If you had the opportunity to become a doctor would you take it over pharmacy?

[BigY]

If given an opportunity to go to medical school would y'all take it? What are some benefits of being a pharmacist? I'm starting to get cold feet with my career choice and wanted to hear your guyses opinion. This sub and r/Pharmacy on reddit is really depressing with everyone complaining about 70k salaries, can't find a job, poor working conditions, how much of this is true? If its that bad why do it at all, what is the reason for doing this career as opposed to medicine? What about a different ancillary career in healthcare like dental, PA, or nursing? If people are drawn solely due to chemistry, does that justify becoming a pharmacist perhaps we need to rethink how we decide in college.

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[Xenophylia]

It's all true. Wasn't always that way though, so the old timers (like me) have an excuse. I never wanted to be a physician. In my case, got a bio degree, and pharmacy seemed to be a way to build on that without wasting those 4 years. Most of my classmates wound up going to med school and bio was considered "pre med" back then. A bio degree then is much like what pharmacy is now- poor job prospects, low salaries. Read some of the doctor forums. Even med school isn't a sure bet anymore depending on what area you go into.

 

[mentos]

If given an opportunity to go to medical school would y'all take it? What are some benefits of being a pharmacist? I'm starting to get cold feet with my career choice and wanted to hear your guyses opinion. This sub and r/Pharmacy on reddit is really depressing with everyone complaining about 70k salaries, can't find a job, poor working conditions, how much of this is true? If its that bad why do it at all, what is the reason for doing this career as opposed to medicine? What about a different ancillary career in healthcare like dental, PA, or nursing? If people are drawn solely due to chemistry, does that justify becoming a pharmacist perhaps we need to rethink how we decide in college.

Yes it's all true. Do you hear these things about other careers? Naive prepharms think they'll get 6 figures cause they're incapable of doing a 5 second Google search. The majority of pharmacists don't use chemistry. They spend most of their time behind a monitor, let the computer check for interactions and make sure the pill in the bottle looks like the photo on the screen.

Dental, PA and nursing are excellent choices. Medicine is always good but not what it used to be, I hear many physicians say they would have done PA if it was around back in their day due to the time commitment and liability. Unless you become a specialist and make like 400k+ per year. But if you're in it for the money then skip the 8 years of school, 300k of student loans and get a comp sci degree at your state university then work at a FAANG company.

 

[PharmtoCS]

Depends on what you want in life.

If you want the best return on investment for your education, maximum lifetime earnings, and work life balance then probably computer science, engineering, or the trades.

Medicine is decent if you really do find it your calling. But I would not say that the amount of time spend in school, residency, and on the job are really worth the returns, but it is still in far better shape than pharmacy right now.

You said you "like chemistry," so why not become a chemist?

Even if you do find aspects of pharmacy to be your calling you will most likely never have the opportunity to use your education for such. You like chemistry? Sorry, you'll use very little of it in day to day practice. Like to "help people?" Nope, you won't be allotted the time and resources to do so, lest you fall way behind and get in trouble. And forget about it being anywhere close to a good monetary and time investment.

 

[Xenophylia]

At one time i would have also said being a physician gets you more respect as well. But as corporate takes over healthcare that isn't necessarily true. I hear many physicians complain about lack of respect from hospital management. Much like pharmacists are to retail bean counters, they're only seen as an extra expense these days.

 

[storyhill2]

There are still ways to have an enjoyable career in pharmacy. If you don't have a lot of location restrictions you can keep your eyes open and take advantage of opportunities that come up. I have always stuck to more rural areas and worked in small to medium sized hospitals. I am on my 3rd job in 12 years and I have enjoyed all of them. I never did a residency but I have been able to get jobs with out any problem at other hospitals. This is my experience. As far as going to medical school instead....right now the debt and income payback would still payoff for me but I am enjoying my life and wouldn't change it. I sometimes fill in at a retail pharmacy and I am glad for it because it makes me so glad I don't do that for a regular job. It is not enjoyable at all. I feel sorry for those pharmacists but some of them like it. If I was making the decision right now I would probably choose medical school, but I'm 12 years in and my experience helps me with future job prospects which I think is more difficult for pharmacists now. No residency for me. hope that helps.

 

[Xenophylia]

I've said it before. The only way to enjoy/ have peace of mind as a pharmacist is to be debt free and in the situation where you know you are not bound to the job. Sadly that only happens after MANY years of NOT being able to do that. Knowing that you can just walk away from the sh*tshow any time is the best feeling in the world. But it's not worth the journey by any means.

 

[Sine Cura]

I've said it before. The only way to enjoy/ have peace of mind as a pharmacist is to be debt free and in the situation where you know you are not bound to the job. Sadly that only happens after MANY years of NOT being able to do that. Knowing that you can just walk away from the sh*tshow any time is the best feeling in the world. But it's not worth the journey by any means.

I "enjoy" being an dingus and giving customers and sycophant DMs attitude (within reason. Don't slug or cuss out) only b/c IDGAF no debt anymore etc. The concept of a nice bougie retirement is completely bogus come 2050+ anyway

If you don't like it go somewhere else/find someone else and see how far you get (not very)

 

[grizzlesgrizzlies]

I've said it before. The only way to enjoy/ have peace of mind as a pharmacist is to be debt free and in the situation where you know you are not bound to the job. Sadly that only happens after MANY years of NOT being able to do that. Knowing that you can just walk away from the sh*tshow any time is the best feeling in the world. But it's not worth the journey by any means.

The other part of being debt free (lucky enough to speak from experience) is the temptation of pulling the trigger. I've been looking into other fields/careers as a backup option in case I lose my pharmacy job. The process is daunting but exciting at the same time!

For years I've been striving for FIRE because of the uncertainty of the pharmacist job market. Now that I'm basically at the point of lean FIRE, I've realized that I don't actually have the desire to retire retire, but just to retire from the pharmacy profession.

 

[StockPharmD2020]

Don't do pharmacy.

 

[projektreverb]

I feel like Medicine isn’t what it used to be 20 years ago. Then again neither is Pharmacy but Pharmacy has gone downhill way faster.

 

[PharmDwithAdream]

I've been a pharmacist for 6 years now and am currently finishing my first year of medical school. Thus far, I have no regrets in switching to medicine.

If you have a burning desire to become a pharmacist and don't see yourself doing anything else, then be a pharmacist. But if there is any inkling that you could see yourself enjoying and practicing as a physician, then go to medical school.

My rationale for going the MD route:

1) I was yearning to have more direct patient care.
2) I wanted to gain more and apply more clinical knowledge. I’ve worked side-by-side with physicians and medical residents and have been amazed at their knowledge base and practice of medicine.
3) I really wanted to gain the expertise in diagnosing and physically assessing patients and close the loop in medicine in such that not only would I know the pharmacotherapy to treating patients but also know how to prevent and diagnose illnesses.
4) Too often I felt I was on the sidelines or behind a computer and reading about what is happening with patients and not having the hands-on approach to treating patients with other healthcare professionals.
5) There is in fact an oversupply of pharmacists/competition for jobs. It seems to only be getting worse.
6) There is a decrease in pay/lack of bonuses for a majority of pharmacists.
7) There is a decrease in pharmacy technician staffing or support from pharmacy upper management. This is mostly in the retail pharmacy sector.
8) And there is an overwhelming lack of respect from patients and other healthcare professionals when practicing as a pharmacist.

*I want to disclose though that I do enjoy the knowledge and skills I did gain from my pharmacy schooling/residency/jobs. However, the real-life job that I had everyday as a pharmacist wasn't as satisfying or ideal as I had wanted it to be prior to becoming a pharmacist. Due to the aforementioned reasons stated from above that I came across while practicing as a pharmacist, I finally had the guts and willpower to make the leap to going to medical school.

 

[grizzlesgrizzlies]

I want to disclose though that I do enjoy the knowledge and skills I did gain from my pharmacy schooling/residency/jobs. However, the real-life job that I had everyday as a pharmacist wasn't as satisfying or ideal as I had wanted it to be prior to becoming a pharmacist. Due to the aforementioned reasons stated from above that I came across while practicing as a pharmacist, I finally had the guts and willpower to make the leap to going to medical school.

This is essentially the gist of why many pharmacists are unhappy with their careers. We were sold a false bill of goods in school and were trained for a job that doesn't readily exist. We weren't trained in school to work 12 hours straight standing up with no breaks, non-stop phone calls, and getting verbal abuse from the general public. Don't even get me started on working evenings/weekends and missing out of personal life events

 

[WorthlessOxygen]

This is essentially the gist of why many pharmacists are unhappy with their careers. We were sold a false bill of goods in school and were trained for a job that doesn't readily exist. We weren't trained in school to work 12 hours straight standing up with no breaks, non-stop phone calls, and getting verbal abuse from the general public. Don't even get me started on working evenings/weekends and missing out of personal life events

There was some decent overlap. For example, pharmacy school focused a lot on useless BS and now I have a DM who focuses on useless BS.

 

[CarpetTable45]

I feel like Medicine isn’t what it used to be 20 years ago. Then again neither is Pharmacy but Pharmacy has gone downhill way faster.

What you are seeing is healthcare's golden days coming to an end, due to costs finally coming under scrutiny. It basically had a blank check for a long time, but now that healthcare spending has been in the political spotlight and politicians are incentivized to show results, they are going to try and squeeze whoever they can.

Hence you see the political will to advance abilities for NPs/PAs/technicians/etc. The goal will be to reduce costs by reducing prices, and part of that will be accomplished by increasing the supply of labor.

I predict we will see tiered healthcare become the norm, like most other products and services. The more you pay, the higher the chance of getting a higher quality good. Managed Care Organizations (MCOs) will be well positioned for this tiering, who will direct people who pay more to MDs and DO down to NPs/PAs, etc.

This already existed, such as rich people buying "concierge medicine" poor people having to deal with Medicaid, but the new change is the 3rd to 8th income/wealth deciles will get to experience tiering. Healthcare workers probably had it the best (at least in terms of compensation) somewhere between 1980 and 2020, but the payers are going to get more discriminating and so it will be go big or go home. Doctors have to work for big groups, hospitals merge, MCOs get bigger, and everyone gets big in order to be able to negotiate (in desirable areas).

 

[DH1987]

I've said it before. The only way to enjoy/ have peace of mind as a pharmacist is to be debt free and in the situation where you know you are not bound to the job. Sadly that only happens after MANY years of NOT being able to do that. Knowing that you can just walk away from the sh*tshow any time is the best feeling in the world. But it's not worth the journey by any means.

Seems like this is true of any career these days. Modern capitalism at its finest.

 

[DoctorRx1986]

No, I would not pursue medicine or any career in the medical field at this point . Health care has turned for the worse in the US and corporate America has ruined the professions of pharmacy , medicine , and even dentistry . Health care professionals , including pharmacists and many MDs, are now nothing but employees working for some a******* in cheap suits and shoes telling you how you should run the show. Telling you this medication is not covered , this service is not covered , you’re not doing enough flu shots . A bunch of bean counters who have no medical background essentially coercing you into practicing with YOUR license as they see fit. Corporate America has infiltrated nearly every health care profession , especially pharmacy and dentistry . Medicine is experiencing the problem too and getting worse every year . And all for what ? In pharmacy $100-$120k BEFORE taxes to deal with all that bs ? And medicine ? Maybe $200-$225k a year before taxes after 4 years of college , 4 years of medical school , and say 3 years of residency for general /internal medicine . Not to mention the government regulations , 60 hour weeks , being on call , less autonomy . No thanks . I wouldn’t do it even if tuition were free . These days even on a $225k salary year in some of the more expensive cities in the US such as NYC, San Francisco , you’re really nothing special . So all that work to be overworked , overwhelmed, and abused the rest of your career ? Hell no . Don’t mention to me the specialist salaries with $300k-$600,000k a year because by the time you get there you’re probably approaching 40 years of age and the best years of your youth are gone . Medicine isn’t worth it at all . My grandfather is a physician and he will tell you to stay away . There are other ways to make $250k a year with less bs. In my opinion - stay away from pharmacy , medicine , and even dentistry (unless you’re willing to be in almost 3/4 of a million in debt to open up your dental practice because otherwise you’ll just end up a lowly employee working in corporate dentistry ). A big FU to corporate America . Detestable and wicked they are , that’s for sure .

 

[DH1987]

No, I would not pursue medicine or any career in the medical field at this point . Health care has turned for the worse in the US and corporate America has ruined the professions of pharmacy , medicine , and even dentistry . Health care professionals , including pharmacists and many MDs, are now nothing but employees working for some a******* in cheap suits and shoes telling you how you should run the show. Telling you this medication is not covered , this service is not covered , you’re not doing enough flu shots . A bunch of bean counters who have no medical background essentially coercing you into practicing with YOUR license as they see fit. Corporate America has infiltrated nearly every health care profession , especially pharmacy and dentistry . Medicine is experiencing the problem too and getting worse every year . And all for what ? In pharmacy $100-$120k BEFORE taxes to deal with all that bs ? And medicine ? Maybe $200-$225k a year before taxes after 4 years of college , 4 years of medical school , and say 3 years of residency for general /internal medicine . Not to mention the government regulations , 60 hour weeks , being on call , less autonomy . No thanks . I wouldn’t do it even if tuition were free . These days even on a $225k salary year in some of the more expensive cities in the US such as NYC, San Francisco , you’re really nothing special . So all that work to be overworked , overwhelmed, and abused the rest of your career ? Hell no . Don’t mention to me the specialist salaries with $300k-$600,000k a year because by the time you get there you’re probably approaching 40 years of age and the best years of your youth are gone . Medicine isn’t worth it at all . My grandfather is a physician and he will tell you to stay away . There are other ways to make $250k a year with less bs. In my opinion - stay away from pharmacy , medicine , and even dentistry (unless you’re willing to be in almost 3/4 of a million in debt to open up your dental practice because otherwise you’ll just end up a lowly employee working in corporate dentistry ). A big FU to corporate America . Detestable and wicked they are , that’s for sure .

Thanks for reminding me that I wasted my mid and late 20s and early 30s in a rat race.

 

[PharmtoCS]

Nope. I would have picked computer programming, IT, or the trades. Computer programming can pay as much as a PCP without the $300k+ loans and 7+ years spent in postgraduate training, not to mention the far cushier lifestyle.

 

[PharmBambi]

While I currently absolutely love what I do, I have friends who work in tech with zero loans, have the ultimate flexibility like work from home, take two hour lunch breaks (and get a workout in sometimes) AND earn significantly more than I do. One of my friends was a biology major that advanced with IT certifications. Honestly, my backup plan is tech. I also know someone who works three tech jobs and racks in $450k/year. Don't ask me how.

 

[alpha12]

While I currently absolutely love what I do, I have friends who work in tech with zero loans, have the ultimate flexibility like work from home, take two hour lunch breaks (and get a workout in sometimes) AND earn significantly more than I do. One of my friends was a biology major that advanced with IT certifications. Honestly, my backup plan is tech. I also know someone who works three tech jobs and racks in $450k/year. Don't ask me how.

Yep. It's easy to get into tech and make big bucks. Many companies don't even ask for degrees. Just the knowledge. It's a great career to get into.

 

[projektreverb]

NO.

 

[PharmtoCS]

Honestly, my backup plan is tech. I also know someone who works three tech jobs and racks in $450k/year. Don't ask me how.

My guess is that they work an average of around 15 hours per week at each job. Definitely possible in tech, especially if they are able to automate some processes.

There was also the employee who paid subcontractors (I think in China or India) to do his work for him as he collected a full salary.

 

[PharmDwithAdream]

Yes, I would have chosen medicine over pharmacy, especially with how things are now with pharmacy. Pharmacy is not like how it was 15 years ago.

 

[wreagle96]

If given an opportunity to go to medical school would y'all take it? What are some benefits of being a pharmacist? I'm starting to get cold feet with my career choice and wanted to hear your guyses opinion. This sub and r/Pharmacy on reddit is really depressing with everyone complaining about 70k salaries, can't find a job, poor working conditions, how much of this is true? If its that bad why do it at all, what is the reason for doing this career as opposed to medicine? What about a different ancillary career in healthcare like dental, PA, or nursing? If people are drawn solely due to chemistry, does that justify becoming a pharmacist perhaps we need to rethink how we decide in college.

Man, I find it hard to believe students are still choosing to go into pharmacy....

 

[RXDOC1986]

I would say NO! Never had any interest, aptitude or mental ability to go to med school. My sister chose to go to Med School, stayed the course after a BS in Biology, then an MS in microbiology she was finally accepted into a State University. Six years undergrad, 4 years Med School, 3 years Residency, she had a Family Practice Office with $200K + and huge headaches to go along with it. Finally sold out to a Hospital System, now making under $250K as an employee. I have been working as a Clinical/hospital Pharmacist full time and always another part-time job for 36 years.

Background - GA Pharmacist for 36 years - Pharm.D. with Residency (yes they had them in the Stone Age)-Home Infusion, Oncology, Hospital clinical/staffing background - kinda aged-out of a horrible metro-Atlanta job market(or maybe it's me!). My last hospital job, I was the oldest staff pharmacist by at least 10 years. They could hire 2 new grads, and they did, for what they were paying me. Been a travel pharmacist (in-state) for over a year now. Working @COVID only Hospital. And as of 2/28, a Staffing Hospital job at the largest Hospital system in GA. I get paid $74/hr plus evening/night/weekend differential. Work 7on/7off (work 70hrs, get paid for 80hrs). About $165,000/year. And I work a second job too. Combined, I still work less hours than my sister!

This has afforded me a VERY comfortable lifestyle. A nice home (better than my sister's), nice cars-paid for, put two kids through college with no loans, enough money to retire tomorrow if I wanted!
Would I do it again, yes (if back in 1982). Nowadays, everybody is correct, I wouldn't pick pharmacy OR Medicine. Our profession is not going downhill, it's fallen off a cliff. Just say no to pharmacy and medicine. Take option C, computers, IT, programming, etc.

 

[grumpyRph]

This is essentially the gist of why many pharmacists are unhappy with their careers. We were sold a false bill of goods in school and were trained for a job that doesn't readily exist. We weren't trained in school to work 12 hours straight standing up with no breaks, non-stop phone calls, and getting verbal abuse from the general public. Don't even get me started on working evenings/weekends and missing out of personal life events

ugh thanks for saying this. this is what i try to tell my friends all the time. especially the don't even get me started part. and you know what, the pandemic has made this 10000x worse because now all my peers outside of health care have so much flexibility and free time with wfh. oye.

 

[grumpyRph]

No, I would not pursue medicine or any career in the medical field at this point . Health care has turned for the worse in the US and corporate America has ruined the professions of pharmacy , medicine , and even dentistry . Health care professionals , including pharmacists and many MDs, are now nothing but employees working for some a******* in cheap suits and shoes telling you how you should run the show. Telling you this medication is not covered , this service is not covered , you’re not doing enough flu shots . A bunch of bean counters who have no medical background essentially coercing you into practicing with YOUR license as they see fit. Corporate America has infiltrated nearly every health care profession , especially pharmacy and dentistry . Medicine is experiencing the problem too and getting worse every year . And all for what ? In pharmacy $100-$120k BEFORE taxes to deal with all that bs ? And medicine ? Maybe $200-$225k a year before taxes after 4 years of college , 4 years of medical school , and say 3 years of residency for general /internal medicine . Not to mention the government regulations , 60 hour weeks , being on call , less autonomy . No thanks . I wouldn’t do it even if tuition were free . These days even on a $225k salary year in some of the more expensive cities in the US such as NYC, San Francisco , you’re really nothing special . So all that work to be overworked , overwhelmed, and abused the rest of your career ? Hell no . Don’t mention to me the specialist salaries with $300k-$600,000k a year because by the time you get there you’re probably approaching 40 years of age and the best years of your youth are gone . Medicine isn’t worth it at all . My grandfather is a physician and he will tell you to stay away . There are other ways to make $250k a year with less bs. In my opinion - stay away from pharmacy , medicine , and even dentistry (unless you’re willing to be in almost 3/4 of a million in debt to open up your dental practice because otherwise you’ll just end up a lowly employee working in corporate dentistry ). A big FU to corporate America . Detestable and wicked they are , that’s for sure .

beautiful.

 

[vm26]

Good discussion...I went from PT to MD (specialist). As of now I am extremely content with the decision...Current unfortunate state of being a pharmacist is a result of total take-over by CVS et al coupled with vast expansion of programs in the late 90's/early 2000's. Seems like a rough gig-pharmacists I see at CVS/Walgreens etc are clearly overly burdened by ridiculous job demands...Personally I can't think of any other field where I'd be making anywhere near what I do as a physician, have similar vacation time & stress levels, and retirement benefits etc, given my intellect/intelligence but maybe others could do better...Interestingly I was told in the early 90's not to go into medicine as the sky was falling (hence the PT detour) yet things are still pretty good. As Yogi Berri said “It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future.”

 

[phamlife]

If given an opportunity to go to medical school would y'all take it? What are some benefits of being a pharmacist? I'm starting to get cold feet with my career choice and wanted to hear your guyses opinion. This sub and r/Pharmacy on reddit is really depressing with everyone complaining about 70k salaries, can't find a job, poor working conditions, how much of this is true? If its that bad why do it at all, what is the reason for doing this career as opposed to medicine? What about a different ancillary career in healthcare like dental, PA, or nursing? If people are drawn solely due to chemistry, does that justify becoming a pharmacist perhaps we need to rethink how we decide in college.

Im still considering lol

I kid.

Actually, I would start a side hustle of you had the time and energy to go to med school. There are so many franchises out there where you can keep your current job and still run your business as an absentee owner.

 

[grumpyRph]

Im still considering lol

I kid.

Actually, I would start a side hustle of you had the time and energy to go to med school. There are so many franchises out there where you can keep your current job and still run your business as an absentee owner.

such as?

 

[phamlife]

such as?

There are so many. You can research them online and see which one fits you the best. I cant tell you what i started but my side income from the franchise i started is catching up with my pharmacist income.