Just wondering if anyone knows how the schools compare to each other? Applied to RCSI, UCC, and UCD grad programs, got an interview with RCSI and waiting to hear from UCC and UCD.
Irish med school rankings
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i also got an interview from RCSI, and in about a day after my application was complete (a bit suspicious i think?!). Does everyone get an interview there?
in any case, from what i hear around the forums, all the schools have pretty much the same level of standards and are looked at the same. in some cases i've seen Trinity and RCSI mentioned as "recognized", but i think its all the same. i tried finding stats on irish and other european medical schools, all i found was a list that dated back about 5-7 years ago and it had Trinity college, the only Irish school in the top 50 european medical schools, cant remember the link, when i find it, ill post it.
I hope that answers your question.
I'd also like to ask, since this thread is here for the new year, have things changed in Irish medical schools over the years? i've been reading a lot of conflicting things about Irish medical schools, some good things and bad things. Mainly i would like to know how much hands on is the education at RCSI, or any medical school in Ireland. From what i hear, they dont let you practice medicine directly for the patients, instead your instructed to just watch. is it true?
in any case, from what i hear around the forums, all the schools have pretty much the same level of standards and are looked at the same. in some cases i've seen Trinity and RCSI mentioned as "recognized", but i think its all the same. i tried finding stats on irish and other european medical schools, all i found was a list that dated back about 5-7 years ago and it had Trinity college, the only Irish school in the top 50 european medical schools, cant remember the link, when i find it, ill post it.
I hope that answers your question.
I'd also like to ask, since this thread is here for the new year, have things changed in Irish medical schools over the years? i've been reading a lot of conflicting things about Irish medical schools, some good things and bad things. Mainly i would like to know how much hands on is the education at RCSI, or any medical school in Ireland. From what i hear, they dont let you practice medicine directly for the patients, instead your instructed to just watch. is it true?
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They are all roughly the same. Galway, Cork and UCD are all National University of Ireland schools, so the standards are pretty similar. Limerick and RCSI are both private schools, Trinity is an entity unto itself. In terms of North American recognition, the only one anyone has reliably heard of is Trinity, but in general the Irish schools are well regarded.
As for the good side/bad side, everyone has their own opinion about how medicine is currently being taught in Ireland. Having been home as a resident for 18 months now, and having just finished a very challenging CCU rotation, I feel comfortable in stating that yes, you won't know everything when you graduate but yes, you will learn just like everyone else. Everyone coming from med school has holes in their knowledge base and their ability with hands on procedures but you will all learn. I had a great time in Ireland, had a very relaxed time in med school with lots of time to travel, get to know people outside of medicine and generally have a life. I have passed all my resident rotations with flying colours and am being actively recruited to work in emerg in my home hospital (from my family medicine residency). I have no regrets about going to Ireland and think in the long run it was a better fit for me than any of the schools in Canada would have been. Just my 2 cents worth. Cheers,
M
congrats 2 narro and heyjoe for ur interviews! I applied to UCD, UCC, RCSI, and UL. So far, I've gotten an interview at RCSI in two weeks.
I'm also a little concerned that they just hand out interviews to everyone. Irish medical schools are notorious for having very extensive waiting lists. I think its because so many North American students keep their acceptances to Irish schools as back-ups. Also, I believe RCSI is the least desirable of the Irish schools.
I wanted to know what you guys' stats r like and what is your school of choice? I have 3.4 overall with a MCAT 28P (9 PS, 10 BS, 9 V) and I'd like to go to UCC.
I'm also a little concerned that they just hand out interviews to everyone. Irish medical schools are notorious for having very extensive waiting lists. I think its because so many North American students keep their acceptances to Irish schools as back-ups. Also, I believe RCSI is the least desirable of the Irish schools.
I wanted to know what you guys' stats r like and what is your school of choice? I have 3.4 overall with a MCAT 28P (9 PS, 10 BS, 9 V) and I'd like to go to UCC.
D
deleted21609
I would say that Trinity is the most and UCC the least desirable.
I wouldn't necessarily say that. I'm an Irish med student in Ireland, and I can really only speak for the Dublin med schools (they're the ones I looked into most when applying).
TCD is the most sought after because of the prestige of the University (and well-deserved too). However, the health sciences department is not exceptional. UCD and RCSI are generally acknowledged to have a slight edge over TCD and are broadly equivalent, with RCSI in particular making major improvements in recent years and UCD building an entire new health sciences building. However, for the most part, in Ireland med school quality is broadly similar across the different schools. From talking to people who recently graduated from TCD, they said they were a bit disappointed with it, considering it's reputation. But, as they hadn't experienced other med schools, they had nothing to compare it to; they just thought the other med school graduates were better prepared. However, it could be that they thought the grass is greener on the other side! I haven't heard any graduates say many bad things about UCD or RCSI however.
They still teach in old fashioned subjects-based method (i.e. individual biochem. anatomy etc.), while UCD and RCSI both teach in a systems-based method (e.g Cardiovascular, Genitourinary etc.)
The teaching hospitals for the three med schools are all fairly equivalent, and amongst the largest in the country. A major difference is that in TCD and UCD you are based on campus for the first 3 years, and then on rotation for the other 2, while in RCSI you are on campus for 1.5 years, in Beaumont Hospital for 1.5 years and then on rotation for 2 years.
In terms of curricula, TCD only has a 5 year programme, RCSI has both 5 and 6 year, but most people do 5 year, and UCD has 5 and 6 year, but most do 6 year. The first year being pre-med naturally enough.
Bear in mind I can only speak from an Irish student's perspective. However, I more than exceeded the requirement to get into any of the Irish med schools (in the CAO system) and I chose RCSI after looking in depth into all the colleges. IMO it had the best laid out programme and, from the Irish grads I talked to, the best feedback. However, this was my personal taste, and different people prefer different things!
The take home message is, in Ireland the difference between med schools isn't on the scale of Harvard v. a small US uni., or Cambridge v. Bristol. They are, by and large, fairly equivalent.
they now have 4 year programs as well i believe.
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Hmm, i wouldn't really go calling a certain school out as "top" and another as "bottom." Honestly, each school offers good teaching and has their strengths and weaknesses. There isn't a school where if you graduate from there, people will think "oh awesome, he/she must be spectacular" and there isn't a school where people think "oh god, he/she must be a horrible doctor." Ireland does not have a ranking system. Typically among irish students, Trinity requires the highest number of leaving cert points and offers the least number of honors upon graduation. But that doesn't say anything about the standard of doctors it produces, and each facility has fantastic graduates as well as some who probably should not become doctors. I've met great students and great people from all facilities - even though I am outside of Ireland and practicing now, I still encounter graduates from most of the schools.
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Does anyone know how many students are interviewed at RCSI and how many actually get in? I'm hearing conflicting stories that if you have an interview and are normal, you will get in. On the other hand, it seems a lot of people are being interviewed?
Anyone know?
Anyone know?
I'd like to know the same thing. My assumption, like I stated in a previous post, was that they probably interview most if not all applicants. I know that most middle tier American schools usually accept 1/4- 1/2 of their interviewed students. Does anyone have any idea?
talking to Peter Nealon, the guy you schedule the interview with, he said that they ask 1:7 for interview and typically accept around 50%., this was for this round, 2010. pretty high chance of acceptance i think. and all i hear is people getting interviews from RCSI, i have only heard of one person complaining about not getting an interview from there, but it does seem that everyone gets an interview there.
the reason i think they accept so many people is because when march roles around, they send out letters of acceptances and ask you to reserve your seats, cuz they're 'filling fast', by throwing in a deposit of about $7000, or so i was told. i can imagine this throws some people off, considering that you still havent heard back from other schools yet. so some will reserve there spots, others will wait to hear from other schools and likely miss their chances at RCSI.
the reason i think they accept so many people is because when march roles around, they send out letters of acceptances and ask you to reserve your seats, cuz they're 'filling fast', by throwing in a deposit of about $7000, or so i was told. i can imagine this throws some people off, considering that you still havent heard back from other schools yet. so some will reserve there spots, others will wait to hear from other schools and likely miss their chances at RCSI.
hey leorl,
what are you doing these days, i see posts of you dating back to 2000. where are you practicing now? if you dont want to share on the forum, message me or something, im curious and might have some follow up questions.
what are you doing these days, i see posts of you dating back to 2000. where are you practicing now? if you dont want to share on the forum, message me or something, im curious and might have some follow up questions.
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I was reading another thread which mentioned that if you get an interview, you're pretty much in and that they just wanted to know that you are sane.
However, 50% sounds pretty low to me. I hope they don't make us reserve seats for RCSI BEFORE we hear from the other ireland schools. 7000 deposit? Geeezzz....
However, 50% sounds pretty low to me. I hope they don't make us reserve seats for RCSI BEFORE we hear from the other ireland schools. 7000 deposit? Geeezzz....
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Hey there, I'm now more than halfway through a US EM residency (based in NYC). I don't message as much as I used to just because I've got less time, but still try to do a bit! 
. I go back to Dublin nearly once a year anyway so still have a lot of great friends / contacts there. Any questions, feel free to ask.
. I go back to Dublin nearly once a year anyway so still have a lot of great friends / contacts there. Any questions, feel free to ask. 
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How did you got your request for an interview--e-mail, regular mail? Also, if you don't mind, could you share your stats?
Good luck!!
trinity is ranked in the top 50 overall as a school not as a medical school
talking to trinity students they seem to have a pretty poor view of the colleges teaching i.e. if your having trouble they don't want to know. Most Irish medical schools will start off with you doing things like taking a patient history, by the end of the course you should be able to do all the basic clinical things like patient exams i.e. neurological, abdominal, cardiorespiratory as well as putting in cannulas and taking bloods. overall thought trinity and RCSI would be the most widely known but the ogther colleges have graduates all over the world so they are not unknown
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I wouldn't really go so far as to say that. I thnk students in each college feel this may be a problem, because it isn't the Irish way of education to spoon feed. You definitely have to be self-motivated and disciplined, and this can be difficult. This also may be a disadvantage for people who don't have good command of English. Of the North Americans who ran into trouble, I remember the Trinity profs actually being pretty accomodating in trying to help, and the issue was trouble understanding fundamental basic science concepts (ie. couldn't even explain a cell lipid bilayer... ) . Final year of medical school I definitely knew way more than I do now, a nice case of "if you don't use it you lose it." I wasn't the most diligent student, I was captain of the boat club and trained 20+ hours a week all throughout med school and still managed to do fine.
How did you got your request for an interview--e-mail, regular mail? Also, if you don't mind, could you share your stats?
Good luck!!
I realize this is a bit late, but i'll answer anyway. I heard by email that RCSI wanted to give me an interview and that I should call Peter Nealon at the phone number provided to schedule an interview. The interview was in NY at the Hilton I believe. Unfortunately though I never made it to NY because of the horrible weather systems there, no flights were going into NY at the time. I called the ABP and scheduled an over the phone interview with RCSI. I ended up getting all my money back from the airlines and stayed for a week at my sister in laws house in chicago for free (I like free trips).
The interview went well, they asked basic questions: Are you familiar with our curriculum, Why Ireland, Why RCSI, Tell us a weakness/ strength about yourself, What do you like to do in your spare time, and some other things that I cant remember this far in time. the issue of cost came up in our discussions, but it was brief. There were three people interviewing me, and I was asked questions by each, although I know others who had been asked by only one. I dont recall their names, but I do remember Dr. Johnson only because he seemed less restricted in his voice, more down to earth, although the other interviewers seemed pretty relaxed and fun to talk to as well.
As far as stats go:
Major: Molecular Biology
GPA: 3.60
MCAT:28M (I know, It sucks)
Applied: RCSI, UCC, UCD, Trinity, Limerick, NUIG
Accepted: RCSI, waiting on others
Rejected: Trinity (probably because of MCAT, but who knows)
Comments: I know earlier I posted that the deposit for RCSI was about $7000 USD, its more like $8800 USD after conversion from EUR. and apparently (I didnt know this) they give you 21 days to wire the deposit and send proof of wiring to ABP, then they require full years tuition by Aug 1st, so be prepared for that. Though talking to other med students in america, it seems they kind of do the same thing (after the first year deposit, its by semester).
Because I thought it was too much and I still hadnt heard back from the other schools, I told ABP I was not going to accept the offer. now Im waiting on UCC and UCD, my top school choices so far.
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Narro.... Are you sure its a good idea to decline an offer without having an acceptance at the other schools first? There is one guy who mentioned earlier that theres only a 10% chance of getting off the wait list for UCD if you are on it, and I think Cork accepts only 20 North American students and they've already gone through several rounds of offers. I'm not saying you won't get an acceptance into these other schools...who knows this admissions process is random. However, it might be safe for you to give the deposit and secure a spot just in case the worst case scenario happens. Students in the past have gotten accepted only into RCSI and not the others so what you are doing is a bit of a gamble.
RCSI is a pretty good school with 100% match rate. The other school have good match rates, but not 100%. The applicants that the schools find competitive get multiple offers during the earlier rounds and the less competitive get single offers at a time or have to wait for the later rounds. I'm not saying you should go to RCSI if you get into the other schools, but I are underestimating the competitiveness of medical school admissions and declining an offer without a backup is a risk.
RCSI is a pretty good school with 100% match rate. The other school have good match rates, but not 100%. The applicants that the schools find competitive get multiple offers during the earlier rounds and the less competitive get single offers at a time or have to wait for the later rounds. I'm not saying you should go to RCSI if you get into the other schools, but I are underestimating the competitiveness of medical school admissions and declining an offer without a backup is a risk.
QFT. Declining med offers, if it's what you really want to do, is a bad idea with out a back up.
Thanks for your concerns guys, but there are a few other reasons why I chose not to go to that school which I will not divulge here. I do have back up plans and I am aware of the risks of rejecting that offer. I will say this though, I wouldnt recommend anyone else do it, it is a big risk (seeing how everything seems to be up to chance in these admissions processes).
RCSI is a good school, but I dont know about that "100% match" business, show me a reference other than RCSI propaganda, then maybe Ill believe it. A match is based off of how hard you work and how well you discipline yourself. Statistics, in this case, just make people feel better about themselves, but in the end it comes down to how much you want it and how far your willing to go to get it. 100% match, 80% match, 30%, whatever, as long as you werent counted in that statistic, it doesnt represent you and your chances. keep that one in mind.
I am also aware that Cork has already sent out their offers to people, but I also know that there will be another review of applicants. And there are other schools besides Cork as well, we just have to wait and see. In the slight chance I dont get into medical school this year, there's always plan B and C.
In the end, Im not worried, so please don't worry for me, but thanks for your concerns, its greatly appreciated. I'll keep you guys updated on my stats, k.
In an effort to bring this thread back to topic, I figured I'd share this site with you guys. its the 2009 world rankings, it has the Irish schools as well and its fairly recent. However, keep in mind that these are the University rankings, not specific to medical school rankings (this is why RCSI is not on here), but still something.
http://www.topuniversities.com/university-rankings/world-university-rankings/2009/results
Trinity
UCD
UCC
NUIG
UL
http://www.topuniversities.com/university-rankings/world-university-rankings/2009/results
Trinity
UCD
UCC
NUIG
UL
There is a fairly tenuous link between these university rankings and how good a med school is. For instance, although Trinity is the top ranking university, other medical schools in the country, such as UCD, would be considered "better" in terms of teaching quality, systems-based modules etc.
In addition, everything is relatively well regulated here so the quality is pretty high in every school.
Ah a conspiracy theorist! You'll fit in very well in med school.
To reiterate (because when I started I almost turned down Ireland because of the negative BS on SD), that's the real stat. It'll be up on the CIMSA website, with a map of where student's matched, as soon as we get some time after exams. Unfortunately, CaRMS has never put out a breakdown of successful IMG matches by medical school and probably isn't going to for the forseeable future. So there's no more information coming. I can tell you that due to the dubious information available on these forums (and the quality of the negative information is much worse than the positive) that no administrator from any of the Irish schools would deign to post here. Considering the other options they have for publishing information, what would be the point?
The only people who post on here are students; who all have limited information. As a rule of thumb, I tend to trust people trying to help as opposed to those who are venting off their various gripes.
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I completely agree, which is why I added, "keep in mind that these are the University rankings, not specific to medical school rankings". I just had no other source that compared medical school ranking and I have been looking for some time now for it. this is as close as I could get to any rankings in an effort to bring the thread back to topic.
Im no conspiracy theorist, but I am a scientists and i do like to have supportable facts. It was unclear to me where that information came from, and if it came from RCSI, well then it holds less meaning, at least for me. Id rather see it from a reputable third party statement.
In any case, what are the websites you were refering to jnuts, CIMSA website and CaRMS?
Agreed.
To be fair, you used the word "propaganda" which certainly denotes some type of wide-spread intentional effort to deceive. As a sidebar, RCSI has always had competitive admissions and really has no reason to deceive you. The school's been producing world renowned surgeons (and more recently medics) since 1784; its far from a Carribean diploma mill.
Out of curiosity, why do you distrust information from RCSI? I'm a current student and I've never met anyone who's said that the college misled them prior to admission. There have been miscommunications, but nothing major and certainly no more than any other college I've attended or worked with.
CIMSA is the Canadian Irish Medical Student Student Association (www.cimsa.ie) [full disclosure: I'm affiliated with CIMSA]
CaRMS is the Canadian Residency Matching Service (www.carms.ca)
Another resource you might find useful is the www.caper.ca which collects statistics on post-graduate training in Canada.
Any Canadian looking for info about matching after Ireland should start at those three organizations.
All of this is irrelevant if you're not Canadian. The American stats are just as good (if not better) from RCSI but the American Medical Student Association doesn't tend to put up as much info. Nor does the American Residency Matching Service for that matter.
I'm sure those data are out there somewhere, but I'm not American and have no intention of training there so I really don't keep tabs on it.
Regardless, the 100% match rate thrown around was actually a number that the Canadian Medical Student Association and the American Medical Student Association collected independantly from the college. It is something that we're all very proud of.
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I did not mean Propaganda in a negative connotation, but I understand how it can be misleading. I guess I really meant "media".
I dont distrust RCSI, nor do i feel misled in any way. I just feel that information directly from a school about itself holds less wieght than information from a reputable third party. every school wants to look good, and thats not a bad thing, but im more interested in what others say (in addition to what the schools say). I dont distrust RCSI at all, they are definately a fine institution with very good match areas. In fact I would have wanted to go there, but as i've mentioned earlier, there were many reasons for me declining the offer.
this is a problem for students wanting to go to international schools, I wish they'd help out by putting up some kind of data on the issue. I know there arent really a lot of american students in Ireland, or at least they are overshadowed by the number of canadian students, and this affects how any match statistic can be interpreted (i.e. too small of a population size, n).
As you should be, great stuff and congrats to you guys.
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Sorry Narro, might have torn a little into you there. I guess I've been doing a lot more defence on these forums recently and that has me on edge.
Plus, exams starting next week might be contributing to some free-floating anxiety.
Apologies!
Plus, exams starting next week might be contributing to some free-floating anxiety.
Apologies!
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"RCSI is a good school, but I dont know about that "100% match" business, show me a reference other than RCSI propaganda, then maybe Ill believe it. A match is based off of how hard you work and how well you discipline yourself. Statistics, in this case, just make people feel better about themselves, but in the end it comes down to how much you want it and how far your willing to go to get it. 100% match, 80% match, 30%, whatever, as long as you werent counted in that statistic, it doesnt represent you and your chances. keep that one in mind."
Just to clarify, that 100% wasn't ever given by RCSI. They are a reputable school with a long list of applicants with limited spaces and there is no need for them to spread misinformation. Its true that you work hard you can go far, but anyone who has gone through the entire process will tell you life isn't always fair and who you know, how much money you have, and where you went to school will influence on how you get matched. If you want to get matched at John Hopkins, its a FARR easier route if you've studied there first as opposed to if you went to a school overseas. I know a lot of foreign doctors who just can't land a residency spot in Canada yet they are some of the most brilliant people I know. All of the Irish schools seem to do okay in the matching for FM/IN which is great for us.
"I am also aware that Cork has already sent out their offers to people, but I also know that there will be another review of applicants. And there are other schools besides Cork as well, we just have to wait and see. In the slight chance I dont get into medical school this year, there's always plan B and C."
I'm sure Cork will do another review of applicants if the students who received acceptance packages drop out and get accepted to other schools unless Cork is their first choice. If all of the students accept they will not...but I'm sure at least a couple will not go through with this. As long as you have an alternate plan thats all that matters!
Just to clarify, that 100% wasn't ever given by RCSI. They are a reputable school with a long list of applicants with limited spaces and there is no need for them to spread misinformation. Its true that you work hard you can go far, but anyone who has gone through the entire process will tell you life isn't always fair and who you know, how much money you have, and where you went to school will influence on how you get matched. If you want to get matched at John Hopkins, its a FARR easier route if you've studied there first as opposed to if you went to a school overseas. I know a lot of foreign doctors who just can't land a residency spot in Canada yet they are some of the most brilliant people I know. All of the Irish schools seem to do okay in the matching for FM/IN which is great for us.
"I am also aware that Cork has already sent out their offers to people, but I also know that there will be another review of applicants. And there are other schools besides Cork as well, we just have to wait and see. In the slight chance I dont get into medical school this year, there's always plan B and C."
I'm sure Cork will do another review of applicants if the students who received acceptance packages drop out and get accepted to other schools unless Cork is their first choice. If all of the students accept they will not...but I'm sure at least a couple will not go through with this. As long as you have an alternate plan thats all that matters!
Best of luck to you man.
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I hope someone can answer my following questions, I am worried that I will not have time to study for the USMLE in Ireland and be able to get a 230+.
Now Trinity only gives 2 months off in 3rd year summer. I have to take a US/Canadian elective during that summer too. So I will have less than 2 months left to study for the step 1.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but Canadian/US students get at least 3 months during summer time to study for the USMLE and their curriculum is geared towards it. How is 2 months enough when Irish curriculum is not geared towards the USMLE?
Can anyone tell me how and when does everyone in Ireland study for a test so important (while at the same time taking maximum number of electives in US/Canada)?
Also, I heard RCSI prepares you for the USMLE significantly better...is that true?
Now Trinity only gives 2 months off in 3rd year summer. I have to take a US/Canadian elective during that summer too. So I will have less than 2 months left to study for the step 1.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but Canadian/US students get at least 3 months during summer time to study for the USMLE and their curriculum is geared towards it. How is 2 months enough when Irish curriculum is not geared towards the USMLE?
Can anyone tell me how and when does everyone in Ireland study for a test so important (while at the same time taking maximum number of electives in US/Canada)?
Also, I heard RCSI prepares you for the USMLE significantly better...is that true?
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Most American students get maybe 3 WEEKS off for Step 1 but their education is more geared towards it...apparently, but who knows. A lot of Step 1 is more about how you think rather than what you can memorize. Some schools are more flexible with when their students do Step 1.
Study during the school year. 2 months is enough to score 230+.
RCSI doesn't prepare you any better than any other school. None of the schools follow a USMLE curriculum.
Do Step 1 during the school year then you'll have the entire summer to do electives.
Study during the school year. 2 months is enough to score 230+.
RCSI doesn't prepare you any better than any other school. None of the schools follow a USMLE curriculum.
Do Step 1 during the school year then you'll have the entire summer to do electives.
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