Help...few interviews but applied to 35 programs

[bpeoples]

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I applied to 35 EM programs, big and small, long established and newer ones, etc. So far, I have only had 7 interview offers with 5 completed already and the other two scheduled, and 8 email rejections. (An 8th offer was given, but no more interview spots are available at this time.)

My letters are strong (I have been told this on all interviews), excellent/good clinical evals including a few high passes (FM, IM, OB/Gyn), good mpse, etc, and lots of extra stuff from activities involved in. Also some research but no publications both before and in medical school, EMS background and other outside stuff.

But, I don't have the numbers behind me, i.e., transcript shows a retaken class and remake exam in 1st year, and remake exam in 3rd year surgery, and Board scores are 210 for Step 1 and 202 for Step 2ck, awaiting cs results (not worried there).

Should I be contacting the remaining 19 programs and asking them to take a second look at my application, beyond the numbers?? Would emailing the PD look desperate or confidant??

Basically, am I, to be blunt, screwed?

My letters are from EM (including a SLOR), IM, Surgery, and FM. I have a second EM letter that came in late, I probably could have my school forward it direct to program directors if requested, if they need two EM letters.

I don't want to get stuck in the scramble and end up in a TY, and then wind up in the hell of primary care or worse (psych and IM).

Please reply here or email me direct: [email protected]

Thanks

 

[RRPiper]

According to the Charting Outcomes in the Match Study from the 2007 class, if you ranked 7 programs, you have a 94/105 (89.5%) chance to match.

Sending emails to PDs might not be a bad idea, but your chances of matching aren't horrible...

 

[bartleby]

Email the PD's and mention that there is an additional EM letter in ERAS that might improve the strength of your application and warrant additional consideration. You have nothing to lose from a program which has not yet invited you.

 

[college!!]

you could also update them on any new grades you've gotten that aren't on your uploaded transcript.

also, if you have any reasons (geographic, county vs private, 3 vs 4 yr, personal interests that match with a programs strengths) why particular programs are a good fit for you let them know.

I agree with piper, you're not in bad shape. Try to get to that magic 10 interviews where the match rate is 100%

Good luck!

 

[deuist]

Try to get to that magic 10 interviews where the match rate is 100%

Not quite 100%, but at >98%, your chances are pretty good if you can interview at 10 or more places.

 

[bpeoples]

So I went and changed my LORs around to include the 2nd EM letter, and emailed the remaining Program Directors (and Program Coordinators) to let them know of the change, resulting in 5 rejections 👎 and 1 interview request 👍 within days of the change.

I think this is getting to me. I hate this ****. (Don't get me wrong, I am normally an upbeat person, but this is too for even me)

This whole 'we look at the whole application' BS. Why not just put your minimum numbers for board scores on their SAEM website page and be honest about it. Save applicants the time and money from applying to their programs if that is the case, and concentrate on programs that they might actually get invited to?? Or is honesty asking for too much?

and great....my first day of a new rotation, I just received word I am on call tomorrow night....well, at least 'they' were honest enough to email me about it.

 

[EM2BE]

So I went and changed my LORs around to include the 2nd EM letter, and emailed the remaining Program Directors (and Program Coordinators) to let them know of the change, resulting in 5 rejections 👎 and 1 interview request 👍 within days of the change.

I think this is getting to me. I hate this ****. (Don't get me wrong, I am normally an upbeat person, but this is too for even me)

This whole 'we look at the whole application' BS. Why not just put your minimum numbers for board scores on their SAEM website page and be honest about it. Save applicants the time and money from applying to their programs if that is the case, and concentrate on programs that they might actually get invited to?? Or is honesty asking for too much?

and great....my first day of a new rotation, I just received word I am on call tomorrow night....well, at least 'they' were honest enough to email me about it.

Sadly, I know someone who is worse off in the application process. They have the same attitude as you at this point (esp about the numbers game). Maybe they don't post minimum scores so that a) they get more money for dinners and/or b) they give those that rotate there a little hope.

 

[docjolly]

This whole 'we look at the whole application' BS. Why not just put your minimum numbers for board scores on their SAEM website page and be honest about it. Save applicants the time and money from applying to their programs if that is the case, and concentrate on programs that they might actually get invited to?? Or is honesty asking for too much?

"The concept of "minimum numbers for board scores" is very program-dependent..i spoke to several programs directly about this, and heard some speak at this year's SAEM conference concerning this issue. when ranked among other factors, board scores are actually somewhere towards the middle, in terms of importance.

if board scores were the be-all-end-all factor, then many emergency medicine applicants wouldn't receive interviews or be ranked.

as a side note, one PD told me that they have a mimimum board cut-off value. those applicants who do not meet that specific criterion aren't tossed aside..rather, their applications are reevaluated at a later time, and if other factors come forth to help improve their apps (.e.g. research, strong SLORs), then they are invited for interviews.

 

[notdeadyet]

"The concept of "minimum numbers for board scores" is very program-dependent..i spoke to several programs directly about this, and heard some speak at this year's SAEM conference concerning this issue. when ranked among other factors, board scores are actually somewhere towards the middle, in terms of importance.

Agreed. This was the same feedback I got from every lecture at EMRA/ACEP and every residency director I've talked to. All I've spoken with say that the clinical evals are much more important than Step I.

 

[domer621]

This whole 'we look at the whole application' BS. Why not just put your minimum numbers for board scores on their SAEM website page and be honest about it. Save applicants the time and money from applying to their programs if that is the case, and concentrate on programs that they might actually get invited to?? Or is honesty asking for too much?

I'm sorry for your situation, man, but having 8 interviews ain't too shabby!

To play devil's advocate, board scores are always some of the most important pieces of any application, and since you're well below average on both Step exams.....

Agreed. This was the same feedback I got from every lecture at EMRA/ACEP and every residency director I've talked to. All I've spoken with say that the clinical evals are much more important than Step I.

That's what they say, but every EP I asked for advice on where I should apply always asked for my board scores, lol

 

[drguy22]

That's what they say, but every EP I asked for advice on where I should apply always asked for my board scores, lol

i know...same here...first question asked.."whats your step 1 score"?

 

[Capgras]

I think those surveys that ask PDs "What's important" applies to students who get an interview. I'm sure most programs have a minimum step 1 score because EM is fairly competitive. After you get the interview then they look at clinical grades and letters. Just my opinion.

 

[NeuroSync]

I think those surveys that ask PDs "What's important" applies to students who get an interview. I'm sure most programs have a minimum step 1 score because EM is fairly competitive. After you get the interview then they look at clinical grades and letters. Just my opinion.

This is definitely not true. I had a terrible (and I mean TERRIBLE) step I score. While there were several significant extenuating circumstances, those don't change the score. I have lots of other great stuff on my CV, though, and good clinical grades (but certainly not all honors). I got interviews at all of the places I wanted, many of which are very, very competitive. And I got the invitations very early in the season.

I have talked with two PDs at very competitive programs (Denver and Stanford), and they say that while scores are a factor, it is the overall picture that they look at, and ONE SCORE will not sink anyone.

So for all of you out there with a crummy board score, don't let anyone derail you from going for what you really want and stay positive! 🙂

 

[quideam]

I second everything NeroSync said... I have a fairly lously step I score (not much higher than the OP's), but the rest of my application - grades, letters, research, etc., is very strong. I got every interview I wanted, with the exception of one - so I really do think that for the majority of programs, it's the whole picture that matters and there is no Step I cutoff. Keep your spirits up... it's still not the end of interview season, so you never know.

 

[Snelgrave]

The good news is that with 8 programs ranked 90+% of applicants matched into EM in 2007, and you still have many applications outstanding. At this point I would concentrate on performing well in interviews, writing prompt thank you cards, and doing a second look at programs you truly are interested in.

If you really think you need more interviews than it's not too late to apply to some programs. I was in a similar situation 2 weeks ago (4 interviews, several rejections) and was consulted by my dean that I may not match. So I emptied the clip and applied to almost every program that had not reached their deadline, and I received enough interviews to breath easy (even in cities I would gladly live in ).

It seems that EM is very popular this year. One PD told me their applications are up 25% this year.

 

[deuist]

Interviews are still coming in. I was very surprised to get an offer yesterday. I had figured that if I hadn't heard back from a program yet, I was going to get a rejection.

 

[RustedFox]

Anyone have a link to where we keep getting these statistics from ? (8 programs = 90% match rate, etc.)

Forum search failed me again.

 

[Bound4EM2009]

I believe this is the site. Download the .pdf file there.

http://www.aamc.org/matchoutcomes

 

[samiuam]

http://www.nrmp.org/data/chartingoutcomes2007.pdf

 

[RustedFox]

Thanks fellas, but I'm still unclear on how you're interpreting this data. Expound?

 

[college!!]

So look on page 39 for E Med.

# of contiguous ranks is statistics-ese for the number of programs on your rank list. So assuming that you went on eight interviews and are ranking all of them, you have eight contiguous ranks.

The data shows that of those graduating from a US allopathic school with eight ranks: 108 matched and three did not. Mathematically 108/111=97.3%
If you include FMGs, IMGs, and DOs the numbers are 129/140=92.1%

nine ranks 128/136=94.1%
ten ranks 137/140=97.9%
eleven ranks 105/107= 98.1%

Dig it?

 

[RustedFox]

I dig. I thought that "no. of contiguous ranks" meant the number of programs that ranked you on their list, instead of having interviewed there and then having the program toss you aside altogether.

- Thank you.