How old is too old?

[SigmundFreudMD]

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so do you normally ask people for their opinions and then passively-aggressively scoff at those which you dont agree with..




Actually I was a bystander reading your comments, not asking you anything, opinions or otherwise. Further, your 'diagnosis' (perception is probably a more apt description) of passive-aggressive behaviour warrants reassessment - you are far from the mark.

Scoff? I laugh.

Lighten up, for heaven's sake. Life is far too gorgeous to get your knickers all in a twist about something you know so little about. Opinions, sure we all have them - but based on what, this is the oyster.

Amusing to have met you. Perhaps we shall meet on graduation day. Then again, perhaps not.

Carry on - I'm outa here.

very well. best of luck with your applications, you'll probably need it. 😀

 

[katciao]

I'm 59 and finishing up a post-master psychiatric nurse practitioner program. I don't intend to enroll in a Ph.D. psychology program but probably will get a Ph.D.. I'm doing it because I love it, need to survive in today's world just like anyone else, and most importantly of all, now that I'm at the age where I know most everything, I can give my patients their money's worth. 😀 If you're under 50...maybe 47...you're still trying to find your zipper.

Zenman, could you PM me? I would like to hear how you plan to go about getting into a PhD program. If you know anyone who started a PhD program over 40, I also would like to hear that person's story Thanks.

 

[deleted315242]

Certain Ph.D programs might actually prefer older students. I know that for clinical psychology programs that are more psychodynamically-oriented, they would like someone with actual life experience than a fresh young college graduate.

 

[zenman]

Zenman, could you PM me? I would like to hear how you plan to go about getting into a PhD program. If you know anyone who started a PhD program over 40, I also would like to hear that person's story Thanks.

I could but there's not much to discuss. Remember I'm not talking about a Ph.D. in psychology and since I've been running around Asia for the last 5 years I don't know anyone trying to get into a psych program. I guess I've just never consider that age was an issue and always expected to be admitted to every program I applied to. So far, 2 masters and now this post-grad program. I am taking a nursing doctoral course as an elective and my professor has asked me twice now to enroll in the program. If I go to the trouble to fill out the paperwork, I expect to be admitted. 😀

 

[Chenelsea3]

As I look around at all the twenty something applicants at my interviews, I can't imagine ever going to any of them as a therapist. I prefer someone older, wiser, and more experienced. Just my 2 cents.

Since therapists aren't supposed to give advice, I don't really see why life experience should be more highly valued than clinical experience and technique. I don't see any reason why a 20 year old can't be an equally good therapist as a 70 year old if they have comparable training. Empirically supported interventions don't generally rely on the therapist drawing from her/his own experience but rather their knowledge of psychology, ability to build rapport with the client, and their adeptness at carrying out the therapy. Unless you are a psychodynamic sort of person, in which case... well we would probably disagree on a lot more things related to therapy than just the age of the therapist

 

[psychmama]

Since therapists aren't supposed to give advice, I don't really see why life experience should be more highly valued than clinical experience and technique. I don't see any reason why a 20 year old can't be an equally good therapist as a 70 year old if they have comparable training. Empirically supported interventions don't generally rely on the therapist drawing from her/his own experience but rather their knowledge of psychology, ability to build rapport with the client, and their adeptness at carrying out the therapy. Unless you are a psychodynamic sort of person, in which case... well we would probably disagree on a lot more things related to therapy than just the age of the therapist

I don't think that age alone makes anyone a better therapist, but I do believe that a therapist's most important instrument in doing their work is his/herself. I realize not everyone would agree, but I believe this is true despite one's theoretical orientation. Than again, I'm more psychodynamic.😉

 

[katciao]

Since therapists aren't supposed to give advice, I don't really see why life experience should be more highly valued than clinical experience and technique. I don't see any reason why a 20 year old can't be an equally good therapist as a 70 year old if they have comparable training. Empirically supported interventions don't generally rely on the therapist drawing from her/his own experience but rather their knowledge of psychology, ability to build rapport with the client, and their adeptness at carrying out the therapy. Unless you are a psychodynamic sort of person, in which case... well we would probably disagree on a lot more things related to therapy than just the age of the therapist

While psychotherapy, especially that which is practiced today, may not be established on a foundation of life experience, all of the psychotherapists I know (dozens of therapists, from many different therapeutic approaches), seem, at least occasionally, to put their life experience to work in providing psychotherapy. I think that a therapist who started at any age can be a highly competent therapist. If I had to compare and contrast therapists, I'd want to do it on a case-by-case basis.

I would bet that I could provide noticeably better psychotherapy now then I could have twenty years ago--just because I've had twenty more years to observe the world.

 

[zenman]

Since the therapeutic relationship trumps specific modalities, does it stand to reason that the older therapist has more "relationship experiences?"

 

[PsychPhDone]

Since the therapeutic relationship trumps specific modalities, does it stand to reason that the older therapist has more "relationship experiences?"

I'm not sure I agree that the therapeutic relationship "trumps" specific modalities. Do we have a citation for older therapists being more effective/having stronger alliances? I'd be hesitant to play the main effect game with this one.

 

[psychmama]

I'm not sure I agree that the therapeutic relationship "trumps" specific modalities. Do we have a citation for older therapists being more effective/having stronger alliances? I'd be hesitant to play the main effect game with this one.

I wouldn't say the relationship trumps everything else, but I'd argue that the relationship is the necessary ingredient that allows everything else to happen. Without it, I think therapy affords little that one couldn't get by reading a good "self help" book.

 

[zenman]

Research shows that it doesn't matter which modality is used so much as the client-therapist relationship, which might explain the effectiveness of bartenders.

 

[deleted176373]

there is no road to go down really, you've created a slippery slope/strawman argument.

and it wouldnt be an official cutoff, just something unwritten that everyone recognized
age is different than skin color/belief system/gender. think about it, lets say someone who is 55 applies, gets in, finishes when they're 62.. now what? start practicing in another year or so, so now they're 64-65 and finally starting on their own, they have maybe a good 10 years of working and that's it. either die or just become too senile to be an effective therapist/researcher/teacher.. just being honest...would you really want to see a therapist who is 80-90 years old?

Beck is 86, are you saying you wouldn't want to sit down and listen to the advice that he has to share for a half hour. The half hour I spent talking with him last year was incredible, I felt fortunate to have had the opportunity to sit down with him and get his take on a few questions.

Just being honest... Yes, if I were a patient and 86 year old Tim Beck rolled into the room, I'd feel pretty fortunate.

Mark

 

[PsychPhDone]

Research shows that it doesn't matter which modality is used so much as the client-therapist relationship, which might explain the effectiveness of bartenders.

If you're referring about the dodo bird verdict paper, I know that's what you're going after, but that interpretation of it isn't quite correct anymore. The relationship is important and necessary, but for some disorders/clientele, modality has been shown to matter.

Beck is 86, are you saying you wouldn't want to sit down and listen to the advice that he has to share for a half hour. The half hour I spent talking with him last year was incredible, I felt fortunate to have had the opportunity to sit down with him and get his take on a few questions.

Just being honest... Yes, if I were a patient and 86 year old Tim Beck rolled into the room, I'd feel pretty fortunate.

Mark

Yeah, I was going to bring up Tim!!

 

[zenman]

If you're referring about the dodo bird verdict paper, I know that's what you're going after, but that interpretation of it isn't quite correct anymore. The relationship is important and necessary, but for some disorders/clientele, modality has been shown to matter.

I was thinking about Lambert & Barley (2002) review of psychotherapy outcome research. Actually I was thinking too hard as I'm multi-tasking here....