Is it inappropriate to ask my pre-health comitee if there were any red flags on my application?

[manohman]

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Rejections have started coming in. I signed ferpa but as it is a general question I was wondering if i could ask my undergrad health comitee if there was any glaring weaknesses in my app

 

[LizzyM]

At this point, you might go to the committee and say that you are planning on working to improve your application proactively until you have an offer of admission. Say, "In that light, what could I do to improve my chances in the next cycle if that becomes necessary? Are there any red flags that I need to address if I need to reapply?"

 

[Goro]

Rejections have started coming in. I signed ferpa but as it is a general question I was wondering if i could ask my undergrad health comitee if there was any glaring weaknesses in my app

SDNers should always consider themselves rejected and be working on their Plan B until they have that accept email in their Inbox.

 

[JeSuisUnDoc]

SDNers should always consider themselves rejected and be working on their Plan B until they have that accept email in their Inbox.

I do that for everything. I find that it keeps me from obsessing too much.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[LizzyM]

SDNers should always consider themselves rejected and be working on their Plan B until they have that accept email in their Inbox.

Correct, but the OP is specifically asking if he should ask his pre-med committee if there is anything in his application (ahem, his letters) that raises a red flag. If the answer comes back, "you might want to get fresh letters for the next application cycle", then the applicant knows that working on grades and ECs won't be enough to overcome what is holding him back.

 

[manohman]

Correct, but the OP is specifically asking if he should ask his pre-med committee if there is anything in his application (ahem, his letters) that raises a red flag. If the answer comes back, "you might want to get fresh letters for the next application cycle", then the applicant knows that working on grades and ECs won't be enough to overcome what is holding him back.

Yeah thank you both! I was/am worried about the letters. Either that or maybe my supplemental essays were bad.

I asked my pre health comitee like you said @LizzyM and they said that this early its possible its due to being out of state or being over qualified (lol). They said to focus on this app cycle though i could talk to an advisor about my school list.

It wasnt clear if they were telling me this after looking at my app or just as a general answer.

The two schools i got rejected from were T10/20 though so im definitey not overqualified.

I only 170hrs clinicalvolunteering butIv continued volunteering in the hospital and may start a clinical job soon. Is it Worth updating schools on this?

Im waiting on a paper but iv given up on it coming out any time soon. lol

 

[deleted804295]

Yeah thank you both! I was/am worried about the letters. Either that or maybe my supplemental essays were bad.

I asked my pre health comitee like you said @LizzyM and they said that this early its possible its due to being out of state or being over qualified (lol). They said to focus on this app cycle though i could talk to an advisor about my school list.

It wasnt clear if they were telling me this after looking at my app or just as a general answer.

The two schools i got rejected from were T10/20 though so im definitey not overqualified.

My LizzyM was ~75, 2,000+ non clinical volunteering, 1,500+ research, 2 pubs (mid author), but only 170hrs clinical. Good amount of shadowing. My app was service/personal experiences as a patient focused.

Iv continued volunteering in the hospital and may start a clinical job soon. Is it Worth updating schools on this? Im waiting on a paper but iv given up on it coming out any time soon. lol

Nice ECs!

 

[manohman]

Nice ECs!

LOL im pretty old. And my activity section had a lot to be desired with regards to clarity. Sitting with two/three rejections already doesn’t inspire a lot of confidence.

Thank you though! ^_^ I fet the opposite at my first interview last week. Everyone was like four years younger than me. We all have our way though

 

[DameJulie]

If you ask about your AMCAS app, for example if your GPA/MCAT would be a red flag for school X or if your low volunteer hour would be a red flag for school Y, that's ok. That's what advisers are there for.

If it's about letters, don't ask if you waive the right to see the letters. You might be creating a red flag that wasn't there before by asking if there's any red flag in the letters.

 

[Lucca]

LOL im pretty old. And my activity section had a lot to be desired with regards to clarity. Sitting with two/three rejections already doesn’t inspire a lot of confidence.

Thank you though! ^_^ I fet the opposite at my first interview last week. Everyone was like four years younger than me. We all have our way though

I think people really abuse the term "red flag" on these boards.

To me, having a "red flag" means that there is something in your app which will destroy any chance that it will be considered from the get-go unless a human being explicitly decides to give you mercy or accept that you have overcome whatever setback it is (IA, a semester of Fs, substance abuse, criminal record, etc.).

If you have an II this early, or multiple, that's a pretty good indication that there are no red flags in your app. The schools that rejected you are extremely competitive. Can't win em all.

 

[manohman]

I think people really abuse the term "red flag" on these boards.

To me, having a "red flag" means that there is something in your app which will destroy any chance that it will be considered from the get-go unless a human being explicitly decides to give you mercy or accept that you have overcome whatever setback it is (IA, a semester of Fs, substance abuse, criminal record, etc.).

If you have an II this early, or multiple, that's a pretty good indication that there are no red flags in your app. The schools that rejected you are extremely competitive. Can't win em all.

Definition of red flag aside. What would you define a bad letter as then? A glaring weakness? Does the term matter that much?

I see your point about not winning them all though that’s a given right? Otherwise we wouldnt apply to so many schools.

DameJulie, i see what you mean. I didnt ask for anything specific because I was mindful of the ferpa. More just general question if there was anything i could improve on if i need to apply next cycle. I see your point though thanks!

 

[LizzyM]

It is kinder to say "over qualified" than to say "underqualified". That's how I'd read the committee's response to you. Keep on keepin' on. Good luck!

 

[Lucca]

Definition of red flag aside. What would you define a bad letter as then? A glaring weakness? Does the term matter that much?

I see your point about not winning them all though that’s a given right? Otherwise we wouldnt apply to so many schools.

DameJulie, i see what you mean. I didnt ask for anything specific because I was mindful of the ferpa. More just general question if there was anything i could improve on if i need to apply next cycle. I see your point though thanks!

A truly negative letter is the kiss of death. A lukewarm letter isn’t helping you but it probably won’t keep you out

 

[RNtoMD87]

It is kinder to say "over qualified" than to say "underqualified". That's how I'd read the committee's response to you. Keep on keepin' on. Good luck!

That's some bs though. Saying someone is overqualified is misleading and an outright lie. I feel like we are adults and can handle the truth.

 

[Lucca]

That's some bs though. Saying someone is overqualified is misleading and an outright lie. I feel like we are adults and can handle the truth.

Lol they aren't lying... Until you are well into a cycle and have more information (applicant school list? number of II's offered? number of IIs attended? post II acceptance rate of schools where app attended interview?) you can't conduct an honest postmortem. I would argue that it would be more dishonest to tell the applicant they are "underqualified" before you have any evidence of how they are actually doing in the cycle. 2 pre-II rejections from the T20 do not rly provide any information other than the applicant is maybe not the very best of the best in a highly competitive pool.

 

[RNtoMD87]

Lol they aren't lying... Until you are well into a cycle and have more information (applicant school list? number of II's offered? number of IIs attended? post II acceptance rate of schools where app attended interview?) you can't conduct an honest postmortem. I would argue that it would be more dishonest to tell the applicant they are "underqualified" before you have any evidence of how they are actually doing in the cycle. 2 pre-II rejections from the T20 do not rly provide any information other than the applicant is maybe not the very best of the best in a highly competitive pool.

It still just sounds like bs. I don’t believe
“Overqualified” is a thing. I just got a Neuroscientist PhD preceptee who is pretty well known in her field of studying Alzheimer’s and dementia, and I would hardly call her “overqualified”. Either she is able to be a nurse (pretty sure she’s gonna make a great RN), or she cant. Wtf does “overqualified” mean?

“Mom.. why do I keep getting picked last for the dodgeball team?”

“Honey.. it’s because... you’re TOO strong! They’re afraid you’ll hurt the other kids... yeah that’s it...”


If the cycle isn’t completed, how do they know that they want to reject someone unless they are vastly under qualified? Don’t they need to see who else applies later in the cycle to see?

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

It still just sounds like bs. I don’t believe
“Overqualified” is a thing. I just got a Neuroscientist PhD preceptee who is pretty well known in her field of studying Alzheimer’s and dementia, and I would hardly call her “overqualified”. Either she is able to be a nurse (pretty sure she’s gonna make a great RN), or she cant. Wtf does “overqualified” mean?

“Mom.. why do I keep getting picked last for the dodgeball team?”

“Honey.. it’s because... you’re TOO strong! They’re afraid you’ll hurt the other kids... yeah that’s it...”


If the cycle isn’t completed, how do they know that they want to reject someone unless they are vastly under qualified? Don’t they need to see who else applies later in the cycle to see?

I actually agree with you here. Saying someone is overqualified in med school admissions is ridiculous except for a small minority of applicants who have 4.0/528 and military/peace corps/Olympian/cured lupus on their apps, and only when they are applying somewhere not in the top 20. No one is overqualified to apply to a top 10 med school. That is no less dishonest than telling someone they’re under qualified.

In fact, I’d argue it’s worse because it implies that all they need to do is apply to more competitive schools, which is very unlikely to be the case.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

you can't conduct an honest postmortem

Here’s an idea: if you can’t give an honest assessment because it’s too early, just say that. If you’ve looked at their app and there are no red flags or harmful letters, then you tell them it’s early and a competitive process, and if they want to continue to strengthen their app, continuing or strengthening ECs is always good, as well as having people look at their secondary responses.

Edit: this sounds snarky, but it's not meant for you. I just quoted your post because you brought up advisors not being able to give an honest assessment. But it's not fair of them to not just be honest with applicants. This desire to not hurt people's feelings is ridiculous. It just hurts them more in the long run when they aren't getting good guidance.

 

[LizzyM]

The rejections were T10/T20 so it is likely "underqualified" is more accurate but there are certainly schools that yield-protect by not interviewing applicants that are "too good" for them. If you are Podunk Valley Medical School there is no sense interviewing the applicant who is going to end up with offers from Harvard, NYU and Stanford. Better to focus on the applicant who is more "in the range" to say yes to an offer from Podunk Valley.

 

[Catalystik]

I only 170hrs clinicalvolunteering butIv continued volunteering in the hospital and may start a clinical job soon. Is it Worth updating schools on this?

Update on a new job won't mean much until you're there for a few months, or at the least, past the probationary period. Mention the additional volunteer hours in the same update letter.

 

[RNtoMD87]

The rejections were T10/T20 so it is likely "underqualified" is more accurate but there are certainly schools that yield-protect by not interviewing applicants that are "too good" for them. If you are Podunk Valley Medical School there is no sense interviewing the applicant who is going to end up with offers from Harvard, NYU and Stanford. Better to focus on the applicant who is more "in the range" to say yes to an offer from Podunk Valley.

Seems awfully presumptive. If I had offers to a decent school near home, I would choose it over Ivy League anyway. Why would I want to pay all of that extra money for a piece of paper? Plus maybe I have reasons for staying in state. I have over 100k worth of property that is not legal to own in many states like NY and CA, and honestly don’t know what I would do with all of it as for as storing it. In order for me to choose an out of state school over a state school, it would have to somehow save me a load of money.

 

[LizzyM]

Seems awfully presumptive. If I had offers to a decent school near home, I would choose it over Ivy League anyway. Why would I want to pay all of that extra money for a piece of paper? Plus maybe I have reasons for staying in state. I have over 100k worth of property that is not legal to own in many states like NY and CA, and honestly don’t know what I would do with all of it as for as storing it. In order for me to choose an out of state school over a state school, it would have to somehow save me a load of money.

Well if you would turn down a full ride at NYU because you have property you can't legally keep in your dorn room at NYU, okay then, that would be a good reason to send a letter of intent to Podunk Valley.

 

[RNtoMD87]

I just don't know why they would assume. I'm not saying there shouldn't be any situations that they should not consider an otherwise qualified applicant (the student appears unenthusiastic about attending the particular school), seems ridiculous to deny someone for being "too good".

 

[LizzyM]

I just don't know why they would assume. I'm not saying there shouldn't be any situations that they should not consider an otherwise qualified applicant (the student appears unenthusiastic about attending the particular school), seems ridiculous to deny someone for being "too good".

Second tier schools do it for sheer survival. This is particularly true of expensive private schools that are treated as safety by top applicants. The adcom has a limited number of interview slots. . If they chased only superstars they’d be empty handed in June as most of the superstars would go up market or to their cheaper state school.

 

[Goro]

Second tier schools do it for sheer survival. This is particularly true of expensive private schools that are treated as safety by up top applicants. The adcom has a limited number of interview slots. . If they chased only superstars they’d be empty handed in June as most of the superstars would go up market or to their cheaper state school.

Gyngyn has also commented on this extensively. Schools like Drexel know from historic norms that Harvard/Stanford calibre candidates rarely end up at Drexel. So, why waste interview slots on them?

 

[Walter Raleigh]

Well if you would turn down a full ride at NYU because you have property you can't legally keep in your dorn room at NYU, okay then, that would be a good reason to send a letter of intent to Podunk Valley.

Might it be possible to rent a storage unit in Podunk, Texas? If it is the kind of property I am thinking it is, it would certainly be legal to store it there. I don't know what you might do for fairly bulky, valuable property as far as security is concerned.

 

[RNtoMD87]

Might it be possible to rent a storage unit in Podunk, Texas? If it is the kind of property I am thinking it is, it would certainly be legal to store it there. I don't know what you might do for fairly bulky, valuable property as far as security is concerned.

That was in response to me. I could keep my property anywhere in Texas pretty much, but NY, CA, IL, and many others are out of the question.


Just to clarify, here is one of my items. It is a machine gun, and I have to avoid even driving through those states. It’s ridiculous

 

[Walter Raleigh]

That was in response to me. I could keep my property anywhere in Texas pretty much, but NY, CA, IL, and many others are out of the question.

Look into storage units. It might be good to disguise the nature of your property by bringing it in nondescript boxes. Make it look like totes and boxes of ordinary, valueless household junk. It might also be good to look at some highly secure area or something for storing it. Four years of this might be cheaper than a hundred grand. Also, if the property is stolen, make sure it's insured and consult a lawyer regarding any liability that might arise from this.

 

[Walter Raleigh]

Well, I mean, if you picked a storage unit you could put what, ten guns or more in a tote? That's twenty totes, not terribly much. That's a lot of guns though man.