How does a 'Group' work..JETPRO et al

[ThinkFast007]

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Even though I suppose this is a little premature for me, I suppose this is a topic that might be useful for me me in the future and residents,et al.

Perhaps JetPro can shed some light.

But how does a "group practice" actually work? From these threads it appears that CCM docs dont make as much, however, they are seen as being 'attractive assets" to a group practice. So....does this work this way. You have various MDAs (cardiac, CCM, pain, OR, etc) and they all work their specialty and are able to cover all the needs of a hospital. Then all the money that is produced is somehow put in a "pot" and then split up according to how many hrs worked, etc?? But I guess that doesnt work since if one goes on those websites it has certain MDAs making more than others 😕

So I'm assuming another benefit is splitting up the malpractice ins?


Just a thought. Thanks again

 

[redstorm]

yeah all the money goes to the group and the anesthesiologists gets about 4o percent of what he actually truly earns.. thats how a groups works.. its all about exploitation.. I say get rid of all anesthesia groups and let it be each man for himself/ herself

 

[jetproppilot]

yeah all the money goes to the group and the anesthesiologists gets about 4o percent of what he actually truly earns.. thats how a groups works.. its all about exploitation.. I say get rid of all anesthesia groups and let it be each man for himself/ herself

Sounds like you need to find a new group.

 

[jetproppilot]

Even though I suppose this is a little premature for me, I suppose this is a topic that might be useful for me me in the future and residents,et al.

Perhaps JetPro can shed some light.

But how does a "group practice" actually work? From these threads it appears that CCM docs dont make as much, however, they are seen as being 'attractive assets" to a group practice. So....does this work this way. You have various MDAs (cardiac, CCM, pain, OR, etc) and they all work their specialty and are able to cover all the needs of a hospital. Then all the money that is produced is somehow put in a "pot" and then split up according to how many hrs worked, etc?? But I guess that doesnt work since if one goes on those websites it has certain MDAs making more than others 😕

So I'm assuming another benefit is splitting up the malpractice ins?


Just a thought. Thanks again

Click on my name and review my posts- one of them has an extensive explanation...

 

[jetproppilot]

Click on my name and review my posts- one of them has an extensive explanation...

The post is from 22April2005 @ 10:37 pm, titled A Private Practice Docs Response To Reality.

 

[militarymd]

I'm glad you answered....save me some typing.

 

[Justin4563]

jet,

I need to find A group.. Not a new one.. Im currently independent right now.. doing office work here and there.. Its a good living but very hap hazard.. My first year out, pretty good money.. Most of the groups esxist based on exploitation. they have an exclusive contract in the hospital so nobody else can give anesthesia in the hospital. So in urban areas where there are a lot of anesthesiologisst. They will hire them as an employee and this employee will work for them ( sort of like a mcdonalds employee), and they will offer them somthing like a 3-5 year or 6 year partnership track and in the middle of the fourth year they will make up some bull **** that will keep them from offering you the partnership and they get a bunch of fresh new grads.. Really sad sad greedy bastards.. Your only hope is to get in a group with older guys and hope they retire or die so you can realize your potential..

 

[Justin4563]

jet explained how a grooup is run but did not mention the finances of the group and if every one in the group achieves equality

 

[jetproppilot]

jet explained how a grooup is run but did not mention the finances of the group and if every one in the group achieves equality

All accounts receivable were worked diligently by our office staff. Money comes in, at the end of each month we paid all our bills (office workers, CRNAs, etc) then split up what was left. All partners were treated equally (equal call, equal $$), save the "senior among equals" who got $1500 extra per month for all the extra office stuff he did, which he deserved.
I did a 2 year partnership track.
I encourage all of you to seek employment where equality comes eventually. I think more than 2 years to partner is unfair. I discourage you from taking a job where the guys that are partners when you get there do not distribute call and money equally, as this will always bother you. Its not worth it. There are plenty of groups out there that you can become a partner and share call and money equally.

 

[militarymd]

There are plenty of groups out there that you can become a partner and share call and money equally.

That's us 👍

 

[powermd]

All accounts receivable were worked diligently by our office staff. Money comes in, at the end of each month we paid all our bills (office workers, CRNAs, etc) then split up what was left. All partners were treated equally (equal call, equal $$), save the "senior among equals" who got $1500 extra per month for all the extra office stuff he did, which he deserved.
I did a 2 year partnership track.
I encourage all of you to seek employment where equality comes eventually. I think more than 2 years to partner is unfair. I discourage you from taking a job where the guys that are partners when you get there do not distribute call and money equally, as this will always bother you. Its not worth it. There are plenty of groups out there that you can become a partner and share call and money equally.

I had heard from some anesthesiologists at Sinai that there were several groups in the NYC area that used to do this when the market was more competitive (keep someone on with the promise of partnership, only to renege years later). Supposedly these practices are well known and now have to pay dearly to hire new anesthesiologists because no one wants to work for these practices. From what I understand 3-4 years to partnership is typical in the NYC area, whereas 1-2 years is typical out in the sticks.

 

[Justin4563]

Lets bring those practices to light... about unfair practices...... if anybody knows of any

hackensack Univ med center.. tiered partnership they will use you for a good 5-6 years and then tell you no thanks

anyone else..

 

[UTSouthwestern]

Some good groups I would highly recommend in the Dallas area are Metropolitan Anesthesia Consultants and Physician Anesthesia Practice.

The group TXAN (Texas Anesthesia) in north Dallas has had some problems with people not making partnership, but its hard to discern the true reason even after listening to both sides.

I believe the group in Austin, Texas has a four year partnership with low salaries.

 

[jetproppilot]

I had heard from some anesthesiologists at Sinai that there were several groups in the NYC area that used to do this when the market was more competitive (keep someone on with the promise of partnership, only to renege years later). Supposedly these practices are well known and now have to pay dearly to hire new anesthesiologists because no one wants to work for these practices. From what I understand 3-4 years to partnership is typical in the NYC area, whereas 1-2 years is typical out in the sticks.

1-2 years is typical in the southeast US, not just in the sticks.

 

[Justin4563]

does south east mean also atlanta..


i bet its not that easy to establish security in atlanta.. do you agree jet?

 

[jetproppilot]

does south east mean also atlanta..


i bet its not that easy to establish security in atlanta.. do you agree jet?

Sorry Dude, I can't render an opinion on Atlanta- I'm more familiar with Louisiana, Mississippi, and Florida. Military is in Alabama so he's the spokesdude there.

 

[jetproppilot]

Sorry Dude, I can't render an opinion on Atlanta- I'm more familiar with Louisiana, Mississippi, and Florida. Military is in Alabama so he's the spokesdude there.

I interviewed for a job in Pensacola around 2001 since I'm from Florida and miss living on the beach- when I began asking questions about how call is distributed and who-went-to-which-hospital, it became obvious the group kept the new guys at the busy hospital where all the trauma went (read busy, up all night doing cranis and ELAPS....HEY UT..LIKE THE COLOR??), and the guys who had been there 15-20 years took the shifts at the quieter hospital and surgery center. I expressed some dissatisfaction with that idea since the group I was with at the time rotated everything equally (towards the end of my time at my previous gig we hired a right-outta-residency dude outta Chicago, started him at 300k, 2 years to partner, and equal workload).

The senior Pensacola partner got a little miffed and said to me "Even if you start with us now, you'll NEVER equal all the call I've taken!"

Geez, I expected him to get up from the elegant dinner and start beating his chest like an alpha guerilla. Taking a big pay cut to go live there was something I had already come to terms with, but unequal workloads? Blow it out your ass, Dr. Alpha Guerilla. Needless to say I thanked them for the dinner, declined the offer, and walked to Flounders with my hot wife for a cuppla after-dinner Diesel Fuels (Flounder's proprietary STRONG alcohol concoction).

Again Dudes/Dudettes, be selective with what group you start with. Inquire about work distribution. Friendly groups realize taking advantage of new hires leads to dissention and they don't do it. If they take offense to you asking on an interview, you don't want to work there.

 

[militarymd]

Here in Alabama, things are pretty good.

All the groups around me are pretty fair...1 to 2 years to partnership. We don't have a time frame to partnership, but you get parity from day 1 on pay.

Birmingham is about the same.

I know of groups in Ohio, and Arizona also offering similar deals...1 year to partnership..and almost parity from day one.

 

[jetproppilot]

jet,

I need to find A group.. Not a new one.. Im currently independent right now.. doing office work here and there.. Its a good living but very hap hazard.. My first year out, pretty good money.. Most of the groups esxist based on exploitation. they have an exclusive contract in the hospital so nobody else can give anesthesia in the hospital. So in urban areas where there are a lot of anesthesiologisst. They will hire them as an employee and this employee will work for them ( sort of like a mcdonalds employee), and they will offer them somthing like a 3-5 year or 6 year partnership track and in the middle of the fourth year they will make up some bull **** that will keep them from offering you the partnership and they get a bunch of fresh new grads.. Really sad sad greedy bastards.. Your only hope is to get in a group with older guys and hope they retire or die so you can realize your potential..

Justin,

There are plenty of groups out there that do not exploit new anesthesiologists. Unfortunately you may have to relocate but in my humble opinion, working conditions and the type of relationship you have with your peers is just as, if not more important then $$. Good luck.

 

[powermd]

1-2 years is typical in the southeast US, not just in the sticks.

If you're from NYC, any place not accessible by subway is in the sticks!

 

[jetproppilot]

If you're from NYC, any place not accessible by subway is in the sticks!