Is it possible to do a lap. ovarian cystectomy using local anesth only?

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brotherbloat

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Just wondered how many GYNs would do this--i.e. a lap. proceudre, such as a lap. ovarian cystectomy, without general anesth--local or epidural only.

I suspect I may have an ovarian cyst and am terrified of general anesthsia! Yikes! I'd rather be awake and in pain during the surgery rather than undergo a general!

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I debated doing an epidural for my pelvic laparoscopy last year, but went with the general instead.

After being on the other end of surgery, I really recommend the general. You won't really want to lie there for all of that time listening to them chatter & feeling them tugging on you. General anesthesia is very safe and they can also give you valium or something similar in advance to help with anxiety.
 
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This is a bit tangential, but... a doctor in India was using local anesthesia only for laprascopic BTL's with clamps, at a rate of 40 to 50 pts per hour! He published a total of 250,000+ BTLs.
 
DrBuzzLightYear said:
This is a bit tangential, but... a doctor in India was using local anesthesia only for laprascopic BTL's with clamps, at a rate of 40 to 50 pts per hour! He published a total of 250,000+ BTLs.

BS - not even remotely possible unless someone else does everything except applying the clip.
 
brotherbloat said:
Just wondered how many GYNs would do this--i.e. a lap. proceudre, such as a lap. ovarian cystectomy, without general anesth--local or epidural only.

I suspect I may have an ovarian cyst and am terrified of general anesthsia! Yikes! I'd rather be awake and in pain during the surgery rather than undergo a general!

I've seen a couple of local laparoscopies for tubals. They're horrible.

You'd be hard pressed to find anyone to do it with even epidural, much less local. Abdominal insufflation is very uncomfortable - the epidural wouldn't touch it. You'd be in a steep trendelenberg position. Breathing would be a bitch. Plus there's no way to numb anything on the inside that they'll be moving around, grabbing, or cutting.

The risk of death from general anesthesia in a healthy patient is on the order of 1:250,000 or less. What's your worry? Get your IV, then get loaded up with versed, and you won't care.
 
jwk said:
BS - not even remotely possible unless someone else does everything except applying the clip.

take it up with this guy:

Mehta PV, "A total of 250,136 laparoscopic sterilizations by a single operator." Br J Obstet Gynaecol 1989 Sep;96(9):1024-34.

A total of 250,136 women were sterilized as outpatients by a single operator working with a team in ad hoc sterilization 'camps'. Falope rings were applied by the laparocator under local anaesthesia, with premedication but without vaginal manipulation (in all but the first 10,100). Volunteers were recruited and the operation discussed in nearby villages. The women were numbered at registration and arranged in groups, each comprised of two rows (odd or even numbers) of 15 women, leading to two improvised operating tables or benches in a steep Trendelenburg position. With good teamwork the number of women sterilized was generally 40 to 50/h. There were 12 associated deaths, not all attributable to the procedure, a mortality rate of 4.8 per 100,000; 8 major complications (3.2 per 100,000) required laparotomy or admission to hospital. In a follow-up survey of 84,940 responders to a questionnaire only 90 pregnancies (0.1%) were reported to have been conceived after the cycle of surgery. The results suggest that the rapid 'no exposure' technique as used in this series is safe and acceptable in an Indian context. If others could acquire this skill it could with appropriate adaptation make appreciable inroads into the unmet need for female sterilization in many other developing countries."
 
First of all, I reject the notion of 40-50 tubals an hour whether it be a Falope ring, clip, bipolar, etc. Even if the guy was doing it, what the hell kind of precautions was he taking? I mean to even insert an IUD it takes at lease a few minutes.

Secondly, our friend from India should'vbe taken time to read the CREST study results to see the failure rates of Falope Rings. With the advent of the amp meter in the OR the bipolar effectiveness rates are in the 90%.

Interesting thread though.
 
DrBuzzLightYear said:
take it up with this guy:

Mehta PV, "A total of 250,136 laparoscopic sterilizations by a single operator." Br J Obstet Gynaecol 1989 Sep;96(9):1024-34.

A total of 250,136 women were sterilized as outpatients by a single operator working with a team in ad hoc sterilization 'camps'. Falope rings were applied by the laparocator under local anaesthesia, with premedication but without vaginal manipulation (in all but the first 10,100). Volunteers were recruited and the operation discussed in nearby villages. The women were numbered at registration and arranged in groups, each comprised of two rows (odd or even numbers) of 15 women, leading to two improvised operating tables or benches in a steep Trendelenburg position. With good teamwork the number of women sterilized was generally 40 to 50/h. There were 12 associated deaths, not all attributable to the procedure, a mortality rate of 4.8 per 100,000; 8 major complications (3.2 per 100,000) required laparotomy or admission to hospital. In a follow-up survey of 84,940 responders to a questionnaire only 90 pregnancies (0.1%) were reported to have been conceived after the cycle of surgery. The results suggest that the rapid 'no exposure' technique as used in this series is safe and acceptable in an Indian context. If others could acquire this skill it could with appropriate adaptation make appreciable inroads into the unmet need for female sterilization in many other developing countries."

Uh, "working with a team" is the key phrase, and kind of contradicts the "single operator" claim. As long as you have some else injecting the local, making your incision, putting in the trocar and scope and then pulling them out and closing for you, big deal. If all you have to do is step up and fire the ring, that's easy.

Hey, using that same concept, I can easily intubate >900 patients a day. I'll have two rows of patients lined up in the OR, IV's and monitors in place, have the patient just deep enough as I walk to the head of the table, pop in the tube (30 sec per patient max), then walk to the next one and repeat. That's 120 per hour x 8 hours (less 30 minutes for lunch of course). You think Anesthesia and Analgesia would be interested?
 
jwk said:
You think Anesthesia and Analgesia would be interested?

probably not, i'm only vaguely interested in what you're saying.
 
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