Honors in Surgery?

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eilis721

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I was hoping to hear from anyone who got honors in their surgery clerkship...is it as impossible as I think it is? How much did you study, how much extra effort does it take? Any opinions or advice would be much appreciated.

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At my school, it's well known that it's the evaluations rather than the exams that will hang you up when it comes to getting honors in surgery. Those surgeons just don't like to honor people...
 
At our school it is exactly the opposite. many evaluations are great, but the surgery shelf makes or breaks you so study your butt off for the part YOU can control.....an exam.

later
 
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More than any other other rotation, they have to believe that you are interested in being a surgeon. I'm not telling you to lie, but .....

Ed
 
I'm a surgery resident. Don't LIE, we'll see right thru you anyway. You don't have to want to do surgery or even really like surgery.

We only ask that you put enough time, effort, and interest into your rotation to take something from it that may help you in your overall medical education. Surgery cares for the same diseases medcine does, just with surgical treatment instead. So if you plan to go into any medical specialty, there is a ton you can learn on surgery if you put the effort in. Some of our best students have honestly said they want to do IM or EM or peds or whatever, but still worked their tails off, asked lots of questions, and read up about what their patietns had, came to the OR prepared having read something about the procedure and why this particular patient needed it - these are the ones who will succeed on clinical evals, the ones who show they are interested in learning something from the rotation.

You do have to find out about your school's grading structure though. At most places I'm afraid it is the test which separates honors from the rest. I feel strongly that this is wrong, as you are on clinical rotations and should be graded on clinical performance, but this is the way it is at most schools. The tests continue during residency though (surgery residents at least take a yearly exam), so you might as well get used to reading a lot when you come home from a long tiring day of work.
 
I honored surgery. Even after one surgeon TOLD me she would give me an honors, she gave me a pass because I "wasn't going into surgery, so I didn't need the grade". WTF??? I honored the other eval and got the highest grade ever at my school on the shelf exam (NO idea how that happened - I just read Recall). So I ended up with honors. Not sure how or why, but that's what happened. The whole experience with that one attending really soured me towards surgeons (no offense to anyone).
 
12R34Y said:
At our school it is exactly the opposite. many evaluations are great, but the surgery shelf makes or breaks you so study your butt off for the part YOU can control.....an exam.

later

exactly, pretty much everyone at my school, with the exception of a few superstars or people who made an exceptionally bad impression on residents or course directors, scores in or very close to the high pass range on the clinical evals, and generally most people do quite well (honors/high pass) on the oral exam and final presentation. the shelf exam is only 25%, but is quite the equalizer. In fact, rumor has it that if all the residents who were supposed to evaluate you (you can pick who to solicit evals from at one rotation site as long as 2 ppl are attendings) don't turn their evals in after a certain time period, then the course director uses his knowledge of you (which is mostly the exam score since most of us don't seem him that often) to "fill in the blanks" on the clinical eval. This too, can work for or against your grade.
Oh, BTW, just about everyone on SDN is an AOA superstar or if they aren't, it's b/c they have kids/spouse at home, so take any advice on here with a grain of salt (including my occasional suspicion and bitterness).
 
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