Have to repeat 1st Year. Residency Chances?

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atomeve

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Just heard from my school and found out I have to repeat my entire first year. :( I simply didn't do well enough. There were some mitigating factors, but none that I think would be given much weight (part of it was there was just a lot of drama within my group of friends that left me in a sort of a funk and the fact that I was just not ready for the rigors of med school and got behind early). I know what I did wrong this year from a study perspective, so I'm already planning out steps to do better next year. :oops:

Anyway, I'm wondering how badly having to repeat M1 year will hurt my residency/fellowship chances?

I never wanted to do something as competitive as Derm or Plastics, but I am still sort of interested in surgery; however, I am actually leaning more towards a sub-specialty in IM like GI, endo, etc.

I know I will have to do super-well from here on out, but I have to admit, my confidence is at a low point now, and I'm wondering how much emphasis residency/fellowship directors put on failing a year? Will fellowship directors even look at my basic science years, or go mainly off my clinical & actual residency training years?

Thanks for the help

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Just heard from my school and found out I have to repeat my entire first year. :( I simply didn't do well enough. There were some mitigating factors, but none that I think would be given much weight (part of it was there was just a lot of drama within my group of friends that left me in a sort of a funk and the fact that I was just not ready for the rigors of med school and got behind early). I know what I did wrong this year from a study perspective, so I'm already planning out steps to do better next year. :oops:

Anyway, I'm wondering how badly having to repeat M1 year will hurt my residency/fellowship chances?

I never wanted to do something as competitive as Derm or Plastics, but I am still sort of interested in surgery; however, I am actually leaning more towards a sub-specialty in IM like GI, endo, etc.

I know I will have to do super-well from here on out, but I have to admit, my confidence is at a low point now, and I'm wondering how much emphasis residency/fellowship directors put on failing a year? Will fellowship directors even look at my basic science years, or go mainly off my clinical & actual residency training years?

Thanks for the help

You will get into a residency. just make sure you are prepared to discuss this during your interviews cos it will come up.
I doubt if it will have an impact on fellowships. To the best of my knowledge, those are weighted heavily on your residency, especially if you do teh fellowship inthe same place as your residency.

Dont get too down on yourself. A lot of people take more than 4 years to finish med school for various reasons and still end up ok in the end
 
Just heard from my school and found out I have to repeat my entire first year. :( I simply didn't do well enough. There were some mitigating factors, but none that I think would be given much weight (part of it was there was just a lot of drama within my group of friends that left me in a sort of a funk and the fact that I was just not ready for the rigors of med school and got behind early). I know what I did wrong this year from a study perspective, so I'm already planning out steps to do better next year. :oops:

Anyway, I'm wondering how badly having to repeat M1 year will hurt my residency/fellowship chances?

I never wanted to do something as competitive as Derm or Plastics, but I am still sort of interested in surgery; however, I am actually leaning more towards a sub-specialty in IM like GI, endo, etc.

I know I will have to do super-well from here on out, but I have to admit, my confidence is at a low point now, and I'm wondering how much emphasis residency/fellowship directors put on failing a year? Will fellowship directors even look at my basic science years, or go mainly off my clinical & actual residency training years?

Thanks for the help

Right now your emphasis should be:
  • Post mortem of exactly why your failed your MS-1.
  • Obtaining a strong faculty mentor/adviser to address why your failed MS-1on residency applications when that time comes. If you have a strong mentor that knows you well for many years, then you stand a good chance of minimal "damage-control".
  • A thorough inventory of what you will work on this summer to do well next year and the years to come.
  • Forgiving yourself for this; it's done and you can't go back so why keep punishing yourself?

Depending on how you handle your academics (grades and boards) from here on out will determine your fate. If you don't concentrate on the above, worrying about any residency is useless. Take one step at a time and make some concrete changes. You need to be ready to hit the next year will a full "head of steam", rested and ready for the immediate tasks in front of you. My guess is if you "just heard that you are repeating", you are not even close to doing what you need to do for a strong performance next year. This sort of thing takes some time and objective review by you and your advisers.

The good thing is that plenty of medical students repeat the first year with few consequences but you have to move on and take one step at a time. Another good thing is that pre-clinical years are not super-important for residency selection but very important for board scores. In short, if you "get it right on the second go around", you have a good shot at a strong Step I score. [If you are offshore, the above is likely not going to apply].

Stop worrying about residency (and certainly not about fellowship) at this point and concentration on what you have to do. If you take one thing at a time, the rest will fall into place. In short, you can't go from Point A to Point D without touching Points B and C.
 
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Thank you all for your advice and words of encouragement. Going into the last month I kind of knew there was a high chance that I would have to repeat the year, but it wasn't until about 2 weeks ago that it became official. I'm trying to put it behind me while also learning from it, and I know I still have a ways to go to truly rectify my mistakes.

Like I mentioned before, there wasn't really this one significant issue (ie- prolonged illness, family problems, etc.) that I can use to explain my troubles. I simply wasn't prepared to deal with the med school work load (though my aforementioned friends drama did make things uncomfortable for me socially, as well as break up our study group). I'm going to try and push residency et al. out of my mind for now and just focus on doing well one test at a time, but I guess I just wanted to hear that things could still turn out alright, and that my situation could be salvaged, as long as I work even harder.
 
Are you a US med student? If so, I think you should be fine.
 
Are you a US med student? If so, I think you should be fine.
Yes, I am a US med student. Sorry I forgot to state that.

Out of curiosity, outside of the ROAD specialties, plastics and orthopedic surgeries, are there any other (sub-)specialties that fall into that really competitive category?
 
Yes, I am a US med student. Sorry I forgot to state that.

Out of curiosity, outside of the ROAD specialties, plastics and orthopedic surgeries, are there any other (sub-)specialties that fall into that really competitive category?


Well Neurosurgery is probably out. ENT (Head and neck) is also out.

General Surgery from what I've heard isn't supercompetitive like plastics or derm but it's still one of the more competitive specialties (similar to radiology and gas I think).

If I was in your position, I'd aim to IM if I wanted to subspecialize. There are a cardiology and gastroenterology fellowships that you can apply after completing the residency.

Even if you didn't do so well this year, it's still possible to get a lifestyle specialties like pathology PMR that have relatively good work hours.

All hope is not lost as long as you can figure out what went wrong. Make sure you meet with your advisor and figure out what's holding you back before next year.
 
General surgery is no where near as competitive as radiology. What do you think the R is, in ROAD? Avg Radiology residency match is well over 240 on Step 1.

Gen Surg is more like 225
 
I think how you handle the situation moving forward will dictate your future.

If you spend your time wallowing in self loathing or not learning from your mistakes then you probably won't have a good shot at anything.

However (and it sounds like you have this mindset) if you say to yourself "you know what, what is done is done and now I need to perform". You'll be fine. I would be a little cautious about putting so much pressure on yourself that you become a nervous wreck. From what I have observed, students that put way too much pressure on themselves usually perform worse than if they chilled out a bit..

Best of luck to you, just keep your head up and stay positive. It's hard to predict exactly how your failed attempt at first year will affect you in the future. All you can do is rebound the best you can and present a portfolio once you're done that shows you can overcome adversity (like the ego blow of having to repeat first year). don't worry about specialties, don't worry about anything beyond the present, just do the best you can right now. The rest will work itself out.
just my two cents.....
 
General surgery is no where near as competitive as radiology. What do you think the R is, in ROAD? Avg Radiology residency match is well over 240 on Step 1.

Gen Surg is more like 225


I heard general surgery was competitive but this may have been several years ago before radiology become even more competitive. If the OP wants hard objective numbers, he can go online and find the NRMP "Charting Outcomes" As a rule any specialty with an average step 1 score at or above 230 can be considered competitive.

I also agree with what the other poster have said about picking yourself up and doing well from this point onward, that is probably a bigger factor in determining your fate than this one failure.
 
I heard general surgery was competitive but this may have been several years ago before radiology become even more competitive. If the OP wants hard objective numbers, he can go online and find the NRMP "Charting Outcomes" As a rule any specialty with an average step 1 score at or above 230 can be considered competitive.

I also agree with what the other poster have said about picking yourself up and doing well from this point onward, that is probably a bigger factor in determining your fate than this one failure.

Rads average is 235, gen surg is 221.
 
Just heard from my school and found out I have to repeat my entire first year. :( I simply didn't do well enough. There were some mitigating factors, but none that I think would be given much weight (part of it was there was just a lot of drama within my group of friends that left me in a sort of a funk and the fact that I was just not ready for the rigors of med school and got behind early). I know what I did wrong this year from a study perspective, so I'm already planning out steps to do better next year. :oops:

Anyway, I'm wondering how badly having to repeat M1 year will hurt my residency/fellowship chances?

I never wanted to do something as competitive as Derm or Plastics, but I am still sort of interested in surgery; however, I am actually leaning more towards a sub-specialty in IM like GI, endo, etc.

I know I will have to do super-well from here on out, but I have to admit, my confidence is at a low point now, and I'm wondering how much emphasis residency/fellowship directors put on failing a year? Will fellowship directors even look at my basic science years, or go mainly off my clinical & actual residency training years?

Thanks for the help

Well, the positive part of having to repeat classes is that you SHOULD be able to do extremely well.

And there's really no such thing as "aiming too high" either, since you will be heading into each class with the substantial advantage of knowing what's going on and what will be expected. I'm talking top of the class. Honestly, I think even someone scoring in the bottom percentiles should be able to flip that around on the second pass. So much of what's hard about 1st year is simply time pressure. Having a second chance at all those classes gives you a tremendous opportunity. (Just don't be satisfied with yourself by only doing average and chugging along, this second go-around.)

You can do very well this time and also achieve a more firm foundation for boards compared to the rest of your classmates.
 
Cuz first year is so heavily emphasized on step...
 
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Cut Jay Leno some slack. He/she is only a premed that doesn't really know anything :D


Points at something in the distance, "Hey! what's that behind you?"

Scurries out of the allopathic threat while you're being distracted. :)
 
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for those of us who are about to start our first year of med school, do you have any advice on what *not* to do? Help us avoid the mistakes that you made.
 
for those of us who are about to start our first year of med school, do you have any advice on what *not* to do? Help us avoid the mistakes that you made.

I wish I didn't listen to the people who told me to change my study habits because we're now in "medical school".

When medical school started, I changed the way I studied, and started doing it the way others in medical school did (one example: I hate study groups, but everyone and their mother told me to join one, which I did, which ended up screwing me over). I failed the first couple of exams, and actually got to see what a 30% looks like on paper. I'm just glad I snapped out of it before it was too late.

What not to do: Don't fix anything until you're 100% positive it needs fixing. If you got into medical school, then you're obviously doing something right. Keep doing it.

If there's one piece of advice I wish I could have given myself, it would have been to not listen to anyone's advice, and simply do things my way. I should have believed in myself more.

I guess I can see how some people might disagree with me. That's what worked for me though. I wish I didn't listen to people's advice. I wish I went out more. I wish I didn't stress too much. I wish I knew that everyone else in my class was as lost as I was, and was as scared as I was. I could go on and on....

:luck:
 
to not listen to anyone's advice, and simply do things my way. I should have believed in myself more.

Yes! That's exactly what a couple of other med students told me also, and it sounds spot-on to me. When I started studying for the MCAT I took the Kaplan course, and it seemed to me like I wasn't getting anything out of "the kaplan method" but I figure, hey, c'mon, they MUST know better than I know, they're fricken Kaplan, this is what they do. So I decided to stick with studying their way even though it seemed like a waste to me. After studying their way for 2 months I realized that I had learned almost nothing and I was going to have to postpone my MCAT which meant I was going to have to take an extra year off before going to med school. So yeah, I learned that lesson as well, and I'm glad to hear you reiterate it. I know what works *for me*, and I'm gonna stick with what I know works for me until I run into a situation where it no longer does.


I wish I didn't listen to people's advice. I wish I went out more. I wish I didn't stress too much. I wish I knew that everyone else in my class was as lost as I was, and was as scared as I was. I could go on and on....


Please do! In fact, this sounds like an amazing topic in its own right, so I created a new thread for it. Knowing what you know now, what advice would you tell to entering 1st years?
 
for those of us who are about to start our first year of med school, do you have any advice on what *not* to do? Help us avoid the mistakes that you made.

1- So many people told me that you could pass anatomy just fine if you just went to required lab sessions... well I passed barely doing that but I found that when I spent time in the lab studying my grades improved drastically- so even if you hate the lab gut up and take it for a few months

2- I agree to not change study skills til you see if what doing before will work. I had to make slight changes but nothing drastic.

3- When not in anatomy try to make sure even if you don't attend class that you get regular social interaction- it is easy to think about just sitting in the library all day but do something else so you see people too!
 
You'll be fine. Derm and plastics are probably out. Rad onc, ENT, urology, and neurosurg are reaches now. You should still be able to match into pretty much everything else for the top programs in those fields. Rads, gas, EM are still very doable. Your future now depends on how you do on step 1 and 3rd year. If you screw up those too, you'll be doing FM in a program nobody wants.
 
Seriously? After failing a year? I'm not arguing with you, I'm just surprised.

i think hes talking about simply matching at all, not really getting a big academic center.
 
Seriously? After failing a year? I'm not arguing with you, I'm just surprised.

We had a dude who had repeated his first year. From what he told mutual friends, he barely passed it the second time around, and then he barely passed 2nd year.

He matched into ortho this year.

Granted it was probably a program in the middle of nowhere, but ortho's ortho dude...

He probably went all out for clinicals and step 1 though... who knows...
 
We had a dude who had repeated his first year. From what he told mutual friends, he barely passed it the second time around, and then he barely passed 2nd year.

He matched into ortho this year.

Granted it was probably a program in the middle of nowhere, but ortho's ortho dude...

He probably went all out for clinicals and step 1 though... who knows...

I'm not surprised. Don't underestimate how importance of the "name" of your school. You can get away with a lot of stuff if you're coming from a top 20 school. Carib or DO students don't have as much margin of error.
 
I'm not surprised. Don't underestimate how importance of the "name" of your school. You can get away with a lot of stuff if you're coming from a top 20 school. Carib or DO students don't have as much margin of error.

You may have just started something...
 
I'm not surprised. Don't underestimate how importance of the "name" of your school. You can get away with a lot of stuff if you're coming from a top 20 school. Carib or DO students don't have as much margin of error.

What if the same person had passed everything 1st and 2nd year but failed step 1. Do you think they would have the same options available for residency (assuming they are coming from a US MD school) as they would failing a year but doing well on step 1?
 
What if the same person had passed everything 1st and 2nd year but failed step 1. Do you think they would have the same options available for residency (assuming they are coming from a US MD school) as they would failing a year but doing well on step 1?

As long as you come from a good school, you get the benefit of the doubt most of the time. You can fail step 1 or 1st year and still do well on the match. However, just don't expect derm or plastics. You have better chances with ENT, urology, rad onc but they also are probably unrealistic. Why? Because you have to look at how many positions are available in those specialties. Not that many. To summarize, black mark on record + highly competitive specialty + low number of spots in that specialty = you better hope your daddy is a Congressman or a billionaire to get in. Ortho or rads are doable because even though they're highly competitive look at how many positions are available. ~600 for ortho, ~1000 for rads. Likewise, gas and EM are less competitive and easier to match. ~1300 for gas. ~1000 for EM.

Obviously, if you have one black mark, you better do well with the rest of your application. Have more than one means a pattern and you're screwed. FM in backwater, Idaho for you.
 
OP--Sorry dude (or dudette), your life in medicine is over....may as well quit now and practice the phrase,"Would you like fries with that?"....I mean, after all, the best you can hope for is maybe a DNP or PA slot unless you want to be banished into HMO hell as an FP doc......

PUHLEASE----

You sound like a 22 year old who walked into the buzz saw of medical school. The fact that you let your 'friends drama' put you in a funk denotes a certain level of immaturity and irresponsibility but I'd expect that from a 22 year old and assuming most PDs are intelligent, mature individuals, they will also.

What matters now is how you handle the repeat year. Cut the BS and get serious about your studying. Quit looking for the easy way out ( all you have to do is go to anatomy lab and you're golden), put down the Wii controller and get to work. Learn the effin' material....you've been given a chance and had a guided tour through the material the first time so you KNOW what's important and where the test questions are coming from....you should be able to increase your scores by a minimum of 7 to 10% per class....

Use the Taus method (found here on SDN) for Step 1 studying and rock the house.....

Learn to work and play well with others during your 3rd year, be on the ball every day and show up. Use a little common sense when dealing with people and you can get some decent LORs.

Do an audition rotation at your places of choice and you should be ok. It's more about how you work with people than what you know. Most people would rather work with someone they could count on to do the job than someone who let's workplace drama affect them. So take the lesson and mature a bit......and go achieve your dreams.....
 
I am just a pre-med. But I wanted to say -- your failures do not define you, but rather your ability to succeed in spite of them! Chin up soldier :)
 
I wish I didn't listen to the people who told me to change my study habits because we're now in "medical school".

When medical school started, I changed the way I studied, and started doing it the way others in medical school did (one example: I hate study groups, but everyone and their mother told me to join one, which I did, which ended up screwing me over). I failed the first couple of exams, and actually got to see what a 30% looks like on paper. I'm just glad I snapped out of it before it was too late.

What not to do: Don't fix anything until you're 100% positive it needs fixing. If you got into medical school, then you're obviously doing something right. Keep doing it.

If there's one piece of advice I wish I could have given myself, it would have been to not listen to anyone's advice, and simply do things my way. I should have believed in myself more.

I guess I can see how some people might disagree with me. That's what worked for me though. I wish I didn't listen to people's advice. I wish I went out more. I wish I didn't stress too much. I wish I knew that everyone else in my class was as lost as I was, and was as scared as I was. I could go on and on....

:luck:

This. Best advice possible. Don't fix something that isn't broke until you know it's broke.
 
I'm sure the difference of those few numbers is not that huge. The point was there is a difference between 230s vs. early to mid 220s on the step 1. The obvious point being that the latter field is less competitive then the former.

:confused:
 
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Just heard from my school and found out I have to repeat my entire first year. :( I simply didn't do well enough. There were some mitigating factors, but none that I think would be given much weight (part of it was there was just a lot of drama within my group of friends that left me in a sort of a funk and the fact that I was just not ready for the rigors of med school and got behind early). I know what I did wrong this year from a study perspective, so I'm already planning out steps to do better next year. :oops:

Anyway, I'm wondering how badly having to repeat M1 year will hurt my residency/fellowship chances?

I never wanted to do something as competitive as Derm or Plastics, but I am still sort of interested in surgery; however, I am actually leaning more towards a sub-specialty in IM like GI, endo, etc.

I know I will have to do super-well from here on out, but I have to admit, my confidence is at a low point now, and I'm wondering how much emphasis residency/fellowship directors put on failing a year? Will fellowship directors even look at my basic science years, or go mainly off my clinical & actual residency training years?

Thanks for the help
You can still do well. Dont lost hope and start reading a lot more. Keep reading and reading and really build your confidence level to the point where you see yourself as a full fledge doctor. Use what motivates you and ignore all negative distractors. You will bounce back harder and smarter in the long run. But put in more time to reading. GL
 
I have seen many people repeat year after year. One of the things thats involved with repeating is the stigma that the faculty in your school and peers have on you. The expectation that you were not responsible to hold it together to pass is very tough. I mean you have to work around it and know that other's opnion's do not matter. There will be a stigma at all cost. You will have to know how to sell yourself and your abilities to the new class. Surviving in the competitive environment will be tough. But, having a good mentor, advisor, and 4-5 friends in your circle will help. In addition, know that from now on you have to be 10X ahead of the game. You cannot let emotions, others opnion take your future away. The peers in the past who have repeated have had one of the best personalities and one of them even interviewed for EM at Harvard. They have been amazing in every level. But, there is different type of courage and mental stamina involved when starting the new year. Keep your sanity and know there is very little room to make mistakes from now on. Maybe start studying on your weaknesses this summer. figure out your study strategies, rooming and know you have to BE PREPARED. And remember, speak up, raise your voice when you dont understand. You are paying tuition for this. I was in IB program in highschool, and I was on probabtion because of family isssues, and every single teacher and friend told me to give up. But, I kept my chin up and still graduated. It wasn't easy not having social support network at times, it wasn't easy being at the bottom, but I think that is the reason why I am in medical school, because I never gave up. Failure is part of life. I think to pass medical school requires an average mind, but strong people skills and confidence. Don't let the past determine your future.
 
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OP--Sorry dude (or dudette), your life in medicine is over....may as well quit now and practice the phrase,"Would you like fries with that?"....I mean, after all, the best you can hope for is maybe a DNP or PA slot unless you want to be banished into HMO hell as an FP doc......

PUHLEASE----

You sound like a 22 year old who walked into the buzz saw of medical school. The fact that you let your 'friends drama' put you in a funk denotes a certain level of immaturity and irresponsibility but I'd expect that from a 22 year old and assuming most PDs are intelligent, mature individuals, they will also.

What matters now is how you handle the repeat year. Cut the BS and get serious about your studying. Quit looking for the easy way out ( all you have to do is go to anatomy lab and you're golden), put down the Wii controller and get to work. Learn the effin' material....you've been given a chance and had a guided tour through the material the first time so you KNOW what's important and where the test questions are coming from....you should be able to increase your scores by a minimum of 7 to 10% per class....

Use the Taus method (found here on SDN) for Step 1 studying and rock the house.....

Learn to work and play well with others during your 3rd year, be on the ball every day and show up. Use a little common sense when dealing with people and you can get some decent LORs.

Do an audition rotation at your places of choice and you should be ok. It's more about how you work with people than what you know. Most people would rather work with someone they could count on to do the job than someone who let's workplace drama affect them. So take the lesson and mature a bit......and go achieve your dreams.....

This is probably the best advice I've found, though pretty condescending (dude, I had major troubles with drama, it has nothing to do with age. stuff happens no matter if you're 21 or 28). Either way he's right about the salient points--knock your classes out of the ballpark since you're taking them again, REMOVE ALL DISTRACTIONS (that was a problem for me which I've fixed), and concentrate on your coursework. If you have a couple other obligations that's alright (leadership, for example).

Above all, STUDY HARD FOR YOUR STEP 1s. The bullcrap above about being "out" when it comes to ENT or orthopedics by the premed is nonsense. This will come up on your residency interviews but if you have amply compensated for it by the time you roll around for them, that will speak for itself.
 
I wish I didn't listen to the people who told me to change my study habits because we're now in "medical school".

When medical school started, I changed the way I studied, and started doing it the way others in medical school did (one example: I hate study groups, but everyone and their mother told me to join one, which I did, which ended up screwing me over). I failed the first couple of exams, and actually got to see what a 30% looks like on paper. I'm just glad I snapped out of it before it was too late.

What not to do: Don't fix anything until you're 100% positive it needs fixing. If you got into medical school, then you're obviously doing something right. Keep doing it.

If there's one piece of advice I wish I could have given myself, it would have been to not listen to anyone's advice, and simply do things my way. I should have believed in myself more.

I guess I can see how some people might disagree with me. That's what worked for me though. I wish I didn't listen to people's advice. I wish I went out more. I wish I didn't stress too much. I wish I knew that everyone else in my class was as lost as I was, and was as scared as I was. I could go on and on....

:luck:

THIS AS WELL. I can't agree more. Everyone has a different style of studying. Go with what works BEST FOR YOU. Don't listen to the BS about what is the "right way" to do something. If you need to start studying from the day of the new unit, do it. It doesn't matter if other people require less time, everyone is different.

Forgive me for being a broken record again, but I cannot emphasize how important it is to remove ALL distractions if you really want to do well. I'm not saying you should become a shut-in, but when you're studying, study seriously. One thing I found which helps is getting away from anything electronic--that's always been a massive hurdle for me.
 
I know this is an old thread, but wanted to bring up I failed first year due to 1 class.

I did well for everything else

My mother died 3 days before my Step 1 and I failed it. I was prepared knowledge wise, but not mentally.

In the end its going to take me 6 years to finish a 4 year program. I am a DO student in the US.

Can anyone tell me what my chances of landing ANY residency are? Thank you
 
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