who have no ties to any Illuminati are selected to enter the class as "moles" who are meant to throw off any suspicion.

So if you have to ask how to get into Harvard medical school, you obviously have no chance to begin with.

 

[sunshine02]

I know that on the AMCAS scale, a 3.7 is an A-. So even if you have all As but they're mostly A-'s you would still not get a 4.0 GPA right?

 

[theseeker4]

I know that on the AMCAS scale, a 3.7 is an A-. So even if you have all As but they're mostly A-'s you would still not get a 4.0 GPA right?

...You do know how averages work, right? If you get mostly A-'s, the rest A's, 3.7 is an A- and 4.0 is an A, you should be able to figure out whether you will be closer to a 3.7 or a 4.0...you shouldn't even need a calculator for this one.......

Seriously, these are not difficult questions to figure out on your own. This is an incredibly helpful forum, but you will get a lot of grief if you ask questions that have been asked over and over, or if you ask questions that are easily found or completely obvious.

 

[notbobtrustme]

best way to get into those schools is to have daddy buy a spot.

 

[circulus vitios]

I know that on the AMCAS scale, a 3.7 is an A-. So even if you have all As but they're mostly A-'s you would still not get a 4.0 GPA right?

 

[RedSox10]

Honestly, schools like Harvard and Yale take you if they want you. Good GPA or bad GPA, your grades aren't going to be the factor to get you in or out. If you get rejected with a 3.6, you'd probably get rejected with a 4.0 as well. At their level, the competition is more than high-performing students, it's people who are special even in comparison to qualified, competitive applicants in the whole pool.

I completely agree. I know someone with less than stellar stats and low 30s MCAT, but had a really unique background and back story (military, etc). Got in pretty much everywhere including Harvard and I dont think that would have changed if the person had slightly higher or slightly lower stats.

 

[alerk323]

Honestly, schools like Harvard and Yale take you if they want you. Good GPA or bad GPA, your grades aren't going to be the factor to get you in or out. If you get rejected with a 3.6, you'd probably get rejected with a 4.0 as well. At their level, the competition is more than high-performing students, it's people who are special even in comparison to qualified, competitive applicants in the whole pool.

Except then the average GPA's of accepted students would be lower than they are. Otherwise why aren't all the "stellar" 3.6 gpa people getting in along with the equally stellar bight slightly higher 3.8 applicants?

A high GPA is necessarily but not sufficient, is another way of saying it, but that's generally true of all med schools.

 

[gettheleadout]

Except then the average GPA's of accepted students would be lower than they are. Otherwise why aren't all the "stellar" 3.6 gpa people getting in along with the equally stellar bight slightly higher 3.8 applicants?

A high GPA is necessarily but not sufficient, is another way of saying it, but that's generally true of all med schools.

Because people who excel (to the extent that it impresses Harvard) in non academic arenas tend to excel universally and have good grades. The point is that Harvard's average GPA isn't a 4.0, it's about a 3.8. I don't have the MSAR's 10th percentile GPA in front of me, but I would guess it's significantly lower since, as I said, students that have what Harvard wants will get in whether their academic record is perfect or not. In general I agree that a high GPA and MCAT demonstrate the intelligence and work ethic necessary to do well in medical school and thus increase one's chances, but for a place like Harvard, which could easily choose only 4.0 students, there are diminishing returns simply because those aren't the deciding factors.

 

[RedSox10]

Because people who excel (to the extent that it impresses Harvard) in non academic arenas tend to excel universally and have good grades. The point is that Harvard's average GPA isn't a 4.0, it's about a 3.8. I don't have the MSAR's 10th percentile GPA in front of me, but I would guess it's significantly lower since, as I said, students that have what Harvard wants will get in whether their academic record is perfect or not. In general I agree that a high GPA and MCAT demonstrate the intelligence and work ethic necessary to do well in medical school and thus increase one's chances, but for a place like Harvard, which could easily choose only 4.0 students, there are diminishing returns simply because those aren't the deciding factors.

To back you up, according to MSAR:

Harvard (10-90%) MCAT: 32-41/ GPA: 3.72-4.0
Yale (10-90%) MCAT: 32-41/ GPA: 3.59-3.99

 

[TheMightySmiter]

Psh, Yale Med isn't even in the top 5. You might as well go to Hollywood Upstairs at that point.

 

[lacrosse87]

Hey guys, I'm wondering if you could help me with something.

How do you eat? I understand you have to first put some food in your mouth (this is proof I've already done a search on sdn to find the answer, no need to be a dick guys), but how do you get it down your throat? My pre-med advisors told me you had to move your jaw up and down a bunch of times, but a really good friend of mine told me he's gotten food down his throat before without having to do that step. So how exactly do you move your jaw? Like, do you you hold it and move it with your hands/arms? I'm seriously lost and desperately need some help. Oh yeah, and which food is most presitgious? I refuse to eat anything that's not like a 9.87436 out of 10 on the prestige scale

 

[Nymphicus]

Hey guys, I'm wondering if you could help me with something.

How do you eat? I understand you have to first put some food in your mouth (this is proof I've already done a search on sdn to find the answer, no need to be a dick guys), but how do you get it down your throat? My pre-med advisors told me you had to move your jaw up and down a bunch of times, but a really good friend of mine told me he's gotten food down his throat before without having to do that step. So how exactly do you move your jaw? Like, do you you hold it and move it with your hands/arms? I'm seriously lost and desperately need some help. Oh yeah, and which food is most presitgious? I refuse to eat anything that's not like a 9.87436 out of 10 on the prestige scale

Feeding tube. You can even get one plated with gold. Super prestigious.

 

[gettheleadout]

To back you up, according to MSAR:

Harvard (10-90%) MCAT: 32-41/ GPA: 3.72-4.0
Yale (10-90%) MCAT: 32-41/ GPA: 3.59-3.99

Ah, thank you. This means that 1 in 10 students at HMS had a GPA of ≤ ~3.7 and 1 in 10 students at Yale SOM had a GPA in the 3.5's or less. I would argue these students represent the minority of students whose academic records simply don't represent the level of excellence they demonstrated outside of their schoolwork. Such grades are good enough however, and a student who is absolutely amazing outside of his/her academics still probably wouldn't get in with a low 3.X range GPA simply because, regardless of other desirable characteristics/qualities/achievements, the adcom cannot realistically have faith that the individual can succeed when faced with the academic rigor of medical school. The same goes for a sub-27 MCAT (I believe this is where a study showed the correlation between MCAT score and board pass rate dropped off.)

 

[ur2l8]

for all the people who think the admission process into harvard is random:

The members of harvard medical and law schools are actually relatives and children of the illuminati. During the interview, certain passphrases must be said at certain times to confirm the identity of these people. Once all passphrases are said, "applicants" are taken to another room where they are inducted in a secret ritual, and nano particles that can be detonated at any time are injected into the bloodstream in order to ensure faith to the illuminati. These individuals go through medical school and/or law school and become set to control everything in modern society (from the adminstering of hiv to the assassination of scientists who come up with cures for cancer). Every applicant is scanned, and a few people who have no ties to any illuminati are selected to enter the class as "moles" who are meant to throw off any suspicion.

So if you have to ask how to get into harvard medical school, you obviously have no chance to begin with.

lol

 

[sportsperson]

Ideally to have a decent shot at those schools ONLY from an academic perspective, a 3.80 will be needed for sure. Keep in mind many people who are accepted with less than that have some spectacular ECs as well as lots of luck.

 

[yellowfish]

Honestly, schools like Harvard and Yale take you if they want you. Good GPA or bad GPA, your grades aren't going to be the factor to get you in or out. If you get rejected with a 3.6, you'd probably get rejected with a 4.0 as well. At their level, the competition is more than high-performing students, it's people who are special even in comparison to qualified, competitive applicants in the whole pool.

Bad GPA will absolutely get you out. And quick.

Listen kid, the ONLY and I mean ONLY ONLY ONLY thing that matters is the MCAT. They don't even look at GPAs anymore, so chill out.

I really hope nobody listens to this... GPA > MCAT (yes, this is an opinion - both are important)

 

[tantacles]

Ah, thank you. This means that 1 in 10 students at HMS had a GPA of ≤ ~3.7 and 1 in 10 students at Yale SOM had a GPA in the 3.5's or less. I would argue these students represent the minority of students whose academic records simply don't represent the level of excellence they demonstrated outside of their schoolwork. Such grades are good enough however, and a student who is absolutely amazing outside of his/her academics still probably wouldn't get in with a low 3.X range GPA simply because, regardless of other desirable characteristics/qualities/achievements, the adcom cannot realistically have faith that the individual can succeed when faced with the academic rigor of medical school. The same goes for a sub-27 MCAT (I believe this is where a study showed the correlation between MCAT score and board pass rate dropped off.)

You might also argue that many of these students are URM (even if there are just 10 of them, 5/10 is a lot).

 

[gettheleadout]

Ideally to have a decent shot at those schools ONLY from an academic perspective, a 3.80 will be needed for sure. Keep in mind many people who are accepted with less than that have some spectacular ECs as well as lots of luck.

I don't believe adcom members cast votes based on luck.

Bad GPA will absolutely get you out. And quick.

I clarified in my previous post what I meant by bad GPA.

 

[realmeaning]

For all the people who think the admission process into Harvard is random:

The members of Harvard medical and law schools are actually relatives and children of the Illuminati. During the interview, certain passphrases must be said at certain times to confirm the identity of these people. Once all passphrases are said, "applicants" are taken to another room where they are inducted in a secret ritual, and nano particles that can be detonated at any time are injected into the bloodstream in order to ensure faith to the Illuminati. These individuals go through medical school and/or law school and become set to control everything in modern society (from the adminstering of HIV to the assassination of scientists who come up with cures for cancer). Every applicant is scanned, and a few people who have no ties to any Illuminati are selected to enter the class as "moles" who are meant to throw off any suspicion.

So if you have to ask how to get into Harvard medical school, you obviously have no chance to begin with.

Elaborate plz.

To the poster: yeah, you could have Googled, but nothing wrong with getting a second opinion or en-/discouragement on these forums. I don't know why some people are freaking out. Good luck to you.

PS-- And yeah, GPA does matter. Unfortunately.

 

[Knocked Up]

I really hope nobody listens to this... GPA > MCAT (yes, this is an opinion - both are important)

I speak only the truth. Heck, you could have had a 4.99 GPA, but if you only had a 30 or 31 on the MCAT, there was absolutely NO WAY you were getting into Penn or Michigan this year. I rest my argument.

I had a freaking kid pull out his printed out AAMC MCAT score sheet thing to brag about it during an interview this year. I don't believe I've ever seen anyone pull out a transcript (aka: no on would care because high GPAs are so prevalent). Trust me: the world only cares about this single test. It gets even worse when you actually enter medical school: the world only cares about a single test again, but there is ABSOLUTELY no way to compensate for that score (whereas with the MCAT, GPA can minimally counter bits and pieces of it).

 

[yellowfish]

I clarified in my previous post what I meant by bad GPA.

Ah, didn't read that post before I quoted your previous. The 10-90th percentile data is useful.

 

[yellowfish]

I speak only the truth. Heck, you could have had a 4.99 GPA, but if you only had a 30 or 31 on the MCAT, there was absolutely NO WAY you were getting into Penn or Michigan this year. I rest my argument.

I had a freaking kid pull out his printed out AAMC MCAT score sheet thing to brag about it during an interview this year. I don't believe I've ever seen anyone pull out a transcript (aka: no on would care because high GPAs are so prevalent). Trust me: the world only cares about this single test. It gets even worse when you actually enter medical school: the world only cares about a single test again, but there is ABSOLUTELY no way to compensate for that score (whereas with the MCAT, GPA can minimally counter bits and pieces of it).

So... you're deciding to base your argument off of a situation that could never actually occur and your "absolute" conclusion concerning that situation, a n=1 observation during an interview, and a "trust me.. yadayada"?

Consider me converted to the MCAT camp.

 

[sportsperson]

I don't believe adcom members cast votes based on luck.


I clarified in my previous post what I meant by bad GPA.

It's well known that applying to many of these schools is a crap shoot. But luck is always a factor... some people will relate to your ECs and like you much better vs. someone else they dont like as much for whatever reason. You might be interviewed by someone who slept bad the night before, etc.

 

[IlDestriero]

Psh, Yale Med isn't even in the top 5. You might as well go to Hollywood Upstairs at that point.

Yes! Any punter can get into Yale.
Aim higher.

 

[sector9]

I speak only the truth. Heck, you could have had a 4.99 GPA, but if you only had a 30 or 31 on the MCAT, there was absolutely NO WAY you were getting into Penn or Michigan this year. I rest my argument.

I had a freaking kid pull out his printed out AAMC MCAT score sheet thing to brag about it during an interview this year. I don't believe I've ever seen anyone pull out a transcript (aka: no on would care because high GPAs are so prevalent). Trust me: the world only cares about this single test. It gets even worse when you actually enter medical school: the world only cares about a single test again, but there is ABSOLUTELY no way to compensate for that score (whereas with the MCAT, GPA can minimally counter bits and pieces of it).

Haha good to have you back to your usual posting style, Knocked Up

 

[1289]

OP, i admit the basis for this post was a little naive.. that being said, there's nothing wrong with getting opinions from people who have gone through the process. I also know that the average GPAs/MCAT scores given on websites don't always tell the whole story. Have you invested in the MSAR? do it.

haters gonna hate.

 

[gettheleadout]

It's well known that applying to many of these schools is a crap shoot. But luck is always a factor... some people will relate to your ECs and like you much better vs. someone else they dont like as much for whatever reason. You might be interviewed by someone who slept bad the night before, etc.

Those factors are at play at every school, in every interview in every setting, etc... Is there a reason why they are more significant at top schools? I've never bought the whole "crap shoot" argument. Yes, getting into top schools is competitive and an applicant who gets into 4 of the top 10 may get rejected from the other 6 for seemingly indiscernible reasons, but I see no evidence to believe that anything is left to chance in the decisions made on applications. Just because a particular interviewer gets a better impression of an applicant because they relate with an experience of theirs, for example, doesn't mean their endorsement of the applicant's personality alone will result in their admission. Likely the applicant has an experience or achievement that the adcom as a whole finds desirable in a student. In this sense I believe everyone who gets in to these top schools gets in for a reason.

 

[notbobtrustme]

I really hope nobody listens to this... GPA > MCAT (yes, this is an opinion - both are important)

I'd argue that MCAT = GPA or MCAT > GPA because there's too much variability in GPA. The absolute best way to "game" the system is to ace your pre-reqs and take a cupcake major, so that you can present a 3.8 or a 3.9 GPA. Because of the volume of applicants, variability in school rigor and vast differences between majors, there's no meaningful way to compare two persons' GPA from two different schools. Imagine a kid who takes 12-14 credit hours a semester while majoring in communications with a 3.9 GPA and someone who double majors in Chem/Physics with a 3.4 GPA. On just about every measure relevant for medical school admissions, the first kid is heads and shoulders above the second kid, even though the second kid is probably much more academically suited for medical school.

However, the MCAT offers a completely standardized, objective measure of one's ability. That first kid may squeak by with a 30 (aka good enough) while the superstar may ace the MCAT with a 35+.

 

[Thego2guy]

Thank you! I am surprised at how much, people need spoon feeding.

And to the guy that called you a dick - good luck when you wake up and find yourself in the real world.

Thanks buddy! That is what I am saying! Being spoon fed and sugar coated was the worst thing anyone could do for me. As for my post, I covered all my bases. I answered the question. I provided the links. I gave long term crucial advice.

As for the current little debate, this is from Harvard "Although grades are considered more important than MCAT scores, there is no formula. MCAT scores must be no older than three years, and, if taken more than once, all scores are evaluated. A low VR score for non-native English speaker may be overlooked if all other aspects of the application are very strong."

Different schools weight the MCAT/GPA differently. Columbia puts a crazy emphasis on MCAT. (70% + ?) meanwhile Einstein actually sees it as 60/40 in favor of the GPA. What I realized after reading and talking to adcoms members and whatnot, is that the GPA is a lot more important than it is played out to be. A lot of people say "oh man, its okay, just rock the MCAT and you'll be good" and that is SOMETIMES misleading. Plenty of schools see GPA > MCAT. But we are simply splitting hairs here because they all look at the applicant holistically and everything counts. To anyone who says that the MCAT is the ultimate factor for Harvard + Yale and that nothing else matters, then why are the average MCAT scores around 35-36 and not 41 or 42? I know a guy that is going to Yale from a city university with a 32 on his MCAT, not URM. 3.98 GPA. It is not a crap shoot in that sense. The only "crap shoot" that you have is during the interview day.

 

[Spurg]

I completely agree. I know someone with less than stellar stats and low 30s MCAT, but had a really unique background and back story (military, etc). Got in pretty much everywhere including Harvard and I dont think that would have changed if the person had slightly higher or slightly lower stats.

Hey Redsox, this person that you know that was prior service,could you contact them or have them post in the "Does prior military help" forum in the DO section? Any inspirational words from a veteran getting into some high tier schools would be greatly appreciated.

 

[yellowfish]

I'd argue that MCAT = GPA or MCAT > GPA because there's too much variability in GPA. The absolute best way to "game" the system is to ace your pre-reqs and take a cupcake major, so that you can present a 3.8 or a 3.9 GPA. Because of the volume of applicants, variability in school rigor and vast differences between majors, there's no meaningful way to compare two persons' GPA from two different schools. Imagine a kid who takes 12-14 credit hours a semester while majoring in communications with a 3.9 GPA and someone who double majors in Chem/Physics with a 3.4 GPA. On just about every measure relevant for medical school admissions, the first kid is heads and shoulders above the second kid, even though the second kid is probably much more academically suited for medical school.

However, the MCAT offers a completely standardized, objective measure of one's ability. That first kid may squeak by with a 30 (aka good enough) while the superstar may ace the MCAT with a 35+.

Very valid argument. GPA is long term, however. Anyone can have a good or bad day, or get a spread of topics on the MCAT they are good/bad at. So "objective" is actually more subjective than some might admit. Both measures have flaws and shortcomings.

Thanks buddy! That is what I am saying! Being spoon fed and sugar coated was the worst thing anyone could do for me. As for my post, I covered all my bases. I answered the question. I provided the links. I gave long term crucial advice.

As for the current little debate, this is from Harvard "Although grades are considered more important than MCAT scores, there is no formula. MCAT scores must be no older than three years, and, if taken more than once, all scores are evaluated. A low VR score for non-native English speaker may be overlooked if all other aspects of the application are very strong."

Different schools weight the MCAT/GPA differently. Columbia puts a crazy emphasis on MCAT. (70% + ?) meanwhile Einstein actually sees it as 60/40 in favor of the GPA. What I realized after reading and talking to adcoms members and whatnot, is that the GPA is a lot more important than it is played out to be. A lot of people say "oh man, its okay, just rock the MCAT and you'll be good" and that is SOMETIMES misleading. Plenty of schools see GPA > MCAT. But we are simply splitting hairs here because they all look at the applicant holistically and everything counts. To anyone who says that the MCAT is the ultimate factor for Harvard + Yale and that nothing else matters, then why are the average MCAT scores around 35-36 and not 41 or 42? I know a guy that is going to Yale from a city university with a 32 on his MCAT, not URM. 3.98 GPA. It is not a crap shoot in that sense. The only "crap shoot" that you have is during the interview day.