Having trouble deciding how many transitional/Prelim programs to apply to.

[SleepyTime]

What does everybody think? 5 or 10 total? or maybe 2 in each city?

I mean, I could just scramble.

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[barkster]

What does everybody think? 5 or 10 total? or maybe 2 in each city?

I mean, I could just scramble.

Yeah, I have the same question. I'm looking at 15 programs that offer categorical and advanced or only advanced positions. If I prefer to do my intern year at the same place as my residency, does that mean I need to apply to at least 15 more prelim programs? If there are mutiple options in the same city, do I apply to all of them (which could add up to 45 additional programs)? What if I only applied to the anesthesia programs, and once I got interview offers, only THEN applied to the preliminary positions? Would that be too late? Sorry for all the questions. As you can tell I'm a little confused...Thanks!

 

[oompa loompa]

Yes, I have this same dilemma. I'm already planning to rank categorical programs higher than prelim...but I'd like to cover all bases. If worst case scenario happens, I'd rather have a prelim spot somewhere near the rest of my residency than have to move twice, or scramble...

 

[mstudent12345]

This is probably the most annoying part of the interview process and the most difficult, but let me try and share some experience/advice.

1) Prelim is more competitive than gas (unless you want to do surgery). Plenty of people going to top gas programs are in not so impressive prelims

2) From what I see now, most (though certainly not all) prelims end up having pretty similar schedules (you basically need 6 months of wards, 2 or ICU and 1 or ed) which is about what the most "busy" have anyway. The difference is only in how busy you are when you are in the hospital (hours end up being similar too).

So your major question ends up being geography. My major advice would be to interview at at least 10 prelims. If you must live in the same city for all four years that would be 10 in each city.

So I would say for those of you that are applying in a few places, pick one place you are most comfortable doing prelim (maybe where you are now, or where you think your #1 will be) and interview at a ton of places in that city/region. Then you can also interview at 1-2 places in those other cities hoping that if you end up there it will work out.

It sucks, but that is the process. Good luck, and feel free to PM me with q's

 

[lord_jeebus]

What is your desired location? The prelim/transitional match is furiously competitive, especially in places where people want to live.

I had 260+ Step I and II, top 1/4 of my class, aggressively recruited by some "top" anesthesia programs (and got the one I wanted) ...and matched #11 for prelim. #1 - #10 were cushy programs in SoCal and NYC.

 

[seamonkey]

I had great board scores, great TY-specific letters, and still only got my 7th choice out of 7. I matched at a totally top-notch gas residency too.

My match-day paper had one of the most ridiculously absurd combinations of intern + advanced on it that could ever exist.

PGY-1 is only1 year. And my 7th choice out of 7 actually wound up giving me only 6 call months out the the entire year, and was actually slacker than I could ever have hoped for from any place I applied to. (i'm probably stupider for it, but i can catch up)

so..its a crapshoot

 

[DO4lifer]

prelim is very competitive. if you scramble, you will be doing prelim surgery.

just cast a broad net like for gas.

 

[darkmansaad]

when we say prelim do we mean prelim med or TY? or both?

 

[Gimlet]

when we say prelim do we mean prelim med or TY? or both?

Both, although there is a difference, at least where I'm from. The TY programs in my hometown are very competitive, whereas I think I could have easily matched into a Prelim Medicine spot here.

FWIW, I only applied to the three TY/Prelim spots in my hometown. Wound up adding a couple extra just because you were automatically considered for the 1st year spots without interviewing when you applied to the anesthesiology program (this was at Virginia Mason and OHSU, if I remember correctly), and I only ranked those on the supplemental lists for those specific programs. I wound up matching to a categorical program anyway.

If you think you have a lock on a 1st year position at home, this strategy of applying to only hometown prelims could work for you. Then you'll only have to move once - it'll just be at the end of intern year instead of before, which can be a pain in the ass. YMMV, though.

Like DO4lifer mentioned, don't underestimate the competitiveness of the prelim/TY spots - you don't want to be scrambling for one because it won't be pretty.

 

[lfesiam]

Both, although there is a difference, at least where I'm from. The TY programs in my hometown are very competitive, whereas I think I could have easily matched into a Prelim Medicine spot here.

FWIW, I only applied to the three TY/Prelim spots in my hometown. Wound up adding a couple extra just because you were automatically considered for the 1st year spots without interviewing when you applied to the anesthesiology program (this was at Virginia Mason and OHSU, if I remember correctly), and I only ranked those on the supplemental lists for those specific programs. I wound up matching to a categorical program anyway.

If you think you have a lock on a 1st year position at home, this strategy of applying to only hometown prelims could work for you. Then you'll only have to move once - it'll just be at the end of intern year instead of before, which can be a pain in the ass. YMMV, though.

Like DO4lifer mentioned, don't underestimate the competitiveness of the prelim/TY spots - you don't want to be scrambling for one because it won't be pretty.

I second above comments.

In general = TY > Prelim Med > Prelim Surg in competitiveness.

Some TYs are not really "TY" (same as a prelim med). Question to ask, "HOW MANY ELECTIVE MONTHS DO YOU GET?" TY will usually give you 6 months. Prelim Med will flux from 2 to 4 months. Also ask about continuity clinic responsibility as a prelim/TY.

Some prelim meds are actually better than some TY. Do a search on SDN!

How many to apply...well it depends....how badly do you want a TY year? - Apply to all TY programs if this is what you want, will be expensive though. Last year, I applied to about 20 of mixed TY/Prelims. Got about 17 interviews, went to 7 interviews (5 TY + 2 Prelim Med) due to budget and time. In hindsight, I over applied...but it gave me a peace of mind.

I would aim for 6-8 interviews on prelim/TY year for an avg applicant.

Try to apply to all of your home town prelim/TY programs = you don't have to move twice + higher chance of getting in.