- Joined
- Jun 14, 2009
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anyway OP.. there must be some Muslims in your class? you should hang out with us, we don't drink and party . can't speak to their personalities though..
Hahahhahahhaha
and the guy talking about mindless consumerism has a point despite his/her writing style..
i liked the "irrationally rational" partI agree, but there's a difference between clever writing with subtext and a jangle of the biggest words you could fetch out of the thesaurus.
i liked the "irrationally rational" part
lol
... I am absolutely BAFFLED by the behavior and attitude of medical students. I can say with conviction that ironically, medical students are a lot less "classy" and mature than in many other professions with less education requirements. It just strikes me as very ironic. It was not at all what I expected.
So granted I am one. But I think I'm an anomaly.
Is it just me or does communicating with fellow medical students leave you frustrated and annoyed?? Why is it that science people tend to criticize and overanalyze everything you do or say?? Or passive aggressively make statements that are supposed to irk you into a debate??
Ok, GUNNER I don't want to debate/argue/make a point for you. I don't want to talk to you and have you look at me as if you were looking through a magnifying glass.
Ugh and yet I have to see these people every day with their righteous, I'm better than GOD attitudes.
Does everyone in this profession have such an inflated ego??? I swear, I have not found one normal, uncritical person - everyone has that stupid "science" mentality and God forbid you misuse a verb.
Also, why do people act like they are high school freshmen? I mean, honestly - keg stands for God's sake?! rumors?! calling people odd if they don't attend these stupid parties where a ping pong ball gets tossed around into gross cups of stale cheap beer, or if they don't sleep with every other person in the class?? what is this?? how is this an f****** profession? and yet they feel that they have a right to judge you. ew. what am I doing here? why did I expect something else? I can't believe the route to becoming such an important figure in people's lives is paved with so much unnecessary bull****.
For someone who is thoroughly disgusted by your classmates' behavior, you care an awful lot about what they think. I agree that there's a lot of regression to undergrad in med school, but to get so worked up about it is equally juvenile, IMHO.
The faculty pisses me off just as much when it comes to the "science thing."
Their obsession with initials after their names makes me want to puke. Every single document we get sent with an instructors name on it has the long string of initials after the name. The world would go to hell in a handbasket if we didn't know what kind of degree someone had because apparently you can't process anything said or written by someone without knowing his/her educational background.
After 6 months of med school, I have decided that I want to be as far, far away from academic medicine as humanly possible. I want to graduate, attend a community residency program and have my own practice. And I get pissed when I hear faculty members lecture politically charged topics at us, telling us that doctors will soon no longer be on their own, we will all be on salary by private hospitals and the government, and this is a good thing.
I am so sick of how the word research is constantly rammed down our throats, especially when the purpose of such "research" is assumed academic prestige. Working in a large, academic/research-based university hospital is my own definition of hell. I came into medicine because I wanted my own practice and my own patients, and to run things my way, and this has been presented as an impossibility to us from day one, and pretty much this kind of career goal is looked down upon by the administration and most of the science faculty.
There are med schools out there whose goal is to produce community physicians, but I didn't really understand the difference between those schools and university hospitals/research centers until now.
OP, there are plenty of people who feel the same way, and my advice to you is to strive for what I am trying to do, and that is to get out there in the community and have your own practice, and to fight "big medicine" policy that is trying to drive doctors out of private practice and into hospital groups.
This generation of graying scientists, riding their tenure trains into the sunset, having just been brought up through the absolute pinnacle of the American empire, and now getting off wanting to impart wild projections about the future of our career, are an evolutionarily dead end species. And their cold war inspired ideology of science saving the planet, outsmarting nature, and saving us from all that is unholy, is now the theater of the absurd.
I feel the same way.The faculty pisses me off just as much when it comes to the "science thing."
Their obsession with initials after their names makes me want to puke. Every single document we get sent with an instructors name on it has the long string of initials after the name. The world would go to hell in a handbasket if we didn't know what kind of degree someone had because apparently you can't process anything said or written by someone without knowing his/her educational background.
After 6 months of med school, I have decided that I want to be as far, far away from academic medicine as humanly possible. I want to graduate, attend a community residency program and have my own practice. And I get pissed when I hear faculty members lecture politically charged topics at us, telling us that doctors will soon no longer be on their own, we will all be on salary by private hospitals and the government, and this is a good thing.
I am so sick of how the word research is constantly rammed down our throats, especially when the purpose of such "research" is assumed academic prestige. Working in a large, academic/research-based university hospital is my own definition of hell. I came into medicine because I wanted my own practice and my own patients, and to run things my way, and this has been presented as an impossibility to us from day one, and pretty much this kind of career goal is looked down upon by the administration and most of the science faculty.
I'm glad to hear that there at least a couple other people like me in this profession. My classmates don't give me much hope. I can see them buying more and more into the culture of academic elitism every day.
We spent a lot of our first semester having to read research papers. I read them. I laughed. When I got to the end at saw upwards of 150 REFERENCES FOR A 5 PAGE PAPER, I laughed even harder. When I saw identical papers published by different people citing the same 150 references, it stopped being funny. Some of these papers have 30 different authors!!!!! 2 months in, I realized that these people, these scientists are writing papers and doing "research" solely in order to get published. The goal is to get your name on as many papers as possible, speak at as many conferences as possible, and get the most absurdly long c.v. as possible. It's a CONTEST. If you don't play the game, you get fired. Because you don't work for yourself. You're at the mercy of the program, and this is what the program wants.
Where does the meaningful **** actually get done? Private industry. But they don't tell us this. Private industry is the enemy. Capitalism is bad. Socialism is good, etc., etc., etc.
Two months in, first year students are already asking, "how do I get published?" "What kind of research do I have to do to get published?" "Can I get a publication over the summer?" Ad naseum...
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Just to further that point a bit, I'm probably going to be published soon for doing a couple PANSS evaluations on a patient of mine. That's right: I'll have an authorship - second author, even - for under 2 hours of work. That, my friends, is scientific progress.
So granted I am one. But I think I'm an anomaly.
Is it just me or does communicating with fellow medical students leave you frustrated and annoyed?? Why is it that science people tend to criticize and overanalyze everything you do or say?? Or passive aggressively make statements that are supposed to irk you into a debate??
Ok, GUNNER I don't want to debate/argue/make a point for you. I don't want to talk to you and have you look at me as if you were looking through a magnifying glass.
Ugh and yet I have to see these people every day with their righteous, I'm better than GOD attitudes.
Does everyone in this profession have such an inflated ego??? I swear, I have not found one normal, uncritical person - everyone has that stupid "science" mentality and God forbid you misuse a verb.
Also, why do people act like they are high school freshmen? I mean, honestly - keg stands for God's sake?! rumors?! calling people odd if they don't attend these stupid parties where a ping pong ball gets tossed around into gross cups of stale cheap beer, or if they don't sleep with every other person in the class?? what is this?? how is this an f****** profession? and yet they feel that they have a right to judge you. ew. what am I doing here? why did I expect something else? I can't believe the route to becoming such an important figure in people's lives is paved with so much unnecessary bull****.
Projects superiority and condescension, uses others moments of weakness to pad own ego / assuage insecurities, concept of empathy and understanding hasn't been seen since personal statement draft 6.
So granted I am one. But I think I'm an anomaly.
Is it just me or does communicating with fellow medical students leave you frustrated and annoyed?? Why is it that science people tend to criticize and overanalyze everything you do or say?? Or passive aggressively make statements that are supposed to irk you into a debate??
Ok, GUNNER I don't want to debate/argue/make a point for you. I don't want to talk to you and have you look at me as if you were looking through a magnifying glass.
Ugh and yet I have to see these people every day with their righteous, I'm better than GOD attitudes.
Does everyone in this profession have such an inflated ego??? I swear, I have not found one normal, uncritical person - everyone has that stupid "science" mentality and God forbid you misuse a verb.
Also, why do people act like they are high school freshmen? I mean, honestly - keg stands for God's sake?! rumors?! calling people odd if they don't attend these stupid parties where a ping pong ball gets tossed around into gross cups of stale cheap beer, or if they don't sleep with every other person in the class?? what is this?? how is this an f****** profession? and yet they feel that they have a right to judge you. ew. what am I doing here? why did I expect something else? I can't believe the route to becoming such an important figure in people's lives is paved with so much unnecessary bull****.
I'm glad to hear that there at least a couple other people like me in this profession. My classmates don't give me much hope. I can see them buying more and more into the culture of academic elitism every day.
We spent a lot of our first semester having to read research papers. I read them. I laughed. When I got to the end at saw upwards of 150 REFERENCES FOR A 5 PAGE PAPER, I laughed even harder. When I saw identical papers published by different people citing the same 150 references, it stopped being funny. Some of these papers have 30 different authors!!!!! 2 months in, I realized that these people, these scientists are writing papers and doing "research" solely in order to get published. The goal is to get your name on as many papers as possible, speak at as many conferences as possible, and get the most absurdly long c.v. as possible. It's a CONTEST. If you don't play the game, you get fired. Because you don't work for yourself. You're at the mercy of the program, and this is what the program wants.
Where does the meaningful **** actually get done? Private industry. But they don't tell us this. Private industry is the enemy. Capitalism is bad. Socialism is good, etc., etc., etc.
Two months in, first year students are already asking, "how do I get published?" "What kind of research do I have to do to get published?" "Can I get a publication over the summer?" Ad naseum...
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In high school and first couple of years of undergrad I lived at home..and my attitude was similar to the OPs. I thought - why are people doing keg stands and having a good time? Shouldn't we all be sipping wines and discussing Plato and dressing really formally and doing everything so properly?? hahaha....that's how I pictured things.
My fun was sports and books.
I then discovered some green stuff and realized there's a whole new world to University Life. the underground rap wannabes, the rock bands, the free love, the open bars.
Honestly buddy, I can appreciate hard work but go have a good time once in a while!! and don't ever talk about anything school related at a party. I used to go to parties in first year and say something like "that was an interesting forumla on the orgo test last night" while holding a beer in my hand. WTF was I thinking!!???~!!!
I blame living at home.
Get free man...have fun in this life, it is the only time you can!
My brother form another mother! (sorry if you're female, but sister doesn't rhyme with another or mother)
The Pan-scientific-savior theory is the biggest bill of good sold to suckers anywhere. Man. People can't even get jobs. Genomic medicine--the thing oft preached from our pulpit--is a pipe dream. A pharmaco-funded crack pipe dream.
Thing is. With the way the economy is headed your model might be the last one standing. Back to as-needed fee for service. There seem to be these springing up to meet demand. Just a doc and a subway system, making fee for service visits for people who need periodic medical care and cannot afford 1500 a month to support a vastly disproportionate herd of dying old people. HMO's, even non-profit ones seem tied to large employment contracts for sustainability. Having worked for one, the out of pocket paying customer was the anomaly. And loosing patients who lost their jobs was a daily thing.
This generation of graying scientists, riding their tenure trains into the sunset, having just been brought up through the absolute pinnacle of the American empire, and now getting off wanting to impart wild projections about the future of our career, are an evolutionarily dead end species. And their cold war inspired ideology of science saving the planet, outsmarting nature, and saving us from all that is unholy, is now the theater of the absurd.
I don't even have the heart to call them on it. I just wave and smile.
Medical academics is a thow-up-in-my-mouth experience for me too. I want a community residency and job. I am lucky enough to be at a school that is down tempo in it's hype of research-as-success model. But it's everywhere now. Everyone has Havard penis envy. And you make it through the ranks of academia in medicine by just exactly how much of this jizz you swallow. Whether your playing for the fresno mudhens or the MGH nerd-gangsters. And they in turn police the ranks for apprentices and successors. And we all get measured accordingly.
And that is what is so sickening sometimes. Competing against pricks to impress pricks on how much of a prick I am. On and on for the rest of my career.
Yeah. Medicine is a good gig. Studying it is fine. Even interesting at times. But the culture. Sucks. It's f@cking humorless.
I'm only uplifted by the fact that most are sold on the ideas of presitige which makes my job less glamorous. And therefore less stressful in obtaining.
(sorry. a little extra wind in my bag today.)
Everyone in your class cannot be like the people you described in the last paragraph. Med school is like any other group of people who forced to see each other a lot - the like minded ones usually gravitate towards each other. Try organizing stuff you like and inviting people to it.
Unless you think the keg standers will throw you under the bus on clinical rotations why do you care what they think of you?
What you are complaining about is more a Symptom of a larger problem with our generation and this country in general.
It's frustrating. I truly empathize with you but the fact that you are at a level of consciousness to where don't reflexively drink from the punch bowl spiked with meconium as the rest of the sheeple in it is reason for at least some self-congratulation.
Most of our peers are victim to the same petty bourgeoisie infantilization for the sake of mindless consumerism as everyone else in the irrationally rational society.
lmao I read this and was instantly reminded of the grad student pony-tailed dude in good will hunting who quotes Gordon Wood and attributes it to himself.
American kids don't grow up until they are in their 30's. It's pathetic and the men are just metrosexuals with no real balls.
The women are more manly than the men in most classes.
American kids don't grow up until they are in their 30's. It's pathetic and the men are just metrosexuals with no real balls.
The women are more manly than the men in most classes.
This made me laugh because I have been corrected for improper verb tense.
So granted I am one. But I think I'm an anomaly.
Is it just me or does communicating with fellow medical students leave you frustrated and annoyed?? Why is it that science people tend to criticize and overanalyze everything you do or say?? Or passive aggressively make statements that are supposed to irk you into a debate??
Ok, GUNNER I don't want to debate/argue/make a point for you. I don't want to talk to you and have you look at me as if you were looking through a magnifying glass.
Ugh and yet I have to see these people every day with their righteous, I'm better than GOD attitudes.
Does everyone in this profession have such an inflated ego??? I swear, I have not found one normal, uncritical person - everyone has that stupid "science" mentality and God forbid you misuse a verb.
Also, why do people act like they are high school freshmen? I mean, honestly - keg stands for God's sake?! rumors?! calling people odd if they don't attend these stupid parties where a ping pong ball gets tossed around into gross cups of stale cheap beer, or if they don't sleep with every other person in the class?? what is this?? how is this an f****** profession? and yet they feel that they have a right to judge you. ew. what am I doing here? why did I expect something else? I can't believe the route to becoming such an important figure in people's lives is paved with so much unnecessary bull****.
If you think you can´t stand 23 year olds in the U.S., imagine 17-18 year olds in Latin America, and being much older than these kids. I´m a dual national by marriage and decided to study medicine in my husband´s country. Here one starts medical school right after high school. In addition to being immature, these kids are lazy and ... dare I say it?... a bit stupid.
Most of the classes consist of group projects with the students giving Powerpoint presentations. In several of my classes, at least one of my group members showed **literally** fifteen minutes before the class, asked if the presentation was ready and just read from the Powerpoint slides that I and other group members had prepared.
In one of my classes, we had several students show up drunk. They arrange themselves in exams in order to be able to cheat off of other students. And, they brag about cheating. These are future doctors, ladies and gentleman!
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I'm sick of med students too, and here is the thing about this issue. I'm a med student. On paper you might think, hey, it will be so great hanging around all these other smart, unique people. Won't it be nice to spend time around people who are all pursuing a similar goal? The sense of camaraderie, etc. This is what I thought before starting med school. The reality is much different for me.
There is very much a stereotypical med student that I don't share much in common with. I really expected to encounter some dorky, interesting people in med school. Instead, there are a lot of people who are adept at looking good and socializing. People who are good at having a cool hair cut and finding a sweater to go over their matching collared shirt. I know this is a gross over-simplification but, it is something I notice.
Being in med school with 100 other people doing the exact same thing as me is BORING no matter how I approach it. It's not that I have anything specifically against any of my classmates. They're nice people. But they're med students. And on most days, the absolute last thing I want to do is talk to my classmates. If I do go to class, I pretty much keep to myself and sit in back.
So granted I am one. But I think I'm an anomaly.
Is it just me or does communicating with fellow medical students leave you frustrated and annoyed?? Why is it that science people tend to criticize and overanalyze everything you do or say?? Or passive aggressively make statements that are supposed to irk you into a debate??
Ok, GUNNER I don't want to debate/argue/make a point for you. I don't want to talk to you and have you look at me as if you were looking through a magnifying glass.
Ugh and yet I have to see these people every day with their righteous, I'm better than GOD attitudes.
Does everyone in this profession have such an inflated ego??? I swear, I have not found one normal, uncritical person - everyone has that stupid "science" mentality and God forbid you misuse a verb.
Also, why do people act like they are high school freshmen? I mean, honestly - keg stands for God's sake?! rumors?! calling people odd if they don't attend these stupid parties where a ping pong ball gets tossed around into gross cups of stale cheap beer, or if they don't sleep with every other person in the class?? what is this?? how is this an f****** profession? and yet they feel that they have a right to judge you. ew. what am I doing here? why did I expect something else? I can't believe the route to becoming such an important figure in people's lives is paved with so much unnecessary bull****.
I'm glad to hear that there at least a couple other people like me in this profession. My classmates don't give me much hope. I can see them buying more and more into the culture of academic elitism every day.
We spent a lot of our first semester having to read research papers. I read them. I laughed. When I got to the end at saw upwards of 150 REFERENCES FOR A 5 PAGE PAPER, I laughed even harder. When I saw identical papers published by different people citing the same 150 references, it stopped being funny. Some of these papers have 30 different authors!!!!! 2 months in, I realized that these people, these scientists are writing papers and doing "research" solely in order to get published. The goal is to get your name on as many papers as possible, speak at as many conferences as possible, and get the most absurdly long c.v. as possible. It's a CONTEST. If you don't play the game, you get fired. Because you don't work for yourself. You're at the mercy of the program, and this is what the program wants.
Where does the meaningful **** actually get done? Private industry. But they don't tell us this. Private industry is the enemy. Capitalism is bad. Socialism is good, etc., etc., etc.
Two months in, first year students are already asking, "how do I get published?" "What kind of research do I have to do to get published?" "Can I get a publication over the summer?" Ad naseum...
L
O
L
I'm sick of med students too, and here is the thing about this issue. I'm a med student. On paper you might think, hey, it will be so great hanging around all these other smart, unique people. Won't it be nice to spend time around people who are all pursuing a similar goal? The sense of camaraderie, etc. This is what I thought before starting med school. The reality is much different for me.
There is very much a stereotypical med student that I don't share much in common with. I really expected to encounter some dorky, interesting people in med school. Instead, there are a lot of people who are adept at looking good and socializing. People who are good at having a cool hair cut and finding a sweater to go over their matching collared shirt. I know this is a gross over-simplification but, it is something I notice.
Being in med school with 100 other people doing the exact same thing as me is BORING no matter how I approach it. It's not that I have anything specifically against any of my classmates. They're nice people. But they're med students. And on most days, the absolute last thing I want to do is talk to my classmates. If I do go to class, I pretty much keep to myself and sit in back.
Question: How do you hide a $100 from a pediatrician?Tachyon is right about orthopods.
Question: how do you hide a $100 bill from an orthopedic surgeon?
Answer: put it in a textbook.
Completely agree with this.If you think all the meaningful research is done in private industry then you are sadly mistaken. Sure there are some people who try to publish anything just to get their "numbers" up, but to generalize that to most academic work is wrong. A lot of time, even the stuff that ends up coming out of industry started in an academic lab funded by NIH grants. Academics have to do the early stuff because industry just isn't interested in developing it until you can show promise.
Hell, there was a recent mass cut of neuroscience research from big pharma because it just wasn't producing enough for their bottom line. Now they will just sit back and watch for anything promising to show up from academia and then license it.
I don't know what you are trying to say with your comments about capitalism and socialism. Academic research is far more like capitalism than socialism. It's cut throat competitive and no one is looking to give handouts.