Is a 504 MCAT "lethal" for MD?

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kiddles

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Just talked to my premed advisor today about how I decided to continue applying this cycle despite my 504 MCAT since I received the AAMC FAP. She basically told me my chances are "lethal" for MD and I should not have wasted my time. She told me to retake the MCAT before next cycle and that there is a "99% chance" I will be a re-applicant because "medical schools only take someone with a 504 if they are non-trad" (I'm applying straight out of undergrad). I know my MCAT is not all that, but I thought my high GPA (3.85), ECs, and unique experiences could balance the 504. I'm now wondering if I have been overly optimistic this whole time about receiving interviews. I honestly thought I had a shot until my premed advisor said otherwise.

My secondaries are complete and I applied to all my state schools (I am a MI resident) and OOS friendly MD schools where my MCAT was around the 10th percentile on MSAR. I've been scrolling through SDN and saw some users post that the only applicants that get in with a 504 are those who come from disadvantaged backgrounds or are URM.

I guess my question is if I should I listen to my premed advisor's advice? Am I being way too optimistic? Is a 504 truly "lethal" for MD? Any insight would be very much appreciated!

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Just talked to my premed advisor today about how I decided to continue applying this cycle despite my 504 MCAT since I received the AAMC FAP. She basically told me my chances are "lethal" for MD and I should not have wasted my time. She told me to retake the MCAT before next cycle and that there is a "99% chance" I will be a re-applicant because "medical schools only take someone with a 504 if they are non-trad" (I'm applying straight out of undergrad). I know my MCAT is not all that, but I thought my high GPA (3.85), ECs, and unique experiences could balance the 504. I'm now wondering if I have been overly optimistic this whole time about receiving interviews. I honestly thought I had a shot until my premed advisor said otherwise.

My secondaries are complete and I applied to all my state schools (I am a MI resident) and OOS friendly MD schools where my MCAT was around the 10th percentile on MSAR. I've been scrolling through SDN and saw some users post that the only applicants that get in with a 504 are those who come from disadvantaged backgrounds or are URM. I am neither, but I am a first-generation Arab American.

I guess my question is if I should I listen to my premed advisor's advice? Am I being way too optimistic? Is a 504 truly "lethal" for MD? Any insight would be very much appreciated!
Lethal? No. But limiting in choices, yes.
 
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Considering how my premed advisor made it seem, a 47% acceptance rate for my stats is honestly a relief. Thank you for the replies!
Your premed advisor knows what she is talking about. It doesn't matter since you had the FAP, so at least it didn't cost you anything, but you shouldn't be relieved by the 47%. That includes every group that receives an advantage.

A 504 from a non-disadvantaged, non-URM, traditional student is far less likely than 47% (which is slightly above average for EVERYONE) to receive an A to a MD school, even with a 3.85. I wish you the best of luck, but you honestly should expect to be a reapplicant next year, and you should have consulted with your advisor before applying. You could have used the FAP next year. Now you'll have to reapply and hopefully be approved for another one next year.
 
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It’s a well known thing on SDN that until you have that acceptance in hand consider yourself rejected. Just over 40 % of all applicants are accepted each cycle so there’s that stat/percentage too.
 
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Lethal is too strong a word. Underdog, sure, but take a look at your EC's and see if they're strong enough to get you an interview, especially if you apply broadly.

David D MD - USMLE and MCAT Tutor
Med School Tutors
 
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The stats are skewed by several things including people who live in states that have high rates of in-state acceptance.
Thank you! I probably would not have considered these factors without the insight of you and the other users that posted on here. I'm assuming MI is one the better states for MD since its has a decent number of medical schools. My optimism can sometimes make me unrealistic so I needed this reality check!
 
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Your best chances for interviews will be at Central Michigan, Michigan State, Wayne State and Oakland Beaumont.
 
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depends on your school list, if your EC's are actually great the way you say you are, essays, etc. It's not impossible to get accepted with a 504 but it will be hard and you will need some fate. Good luck!
 
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Your best chances for interviews will be at Central Michigan, Michigan State, Wayne State and Oakland Beaumont.
Seconded. OUWB tends to accept a lot of high GPA, average/lower MCAT (for MD) people. On the other hand, Western MI seems to go for the higher MCAT but slightly lower GPA.
 
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Just talked to my premed advisor today about how I decided to continue applying this cycle despite my 504 MCAT since I received the AAMC FAP. She basically told me my chances are "lethal" for MD and I should not have wasted my time. She told me to retake the MCAT before next cycle and that there is a "99% chance" I will be a re-applicant because "medical schools only take someone with a 504 if they are non-trad" (I'm applying straight out of undergrad). I know my MCAT is not all that, but I thought my high GPA (3.85), ECs, and unique experiences could balance the 504. I'm now wondering if I have been overly optimistic this whole time about receiving interviews. I honestly thought I had a shot until my premed advisor said otherwise.

My secondaries are complete and I applied to all my state schools (I am a MI resident) and OOS friendly MD schools where my MCAT was around the 10th percentile on MSAR. I've been scrolling through SDN and saw some users post that the only applicants that get in with a 504 are those who come from disadvantaged backgrounds or are URM. I am neither, but I am a first-generation Arab American.

I guess my question is if I should I listen to my premed advisor's advice? Am I being way too optimistic? Is a 504 truly "lethal" for MD? Any insight would be very much appreciated!
I suggest these schools:
Temple (maybe)
SLU (maybe)
MCW
Loma Linda (only if you are SDA or a very devout Christian)
Loyola
Rosy Franklin
TCU/UNT
Uniformed Services University/Hebert (just be aware of the military service commitment)
Your state school(s).
Any DO program. Include UNECOM if you’re from the NE, OSUCOM if you’re from the Plains states and PacNW if you’re from that region. I can't recommend Nova, BCOM, ICOM and LUCOM, for different reasons. MSUCOM? Read up on Larry Nasser and you decide. LMU has an accreditation warning, which concerns me. CUHS is too new and appears to be too limited in rotations sites. UIW refuses to post their Boards scores, which is fishy.
 
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Why not just retake the MCAT while you’re applying, add about 10 points and go to a top 15 school? You have a solid GPA so I assume you’re a good student. You’ll be taking tons of standardized exams all your life, you might as well go all in now.
 
I got a 504 and was accepted to Temple, GW, Buffalo (NYS resident), and Gesinger. Interviewed at 5+ more schools. Accepted to lots of DO programs as well. Although I am URM and non-trad, I don't think its lethal. Just make sure those essays are good and that you can stand out in whatever experience make you stand out! Also, if you wanna be a doctor, apply DO too
 
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Straight up with you: a 504 to an MD school is for URMs and non-trads. Pre-meds often overestimate the strength of their ECs (as I did when applying). You already applied so maybe you’ll be one of the lucky 10%, but you need to be realistic with yourself, look at the median MCAT scores, and either apply DO or retake the MCAT to prepare for next cycle. Don’t let your pride get in the way of becoming a doctor.

Edit: as was said before, you have an okay shot at MSU, CMU, and Oakland, but even at CMU and Oakland you are <25th percentile for the MCAT. Many people think a solid gpa will make up for a low MCAT score, but that is not the case. For MD schools, you will need both.
 
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Why not just retake the MCAT while you’re applying, add about 10 points and go to a top 15 school? You have a solid GPA so I assume you’re a good student. You’ll be taking tons of standardized exams all your life, you might as well go all in now.
Thank you for your insight! If I do not receive an acceptance this cycle, I will definitely study hard and retake the MCAT.
 
Not lethal if you donate a few milli to a couple med schools in a kind donation
 
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The precise group for which a 504 MCAT is least problematic.
Yes but I know other classmates at Temple who have similar scores and are not URM (or non trad)...I just happen to be the one typing and I am URM. Definitely not the majority and will be more difficult to get in, but I really don't think its a death sentence for MD. Hence why I said if you really wanna make sure you're a doc, apply DO as well
 
Yes but I know other classmates at Temple who have similar scores and are not URM (or non trad)...I just happen to be the one typing and I am URM. Definitely not the majority and will be more difficult to get in, but I really don't think its a death sentence for MD. Hence why I said if you really wanna make sure you're a doc, apply DO as well
I'll bite. Temple's class is 195, 505 is the 10%-ile for matriculants, 15 are BS/MD or early decision or early assurance, 54 are neither White nor Asian, 16% are disadvantaged, and 93 people in the first year class are age 24 or over. I'm betting exactly zero of your classmates don't fit into one of those categories and have a MCAT of 504 or lower.
 
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I'll bite. Temple's class is 195, 505 is the 10%-ile for matriculants, 15 are BS/MD or early decision or early assurance, 54 are neither White nor URM, 16% are disadvantaged, and 93 people in the first year class are age 24 or over. I'm betting exactly zero of your classmates don't fit into one of those categories and have a MCAT of 504 or lower.
I can think of exactly two people (in my circle, i obvi don't know everyone in the class) who had 503/504 and don't fit into those categories so although odds are not in your favor, it happens. This is again why I emphasize applying DO as well because odds are much much higher there

Also, the people I know that are BS/MD had to get a 507 on the MCAT, not sure if it changed since 3 years ago though.

Ok lets end this here I was just trying to be optimistic for OP but I don't want to derail the thread! Carry on with advice
 
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Hi all, just wanted to give an update in regards to my cycle (especially for fellow pre-meds with lower MCAT scores) because I know how stressful this process can be and hope my story can remind us that we are more than our GPA/MCAT. Truthfully, I was beginning to feel down after hearing from people I know tell me that my MCAT score would make medical school nearly impossible and I should withdraw my application. Nevertheless, I applied and not too long after I made my original post on SDN, I ended up getting an interview for one of my state's medical schools and was accepted just this past week! I am still in shock that I am going to be a doctor!!!! Additionally, I have 2 more MD interviews scheduled in January (one of which is an OOS school).

This is just my opinion based on my own experiences from this cycle, but do not let your scores, other people, or self-doubt define your value as a person in this process. I think what benefitted me was for the most part maintaining a positive mindset, having a very well-documented theme in my application, working multiple jobs (my interviewer was highly impressed that I worked 2-3 jobs throughout college), and doing activities that I actually enjoyed (some of which had nothing to do with medicine, but helped me grow as a person). My interview went well on my end because I genuinely enjoyed the conversation about what I wrote in my application.

Anyways, wishing good luck this cycle (or in future cycles) to all my fellow "underdogs" out there!
 
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Hi all, just wanted to give an update in regards to my cycle (especially for fellow pre-meds with lower MCAT scores) because I know how stressful this process can be and hope my story can remind us that we are more than our GPA/MCAT. Truthfully, I was beginning to feel down after hearing from people I know tell me that my MCAT score would make medical school nearly impossible and I should withdraw my application. Nevertheless, I applied and not too long after I made my original post on SDN, I ended up getting an interview for one of my state's medical schools and was accepted just this past week! I am still in shock that I am going to be a doctor!!!! Additionally, I have 2 more MD interviews scheduled in January (one of which is an OOS school).

This is just my opinion based on my own experiences from this cycle, but do not let your scores, other people, or self-doubt define your value as a person in this process. I think what benefitted me was for the most part maintaining a positive mindset, having a very well-documented theme in my application, working multiple jobs (my interviewer was highly impressed that I worked 2-3 jobs throughout college), and doing activities that I actually enjoyed (some of which had nothing to do with medicine, but helped me grow as a person). My interview went well on my end because I genuinely enjoyed the conversation about what I wrote in my application.

Anyways, wishing good luck this cycle (or in future cycles) to all my fellow "underdogs" out there!
Fellow 504'er out here, congrats on the acceptance!
 
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i would say it depends on your goals. if you view med school as a means to an end and you have the ECs & experiences to send a compelling narrative, then yeah, I'm sure with your stats you could earn As at DO & MD programs. just do not apply anywhere where the ave mcat is above like, a 512.

if you are shooting for a T20 or even T40, I would follow her advice and retake the mcat. I'm also a non-trad and FAP (as well as URM) and even with a high mcat score, I've only snagged 1 t20 II. i feel like SDN makes it out to seem that being any of the aforementioned categories gives a huge leg up, when that really isn't the case. again, it all depends on your goals. im sure you'll be successful no matter which path you decide to take. best of luck to you
Seems like a moot point since OP said they got accepted lol
 
i would say it depends on your goals. if you view med school as a means to an end and you have the ECs & experiences to send a compelling narrative, then yeah, I'm sure with your stats you could earn As at DO & MD programs. just do not apply anywhere where the ave mcat is above like, a 512.

if you are shooting for a T20 or even T40, I would follow her advice and retake the mcat. I'm also a non-trad and FAP (as well as URM) and even with a high mcat score, I've only snagged 1 t20 II. i feel like SDN makes it out to seem that being any of the aforementioned categories gives a huge leg up, when that really isn't the case. again, it all depends on your goals. im sure you'll be successful no matter which path you decide to take. best of luck to you
Thank you for the response and good point! While I applied, medical school ranking never mattered to me since I was happy and grateful to go anywhere. My goal was always to get into a medical school, learn how to be the best doctor I can possibly be, and one day match into a residency. The goals I set for myself are not the same as all pre-meds, but I did want to spread the message that med school can be a possible with a lower MCAT because there are people out there who say otherwise. I should also add that I did my research on the schools I applied to and made sure my MCAT score was around the 10th percentile on MSAR. Good luck this cycle!
 
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Thank you for the response and good point! While I applied, medical school ranking never mattered to me since I was happy and grateful to go anywhere. My goal was always to get into a medical school, learn how to be the best doctor I can possibly be, and one day match into a residency. The goals I set for myself are not the same as all pre-meds, but I did want to spread the message that med school can be a possible with a lower MCAT because there are people out there who say otherwise. I should also add that I did my research on the schools I applied to and made sure my MCAT score was around the 10th percentile on MSAR. Good luck this cycle!
Congrats...keep proving all the haters/doubters wrong! Hard part is over my friend, best of luck to you
 
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Hi all, just wanted to give an update in regards to my cycle (especially for fellow pre-meds with lower MCAT scores) because I know how stressful this process can be and hope my story can remind us that we are more than our GPA/MCAT. Truthfully, I was beginning to feel down after hearing from people I know tell me that my MCAT score would make medical school nearly impossible and I should withdraw my application. Nevertheless, I applied and not too long after I made my original post on SDN, I ended up getting an interview for one of my state's medical schools and was accepted just this past week! I am still in shock that I am going to be a doctor!!!! Additionally, I have 2 more MD interviews scheduled in January (one of which is an OOS school).

This is just my opinion based on my own experiences from this cycle, but do not let your scores, other people, or self-doubt define your value as a person in this process. I think what benefitted me was for the most part maintaining a positive mindset, having a very well-documented theme in my application, working multiple jobs (my interviewer was highly impressed that I worked 2-3 jobs throughout college), and doing activities that I actually enjoyed (some of which had nothing to do with medicine, but helped me grow as a person). My interview went well on my end because I genuinely enjoyed the conversation about what I wrote in my application.

Anyways, wishing good luck this cycle (or in future cycles) to all my fellow "underdogs" out there!

There is nothing in life that beats destiny. Congratulations .
 
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Just hear to say my friend got into rush with a 504. She worked really hard, really fit their mission, got the interview and worked SO HARD to prep for it. And got in!
 
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This thread is an object lesson in survivorship bias.
Not sure where the bias is that you are referring to. I think we all acknowledge that a 504 isn't ideal and puts us on the bottom end of the applicant pool but as the title of the the thread asks, is it lethal? No, it's clearly possible. I don't think anyone is biased and saying that it's a walk in the park for us 504-ers. I think OP really wanted to know if there was any possibility that they would get in with a 504...they weren't looking for "is it going to be easy"
 
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Not sure where the bias is that you are referring to.

It's embedded in these posts:
I got a 504 and was accepted to Temple, GW, Buffalo (NYS resident), and Gesinger.
Yes but I know other classmates at Temple who have similar scores and are not URM (or non trad)...
and was accepted just this past week! I am still in shock that I am going to be a doctor!!!!
Just hear to say my friend got into rush with a 504.
To add - I got into 6 MD schools ( and 2 T30 or higher) with a 505

A strict reading of the AAMC Table A-23 shows that the only truly lethal metric is a GPA <2.00 (0% acceptance rate).*

*Edit: Even that doesn't look right, as the table appears to omit some data in the MCAT 486-490 range. Looks like 1 person was admitted (1.2% acceptance rate). The only two metric categories that are worse are MCAT 486-490 (1.0% acceptance rate) and MCAT <486 (0.5% acceptance rate).
 
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Of course not, but all the anecdotes on this thread involve applicants who were successful, which can distort the mathematical reality of the situation.
Even AAMC graph A- 23 statistically speaking has people with a 504 and a solid gap having a 33-44% chance of acceptance (assuming that means when applying to the average school number of ~17). I understand that includes the superstar candidates (URM, Military, etc). But statistically speaking those odds are pretty solid imo, and just statistically will get better when you apply with a solid school list and a larger list of schools (correct me if I am wrong).

But I understand your point on survivorship bias, you definitely need to make up for the low mcat in multiple parts of your application like some eye catching EC's, stellar gpa, and killing the interview. Definitely creates a significant hurdle you have to jump to catch an acceptance. But for some of us terrible at standardized test people, the MCAT was BY FAR the biggest hurdle we had to jump :lol:
 
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Even AAMC graph A- 23 statistically speaking has people with a 504 and a solid gap having a 47-59% chance of acceptance (assuming that means when applying to the average school number of ~17). I understand that includes the superstar candidates (URM, Military, etc). But statistically speaking those odds are pretty solid imo, and just statistically will get better when you apply with a solid school list and a larger list of schools (correct me if I am wrong).

But I understand your point on survivorship bias, you definitely need to make up for the low mcat in multiple parts of your application like some eye catching EC's, stellar gpa, and killing the interview. Definitely creates a significant hurdle you have to jump to catch an acceptance. But for some of us terrible at standardized test people, the MCAT was BY FAR the biggest hurdle we had to jump :lol:

Agree with some of your comments. If the rest of the application is stellar you may still stand a reasonable chance of getting into an MD school with an MCAT 504.

However , when you factor in URM/disadvantaged, military, puerto rican schools, some other state schools with low avergae GPA, if you dont fall into any of these categories (URM/disadvantaged, puerto rico or some of the other states with lower mcat, military etc) , the true percentage of getting in is not even close to the 33-44% that the AMCAS table states. It is probably closer to 20%, and mostly stellar applicants, there are always exceptions/luck to this rule.

His comments were mostly correct, to take this comment I got a 504 and was accepted to Temple, GW, Buffalo (NYS resident), and Gesinger. with a grain of salt. These kind of multiple acceptances would clearly be an exception outside the norm.

Your other comment, and a larger list of schools is not completely true. After you cross the standard norm of 17 schools, and if one has been intelligent in selecting the best schools where their application stands a higher chance, the further applications dont have similar returns, and there is diminishing returns after the first 17 best schools to fit your profile. My point being, if an applicant has had no acceptances/interviews in the best fit 17 schools, then his chance of getting in the next 17 is low. However, if one has had a couple of interviews/ acceptances in the first 17, then his chance of getting more offers in the next 17 is higher. I know this logic sounds quirky, but it has to deal with the overall strength of the application, which is perceived similarly by most ADCOMs. In addition, the quality of the secondary applications does start suffering, due to sheer fatigue.
 
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Congrats...keep proving all the haters/doubters wrong! Hard part is over my friend, best of luck to you
Congrats to OP. The hard part is not over. Rather, the easy part is over.
 
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Agree with some of your comments. If the rest of the application is stellar with an MCAT you still stand a reasonable chance of getting into an MD school with an MCAT 504.

However , when you factor in URM/disadvantaged, military, puerto rican schools, some other state schools with low avergae GPA, if you dont fall into any of these categories (URM/disadvantaged, puerto rico or some of the other states with lower mcat, military etc) , the true percentage of getting in is not even close to the 47-59% that the AMCAS table states. It is probably closer to 20%, and mostly stellar applicants.

His comments were mostly correct, to take this comment I got a 504 and was accepted to Temple, GW, Buffalo (NYS resident), and Gesinger. with a grain of salt. These kind of multiple acceptances would clearly be an exception outside the norm.

Your other comment, and a larger list of schools is not completely true. After you cross the standard norm of 17 schools, and if one has been intelligent in selecting the best schools where their application stands a higher chance, the further applications dont have similar returns, and there is diminishing returns after the first 17 best schools to fit your profile. In addition, the quality of the secondary applications does start suffering, due to sheer fatigue.
just caught myself in the chart myself hahaha. It is 33-44% for that mcat range :lol:

I agree, 4 MD acceptances with that MCAT (especially with 3 OOS) is nuts.

But that's very true, the secondary fatigue hits pretty hard. Also, I understand this particular cycle may be significantly less forgiving to low mcat applicants.
 
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Survivorship bias or not, I just wanted to update the answer to my own question and let people know that a 504 is not actually "lethal." As I said before, despite my low MCAT, I had a good GPA, ECs, and theme to my application. Wasn't trying to instill false hope, but with 3 interviews now, I just wanted to say a 504 MCAT won't kill your application (IF everything else is solid). There are people out there who really try to deter or hate on less than average stat applicants so I do not see anything wrong with a person sharing their story of success (especially when they beat the odds and the naysayers). Applicants with less than average stats work hard (sometimes even harder) to get into medical school too. I do not think it is pure luck/chance/survivorship/destiny/etc., although I am grateful for how my cycle turned out.

Also, while thinking about the statistics, AAMC Table A-23 does not consider the number of applicants who applied to medical school with poor applications that show they are unprepared to go into medical school in terms of ECs, clinical experience, personal statement, LOR, etc. Take out those applicants and the chances of being accepted may be higher than 43% for someone with a 3.8+ GPA and 502-505 MCAT. At the end of the day, I think all individuals should assess their own application/finances and make the decision on whether or not to apply for themselves.

This will be my last post on this thread. I think I got the answer to my original question based on my own experiences lol. Thank you all for your helpful/insightful responses, as well as the congratulations!
 
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Just talked to my premed advisor today about how I decided to continue applying this cycle despite my 504 MCAT since I received the AAMC FAP. She basically told me my chances are "lethal" for MD and I should not have wasted my time. She told me to retake the MCAT before next cycle and that there is a "99% chance" I will be a re-applicant because "medical schools only take someone with a 504 if they are non-trad" (I'm applying straight out of undergrad). I know my MCAT is not all that, but I thought my high GPA (3.85), ECs, and unique experiences could balance the 504. I'm now wondering if I have been overly optimistic this whole time about receiving interviews. I honestly thought I had a shot until my premed advisor said otherwise.

My secondaries are complete and I applied to all my state schools (I am a MI resident) and OOS friendly MD schools where my MCAT was around the 10th percentile on MSAR. I've been scrolling through SDN and saw some users post that the only applicants that get in with a 504 are those who come from disadvantaged backgrounds or are URM.

I guess my question is if I should I listen to my premed advisor's advice? Am I being way too optimistic? Is a 504 truly "lethal" for MD? Any insight would be very much appreciated!

Your back is going to be against the wall. With that said, I know a non-URM NC resident who was accepted to UNC Chapel Hill this cycle with a 504. I don't recall the applicant's GPA or other stats though. Your best bet is going to be with state schools and DO schools.
 
Survivorship bias or not, I just wanted to update the answer to my own question and let people know that a 504 is not actually "lethal." As I said before, despite my low MCAT, I had a good GPA, ECs, and theme to my application. Wasn't trying to instill false hope, but with 3 interviews now, I just wanted to say a 504 MCAT won't kill your application (IF everything else is solid). There are people out there who really try to deter or hate on less than average stat applicants so I do not see anything wrong with a person sharing their story of success (especially when they beat the odds and the naysayers). Applicants with less than average stats work hard (sometimes even harder) to get into medical school too. I do not think it is pure luck/chance/survivorship/destiny/etc., although I am grateful for how my cycle turned out.

Also, while thinking about the statistics, AAMC Table A-23 does not consider the number of applicants who applied to medical school with poor applications that show they are unprepared to go into medical school in terms of ECs, clinical experience, personal statement, LOR, etc. Take out those applicants and the chances of being accepted may be higher than 43% for someone with a 3.8+ GPA and 502-505 MCAT. At the end of the day, I think all individuals should assess their own application/finances and make the decision on whether or not to apply for themselves.

This will be my last post on this thread. I think I got the answer to my original question based on my own experiences lol. Thank you all for your helpful/insightful responses, as well as the congratulations!
I think it is definitely survivorship bias, but as one of the survivors, you should be elated. Congratulations! :)
 
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But I understand your point on survivorship bias, you definitely need to make up for the low mcat in multiple parts of your application like some eye catching EC's, stellar gpa, and killing the interview. Definitely creates a significant hurdle you have to jump to catch an acceptance. But for some of us terrible at standardized test people, the MCAT was BY FAR the biggest hurdle we had to jump :lol:

This about sums it up. A 504 is only lethal if it's the best part of the application.
 
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A 504 with a roughly 40% acceptance rate perfectly matches the stats that Angus Avogadro always quotes about 60% not earning admittance, 20% earning 1 and 20% earning multiple

In other words... it’s a fairly standard shot to take.
 
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A 504 with a roughly 40% acceptance rate perfectly matches the stats that Angus Avogadro always quotes about 60% not earning admittance, 20% earning 1 and 20% earning multiple

In other words... it’s a fairly standard shot to take.
Which makes sense considering those are just about the average stats of applicants to medical school 😲

1606686409517.png
 
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A 504 with a roughly 40% acceptance rate perfectly matches the stats that Angus Avogadro always quotes about 60% not earning admittance, 20% earning 1 and 20% earning multiple

In other words... it’s a fairly standard shot to take.
I'm not so sure about that. You know what they say about lies, damn lies and statistics!! :cool:

Approximately 40% of 55,000 total applicants are successful, and, in the 502-505 MCAT range, 44% of applicants with GPAs 3.80+ are successful. They are NOT the same, and one does NOT perfectly match the other.

One includes all GPAs and one doesn't. They key is that the median MCAT for all matriculants is 511.5, NOT 504. No matter how you slice it, the average applicant with a 504 is at a huge disadvantage when their MCAT is more than 7 points below the median of those matriculating.

Yes the average applicant has a 506.4. The average applicant is also unsuccessful. Clearly, being low SES, URM, etc. can mitigate this in certain cases, but the average applicant with a 504 is not taking a standard shot, even with a 3.8+ GPA, just because 40%=40%. They are not the same!!!
 
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I wasn’t clear when I said the category w/ approx. 40% acceptance rate, which is found on the GPA/MCAT grid everyone uses.

There are lots of variables to acceptance, certainly, but since the topic title is asking if a 504 is lethal... the resounding answer is “No.”
 
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I wasn’t clear when I said the category w/ approx. 40% acceptance rate, which is found on the GPA/MCAT grid everyone uses.

There are lots of variables to acceptance, certainly, but since the topic title is asking if a 504 is lethal... the resounding answer is “No.”
Absolutely true. Very few things are lethal. It's just worth noting that admissions are indeed very holistic, and one needs pretty significant mitigation to be in the statistical bottom 10%, or even 25%, of anyone's class, or to be admitted with an MCAT 7 points below the median of matriculants. Absolutely anyone can overcome this, but it is difficult. More so for a high SES ORM than a low SES URM, but not impossible for anyone.
 
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LMAO. For the majority of us, a 504 is an automatic DNR or DOA for the vast majority of MD schools. For DO schools. you are golden.
 
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LMAO. For the majority of us, a 504 is an automatic DNR or DOA for the vast majority of MD schools. For DO schools. you are golden.
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LMAO. For the majority of us, a 504 is an automatic DNR or DOA for the vast majority of MD schools. For DO schools. you are golden.

Yes, even in the statistics provided 60% not getting accepted would be the majority.

...CARS, anyone?
 
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