How competitive is a 3.8, really?

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Wafflyw

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Let's disregard the extra curricular and the MCAT for a moment, and focus only on the GPA -- or lets say the MCAT score and the EC's are fantastic. How competitive is a 3.8? Is it enough to get admitted to the top 20 schools or even the top 10?
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Wafflyw said:
Let's disregard the extra curricular and the MCAT for a moment, and focus only on the GPA -- or lets say the MCAT score and the EC's are fantastic. How competitive is a 3.8? Is it enough to get admitted to the top 20 schools or even the top 10?
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Stop. Pls. Just stop.
 
Wafflyw said:
Let's disregard the extra curricular and the MCAT for a moment, and focus only on the GPA -- or lets say the MCAT score and the EC's are fantastic. How competitive is a 3.8? Is it enough to get admitted to the top 20 schools or even the top 10?
Click to expand...

a 3.8 means NOTHING without a decent MCAT and EC's and good essays, just like a 4.0 would mean nothing without those things.
 
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Wafflyw said:
Let's disregard the extra curricular and the MCAT for a moment, and focus only on the GPA -- or lets say the MCAT score and the EC's are fantastic. How competitive is a 3.8? Is it enough to get admitted to the top 20 schools or even the top 10?
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No.
 
YouNeverKnow22 said:
a 3.8 means NOTHING without a decent MCAT and EC's and good essays, just like a 4.0 would mean nothing without those things.
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Right, but let's assume the other factors are good. How would the 3.8 make your application look?
 
Wafflyw said:
Let's disregard the extra curricular and the MCAT for a moment, and focus only on the GPA -- or lets say the MCAT score and the EC's are fantastic. How competitive is a 3.8? Is it enough to get admitted to the top 20 schools or even the top 10?
Click to expand...

Your answer: https://www.aamc.org/data/facts/app...mcat-gpa-grid-by-selected-race-ethnicity.html


As has been said, beyond a 3.75 or so, it's pretty much only your MCAT, ECs,LORs, PS & ECs that are going to matter (just like beyond a balanced 35 MCAT, only your GPA, ECs, LORs & PS matter). The difference between a 3.8 and a 4.0, frankly, is marginal. Yes, there is one, but its effect is marginal.
 
3.8? Zach Morris would have been more competitive than that.

Sheesh
 
mauberley said:
What answer would you like to hear?
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Maybe the question is a bit weird.
How low would a 3.8 look compared to a 4.0 with the same stats? Or would it make no difference? Obviously the 4.0 may be preferred in the end.
 
apumic said:
Your answer: https://www.aamc.org/data/facts/app...mcat-gpa-grid-by-selected-race-ethnicity.html


As has been said, beyond a 3.75 or so, it's pretty much only your MCAT, ECs,LORs, PS & ECs that are going to matter (just like beyond a balanced 35 MCAT, only your GPA, ECs, LORs & PS matter). The difference between a 3.8 and a 4.0, frankly, is marginal. Yes, there is one, but its effect is marginal.
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Ah! Thank you for the answer.
I'm a bit new to the whole medical school admissions and such, so I might have come off as a typical pre-med.
I have quite a lot of research to do!
 
Wafflyw said:
Maybe the question is a bit weird.
How low would a 3.8 look compared to a 4.0 with the same stats? Or would it make no difference? Obviously the 4.0 may be preferred in the end.
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You answered your own question.
 
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Wafflyw said:
Let's disregard the extra curricular and the MCAT for a moment, and focus only on the GPA -- or lets say the MCAT score and the EC's are fantastic. How competitive is a 3.8? Is it enough to get admitted to the top 20 schools or even the top 10?
Click to expand...

All else being equal, a 3.8 is more competitive than a 3.6, but less competitive than a 4.0.
 
phltz said:
All else being equal, a 3.8 is more competitive than a 3.6, but less competitive than a 4.0.
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Actually, I have information and experience which enables me to be more specific.

3.8 is more competitive than 3.79 but less than 3.81.
 
Let's stop playing coy. Yes, my 3rd grade cousin knows a 3.8 is better than a 3.6 and worse than a 4.0. Why is it so hard to answer these questions instead of trying to pretend as if the concept of the question itself is somehow offensive?

What the OP is clearly asking is whether a 3.8GPA is one that should make him feel confident about himself applying to these top 20 schools (considering the rest of his application is what you would expect of a top 20 school applicant) or whether he should feel like he is going to need to compensate for his GPA.

OP, le'ts just say a 3.8 will not hold you back. A 3.8 is around the median for a lot of these schools if not a bit below. You will wow none of these schools with your GPA and it probably will not be considered a strength in your application but merely meeting some standard requirements, much like having some basic levels of volunteer or clinical experience. This is not at all to say that your scores will put you in the dog house...That said, you will be expected to have EC and MCAT scores that will impress.

Nonetheless, like apumic was saying, there's a lot of diminishing returns at the higher GPAs. I would personally consider the difference to become negligible at the 3.9+ range and not necessarily the 3.8+ range. However, look to the stats that were posted to get a better quantitative understanding of what you're looking for.
 
Grab a copy of the MSAR from your library or premed advisor's office. You can see the average GPA of last year's matriculants for each med school. This will at least give you an idea of what GPAs are being accepted at the various medical schools.
 
Narmerguy said:
Let's stop playing coy. Yes, my 3rd grade cousin knows a 3.8 is better than a 3.6 and worse than a 4.0. Why is it so hard to answer these questions instead of trying to pretend as if the concept of the question itself is somehow offensive?

What the OP is clearly asking is whether a 3.8GPA is one that should make him feel confident about himself applying to these top 20 schools (considering the rest of his application is what you would expect of a top 20 school applicant) or whether he should feel like he is going to need to compensate for his GPA.

OP, le'ts just say a 3.8 will not hold you back. A 3.8 is around the median for a lot of these schools if not a bit below. You will wow none of these schools with your GPA and it probably will not be considered a strength in your application but merely meeting some standard requirements, much like having some basic levels of volunteer or clinical experience. This is not at all to say that your scores will put you in the dog house...That said, you will be expected to have EC and MCAT scores that will impress.

Nonetheless, like apumic was saying, there's a lot of diminishing returns at the higher GPAs. I would personally consider the difference to become negligible at the 3.9+ range and not necessarily the 3.8+ range. However, look to the stats that were posted to get a better quantitative understanding of what you're looking for.
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Thank you so much for your response and for understanding my question. I suppose I could have been more specific with my question. I think my EC's and MCAT will impress, so I should stop worrying too much. Thank you, again!
Thank you all for your responses. They gave me a good laugh!
 
Narmerguy said:
Let's stop playing coy. Yes, my 3rd grade cousin knows a 3.8 is better than a 3.6 and worse than a 4.0. Why is it so hard to answer these questions instead of trying to pretend as if the concept of the question itself is somehow offensive?

What the OP is clearly asking is whether a 3.8GPA is one that should make him feel confident about himself applying to these top 20 schools (considering the rest of his application is what you would expect of a top 20 school applicant) or whether he should feel like he is going to need to compensate for his GPA.

OP, le'ts just say a 3.8 will not hold you back. A 3.8 is around the median for a lot of these schools if not a bit below. You will wow none of these schools with your GPA and it probably will not be considered a strength in your application but merely meeting some standard requirements, much like having some basic levels of volunteer or clinical experience. This is not at all to say that your scores will put you in the dog house...That said, you will be expected to have EC and MCAT scores that will impress.

Nonetheless, like apumic was saying, there's a lot of diminishing returns at the higher GPAs. I would personally consider the difference to become negligible at the 3.9+ range and not necessarily the 3.8+ range. However, look to the stats that were posted to get a better quantitative understanding of what you're looking for.
Click to expand...
I would agree with this. I don't think the difference between a 3.93 and a 3.97 would decide who gets a spot, but I can see a 3.93 vs a 3.85 making a difference.
 
gettheleadout said:
I would agree with this. I don't think the difference between a 3.93 and a 3.97 would decide who gets a spot, but I can see a 3.93 vs a 3.85 making a difference.
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:laugh: that's ridiculous

i'm quite sure adcoms don't sit there and nitpick over less than a tenth of a GPA point ...that is purely a phenomenon of neurotic premeds

to answer the original question is inconsequential ...do your best and try to get the highest GPA possible. It seems from the stats that adcoms at any school are more likely to to be lenient with GPA as long as it is respectable (in the range of 3.5 or 3.6+) while on the other hand a 1 or 2 point difference on the MCAT means a whole lot more
 
GPA is just a way to get your foot in the door because comparing GPAs from different institutions is comparing apples to oranges. Some schools deflate grades while others inflate grades. Therefore, much more is in play than simply GPA alone. I had a 3.5 undergrad GPA and I am going to a top 15 school (whatever that means), and I have friends that wanted to go to this same institution with GPAs in the 3.9-4.0 range that got outright rejected. Go figure, it is a complete roll of the dice...
 
Wafflyw said:
Maybe the question is a bit weird.
How low would a 3.8 look compared to a 4.0 with the same stats? Or would it make no difference? Obviously the 4.0 may be preferred in the end.
Click to expand...

i know what you mean op. gpa follows the law of diminishing returns. sure, you have a 5% better chance with a 4.0 but oh well. just dont go under 3.8 and you're fine!
 
Good Lord. Are you really wound this tight or did you just want more pats on the back for your GPA? Look up the entering class profiles for all the "top ranked" medical schools. Their median is about a 3.8.

http://hms.harvard.edu/admissions/default.asp?page=statistics
http://www.med.upenn.edu/admiss/2006_class.html
http://medschool.ucsf.edu/admissions/profile/
http://medschool.duke.edu/modules/som_education/index.php?id=6#MCAT
http://facts.med.yale.edu/education/index.aspx
http://ps.columbia.edu/education/admissions-office

Hopkins, WashU, and Stanford took too long to find.
 
your gpa means so much less than you think. everyone and their mom has a 3.75 plus who applies to medical school. top schools are all about insane extracurriculars and super high mcats
 
Geekchick921 said:
Good Lord. Are you really wound this tight or did you just want more pats on the back for your GPA? Look up the entering class profiles for all the "top ranked" medical schools. Their median is about a 3.8.

http://hms.harvard.edu/admissions/default.asp?page=statistics
http://www.med.upenn.edu/admiss/2006_class.html
http://medschool.ucsf.edu/admissions/profile/
http://medschool.duke.edu/modules/som_education/index.php?id=6#MCAT
http://facts.med.yale.edu/education/index.aspx
http://ps.columbia.edu/education/admissions-office

Hopkins, WashU, and Stanford took too long to find.
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:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:
 
ummm.. anything above a 3.7 is all the same. sry.
 
some top 20s aren't exactly stats laden, ie Mayo. So saying 3.8 is good enough or not isn't entirely relevant. So many schools evaluate applicants holistically, and if your stats were good enough to get you an interview, it's time for you as a person to shine. So long story short, get the best GPA you can, it's really as simple as that. If we are just talking about GPA ALONE, then 3.8 shouldn't stop you from applying to any top 20 schools.
 
Ok, let's see. As already mentioned, everyone who applies to these top 20 schools generally has around this gpa. If you want to be competitive (and this ususally stands for OOS), you will HAVE TO have a HIGHER gpa that the median. Same with teh mcat.......and do not forget ecs, ps, lors...blah..blah

Forget medicine, you should be a statistician.
 
skinMD said:
:laugh: that's ridiculous

i'm quite sure adcoms don't sit there and nitpick over less than a tenth of a GPA point ...that is purely a phenomenon of neurotic premeds

to answer the original question is inconsequential ...do your best and try to get the highest GPA possible. It seems from the stats that adcoms at any school are more likely to to be lenient with GPA as long as it is respectable (in the range of 3.5 or 3.6+) while on the other hand a 1 or 2 point difference on the MCAT means a whole lot more
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Not a big difference, but just as far as the psychological effect of seeing a 3.9X vs a 3.8X goes, I can imagine the higher one would be preferred.
 
gettheleadout said:
I would agree with this. I don't think the difference between a 3.93 and a 3.97 would decide who gets a spot, but I can see a 3.93 vs a 3.85 making a difference.
Click to expand...


gettheleadout said:
Not a big difference, but just as far as the psychological effect of seeing a 3.9X vs a 3.8X goes, I can imagine the higher one would be preferred.
Click to expand...

"It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt." - Wesley Snipes
 
jvesco22 said:
"It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt." - Wesley Snipes
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LizzyM said:
Funny thing.... if it is the difference between 3.61 and 3.63, there is no difference. If it 3.61 or 3.59... the 3.59 loses. Its just a funny psychological thing....
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Again, I'm not saying it's a large difference, but it is there. I was only ever agreeing with Narmerguy that I would think 3.9+ is all the same whereas the variation above 3.8 is slightly more significant.
 
Wafflyw said:
Let's disregard the extra curricular and the MCAT for a moment, and focus only on the GPA -- or lets say the MCAT score and the EC's are fantastic. How competitive is a 3.8? Is it enough to get admitted to the top 20 schools or even the top 10?
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, a 3.8 is just not competitive enough to get into any decent American institutions. Even though the median GPA at these schools may be "listed" as 3.8, this doesn't mean anyone actually was admitted with a GPA that low. I know this is disappointing, but there is very little chance you can overcome this handicap, as most schools make their cutoff at 3.9.

Seriously, though, from what I've heard admissions committees prefer applicants who are not self-absorbed, insecure, dependent, or sarcastic. If we try to make sure none of these adjectives apply to us and we'll be in good shape.
 
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osumc2014 said:
some top 20s aren't exactly stats laden, ie Mayo. So saying 3.8 is good enough or not isn't entirely relevant. So many schools evaluate applicants holistically, and if your stats were good enough to get you an interview, it's time for you as a person to shine. So long story short, get the best GPA you can, it's really as simple as that. If we are just talking about GPA ALONE, then 3.8 shouldn't stop you from applying to any top 20 schools.
Click to expand...

according to us news, mayo isn't top 20 though (which just shows how reliable us news is).
 
I removed my sarcastic post... don't want to be rude :p
 
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