Help! My life is in danger!!

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I am on my overnight week of labor and delivery. I am surrounded by 16 women. They are giving eachother manicures, talking about celebrities in baby voices, and laughing uncontrollably. I slowly feel the life being sucked out of my body. I don't know if I'll make it. Must...talk...football...hot chicks...cannntt...b r e a t h e.......

 

[BlackNDecker]

Man up. You're not the first dude to rotate through the valley of meconium.

 

[drlisa0318]

Guys aren't the only ones that would feel as you do. That kind of atmosphere would drive me crazy, too. Only, I wouldn't want to be talking football (can't stand it 😱 - I know - heresy!) or hot chicks (I'm straight). Might want to talk politics or about the latest movies or a good book.

 

[Arctic Char]

hang in there mate . . .

 

[wire]

It's alright. The estrogen overload caused a massive clot to land in my amygdala, I no longer feel emotion.

 

[Arctic Char]

the amygdala is responsible for fear and aversive behaviors.

uh oh . . . not sure what that means for you

 

[Ashers]

I didn't like all the estrogen on OB/gyn either. My favorite surgery, though, on OB/gyn was a gyn onc case where I was the only girl in the room except for the scrub tech -- the gyn chief and gyn oncologist were both guys, so we talked about music and movies the entire case. I'm on my ortho elective now, and I like hanging out with all the guys.

 

[amy2003uva]

I am on my overnight week of labor and delivery. I am surrounded by 16 women. They are giving eachother manicures, talking about celebrities in baby voices, and laughing uncontrollably. I slowly feel the life being sucked out of my body. I don't know if I'll make it. Must...talk...football...hot chicks...cannntt...b r e a t h e.......

lol... okay, this description is just a wee bit histrionic.

IMO there is very little that is girly-girl about ob/gyn, aside from the obvious fact that all adult patients are women. it's a specialty full of blood, poop, and other bodily secretions -- women preoccupied with manicured toes and giggles would hurl at the sight of a c/s.

granted, it's not for everyone, but i had to take a jab at your whining. 😉

 

[Thievery Corp.]

lol... okay, this description is just a wee bit histrionic.

I dunno, I think he hit the nail on the head. It's not just the patients. At our house EVERY single nurse on L&D was female, and hell half of them were pregnant. As well, every single doc that provided OB service was female, except the peri. So those conversations were dead on. Wow, just talking about it brings back the nightmares.
I'm now on surgery at the VA. Kind of the polar opposite really.

 

[fakin' the funk]

I dunno, I think he hit the nail on the head. It's not just the patients. At our house EVERY single nurse on L&D was female, and hell half of them were pregnant. As well, every single doc that provided OB service was female, except the peri. So those conversations were dead on. Wow, just talking about it brings back the nightmares.

Absolutely. Just imagine: it's 3am. You should be asleep. You're tired. The lighting is fluorescent. And despite the fact that most of the patients are quiet in their rooms, it's not quiet on the floor, is it? There is the steady roar of mindless, idle chatter of L&D nurses flipping through women's and entertainment magazines, talking about clothes and makeup, their menstrual cycles, and (perhaps worst of all) teaching each other factually incorrect medical knowledge. Oh, and did I mention that EVERYONE is in a bad mood, all the time?

This is why I spent my L&D week sleeping in the call room 😴

 

[overthebars]

One night very similar to the OP's I was also stuck in the world of celebrity talk, baby shower talk, knitting and estrogen. It was 3AM, I was sleeping standing up leaning against the counter in front of the board trying to seem interested. Then my friends the heavens opened up and in a glorious voice I heard the following:
"OTB, you are kind of a guy, what do you think of these half-nude Vanity Fair pictures of Scarlett Johanson?"
They went to argue points of celebrity physique like who has a hotter butt Alba or that "actress" was dating Timberlake.
Good times, good times.

 

[wire]

lol... okay, this description is just a wee bit histrionic.

IMO there is very little that is girly-girl about ob/gyn, aside from the obvious fact that all adult patients are women. it's a specialty full of blood, poop, and other bodily secretions -- women preoccupied with manicured toes and giggles would hurl at the sight of a c/s.

granted, it's not for everyone, but i had to take a jab at your whining. 😉

No problems with ob/gyn in itself, I actually find it fun. Luckily, I learned from my previous mistake and brought my ipod to tune out the celebrity talk. I haven't figured out how to shield myself from the hot flashes I get everytime the horde of chatty nurses leave the room though.

 

[smq123]

Absolutely. Just imagine: it's 3am. You should be asleep. You're tired. The lighting is fluorescent. And despite the fact that most of the patients are quiet in their rooms, it's not quiet on the floor, is it? There is the steady roar of mindless, idle chatter of L&D nurses flipping through women's and entertainment magazines, talking about clothes and makeup, their menstrual cycles, and (perhaps worst of all) teaching each other factually incorrect medical knowledge. Oh, and did I mention that EVERYONE is in a bad mood, all the time?

Ummm...this also accurately describes the nurses station in some of the ICUs/SICUs that I've been in. Well, technically...the ICU nurses will occasionally be silent - as they munch on triscuits while they watch Entertainment Tonight reruns on TV.

 

[mules05]

Ummm...this also accurately describes the nurses station in some of the ICUs/SICUs that I've been in. Well, technically...the ICU nurses will occasionally be silent - as they munch on triscuits while they watch Entertainment Tonight reruns on TV.

Also describes the peds floor, although they're often flipping through one another's ultrasound photos rather than People magazine. And the residents join in. It's much like what I imagined meetings of The Babysitter's Club to be like when I read those books.

 

[drlisa0318]

Also describes the peds floor, although they're often flipping through one another's ultrasound photos rather than People magazine. And the residents join in. It's much like what I imagined meetings of The Babysitter's Club to be like when I read those books.

Oh, jeez, is this what I have to look forward to? Where I work, one floor of our company is made up ENTIRELY of women (clerical workers and their managers). I avoid that floor as much as possible. Every where you go, all you can hear is gossip, celebrity talk, etc. It's depressing. I thought for sure one of the perks of going into medicine was not having this to put up with. Well y'all have bummed me out for sure now.

 

[kamehame]

We have a couple of ICU nurses who knit during night shift. They all graze on food all the time and the amount of gossip is unbelievable. They also show each other pictures of their kids. Once I even overheard a conversation between two ICU nurses and one was telling the other about how her daughter was going out with this boy in high school. She then whipped out a few photos of the two and the other nurses crowded around and started saying, "oh, my, he's a cutie!" And she was extremely proud and was like, "yeah, he's very popular." They noticed me looking at them with a horrified and disgusted look. I mean, do you really have to evaluate how good-looking your daughter's boyfriend is in public? Talk about living vicariously. I threw up in the corner a few times.

 

[Anka]

Oh, jeez, is this what I have to look forward to? Where I work, one floor of our company is made up ENTIRELY of women (clerical workers and their managers). I avoid that floor as much as possible. Every where you go, all you can hear is gossip, celebrity talk, etc. It's depressing. I thought for sure one of the perks of going into medicine was not having this to put up with. Well y'all have bummed me out for sure now.

The overwhelming majority of medicine isn't like this. Certain very particular fields are (and then only in certain places at certain times).

Anka

 

[haveaniceday]

The overwhelming majority of medicine isn't like this. Certain very particular fields are (and then only in certain places at certain times).

Anka

Yeah, medicine is just a cross-section of humanity like anything else. You will find a little of everything and end up fitting in where you belong. Just sucks as a 3rd year because you are forced to spend time in every little slice...and sometimes have to pretend to care.

My outpatient peds rotation was with 6 female docs in their late 30's, we may as well have been from different planets. But, in the end I learned some pediatrics and a LOT about their kids, husbands, nannies, boyfriends, and ex-boyfriends.

 

[drlisa0318]

The overwhelming majority of medicine isn't like this. Certain very particular fields are (and then only in certain places at certain times).

Anka

Well, thank goodness for that! All the gossip, etc. is at best unprofessional. And when patients see or overhear that, it gives them an even worse opinion of health care "professionals." As for me, it gives me the shudders.

 

[kamehame]

But, in the end I learned some pediatrics and a LOT about their kids, husbands, nannies, boyfriends, and ex-boyfriends.

Isn't this the point of the OP? Why do females have to do that? We don't care about your husband. Or what you think about what someone wore to an awards show. Or whether those shoes go well with that dress. Or that your son is in some school play.

 

[drlisa0318]

Yeah, medicine is just a cross-section of humanity like anything else. You will find a little of everything and end up fitting in where you belong. Just sucks as a 3rd year because you are forced to spend time in every little slice...and sometimes have to pretend to care.

My outpatient peds rotation was with 6 female docs in their late 30's, we may as well have been from different planets. But, in the end I learned some pediatrics and a LOT about their kids, husbands, nannies, boyfriends, and ex-boyfriends.

Jeez, what is it with women? Is it in our genes that we tell anyone and everyone every detail of our personal lives? Do we have no concept of the word "private?" Do we REALLY think that our coworkers (and anyone else within hearing distance) are honestly interested in every little tidbit of our lives (or our children's or grandchildren's?) Do we have so little self-confidence that we need the affirmation that an audience brings?

 

[haveaniceday]

I'm a single female in my late twenties, which I why I felt from a different planet from the pediatricians I was with. But, on the flip side I see how these conversations happen...again it is just about the situation you are in. I am sure that I have been part of "that" table of women or whatever having some asinine conversation and annoying the crap out of those around me.

I kinda like knowing that doctors are not so cynical and hard that they can't get all goofy about stuff. That said, usually I do prefer different topics of conversation than kids/celebrities/football/hot chicks. Again, you find your environment in life and in medicine 🙂

 

[Anka]

Jeez, what is it with women? Is it in our genes that we tell anyone and everyone every detail of our personal lives? Do we have no concept of the word "private?" Do we REALLY think that our coworkers (and anyone else within hearing distance) are honestly interested in every little tidbit of our lives (or our children's or grandchildren's?) Do we have so little self-confidence that we need the affirmation that an audience brings?

It's not just women. I know way too much about my male collegues personal lives, too. I think it is another result of having a strict heirarchy, in which I have to listen (and appear interested and approving and supportive) to anything my superior cares to talk about, but I myself can't speak freely.

Anka

 

[drlisa0318]

It's not just women. I know way too much about my male collegues personal lives, too. I think it is another result of having a strict heirarchy, in which I have to listen (and appear interested and approving and supportive) to anything my superior cares to talk about, but I myself can't speak freely.

Anka

Interesting. And here I thought women had a corner on the market. Well, if we don't have the market cornered, I think we must at least have the dubious honor of having "elevated" it to an art.

 

[persia]

I think it is another result of having a strict heirarchy, in which I have to listen (and appear interested and approving and supportive) to anything my superior cares to talk about, but I myself can't speak freely.

Anka

This might be why I had such a hard time on OB, and why I got a crappy eval. 🙄

I agree with the OP, and others. Why do women have to act like this? It's ridiculous and unprofessional. Of course, I now also know plenty about my male attendings' kids - at least the ones on OB. I know practically nothing about any of the others, male or female, on other services. Alot of people manage to keep their work and personal lives separate. That's my goal, as well.

 

[Anka]

The thing about the OBs at the site I was at, was that they were fundamentally not courteous people. In order to be courteous in a heirarchy when you're senior, you have to recognize that you're in one -- you KNOW that your medical student can't give you the "shut up and get to work" look, so you try to police your own behavior and topics of conversation. I think one of the reasons women (in and out of OB) tend to talk too much about their personal lives or yesterday's entertainment news is that, as a general rule, heirarchy doesn't come as naturally to women as to men.

Anka

 

[kamehame]

I disagree with that. Females are notorious for setting up a "pecking order" in any environment. The reason they engage in all the gossip and eating and magazine-browsing is because that's what a lot of females do. And there's nothing wrong with that fundamentally, except that it's a little pathetic that it's happening in the workplace. When you think "nurse," how many laypeople do you think picture someone sitting at a desk gabbing with their friends about what happened yesterday on their date? And yet how often does that happen? You're supposed to be professional. I don't mean 100% of the time, but it should be close. A lot of times it feels like the hospital is the mall and everyone is "hanging out."

 

[PeepshowJohnny]

I disagree with that. Females are notorious for setting up a "pecking order" in any environment. The reason they engage in all the gossip and eating and magazine-browsing is because that's what a lot of females do. And there's nothing wrong with that fundamentally, except that it's a little pathetic that it's happening in the workplace. When you think "nurse," how many laypeople do you think picture someone sitting at a desk gabbing with their friends about what happened yesterday on their date? And yet how often does that happen? You're supposed to be professional. I don't mean 100% of the time, but it should be close. A lot of times it feels like the hospital is the mall and everyone is "hanging out."

And yet nursing is the most trusted profession. 🙄

 

[kamehame]

Of course. That's because nurses have the most interaction with a patient. Therefore, they definitely have a stronger bond with patients. Usually, when a patient sends a "thank you" note, it's to nurses, not doctors. But the only person who would mistake this for anything other than what I just said is someone who has no experience with the mechanics of a hospital.

 

[Anka]

I disagree with that. Females are notorious for setting up a "pecking order" in any environment. The reason they engage in all the gossip and eating and magazine-browsing is because that's what a lot of females do. And there's nothing wrong with that fundamentally, except that it's a little pathetic that it's happening in the workplace. When you think "nurse," how many laypeople do you think picture someone sitting at a desk gabbing with their friends about what happened yesterday on their date? And yet how often does that happen? You're supposed to be professional. I don't mean 100% of the time, but it should be close. A lot of times it feels like the hospital is the mall and everyone is "hanging out."

There's a difference between a pecking order and a formal heirarchy. Indeed, one of the great advantages of a well functioning heirarchy is the avoidence of people on the same team undercutting each other (e.g., gossip) in order to create a pecking order. The great pitfall of a heirarchy from a functional standpoint is that there tends to be unidirectional flow of information and feedback -- which is highly annoying because you can't give feedback that you don't really care to talk about Brangilina's latest scandal, but more importantly can be detrimental to patient care.

I was commenting less on choice of reading than gossip and introduction of personal topics into conversation. I honestly couldn't care less what you read, as long as I don't have to hear about. Uninteresting conversation topics that I'm not allowed to opt out of are very annoying. Needless to say, gossip is destructive to any high functioning team.

Anka

 

[kamehame]

I might also add that perception is unfortunately reality to a lot of people. So while a physician may write for pain meds, the patient just sees that a nurse asks them if they are in pain and then says "I'm going to get the doctor to write for pain meds." To the patient, it appears that the nurse was the one who had the concern and that she acted to change the situation. The doctor, comparitively speaking, looks like a distant person who barely cares at all about what is going on and is almost never around. I've seen it where people come in with sepsis and the doctors write all the orders, but the patients see that the nurse was the one who gave the medications and "made them better." But again, you've just introduced an apples to oranges comparison.

 

[kamehame]

The great pitfall of a heirarchy from a functional standpoint is that there tends to be unidirectional flow of information and feedback -- which is highly annoying because you can't give feedback that you don't really care to talk about Brangilina's latest scandal, but more importantly can be detrimental to patient care.

I hear you on that. It's unfortunate because a lot of medicine is "do what I tell you to do."

When people gossip or talk about celebrities or show off baby pictures, I'll usually just nod and then sort of edge away. But it's really annoying because often there are groups of nurses gabbing away or reading magazines wherever you go in the hospital.

 

[persia]

Interesting digression on power and creating it in a healthy versus unhealthy environment.

I was thinking that on the best run, and healthiest, services it was very clear who was in charge and there were no issues of undermining, or trying to get control through backdoor (and ineffective) means. Passive aggressive **** comes to my mind. Those were the services where the most work was done in the least amount of time, and people were in general very happy. Tired, but happy. Alot of teaching was done as well.

The least healthy and most chaotic services were where I experienced the most gossip, hostility and undermining behavior. And not just with the staff, but among other students and observed between attendings and residents. Those were the services where there was NO teaching, and people were openly angry and unhappy.

I think that men have figured out energy-saving methods for creating hierarchy and so just get down to business. Women, being new to the professional world are still trying to figure this stuff out. Some already know how to do it right, but alot have a ways to go to get it better. Interesting discussion! 👍

 

[jocg27]

....

 

[THP]

I'm having a hard time picturing why you guys are standing around watching the nurses. Don't you have something better to do? If you aren't doing something directly with a patient or attending or resident go somewhere else and do something else. I recommend you keep your interaction with nurses to a minimum.

 

[AmoryBlaine]

I too survived OB in an estrogen-bath. Some tips for survival...

-Act extremely self-depricating around the nurses ("hey, um, do you think you could show me how to turn on the u/s machine? for some reason it's really confusing me...")

-Ask them about their kids ("How old are they?" "Are you planning to have more?")

-Ask them open ended questions that let them ramble about themselves ("So why did you decide to do Ob nursing?" "Have you ever had to deal with a really annoying medical student?")

-Make it clear to them that they are the boss (*in joking voice* "I'd like to scrub in for this C/S but feel free to yell at me if I'm in your way.")

-Offer to help them with the scut ("Do you need an extra set of hands moving that patient?")

-Ask to watch them do things ("Would you mind if I watched you set up the fetal monitor? I'd just like to know how to do it if I have to.")


You'll be in like Flynn. Most of them are pretty great ladies.

 

[kamehame]

I'm having a hard time picturing why you guys are standing around watching the nurses. Don't you have something better to do? If you aren't doing something directly with a patient or attending or resident go somewhere else and do something else. I recommend you keep your interaction with nurses to a minimum.

I don't know about everyone else, but I'm usually trying to do work, like writing a note or checking labs. Unless you're camped out in the call room (not a bad idea) or keeping a patient company, avoiding nurses is pretty difficult because they are all over the common areas of the floors.

 

[kamehame]

I too survived OB in an estrogen-bath. Some tips for survival...

-Act extremely self-depricating around the nurses ("hey, um, do you think you could show me how to turn on the u/s machine? for some reason it's really confusing me...")

-Ask them about their kids ("How old are they?" "Are you planning to have more?")

-Ask them open ended questions that let them ramble about themselves ("So why did you decide to do Ob nursing?" "Have you ever had to deal with a really annoying medical student?")

-Make it clear to them that they are the boss (*in joking voice* "I'd like to scrub in for this C/S but feel free to yell at me if I'm in your way.")

-Offer to help them with the scut ("Do you need an extra set of hands moving that patient?")

-Ask to watch them do things ("Would you mind if I watched you set up the fetal monitor? I'd just like to know how to do it if I have to.")


You'll be in like Flynn. Most of them are pretty great ladies.

No offense, but doesn't your advice boil down to "in order to get along with nurses all you have to do is be their complete and total b!tch by complimenting them, insulting yourself, and helping them in any way possible?" If we wanted to do that, we'd just become nursing assistants.

 

[fakin' the funk]

I too survived OB in an estrogen-bath. Some tips for survival...

-Make it clear to them that they are the boss (*in joking voice* "I'd like to scrub in for this C/S but feel free to yell at me if I'm in your way.")

They're not. You might say its the attending, or you could say that there is no boss...but the boss certainly isn't a nurse. But do whatever you have to do, gunner.

As a sidenote, do be aware that circulators and scrubs actually benefit by having medical students around to help out and (partially) do their work.

 

[brightness]

See, if I was to be a doctor I really would say (as a premed, so I don't know anything about it) OB-GYN would be one of my top choices! Is it really that bad? I'm not an intense girly girl, but I usually get along well with people....😕

 

[smq123]

See, if I was to be a doctor I really would say (as a premed, so I don't know anything about it) OB-GYN would be one of my top choices! Is it really that bad? I'm not an intense girly girl, but I usually get along well with people....😕

I personally don't think so.

What they've described (a lot of giggling, gossiping, etc.) also accurately describes any nurses station, after 10 PM, with > 3 nurses present at any given time. Hang out in parts of the SICU, the peds floors, or the psych ward. The nurses do the same thing at all of these places. As a student, you spend more time with the nurses on L&D than you do in the other services, which is why I think it's more noticeable.

 

[AmoryBlaine]

No offense, but doesn't your advice boil down to "in order to get along with nurses all you have to do is be their complete and total b!tch by complimenting them, insulting yourself, and helping them in any way possible?" If we wanted to do that, we'd just become nursing assistants.

No it doesnt, what year are you? Nurses run hospitals, like it or not. It behooves you to get along with them. If that means acting a little self-depricating or *gasp* actually helping with a "nurses job" instead of sitting there reading Blueprints Ob-Gyn I think that's a pretty small price to pay.

If a nurse is acting mean or innappropriately I do not grovel, but I don't think looking at US Weekly and talking about manicures (the OP's original complaints) are exactly capital offenses.

 

[AmoryBlaine]

They're not. You might say its the attending, or you could say that there is no boss...but the boss certainly isn't a nurse. But do whatever you have to do, gunner.

As a sidenote, do be aware that circulators and scrubs actually benefit by having medical students around to help out and (partially) do their work.

Calm down, calm down. I didn't say that they were the boss, merely that you would be well-served by letting them labor under that illusion.

If you are on L+D and have the choice between letting the RN think she is the boss or insinuating that you think YOU are, I would go with the former.

 

[funkless]

this mkes me laugh.. they are all (insert c word).. DO not discuss anything with them. Just do your job and count down how much more time you will be in hell

Actually, his advice was pretty sound. The important thing is not winning some battle of wills with the nursing staff, but rather getting an A on the ol' transcript with the minimal amount of hassle, and kissing a little nurse-ass goes a long way toward minimizing hassle.

 

[funkless]

Nurses run hospitals, like it or not.

Well, I don't know about that...

Nurses are the wheels. Doctors are the steering wheel, accelerator, and brakes. Bean-counting bureaucrats are the drivers.

 

[kamehame]

Nurses run hospitals, like it or not.

That's about as inaccurate a statement as could possibly be made about any subject. Unless I guess you're one of those people who also think that secretaries are the ones who really run Fortune 500 companies. Nobody's saying they don't do a necessary job, but so do the hospital operators. Acting like nurses run the hospital for it is inane. There's always a great belief amongst certain people that everything is really run by the people who are actually at the bottom rung. Guess what? They're wrong.

they are all (insert c word)

 

[psychbender]

That's about as inaccurate a statement as could possibly be made about any subject. Unless I guess you're one of those people who also think that secretaries are the ones who really run Fortune 500 companies. Nobody's saying they don't do a necessary job, but so do the hospital operators. Acting like nurses run the hospital for it is inane. There's always a great belief amongst certain people that everything is really run by the people who are actually at the bottom rung. Guess what? They're wrong.

I think he was alluding to the fact that a fair number of nurses end up in hospital administration. They end up being the underbosses of the hospital, and set a lot of policy, while still bowing to the CEO and Board. Doctors, on the other hand, do not make the move to admin in near the numbers as nurses, so more nurses "run" the hospitals than doctors.

 

[kamehame]

If you read the post in context, he was clearly referring to regular nurses on floors (since that is what his advice was in regards to). He wasn't advising people to cross the street to the administrative building and compliment nurse administrators; he was advising them to sit around the nursing station and comb the hair of the nurses while they read Glamour. Also, most of the top administrators at my place are physicians, not nurses. But that's not relevant because everyone universally hates administrators. Nurses hate nurses who are administrators, physicians hate physicians who are administrators, and so on.

 

[psychbender]

Seems to vary by hospital. In some of the hospitals where I've worked or rotated, more administrators are former nurses than doctors, and some of the regular nurses seem to actually talk to the nurse administrators (who are in the same building). Before med school, I worked as a tech at one of these hospitals, and regularly saw some of the newer administrators up on the floors, talking with their former coworkers. If you're a dick to Jane floor nurse, she'll tell her buddies at the nurses' station, someone tells one of their friends who's now in admin, and voila! instant bad rep at the hospital.

 

[amy2003uva]

See, if I was to be a doctor I really would say (as a premed, so I don't know anything about it) OB-GYN would be one of my top choices! Is it really that bad? I'm not an intense girly girl, but I usually get along well with people....😕

No, it is not bad. Some of these posters are just being ridiculous. They need to stop hanging out at the nurse's station and get back to work!🙄