internship at the AMC, nyc?

[hopefulvet21]

I was wondering if anyone could tell me how hard it is to get an internship or residency at the AMC in New York? Are all internships equally hard to get? Or would a well known one like the AMC have a lot more applicants?

I am concerned because I am probably going to vet school abroad (an AVMA accredited school for sure) and will not have things like class rank or GPA on my application since grading is done differently there. I know that great LORs, class rank, and grades are highly valued in an internship application, so would not having certain stats rule me out of getting an interview? Are applicants from certain schools considered better at all? How many applicants typically apply to these internships? If the school I choose is likely to have a negative effect on my future application for internships/residencies, then I think I would have to reconsider my choice of vet school...

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[alliecat44]

AMC is definitely considered one of the most competitive internships out there. I don't think anybody really knows for sure how many folks apply/are matched to any specific internship, since the ranking/matching system is so complicated. However, it is one of the few private practices whose internship is regarded at an equivalent level to an academic institution.

That said, your school is AVMA accredited. Even though it doesn't publish things like class rank, etc, you *should* have just as much a shot at an internshp there as anyone at a stateside school. It's considered equivalent and I'm sure they're used to looking at international applicants. (This is barring any sort of personal political agenda on the part of the internship committee, but let's hope there's a minimum of that!) Letters of recommendation are weighted pretty heavily by institutions offering internships, so focus on those and other things. With a competitive-for-internship GPA of around a 3.5, you should be a competitive applicant!

Of course, you could always call them and ask to speak to the intern coordinator and ask what their selection process is like, how they evaluate the academic performance of internationally-educated veterinarians, etc.

congrats and good luck!!!

 

[david594]

However, it is one of the few private practices whose internship is regarded at an equivalent level to an academic institution.

Huh, so are you saying that academic internships are generally considered to be the best out there?

Any thoughts on how the MSPCA's internship program stacks up?

 

[alliecat44]

Historically, Angell and AMC are the two most highly-regarded private practice internships (and both notorious for having their interns go through even more hell than many interns--but coming out really strong). I'm tentatively planning on applying to both, too.

David, academic internships in general are regarded more highly. Their programs are more structured and have been around a lot longer. Unlike residency programs, there is no official criteria (like number of specialists, how much emergency duty, journal club, rounds presentations, etc) for institutions offering internships. (Your GP down the road with no specialists could offer an "internship"--not quite the same--or a private referral hospital could offer an internship, use you as slave labor for the emergency service and give you almost no mentorship on your departmental rotations).

In my understanding, there are a few private practice internships that are now becoming more highly regarded, but percentage-wise, most folks in the community don't know a whole lot about the quality of most private practice internships out there. Does that make sense? Angell and AMC are sort of the gold standard in private practice internships. (Their programs have also been around for quite a while!)

 

[hopefulvet21]

thanks alliecat. I also noticed that the interns listed on the AMC website are from all different schools. There were two from Ross and one from RVC out of about 15 interns, so I guess it won't be a problem (thanks rachroo!). I also noticed that under their CV's for postgraduate work/research, all of them were straight out of vet school. Is it not beneficial to work for a year or two before applying to an internship? Is there a reason why they might all have pursued an internship right away?

 

[alliecat44]

Usually, people do an internship straight out of vet school. However, some choose to go into practice and then change their mind and puruse an internship.

You do an internship for one of two reasons: either in preparation for a residency, or to get extra experience/knowledge before jumping into practice. So, if you know you want to do a residency, the typical thing is to do an internship right out of school. Some people change their mind about specializing after being out for a few years, and some people just don't feel as confident jumping in to practice.

The vast majority of interns nationwide are fresh out of school/new graduates, though anybody can "go back" and do their internship (it's great training!).

 

[runnerDC]

For those who choose to do an internship, it seems typical to go that route right out of vet school.

I'm not sure there is any benefit to working for a year or two and then applying for an internship, unless you could not get an internship (e.g. did not match to one and could not obtain one through the post-match clearinghouse) and/or have career goals for which an internship could be seen as beneficial (e.g. residency in one of the specialties). These are generalities, of course, as there are many ways to go about achieving your career goals, whatever they may be.

thanks alliecat. I also noticed that the interns listed on the AMC website are from all different schools. There were two from Ross and one from RVC out of about 15 interns, so I guess it won't be a problem (thanks rachroo!). I also noticed that under their CV's for postgraduate work/research, all of them were straight out of vet school. Is it not beneficial to work for a year or two before applying to an internship? Is there a reason why they might all have pursued an internship right away?

 

[rachroo]

(thanks rachroo!)

No problem!

If anyone else is interested: http://www.amcny.org/doctor/staffDirectory.aspx

 

[2quick]

Not all academic and not all private practice internships are created equal, therefore it's important to do your research regarding every program you apply to.

Where you'll rank is also very much dependent on what your goals are following the internship...are you looking to see a high caseload prior to entering GP/Emergency practice? Want to do a residency? A residency in which field? How much primary case responsibility will you have / do you want? etc...
Obviously, if you want to see a ton of cases, going to a university that sees a few thousand a year vs. a private practice that sees 50,000/yr is not the right choice. But if you want to participate in research, teach students, pursue an academic residency, etc... academia would be a good fit.

I'll be completing an internship next year- If anyone wants more info, please PM me and I can comment on programs, the process, etc...

I also used to work at AMC and have recently externed there, so I can answer more specific questions about this hospital.

 

[DocDVMD]

Do you think having prior experience (and extremely positive feedback) being a volunteer and then employee at the AMC (or any other vet hospital for that matter) would increase your chances of getting an internship or residency there?

 

[hopefulvet21]

when I contacted them they said to try and do an externship there so they can get to know you better. If you have crap LORs and grades, then I don't think it makes a difference, but if they know you and you are also a very good applicant, then yes, I would think so.

 

[chris03333]

when I contacted them they said to try and do an externship there so they can get to know you better. If you have crap LORs and grades, then I don't think it makes a difference, but if they know you and you are also a very good applicant, then yes, I would think so.

As internships become your home for a year, you should do an externship at ANY of the large private ones if you think you want to apply. Only then will you know for sure if you want to do that intense of an internship.

 

[KittyRex]

As internships become your home for a year, you should do an externship at ANY of the large private ones if you think you want to apply. Only then will you know for sure if you want to do that intense of an internship.

Are large private hospital internships generally thought of as being more intense than academic internships???

 

[chris03333]

Are large private hospital internships generally thought of as being more intense than academic internships???

AMC and Angell are notorious for it.

 

[david594]

AMC and Angell are notorious for it.

And if you talk to older Angell interns they will tell you that the current internships are nothing compared to back in the day.

One was telling me there was some sort of intern rebellion in the late 70's in order to get more reasonable hours.

 

[GoldensForever]

After going through the match for internship and residency... I can honestly say that WHO you know plays a big part in the match. That is one of the big reasons why academic internships are so valuable. The academic community is small and connections open a lot of doors for you.

It also puts you in a place to do research, which almost everyone has now... you almost have to have a publication in the works to get in somewhere for residency. Academic places want people who are interested in research and show interest in furthering the profession. And people who are in academia are perceived as more likely to stay in academia than people coming from private practices.

So while there are many good quality private practice internships, the private practice residencies often take their own or people who have done second internships. Academic residencies are more numerous (not like there are a lot anyway) and are more likely to take people from academic institutions. That's not a hard and fast rule but if you're playing the odds, an academic internship will definitely help you out.

 

[Nexx]

There's a couple good reads on VIN with regard to internships/residencies although they are a bit dated now (2-3 years old) and at least two of the 'online rounds' has a bit of conflicting info occasionally.

What the one source said with regards to their specific uni is that to choose an applicant for an internship (probably able to extrapolate that this is similar for other schools) they look at the following (in rough order of rank): Good references, Diverse experience (leadership, research, papers, talking), Grades (good, not great needed), personal knowledge of the candidate, a good personal statement, and no "red flags"
(source: http://www.vin.com/Members/CMS/Rounds/default.aspx?id=766)

So yeah, a bit of who you know and what you've done can certainly make your more competitive. Heck, that seems to happen everywhere in vet med!