Hpsp Faq

[FermiParadox42]

Contact the Navy HPSP office at [email protected]. Once you are comissioned, they are in charge and can make those decisions. If it is a money issue, they may not be able to help, but ask.

Thanks for the suggestion. It kind of sounds like I am out of luck though. If they can't help me until I am commissioned, and I can't get the commission papers till June, I doubt they could squeeze me into the July ODS on such short notice.

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Members don't see this ad.

 

[buchemist]

So I think this is a new question (can't find any info about it in this thready at least)...

My recruiter called me back in December to let me know I have been awarded the Navy HPSP scholarship (hooray)! He also told me that I can't sign my commission papers until June (for budget reasons), and that I can't attend ODS until next summer. This would mean having to do ODS between 1st and 2nd year of med. school.

Every doc, HPSP student and school I have talked to has told me to do ODS before school if at all possible. And really, I want to get it out of the way now while I have free time, so I can enjoy my time off next year.

Any one have any advice/suggestions?

I completed ODS between first and second year. No issues at all. The wait for commissioning does give you the chance to not do this though, which I highly recommend. Imagine if they couldn't even get their ducks in a row to get you commissioned, how the rest of it will pan out.

 

[drjunieswife]

Hi everyone! I am new to this thing and I am just trying to find answers for my husband about the HPSP Scholarship.

All of his paperwork is in and he is waiting for a Board Date for his recruiter to present his application. He was originally told it would be held in January but is now being told February 21st.

He's losing hope that this will come through. Any advice?

BTW he is already in medical school, he's applying for a 3 year scholarship at this point. He attends PCOM.

 

[NavyFP]

Hi everyone! I am new to this thing and I am just trying to find answers for my husband about the HPSP Scholarship.

All of his paperwork is in and he is waiting for a Board Date for his recruiter to present his application. He was originally told it would be held in January but is now being told February 21st.

He's losing hope that this will come through. Any advice?

BTW he is already in medical school, he's applying for a 3 year scholarship at this point. He attends PCOM.

Be patient, if his stats are decent, he is likely to be offered a scholarship.

 

[WFdeacon04]

After medical school if you choose to do your AD during this time. When you do the internship and serve the 3-4 years of AD depending on the scholarship length. After AD (4 years) if you choose to go into a specialty that requires a internship do you have to repeat the one you did years ago? For example such as anesthesiology

Was wondering if anyone had any additional insight into this question. I am an accepted MD student for this year, and am pursuing HPSP. However, my desire is to graduate medical school, do my one year internship, four years of pay back, and then a civilian residency. If I do choose anesthesiology, would my previous PGY-1 internship count towards my anesthesia internship?

 

[NavyFP]

Was wondering if anyone had any additional insight into this question. I am an accepted MD student for this year, and am pursuing HPSP. However, my desire is to graduate medical school, do my one year internship, four years of pay back, and then a civilian residency. If I do choose anesthesiology, would my previous PGY-1 internship count towards my anesthesia internship?

A transitional internship should suffice. Confirm that with the civilian program you want after you get out.

 

[Gastrapathy]

A transitional internship should suffice. Confirm that with the civilian program you want after you get out.

Tranny , prelim IM, GS are all fine for anesthesia.

 

[djl27]

Ive been accepted to NYCOM and am considering Army HPSP. I have to be honest in saying that finances are a major reason. I am coming into medical school with around 35k in debt and am looking at around 80 a year for everything at NYCOM due to not being from the area. I also am interested in the experiences the military will offer (mostly the prospect of traveling and serving US soldiers) so I won't say its all financial. I was just hoping someone could address some of my concerns.
1. I want to go Emergency Medicine, I have extensive background in it(medic full time during undergrad). What are chances of me getting a residency first time around if I cover all the necessary bases?
2. Are there GMO's, or anything comparable in the Army? How likely am I to not get into a residency?
3. Do you really get to shadow doctors over your summers in really cool places like the recruiter said?
4. Is there any truth to what I've heard that military doctors often feel unprepared to go to the civilian world after serving active duty in the military?
5. How many people get to do a civilian residency of their choice?
6. As a new attending in the military how often do you move? Do you get stuck in places that absolutely suck to be in?
7 .Do you get deployed often? What is deployment like? Are doctors put in harms way?
8. Are there any questions I'm not asking that I should?

I understand I have a lot of questions that may be posted elsewhere but if anyone could answer whatever they feel like answering that would be great.

 

[NRL77]

Does the HPSP take care of housing when in medical school? I hear textbook, fees, tuition but housing.

 

[mwahnster]

Does the HPSP take care of housing when in medical school? I hear textbook, fees, tuition but housing.

No, but most people use their monthly stipend to cover room and board costs

 

[Kilgoretrout 65]

1. I want to go Emergency Medicine, I have extensive background in it(medic full time during undergrad). What are chances of me getting a residency first time around if I cover all the necessary bases?

Good but not 100%, need good grades, rotate at an Army ED program and do some research.

2. Are there GMO's, or anything comparable in the Army? How likely am I to not get into a residency?

The Army has GMO for those not accepted into residency after internship. Increases your chance at emed later.

3. Do you really get to shadow doctors over your summers in really cool places like the recruiter said?

Funny! Is Ft Stewart or FT Bliss a cool place?

4. Is there any truth to what I've heard that military doctors often feel unprepared to go to the civilian world after serving active duty in the military?
- depends on specialty and duty station, moonlighting helps

5. How many people get to do a civilian residency of their choice?
In the Army? Less than 5%. Their programs need fillin.

6. As a new attending in the military how often do you move? Do you get stuck in places that
absolutely suck to be in?
- could move q3-4 years; see answer to #3

7 .Do you get deployed often? What is deployment like? Are doctors put in harms way?
- read other posts; yes, tedious; yes see other posts

8. Are there any questions I'm not asking that I should?
- you need to talk directly with an Army Major ED doc pronto to get the truth. Ask the recruiter to arrange than ask the recruiter to leave the room.

 

[orbitsurgMD]

What is NYCOM's rate of placement to EM for graduates applying for the first time who are not in the military?

You might compare that rate to the Army applicant rate of acceptance for intern applicants (not those ultimately accepted but who must first wait in the wings as GMOs) I suspect you will find the rate of acceptance for non-HPSP EM applicants at your school to be higher. The number of available training programs available in EM is orders of magnitude greater on the civilian side vice the Army (which has more relative to the other services.) The relative quality of the civilian programs will likely be better as concerns volume of patient contact and disease acuity, even if military programs have high boards passing rates.

As a civilian EM doctor, you will be well paid and you will obviously have quite a bit of choice as to where you will practice. Not so much for the Army. The money difference and the choice of location difference weighs toward not taking HPSP.

If I were interested in EM, I would without hesitation opt for the civilian pathway and avoid HPSP. You can always join the reserves after medical school as a resident and get one of their loan repayment deals if you want, and even go on active duty. They will take you and probably give you a better deal than the would feel obligated to give if you came in obligated under HPSP.

 

[orbitsurgMD]

It might be useful to separate your decision into three questions, which you can answer individually:

1. Do I want to join the military?

No matter what choice you make of affiliation or which service you are interested in, HPSP, other medical school support programs, FAP, postgraduate reserve loan repayment for commissioning, active reserves, etc., if the answer is anything other than an unqualified "yes," then stop. Do not join the military unless or until you change your mind.

2. How will I pay for medical school if I do not sign for a program like HPSP?

Most medical students pay for medical school without the help of the military and have little difficulty repaying their loans. Even if you do find the loan repayment terms burdensome, there are alternatives to military contracts: federal, state and local repayment incentives, private incentives for specific specialties paid by hospitals, Public Health Service. The military is not the only game in town.

Even if you really do want a military "scholarship," for various reasons, you might not get one, and this would have to be your "Plan B." So you need to prepare for this possibility.

3. Am I willing to risk not being able to finish my residency training during the term of obligated repayment for any contract I might sign with the military, and can I accept possible--not certain--loss of competitiveness as a civilian applicant once my service is repaid, presumably as a general medical officer?

Becoming less competitive as a non-typical applicant isn't necessarily the rule, and many who have exited the military after completing their repayment obligations have found their service to be advantageous with some programs, but that is not the case with all specialties. While it might be easy to make good of your service in applying for anesthesia, EM or psychiatry residencies, for example, you might not get the same effect when applying for orthopedics or ENT residencies. Unfortunately, once you have signed the contract at the beginning of medical school, you can't back out if your interests change and you discover you will not likely have an easy time getting a residency slot in your desired specialty after internship and burning your time and applying three or four years after internship might render you less competitive for a slot you might otherwise get if you weren't obligated to the military. This is where the benefits of post-graduate commissioning programs are greatest, if you still want to go the military route.

 

[coffeeking]

Hey folks,

I'm starting med school in, I'm in the middle of the the application process for the Army's HPSP and I just had a few questions (I know some of them may have been presumably answered in the thread but I cannot find the answers, hence why I'm asking again):

1. What does an average day for a military physician look like when deployed?
2. During pay back time, how many times were you all deployed?
3. I am thinking of going into orthopaedic surgery and I just want to know how does the military residency program compare with the civilian one (I know there's a lot of concern with military residencies not training physicians well enough to work in the civilian world)

Thanks

 

[playaodamonth]

Hey everyone. I posted this as a topic on Military Med, I accidentally missed this HPSP faq thread, sorry for posting twice. But this was my question:

My Navy HPSP package was sent to the March 1st Board for review, according to my recruiter. Because my application is so late in the game, I was curious as to weather or not you guys think I'll have a shot in getting the HPSP. I'm just trying to plan my future prior to medical school, and it would definitely help having some piece of mind/idea on what to do which greatly depends on if I get the HPSP or not.

I'm already accepted into medical school and will be starting in August. I have a 3.45 undergrad, a 3.9 Masters, and a 32 MCAT. Thanks everyone in advanced!

 

[NavyFP]

Hey everyone. I posted this as a topic on Military Med, I accidentally missed this HPSP faq thread, sorry for posting twice. But this was my question:

My Navy HPSP package was sent to the March 1st Board for review, according to my recruiter. Because my application is so late in the game, I was curious as to weather or not you guys think I'll have a shot in getting the HPSP. I'm just trying to plan my future prior to medical school, and it would definitely help having some piece of mind/idea on what to do which greatly depends on if I get the HPSP or not.

I'm already accepted into medical school and will be starting in August. I have a 3.45 undergrad, a 3.9 Masters, and a 32 MCAT. Thanks everyone in advanced!

The scholarships are not all gone. Your numbers are good, barring other skeletons, you ought to be offerred one.

 

[playaodamonth]

The scholarships are not all gone. Your numbers are good, barring other skeletons, you ought to be offerred one.

Much appreciated! You wouldn't happen to know how long it takes for the board to make their decision would you?

 

[mwahnster]

Much appreciated! You wouldn't happen to know how long it takes for the board to make their decision would you?

For me, the board met on Oct. 11, and I was accepted on Oct. 24. I'm guessing it also depends on how many applications they need to review for the month.

 

[playaodamonth]

For me, the board met on Oct. 11, and I was accepted on Oct. 24. I'm guessing it also depends on how many applications they need to review for the month.

Yikes. Haha I'm entering the 5th week and still no word... Which branch are you?

 

[NavyFP]

Yikes. Haha I'm entering the 5th week and still no word... Which branch are you?

Your package may have been submitted on the 1st of March, but I am not sure when the board actually met. Results are usually out about 2 weeks after the board meets. Then it is up to your recruiter to notify you.

 

[mwahnster]

Yikes. Haha I'm entering the 5th week and still no word... Which branch are you?

Navy

Your package may have been submitted on the 1st of March, but I am not sure when the board actually met. Results are usually out about 2 weeks after the board meets. Then it is up to your recruiter to notify you.

I know some people whose applications were sent to the board for a certain month, but they weren't actually reviewed until later. Don't lose hope!

 

[playaodamonth]

Navy
I know some people whose applications were sent to the board for a certain month, but they weren't actually reviewed until later. Don't lose hope!

haha thanks. After more stalking on these threads, I saw someone post that they know the March board met on the 18th for 3 days, not on the 1st like my recruiter told me. Sooo we'll see what the word is this week or early next week

Since you're Navy HPSP, are you planning on trying to do a straight-through residency? or are you going to do 4 years as GMO after internship year, and then do civilian residency?

 

[mwahnster]

haha thanks. After more stalking on these threads, I saw someone post that they know the March board met on the 18th for 3 days, not on the 1st like my recruiter told me. Sooo we'll see what the word is this week or early next week

Since you're Navy HPSP, are you planning on trying to do a straight-through residency? or are you going to do 4 years as GMO after internship year, and then do civilian residency?

I'm hoping to go straight through, but I'm also thinking about staying in, so I wouldn't mind doing a GMO. Are you planning on going to ODS this summer?

 

[playaodamonth]

I'm hoping to go straight through, but I'm also thinking about staying in, so I wouldn't mind doing a GMO. Are you planning on going to ODS this summer?

Ohh okay cool. I'm still debating weather or not I want to do a civilian residency or military residency.... I'm thinking of doing a 4 year GMO tour then doing a civ residency and fellowship because I'm leaning toward Heme/Onc right now..and there are a lot more opportunities for that field in civ world...but we'll see.

If I get selected I'll try to make the May 12th ODS since the one in June is booked up. Are you?

 

[mwahnster]

Ohh okay cool. I'm still debating weather or not I want to do a civilian residency or military residency.... I'm thinking of doing a 4 year GMO tour then doing a civ residency and fellowship because I'm leaning toward Heme/Onc right now..and there are a lot more opportunities for that field in civ world...but we'll see.

If I get selected I'll try to make the May 12th ODS since the one in June is booked up. Are you?

Ohh, that makes sense.

Yea, I'm going to the one in May. Apparently there are a lot of seats open, so I'm sure you could snag one.

 

[Homunculus222]

Hi everyone,

I am currently an M1 and completed my packet for Navy HPSP in mid-February. My recruiter said he had submitted it to the Program Manager for the March board. From reading on this thread that board meeting would have been on the 18th. I am a class of 2016 applicant. Does anyone know if my application would be bumped in order to review the incoming 2017 applicants? Are these two years reviewed at separate boards?

I've been trying to get ahold of my recruiter. He said he would call the Program Manager last week but I haven't heard anything. He originally said if I made it to the March board I would find out in early to mid-April. Is there any way to confirm that my kit was reviewed at the March board without going through my recruiter if he continues to not respond? I know patience is a virtue especially in all things regarding the military but I am getting antsy in large part due to financial reasons.

Any advice?


Thanks everyone!

 

[Snowdon48]

Hi everyone,

I am currently an M1 and completed my packet for Navy HPSP in mid-February. My recruiter said he had submitted it to the Program Manager for the March board. From reading on this thread that board meeting would have been on the 18th. I am a class of 2016 applicant. Does anyone know if my application would be bumped in order to review the incoming 2017 applicants? Are these two years reviewed at separate boards?

I've been trying to get ahold of my recruiter. He said he would call the Program Manager last week but I haven't heard anything. He originally said if I made it to the March board I would find out in early to mid-April. Is there any way to confirm that my kit was reviewed at the March board without going through my recruiter if he continues to not respond? I know patience is a virtue especially in all things regarding the military but I am getting antsy in large part due to financial reasons.

Any advice?


Thanks everyone!

I know that it often takes 3-4 weeks to hear back after the board meets so I wouldn't assume that your application has been bumped down. The waiting is miserable I know

 

[NavyFP]

Hi everyone,

I am currently an M1 and completed my packet for Navy HPSP in mid-February. My recruiter said he had submitted it to the Program Manager for the March board. From reading on this thread that board meeting would have been on the 18th. I am a class of 2016 applicant. Does anyone know if my application would be bumped in order to review the incoming 2017 applicants? Are these two years reviewed at separate boards?

I've been trying to get ahold of my recruiter. He said he would call the Program Manager last week but I haven't heard anything. He originally said if I made it to the March board I would find out in early to mid-April. Is there any way to confirm that my kit was reviewed at the March board without going through my recruiter if he continues to not respond? I know patience is a virtue especially in all things regarding the military but I am getting antsy in large part due to financial reasons.

Any advice?


Thanks everyone!

Same board. Same time. Keep bugging your recruiter.

 

[playaodamonth]

Hmm wish we could merge the HPSP March Board thread to this one, feel bad for repeating the same thing throughout SDN. But yeah, just got word from my recruiter I got the scholarship! Waiting on the commissioning papers now.

 

[playaodamonth]

Also, I would like to ask a question. This may seem silly, but can't hurt to try. For those HPSP students who have commissioned, would it be possible to get student orders? I ask because I live in NJ, and my med school is in North Carolina, sooo it's going to be a pain in the arse to move all of my household goods. It would definitely help a lot to get military orders to help with the move...I know a few friends who got ROTC scholarships and the Navy shipped 10,000 lbs of their household goods under their student orders...maybe it's not impossible?

 

[Oo Cipher oO]

Also, I would like to ask a question. This may seem silly, but can't hurt to try. For those HPSP students who have commissioned, would it be possible to get student orders? I ask because I live in NJ, and my med school is in North Carolina, sooo it's going to be a pain in the arse to move all of my household goods. It would definitely help a lot to get military orders to help with the move...I know a few friends who got ROTC scholarships and the Navy shipped 10,000 lbs of their household goods under their student orders...maybe it's not impossible?

I can think of a few reasons the military will not help with your moving expenses.

1) Your start date for HPSP is usually the first day of school. You will have to be moved by then.
2) You will be a commissioned officer in the reserves while in school. Many of the benefits of active duty members will not be available to you.
3) Most medical students move to go to medical school. That would be a lot of money to spend on each one
4) The military is paying you a $20,000 bonus. Doubt they would take pity on your case.

 

[playaodamonth]

I can think of a few reasons the military will not help with your moving expenses.

1) Your start date for HPSP is usually the first day of school. You will have to be moved by then.
2) You will be a commissioned officer in the reserves while in school. Many of the benefits of active duty members will not be available to you.
3) Most medical students move to go to medical school. That would be a lot of money to spend on each one
4) The military is paying you a $20,000 bonus. Doubt they would take pity on your case.

haha yeahh I considered all of the reasons above, can't hurt to hope right? I sent OH an e-mail just to be 100% sure, even if it's a long shot.

 

[J-Rad]

Also, I would like to ask a question. This may seem silly, but can't hurt to try. For those HPSP students who have commissioned, would it be possible to get student orders? I ask because I live in NJ, and my med school is in North Carolina, sooo it's going to be a pain in the arse to move all of my household goods. It would definitely help a lot to get military orders to help with the move...I know a few friends who got ROTC scholarships and the Navy shipped 10,000 lbs of their household goods under their student orders...maybe it's not impossible?

No, they won't. They'll PCS you when you come on active duty.

 

[playaodamonth]

No, they won't. They'll PCS you when you come on active duty.

Yeah just got the official confirmation in the e-mail. Its okay, asking never-hurt-no-body. Time to find a shipping company....

 

[CUAnes12]

I'm currently applying for the 2014 entering class and I've begun my HPSP application as well. My recruiter has been great with my questions but I have a few that would be better suited for applicants and recipients of the HPSP.

1. What is the screening process like, including MEPS? I've been trying to collect as complete of a medical record as I can but it seems like if one thing is missing, the whole process will be delayed. Or if something ends up being a temporary disqualifier that will also effect the application.
2. Are there any specific cutoffs different from what I have been told? When a speaker from the Navy came to my campus 2 years ago, a 3.2 GPA/24 MCAT or higher indicated a competitive application. Does this still hold true?

If anyone could help, I'd be really grateful!

 

[NavyFP]

I'm currently applying for the 2014 entering class and I've begun my HPSP application as well. My recruiter has been great with my questions but I have a few that would be better suited for applicants and recipients of the HPSP.

1. What is the screening process like, including MEPS? I've been trying to collect as complete of a medical record as I can but it seems like if one thing is missing, the whole process will be delayed. Or if something ends up being a temporary disqualifier that will also effect the application.
2. Are there any specific cutoffs different from what I have been told? When a speaker from the Navy came to my campus 2 years ago, a 3.2 GPA/24 MCAT or higher indicated a competitive application. Does this still hold true?

If anyone could help, I'd be really grateful!

A 3.2/24 this year would be a no. Based on last weeks board, anything less than a 3.5/29 is going to get you significant scrutiny.

For MEPS, if you have any chronic medical issues, it can hold up the process. Young, healthy people with no problems tend to sail through.

 

[CajunMedic]

A 3.2/24 this year would be a no. Based on last weeks board, anything less than a 3.5/29 is going to get you significant scrutiny.

I started my Navy HPSP Paperwork this week as well. I'm looking at 3.5/23 and waiting on the retake score. I'm prior service Army, will that make any difference in how they look at me?

 

[NavyFP]

I started my Navy HPSP Paperwork this week as well. I'm looking at 3.5/23 and waiting on the retake score. I'm prior service Army, will that make any difference in how they look at me?

Prior service helps, but won't likely overcome a 23. Hopefully you will get a 24+ on the retake with no 7s.

 

[Mt Kilimanjaro]

Applying this year for 2014 entering class. Planning to do either USUHS, HPSP, or maybe a state primary care scholarship.

Should I get the ball rolling on HPSP application this early?

 

[NavyFP]

Applying this year for 2014 entering class. Planning to do either USUHS, HPSP, or maybe a state primary care scholarship.

Should I get the ball rolling on HPSP application this early?

Yes. Apply early and often.

 

[Mt Kilimanjaro]

Can someone be so kind as to update this info from post 38 in this thread? Thank you!


4. What will I make as a physician in the military?

These are new figures calculated as of 2005 for a 4 year scholarship. I have factored in the cost of medical school education, stipend amount, and interest avoided to come up with a true scholarship value. This will then be calculated into what you receive in pay over the lifetime of your commitment. Pay is fairly comparable for the fields of FP, PEDS, and IM. ER is not far behind.


Scholarship Value

Medical School Education Loans Saved * 4 years: $154,000
Interest Saved: $25,000
Stipend Pay * 4 years: $65,000

Total Scholarship Value (4 years): $244,000 (61K per year of commitment)


Military Pay

Pay: 46K (Captain)
BAH: 10k (housing allowance)
BAS: 2K (food allowance)
VSP: 5K (specialty pay based on years)
BCP: 2.5K (board certification pay)
MASP: 15K (flat pay given to all doctors)
ISP: 13.5K (independent specialty pay based on specialty (FP or IM))

Total Military Pay yearly: $94,000

Avg. Malpractice Saving (FP & IM): $12,000

Yearly Compensation for 4 year commitment: $167,000
(Military Pay + Malpractice Savings + Scholarship Value)
(I did not take into account that a portion is not taxed)


Comparisons

Average starting salary for IM – Malpractice: $155,000 (after 3 years 172K)
Average Starting salary for FP – Malpractice: $135,000 (after 3 years 151K)


Military Pay Post-Commitment

After commitment is up, one looses the loan advantage and equivalent pay drops to about $106,000 per year.


Retirement?

Military retirement is 0% vested until 20 years, after which it becomes fully vested at ½ base salary (add 2.5% for each additional year up to mandatory retirement at 30 years). Most physicians that choose to stay till retirement will be Lt. Colonels. This means a yearly retirement pay of about $30-$35,000 plus lifetime healthcare benefits.

Time in school is considered IRR butt does NOT count toward retirement.

5. What will I make as a resident?
A lot more....the average civilian resident makes 35-40K

1st year (FYGME): Base Pay + BAH + BAS + 100 monthly for VSP = 59K

Residents: Base Pay + BAH + BAS + full VSP = 63K

 

[PinknGreenMD]

I started my Navy HPSP Paperwork this week as well. I'm looking at 3.5/23 and waiting on the retake score. I'm prior service Army, will that make any difference in how they look at me?

Hi CajunMedic;
Question: I thought the cutoff age for the Military ... and HPSP was 34? Isn't that in all the fine print? Or did I read that wrong? thanks

 

[CajunMedic]

Hi CajunMedic;
Question: I thought the cutoff age for the Military ... and HPSP was 34? Isn't that in all the fine print? Or did I read that wrong? thanks

It is, I'm going to need an age waiver.

 

[NavyFP]

It is, I'm going to need an age waiver.

Age wavier is needed after age 38. You need to graduate prior to age 42.

 

[playaodamonth]

Can someone be so kind as to update this info from post 38 in this thread? Thank you!

Did my best. If anyone finds any errors, please edit/update.

4-year HPSP

2010/2011 Median Total Cost for Public Medical Students = $49,298/year * 4 years
= $197,192

2010/2011 Median Total Cost for Private Medical Students = $66,984/year * 4 years
= $267,936

Stipend Pay Before Tax ($2122/month) * 4 years = $101,856 - 3 months for ADT
= $95,490
***Stipend pays monthly except during the 45 day Active Duty Time (ADT), in which you will get paid your Active Duty salary of an O-1 under 2 years.

2013 ADT Pay O-1 Before Taxes = Basic Pay + Basic Housing Allowance + Basic Allowance for Subsistence = $2876.40 + $1875 + $242.60 = $4994 * 3 ADTs = $14,982
***For BAH without dependents (you get a couple hundred more if you're married or have kids), I chose Bethesda as the duty station since that is where Walter Reed National Military Medical Center is.

USMLE Board Exam = $2385

Signing Bonus = $20,000 (one-time payment)

Also reimbursed for health insurance, didn't know how to factor that into the value.

Estimated Scholarship Value for all 4 years
Public School = $329,959
Private School = $398,408
_______________________________________________________________________

The pay below is for Straight-Through IM Residency:
Intern (PGY-1) to PGY2 Pay

Basic Pay = $3835.50/month (O-3 pay under 2 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $1875/month (Bethesda, MD WRNMMC)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $100/month (variable special pay)

Monthly = $6053.10
Yearly = $72,637.20


PGY-3 Pay
Basic Pay = $4347.90/month (before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $1875/month (Bethesda, MD WRNMMC)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $100/month (variable special pay)

Monthly = $6565.50
Yearly = $78,786


IM Attending Starting Pay
Basic Pay = $5386.80/month (O-4 pay for under 4 years service, before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $1875/month (Bethesda, MD WRNMMC)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $416.66/month (variable special pay; increases as service years increases)
BCP = $208.33/month (board certification pay; increases as service years increases)
ASP = $15,000/year (additional special pay for all medical doctors)
ISP = $20,000/year (incentive specialty pay for IM; differs for each specialty)

Monthly = $11,046.06
Yearly = $132,552.68

***This track will give you 6 years Active Duty service after all commitments are met. 14 more years to get retirement benefits.
_________________________________________________________________________

The pay below is for GMO Tour first, then Residency:
Intern (PGY-1) pay

Basic Pay = $3835.50/month (O-3 pay under 2 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $1875/month (Bethesda, MD WRNMMC)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $100/month (variable special pay; less than 3 years service)

Monthly = $6053.10
Yearly = $72,637.20


4-year GMO pay
***I chose San Diego as the GMO Billet, just because I felt like it haha.

Year 1
Basic Pay = $3835.50/month (O-3 pay under 2 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $2187/month (San Diego, CA)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $100/month (variable special pay)
ASP = $15,000 (additional special pay)

Monthly = $7615.10
Yearly = $91,381.20

Year 2
Basic Pay = $4347.90/month (O-3 pay under 3 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $2187/month (San Diego, CA)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $416.66/month (variable special pay; 3-6 years service)
ASP = $15,000 (additional special pay)

Monthly = $8443.26
Yearly = $101,319.12

Year 3
Basic Pay = $4692.90/month (O-3 pay under 4 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $2187/month (San Diego, CA)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $416.66/month (variable special pay)
ASP = $15,000 (additional special pay)

Monthly = $8789.16
Yearly = $105,469.92

Year 4
Basic Pay = $5116.50/month (O-3 pay under 6 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $2187/month (San Diego, CA)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $416.66/month (variable special pay)
ASP = $15,000 (additional special pay)

Monthly = $9212.75
Yearly = $110,553.12


PGY-2 Pay
Basic Pay = $5461.80/month (O-4 pay under 6 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $1875/month (Bethesda, MD WRNMMC)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $416.66/month (variable special pay)

Monthly = $7996.06
Yearly = $95,952.72


PGY-3 Pay
Basic Pay = $5774.70/month (O-4 pay under 8 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $1875/month (Bethesda, MD WRNMMC)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $1000/month (variable special pay; >6 years service)

Monthly = $8892.30
Yearly = $106,707.60


IM Attending Starting Pay
Basic Pay = $5774.70/month (O-4 pay for under 8 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $1875/month (Bethesda, MD WRNMMC)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $1000/month (variable special pay; increases as service years increases)
BCP = $208.33/month (board certification pay; increases as service years increases)
ASP = $15,000/year (additional special pay for all medical doctors)
ISP = $20,000/year (incentive specialty pay for IM; differs for each specialty)

Monthly = $12,017.30
Yearly = $144,207.56

***This track will give you 8 years of Active Duty service after meeting all commitments. 12 years left for retirement benefits.

_________________________________________________________________________

Pay increases with number of active years served as well as making rank. Most medical doctors make rank every 5-6 years.

***Also keep in mind, military medicine includes:
-Not having to pay malpractice insurance
-Free medical, dental, vision healthcare
-No Medical School Debt
-Base amenities (free gym, cheap movie theater/bowling/recreation, tax-free groceries and items at the commissary and exchange).




_________________________________________________________________________

 

[Mt Kilimanjaro]

@playaodamonth: Thanks for doing that!

Couple of questions...

1) I'm not sure how to calculate it correctly, but my understanding is that med school loans start accruing interest from the first semester. So by the time you graduate, you're looking at considerably more than the actual COA x 4. Is this correct?

2) I know that only certain parts of military pay is taxable, but I'm curious if anyone has done the math to see how much that saves you. The 275k your civilian buddy makes on the outside looks a lot smaller after Uncle Sam gets his ~35% and he writes a loan check for 3k a month. Has anyone done the math to see how much the post-tax salaries actually stack up?

Thanks again!

 

[cautionmaster]

Did my best. If anyone finds any errors, please edit/update.

4-year HPSP

2010/2011 Median Total Cost for Public Medical Students = $49,298/year * 4 years
= $197,192

2010/2011 Median Total Cost for Private Medical Students = $66,984/year * 4 years
= $267,936

Stipend Pay Before Tax ($2122/month) * 4 years = $101,856 - 3 months for ADT
= $95,490
***Stipend pays monthly except during the 45 day Active Duty Time (ADT), in which you will get paid your Active Duty salary of an O-1 under 2 years.

2013 ADT Pay O-1 Before Taxes = Basic Pay + Basic Housing Allowance + Basic Allowance for Subsistence = $2876.40 + $1875 + $242.60 = $4994 * 3 ADTs = $14,982
***For BAH without dependents (you get a couple hundred more if you're married or have kids), I chose Bethesda as the duty station since that is where Walter Reed National Military Medical Center is.

USMLE Board Exam = $2385

Signing Bonus = $20,000 (one-time payment)

Also reimbursed for health insurance, didn't know how to factor that into the value.

Estimated Scholarship Value for all 4 years
Public School = $329,959
Private School = $398,408
_______________________________________________________________________

The pay below is for Straight-Through IM Residency:
Intern (PGY-1) to PGY2 Pay

Basic Pay = $3835.50/month (O-3 pay under 2 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $1875/month (Bethesda, MD WRNMMC)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $100/month (variable special pay)

Monthly = $6053.10
Yearly = $72,637.20


PGY-3 Pay
Basic Pay = $4347.90/month (before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $1875/month (Bethesda, MD WRNMMC)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $100/month (variable special pay)

Monthly = $6565.50
Yearly = $78,786


IM Attending Starting Pay
Basic Pay = $5386.80/month (O-4 pay for under 4 years service, before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $1875/month (Bethesda, MD WRNMMC)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $416.66/month (variable special pay; increases as service years increases)
BCP = $208.33/month (board certification pay; increases as service years increases)
ASP = $15,000/year (additional special pay for all medical doctors)
ISP = $20,000/year (incentive specialty pay for IM; differs for each specialty)

Monthly = $11,046.06
Yearly = $132,552.68

***This track will give you 6 years Active Duty service after all commitments are met. 14 more years to get retirement benefits.
_________________________________________________________________________

The pay below is for GMO Tour first, then Residency:
Intern (PGY-1) pay

Basic Pay = $3835.50/month (O-3 pay under 2 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $1875/month (Bethesda, MD WRNMMC)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $100/month (variable special pay; less than 3 years service)

Monthly = $6053.10
Yearly = $72,637.20


4-year GMO pay
***I chose San Diego as the GMO Billet, just because I felt like it haha.

Year 1
Basic Pay = $3835.50/month (O-3 pay under 2 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $2187/month (San Diego, CA)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $100/month (variable special pay)

Monthly = $6365.10
Yearly = $76,381.20

Year 2
Basic Pay = $4347.90/month (O-3 pay under 3 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $2187/month (San Diego, CA)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $416.66/month (variable special pay; 3-6 years service)

Monthly = $7193.26
Yearly = $86,319.12

Year 3
Basic Pay = $4692.90/month (O-3 pay under 4 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $2187/month (San Diego, CA)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $416.66/month (variable special pay)

Monthly = $7539.16
Yearly = $90,469.92

Year 4
Basic Pay = $5116.50/month (O-3 pay under 6 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $2187/month (San Diego, CA)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $416.66/month (variable special pay)

Monthly = $7962.76
Yearly = $95,553.12


PGY-2 Pay
Basic Pay = $5461.80/month (O-4 pay under 6 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $1875/month (Bethesda, MD WRNMMC)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $416.66/month (variable special pay)

Monthly = $7996.06
Yearly = $95,952.72


PGY-3 Pay
Basic Pay = $5774.70/month (O-4 pay under 8 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $1875/month (Bethesda, MD WRNMMC)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $1000/month (variable special pay; >6 years service)

Monthly = $8892.30
Yearly = $106,707.60


IM Attending Starting Pay
Basic Pay = $5774.70/month (O-4 pay for under 8 years; before tax)
BAH w/o dependents = $1875/month (Bethesda, MD WRNMMC)
BAS = $242.60/month (food allowance)
VSP = $1000/month (variable special pay; increases as service years increases)
BCP = $208.33/month (board certification pay; increases as service years increases)
ASP = $15,000/year (additional special pay for all medical doctors)
ISP = $20,000/year (incentive specialty pay for IM; differs for each specialty)

Monthly = $12,017.30
Yearly = $144,207.56

***This track will give you 9 years of Active Duty service after meeting all commitments. 11 years left for retirement benefits.

_________________________________________________________________________

Pay increases with number of active years served as well as making rank. Most medical doctors make rank every 5-6 years.

***Also keep in mind, military medicine includes:
-Not having to pay malpractice insurance
-Free medical, dental, vision healthcare
-No Medical School Debt
-Base amenities (free gym, cheap movie theater/bowling/recreation, tax-free groceries and items at the commissary and exchange).




_________________________________________________________________________

You get the ASP of 15k while a GMO, so you can add that in

 

[playaodamonth]

@playaodamonth: Thanks for doing that!

Couple of questions...

1) I'm not sure how to calculate it correctly, but my understanding is that med school loans start accruing interest from the first semester. So by the time you graduate, you're looking at considerably more than the actual COA x 4. Is this correct?

2) I know that only certain parts of military pay is taxable, but I'm curious if anyone has done the math to see how much that saves you. The 275k your civilian buddy makes on the outside looks a lot smaller after Uncle Sam gets his ~35% and he writes a loan check for 3k a month. Has anyone done the math to see how much the post-tax salaries actually stack up?

Thanks again!

No problem. I'm glad to help .

1) I'm not sure how to calculate it correctly, but my understanding is that med school loans start accruing interest from the first semester. So by the time you graduate, you're looking at considerably more than the actual COA x 4. Is this correct?

Let's take the average tuition of attending a public medical school = $49,298
Add in fees + books + supplies + living expenses + transportation + licensure fees = $20,000 (rough estimate).
Total cost = $70,000/year * 4years = $280,000 borrowed.

Then lets say you choose the Forbearance option on the loan, meaning you do not have to pay into the loan during your residency since you will only be making around $45,000/year and can't afford to pay into it. If you're doing a 3-year IM residency, that's another 3 years of interest accrued. Using the current interest rate, which is fixed at 6.8%, and using the federal StudentAid website interest calculator, total interest accrued over the 7 years will be approximately $133,280.

Total debt after residency = $413,280

Now you're an Attending and can make payments on your loan. However, keep in mind, the loan will still accrue interest even as you pay into it. Let's say you chose the 15-year payment option. That means you must make 180 monthly payments for the next 15 years. With interest accumulating concurrently as you pay off the loan, you must pay the minimum $3,670 every month for next 15 years, and will have accrued a total of $246,890 as you did so.

Over the 15 year period, total repayment would have been = $660,200. That's $44,000 a year for 15 years spent on just paying back your loan!

2) I know that only certain parts of military pay is taxable, but I'm curious if anyone has done the math to see how much that saves you. The 275k your civilian buddy makes on the outside looks a lot smaller after Uncle Sam gets his ~35% and he writes a loan check for 3k a month. Has anyone done the math to see how much the post-tax salaries actually stack up?

According to MedScape's 2013 Compensation Report, average salary of IM Attending is $185,000/year. Assume you're single. You fall into the 33% tax bracket. After federal income tax, your income will be approximately $123,950/year. Disregard state taxes as you can live in one of the few states without state income tax. Then, subtract avg malpractice insurance cost ($6000/year) and avg healthcare premium cost ($2000/year) and you're left with $116,000. And then here's the kicker, subtract the loan debt payment you made that year of $44,000. You're left with a net income of $72,000/year.

In the military, only your BAH and BAS are non-taxable. All other pay (BAS & Special Pays) are taxable. So as an IM Attending who went Straight-Through to residency, assuming you were a good boy/girl and were promoted every 5-6 years, you should be an O-6 within 12 years after residency. Adding up the yearly salary from O-4 to O-6 over the 15 year period, including adjusting the numbers for basic pay as well as special pay for each year served, and adjusting each basic pay with its respective tax bracket, you will have made a mean salary of: $134,040/year after taxes.

15 year average IM Attending net salary, after taxes, over a 15-year period after residency:
Civilian = $72,000; after 15 years when you fully pay off your loan, your net salary will return too approximately $120,000.
Military = $134,040

For Primary Care fields, military seems to be just as good, if not, better than the civilian sector when it comes to salary.

HOWEVER, if you are planning on specializing (i.e. Neurosurgery, Heme/Onc, Cardiothoracic Surgery, Ortho), your salary in the civilian sector can range from $300,000 to $500,000+/year. This is SIGNIFICANTLY more than you will make in the military in that specialty, even after malpractice+health insurance+loan costs you will still be netting $150,000+ after it all.

Although I never recommend anyone to join the military purely for salary/expense purposes, the moral of the story when it comes to basing your decision on salary:
**If you are going to be a Primary Care provider, military is a great option all around. Maybe even better than the civilian sector.
**If you are going to specialize, but feel the need to serve at least for a little bit in the military because its just gushing through your veins, either opt to do GMO tours and get out as soon as you fulfill your HPSP commitment, or do your Straight-Through residency, fulfill your commitment time as an attending, and get out into the civilian sector.
**If you plan to specialize and don't care about serving in the military at all, but are looking into the HPSP for medical school financial assistance, DON'T DO IT, just take out loans, you'll be making plenty to cover your loans as a specialist.

 

[playaodamonth]

You get the ASP of 15k while a GMO, so you can add that in

Wow, can't believe I missed that. I adjusted the numbers above. Thanks for the heads up.

 

[MilMD01]

Hello,

So I just completed BOLC and I have a few questions.

1. Where/how do I submit reimbursement claims for my cab?
2. Am I supposed to submit the 1059 form saying I completed BOLC anywhere?
3. Is there a form that I need to submit after completion of my school portion of ADT? And if so, please name the form and provide the address for submission.