Is Reapplying dangerous or just plain dumb?

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When I see someone who had a stellar MCAT score early enough that they could have/should have applied in the previous cycle but are standing here, appearing to be applying for the second time, I always wonder why this applicant wasn't snatched up in the previous cycle. What is wrong with them? What might be wrong would be the hubris of applying to too few schools or less than broadly, the procrastination/perfectionist tendencies to apply too late, or a personality issue that results in poor interviewing. So, a reapplicant is always up against those concerns.

If you get nothing in the next cycle and the cycle after that, would you be okay with never being a doctor at all?? Could you live with what could have been? If so, reapply. If not, take the DO offer and make the most of it.
 
Just wanted to pop in and share my story OP

During the 2017 cycle I applied to many many MDs and three DOs. I didn’t receive any MD interviews and received two DO interviews. I got accepted into a state DO and declined the out of state interview.

Everyone knows the stigma around DOs and how it’s “harder” to get residencies (although if you really want something and work hard, nothing will hold you back, but that’s another story). Anyway so I really did not want to go to the DO for this reason including other reasons that probably only pertain to me. So I contacted the DO school and asked them if they could hold my seat for a year, they said yes. I studied really hard for the MCAT, improved my application, and reapplied for the 2018 cycle. Ended up this cycle with 5 in state MD interviews and an acceptance to my top choice. Nothing ever came up about my DO acceptance. I called them and said thank you for holding my seat but I’m going else where. They said congratulations and good luck. Clean and easy.

Really sit there and think about what you want OP. This is your career and your future, it really doesn’t matter what any strangers on the internet have to say. If something isn’t sitting right with you and you wanna try again, go for it. Good luck!

I think we found OP's solution. No guarantee they'll say yes, but I think it's worth a shot. If it works, you'll lose a year in physician salary and also a lot of application-related money but no matter what you still go to medical school.
 
When I see someone who had a stellar MCAT score early enough that they could have/should have applied in the previous cycle but are standing here, appearing to be applying for the second time, I always wonder why this applicant wasn't snatched up in the previous cycle. What is wrong with them? What might be wrong would be the hubris of applying to too few schools or less than broadly, the procrastination/perfectionist tendencies to apply too late, or a personality issue that results in poor interviewing. So, a reapplicant is always up against those concerns.

If you get nothing in the next cycle and the cycle after that, would you be okay with never being a doctor at all?? Could you live with what could have been? If so, reapply. If not, take the DO offer and make the most of it.
This brings up an interesting point. I'm a non-trad looking to apply not this summer but the next after I have completed a yearlong post-bacc. In order to maximize the amount of time I have to study for the MCAT, I had planned on taking it this August. Would this be a potential red flag for when I do apply?
 
I think we found OP's solution. No guarantee they'll say yes, but I think it's worth a shot. If it works, you'll lose a year in physician salary and also a lot of application-related money but no matter what you still go to medical school.

Or he doesn’t get in MD again since he’s a reapplicant who has already been rejected once by his state school, and he doesn’t get in DO again because he turned down a DO acceptance already, and then he doesn’t get to be a doctor at all.

Or he could just go to the med school he’s already been accepted to.
 
Or he doesn’t get in MD again since he’s a reapplicant who has already been rejected once by his state school, and he doesn’t get in DO again because he turned down a DO acceptance already, and then he doesn’t get to be a doctor at all.

Or he could just go to the med school he’s already been accepted to.

Look at the part of @mamadrama ’s post that I bolded. I’m suggesting that OP do the same thing and ask the DO school at which he/she has been accepted if they could hold his/her seat for a year. If they say no I would not suggest that OP reapply MD.
 
Look at the part of @mamadrama ’s post that I bolded. I’m suggesting that OP do the same thing and ask the DO school at which he/she has been accepted if they could hold his/her seat for a year. If they say no I would not suggest that OP reapply MD.

Ah, missed that. I don’t think you can apply while holding an acceptance to a med school, but I could be wrong.
 
This brings up an interesting point. I'm a non-trad looking to apply not this summer but the next after I have completed a yearlong post-bacc. In order to maximize the amount of time I have to study for the MCAT, I had planned on taking it this August. Would this be a potential red flag for when I do apply?

What is the purpose of the post-bac after MCAT?? Also, Aug MCAT is so late that no one would assume that you applied during that cycle.

I'm talking about someone who interviews during a gap year and who took the MCAT between sophmore summer and junior spring and who presents with a 3.95/518+. Sometimes one can gleen from the letters or essays that this is a reapplicant. Sometimes, the applicant will address the reason for not applying earlier which saves us the wondering.
 
Could you explain what you mean by "be more PC/general"?

I plan to have my application looked at by other knowledgable people but other medical students and advisors have told me everything seemed fine and they thought the timing was the issue. And I definitely understand DO schools not accepting me because of declining a previous acceptance, there just seems to be no consensus on how MD schools react to this

You always have to look at it from the perspective of the school. What you're basically trying to tell them right now is that the school that you were accepted to, which has now processed your application, read your application, interviewed you, debated you at committee, and accepted you based on the reasons you gave why you would like to be at their school, is now not an acceptable choice for you. Why would the schools you apply to next year not think that you might do the same thing to them? Schools you haven't interviewed at or interviewed at and were not accepted might understand if the information is not released, but if it is then there's an obvious reason why all parties involved would like to clear up that misunderstanding.

If your significant other left their previous partner at the alter, wouldn't you be just a little worried they could do the same thing to you?
 
My cgpa and sgpa are both in the high 3.7's and my MCAT was 513. Should I reapply MD?

Hell yes. This isn’t even a question.

although if you really want something and work hard, nothing will hold you back, but that’s another story)

This is unequivocally false.


I am a DO student who is doing well in class, already has good research output, and is very confident in my ability to match my field of choice. The difference is I am busting my butt every day to land in a field that average MDs essentially walk into. I don’t regret my choice, but the truth is that the letters matter when it comes to residency selection and you have a good chance of landing in an MD school. Next cycle apply to 20+ MD and your top 10 DO schools. I can essentially guarantee you will get more DO acceptances, and the potential payoff of going MD is worth the opportunity cost.
 
If you get nothing in the next cycle and the cycle after that, would you be okay with never being a doctor at all?? Could you live with what could have been? If so, reapply. If not, take the DO offer and make the most of it.

That question is what keeps me up at night. When you said the next cycle and the cycle after that; is there a precedent that after three cycles schools won't look at an application any more?
 
That question is what keeps me up at night. When you said the next cycle and the cycle after that; is there a precedent that after three cycles schools won't look at an application any more?

Some schools will say, "hey dude, get a clue"
 
That question is what keeps me up at night. When you said the next cycle and the cycle after that; is there a precedent that after three cycles schools won't look at an application any more?

Some schools (Einstein for example) don’t even allow a third application.
 
Joining the party late, I know, but here's my opinion: take the DO acceptance, become a doctor, and never once think about the "coulda beens". You shot yourself in the foot by applying late and only to eight schools and still got an acceptance? Turning it down would be the epitome of looking a gift horse in the mouth, not to mention elitist and totally wasteful. Might I ask why you bothered applying to DO schools in the first place if you were just going to have some kind of existential crisis when you got accepted by one?

@Goro's post above about a bird in the hand versus two in the bush is apt. That expression is a proverb for a reason. You've got a bird in the hand. Don't let it get away. Work hard in med school, become a DO, and you'll find that far more doors are open to you than closed.
 
I don’t believe in trickle down economics, but I do believe in trickle down medical school acceptances. When you give up your seat at what I’m assuming is an established DO school, it will cause an acceptance cascade of people getting into more preferred schools until some kid with a 500, 3.5 gets an acceptance letter from a newer school and starts jumping up and down while screaming, crying, and speeddialing mom. Drop it for the Rudy’s of this cycle, because I’m betting you weren’t jumping up and down screaming when you got this accept.
 
Work hard in med school, become a DO, and you'll find that far more doors are open to you than closed.

Sorry HomeSkool, I know you're an attending and I fully respect your opinion, but on this topic I completely disagree, at least now with the merger and the current climate. I see what is happening to the current 4th years with the merger and someone with the OPs stats owes it to themselves to give themselves a true shot at MD with an early and broad application. With how many new grads there are being pumped out, the relative stagnation of residency spots, and the true bias that DO grads face in the match in most fields there is absolutely no reason OP should take that acceptance without giving MD an honest effort. The difference in opportunities for an average MD far outstrip the opportunities for the average DO.

OP you owe it to yourself and your career to give MD a real shot. Anyone who says otherwise simply doesn't understand the current climate, or doesn't have your best interests at heart. I repeat my previous advice: apply to 20+ MD schools on June 1 and apply to 10-12 of your favorite DO schools. You will get another DO acceptance, and you have a decent shot at MD. No MD school will care you turned down a DO acceptance, and they probably won't ever even ask so you don't even have to tell them. Some DO schools might ask, but the only school it really hurts you at is the school you will be turning down.
 
Sorry HomeSkool, I know you're an attending and I fully respect your opinion, but on this topic I completely disagree, at least now with the merger and the current climate. I see what is happening to the current 4th years with the merger and someone with the OPs stats owes it to themselves to give themselves a true shot at MD with an early and broad application. With how many new grads there are being pumped out, the relative stagnation of residency spots, and the true bias that DO grads face in the match in most fields there is absolutely no reason OP should take that acceptance without giving MD an honest effort. The difference in opportunities for an average MD far outstrip the opportunities for the average DO.

OP you owe it to yourself and your career to give MD a real shot. Anyone who says otherwise simply doesn't understand the current climate, or doesn't have your best interests at heart. I repeat my previous advice: apply to 20+ MD schools on June 1 and apply to 10-12 of your favorite DO schools. You will get another DO acceptance, and you have a decent shot at MD. No MD school will care you turned down a DO acceptance, and they probably won't ever even ask so you don't even have to tell them. Some DO schools might ask, but the only school it really hurts you at is the school you will be turning down.
No apology necessary, you're just as entitled to your opinion as I am to mine. I get where you're coming from and I don't deny there's a persistent bias against DOs (which, fortunately, is gradually disappearing). But I'm a naturally risk-averse person, and I have a hard time recommending that someone turn down a guaranteed acceptance for a far-from-certain second shot. Ultimately, the OP's risk tolerance is going to play a significant role in his/her decision process.
 
OP you owe it to yourself and your career to give MD a real shot.

I totally agree with you most of the time, but this is not good advice. The guy has an acceptance (to a DO school, yes--but he will still be a doctor and is not automatically shut out from all specialties not primary care as SDN would make it seem). He also already interviewed at his state school and another MD school and was straight up rejected. Giving up an acceptance for a poor shot at MD is way too risky.
 
I think what should be driving the decision is which is more important, being a doctor, specialty, or prestige. If prestige is most important to you (i.e. having the MD after your name) then try again. If your specialty is most important and your chances are more difficult as a DO then try again. If being a doctor is most important to you then take the acceptance and move on.

Sent from my Pixel XL using SDN mobile
 
Sorry HomeSkool, I know you're an attending and I fully respect your opinion, but on this topic I completely disagree, at least now with the merger and the current climate. I see what is happening to the current 4th years with the merger and someone with the OPs stats owes it to themselves to give themselves a true shot at MD with an early and broad application. With how many new grads there are being pumped out, the relative stagnation of residency spots, and the true bias that DO grads face in the match in most fields there is absolutely no reason OP should take that acceptance without giving MD an honest effort. The difference in opportunities for an average MD far outstrip the opportunities for the average DO.

OP you owe it to yourself and your career to give MD a real shot. Anyone who says otherwise simply doesn't understand the current climate, or doesn't have your best interests at heart. I repeat my previous advice: apply to 20+ MD schools on June 1 and apply to 10-12 of your favorite DO schools. You will get another DO acceptance, and you have a decent shot at MD. No MD school will care you turned down a DO acceptance, and they probably won't ever even ask so you don't even have to tell them. Some DO schools might ask, but the only school it really hurts you at is the school you will be turning down.

Unfortunately, OP’s post-interview record for MD schools isn’t good considering they got rejected by a few schools. Turning down DO acceptance to reapply MD isn’t a good move since there is a significant, if not likely, chance that OP will not be accepted anywhere in next cycle. Better to be a DO than not being a doctor at all.
 
I totally agree with you most of the time, but this is not good advice. The guy has an acceptance (to a DO school, yes--but he will still be a doctor and is not automatically shut out from all specialties not primary care as SDN would make it seem). He also already interviewed at his state school and another MD school and was straight up rejected. Giving up an acceptance for a poor shot at MD is way too risky.

No it’s not. I would bet my seat in medical school that OP would receive another DO acceptance. And as a current DO student who knows a lot of medical students I can tell you that there are significant doors shut to an average DO compared to an average MD. I’m not even talking competitive specialties and super star applicants, where there are even more doors shut.

Unfortunately, OP’s post-interview record for MD schools isn’t good considering they got rejected by a few schools. Turning down DO acceptance to reapply MD isn’t a good move since there is a significant, if not likely, chance that OP will not be accepted anywhere in next cycle. Better to be a DO than not being a doctor at all.

Did I miss that in the OP? How many schools did they apply to and how many did they interview at?

It’s an SDN myth that someone like OP would be shut out of DO schools because they turned down a DO acceptance.
 
No it’s not. I would bet my seat in medical school that OP would receive another DO acceptance. And as a current DO student who knows a lot of medical students I can tell you that there are significant doors shut to an average DO compared to an average MD. I’m not even talking competitive specialties and super star applicants, where there are even more doors shut.

Did I miss that in the OP? How many schools did they apply to and how many did they interview at?

It’s an SDN myth that someone like OP would be shut out of DO schools because they turned down a DO acceptance.

Then OP would lose about $200K in salary on the gamble. It's pretty easy to gamble with other people's money.

I can guarantee you that if my Adcom found out a candidate turned down an accept to reapply a second year, that kid would get rejected. And stop projecting.
 
Did I miss that in the OP? How many schools did they apply to and how many did they interview at?

It’s an SDN myth that someone like OP would be shut out of DO schools because they turned down a DO acceptance.

He had two IIs—one from his state school and one from an OOS—and was rejected post interview from both.
 
Then OP would lose about $200K in salary on the gamble. It's pretty easy to gamble with other people's money.

I can guarantee you that if my Adcom found out a candidate turned down an accept to reapply a second year, that kid would get rejected. And stop projecting.

So? That’s 200k that is easily made up. We’re talking about a 30 year career. I’m not projecting and I would gamble with my own money in OPs situation. 100%. They have a 513 and a 3.7. If they apply to 12 DO schools they will get interviews at half of them, even with the prior DO acceptance. I’ve seen far too many anecdotes to believe otherwise. More anecdotes than digits.
He had two IIs—one from his state school and one from an OOS—and was rejected post interview from both.

Out of 5 schools....
Actually, while I respect your experience, I think you are letting your own feelings cloud your judgement of risk and reward.

The risk you guys keep going on about is extremely minimal. The reward is huge. Career altering.
 
So? That’s 200k that is easily made up. We’re talking about a 30 year career. I’m not projecting and I would gamble with my own money in OPs situation. 100%. They have a 513 and a 3.7. If they apply to 12 DO schools they will get interviews at half of them, even with the prior DO acceptance. I’ve seen far too many anecdotes to believe otherwise. More anecdotes than digits.


Out of 5 schools....


The risk you guys keep going on about is extremely minimal. The reward is huge. Career altering.

The risk of a repeat performance and not getting in is minimal? Again, I think you’re letting your personal feelings get the better of you. But we can agree to disagree.
 
He'd be giving up at least one year of attending physician salary, and at most his entire career as a physician.

The chance that this is his one shot is significant.

That's a big gamble for little to no gain. If he's got the inherent drive and competence to do, say, surgery, he'll make it whether he goes DO or MD.
 
He'd be giving up at least one year of attending physician salary, and at most his entire career as a physician.

The chance that this is his one shot is significant.

That's a big gamble for little to no gain. If he's got the inherent drive and competence to do, say, surgery, he'll make it whether he goes DO or MD.

Not for fields like derm, ENT, neurosurg, ortho etc where the DO degree will hold back regardless of drive or competence. But these fields are hard to get for MD students and turning down DO acceptance to reapply MD is a bad move.
 
Not for fields like derm, ENT, neurosurg, ortho etc where the DO degree will hold back regardless of drive or competence. But these fields are hard to get for MD students and turning down DO acceptance to reapply MD is a bad move.

If he's a marginal enough applicant to get rejected from 2/2 MD schools, he's probably not looking at a future in dermatology or neurosurgery.
 
OP applied to 5 MD schools and 3 DO. He applied late, and still got 2 MD interviews. You guys aren’t getting it, there is essentially a zero percent chance OP doesn’t get into another DO school with a 3.7/513. The ONLY chance they don’t get another DO acceptance is if they apply to the same amount of schools. With a DO list of 12+ schools they will almost assuredly gain another acceptance.

Not for fields like derm, ENT, neurosurg, ortho etc where the DO degree will hold back regardless of drive or competence. But these fields are hard to get for MD students and turning down DO acceptance to reapply MD is a bad move.

For any field except maybe FM and Peds. For a DO to get into university level IM they have to have above average bord scores. Below average MDs walk into these residencies. In almost every single field the DO has to be better than their MD counterpart to get the same opportunities.

I’m not saying DOs don’t land in these fields or programs, but the barrier to entry is higher. Again, this isn’t to even get into discussing top programs or the super competitive specialties.
 
Wait, OP, did you contact the DO school that accepted you and ask if they’d be willing to hold your seat for a year?

If they say yes, then you’re Gucci and you don’t need to worry about this difficult decision.
 
The Wishful and Magic thinking that's going on in this thread is quite eye-opening

If we lived by anecdotes, it would seem that women can smoke and drink during pregnancy and have a big healthy baby and live to be 100 eating fried eggs and sausage every day for breakfast.

The best odds of having a healthy baby or living to be 100 would argue aginst those behaviors but someone will always come around and say "but my great grandmother..."
 
If we lived by anecdotes, it would seem that women can smoke and drink during pregnancy and have a big healthy baby and live to be 100 eating fried eggs and sausage every day for breakfast.

The best odds of having a healthy baby or living to be 100 would argue aginst those behaviors but someone will always come around and say "but my great grandmother..."

My ancestors from one of the longest-living populations insisted that their longevity was due to eating pork.
 
If we lived by anecdotes, it would seem that women can smoke and drink during pregnancy and have a big healthy baby and live to be 100 eating fried eggs and sausage every day for breakfast.

The best odds of having a healthy baby or living to be 100 would argue aginst those behaviors but someone will always come around and say "but my great grandmother..."

I had a patient I tried for an entire year to get to quit smoking and drinking, and to change his diet. Wasn't able to do it before he got kicked out of the Navy, but every time I would talk about the effects to his health, he would tell me that he feels fine and has good labs. Some people just are not capable of looking beyond the present. If eating Applebee's and McDonald's every day isn't making me unhealthy now, why would it make me unhealthy in 20 years? If I could get into a DO school this cycle, why wouldn't I be able to get into at least a DO school next cycle?
 
The Wishful and Magic thinking that's going on in this thread is quite eye-opening

He applied to 5 MD schools... there is no magic thinking going on. Magic thinking would be applying to 20 MD schools, 10 DO schools, and then ending up with only one DO acceptance and then asking about reapplying. We aren’t talking about a 3.3/502 applicant either. OP has a 3.7/513.

I stand by what I’ve said, OP will get into another DO school if they reapply. You misunderstood what I said earlier, I would be willing to gamble my current medical seat. That’s how confident I am that they will get another DO seat.

I am honestly baffled with how I am the only one who is arguing that an applicant with a 3.7/513, who applied late, who only applied to 5 MD schools, should give MD an honest shot.
 
He applied to 5 MD schools... there is no magic thinking going on. Magic thinking would be applying to 20 MD schools, 10 DO schools, and then ending up with only one DO acceptance and then asking about reapplying. We aren’t talking about a 3.3/502 applicant either. OP has a 3.7/513.

I stand by what I’ve said, OP will get into another DO school if they reapply. You misunderstood what I said earlier, I would be willing to gamble my current medical seat. That’s how confident I am that they will get another DO seat.

I am honestly baffled with how I am the only one who is arguing that an applicant with a 3.7/513, who applied late, who only applied to 5 MD schools, should give MD an honest shot.

Any old-timers here who remember Truth or Consequences? Would you choose to take the prize or trade it for what's behind door number two?
 
throwaway because why not

OP, I was in a similar situation last cycle. I applied to AMCAS really late with a rushed personal statement and bad school list, so of course I didn't get any MD love. Later on, I threw out a few DO apps. I interviewed at a DO school and I started to second-guess osteopathic medicine - the dean had a huge chip on his shoulder about how DOs treat patients better than MDs. In hindsight, I should have immediately withdrawn my application following the interview, but I got waitlisted anyway so I decided not to worry about it. A few months later, I was accepted off the waitlist. I declined the acceptance, and instead chose to reapply for the MD2022 cycle - submitted the very first day - and I feel I painted a much better picture of myself the second time through, since I wasn't nearly as rushed. Buffed up my service hours over the summer and currently killing an SMP, with an acceptance to a US MD school and waiting to hear back from another. I would do it all over again if I had to, because now I'm going somewhere where I'll actually be happy.

So obviously I think you should reapply, and this time give it 100%: early app, good school list, good PS/secondaries. The fact that you got interviews at MD schools even when you applied near the deadline suggests that you are a strong candidate. Some people on this thread think that your postII rejections raise red flags but I disagree. Getting rejected postII doesn't *always* mean a poor interview. Some schools are more trigger happy with the reject button than the waitlist button. Maybe the other students in your interview cohort were really strong. Maybe you interviewed too late in the cycle. Who knows. And even if your interview skills were to blame, you have a good few months to work on them. And it goes without saying that you should find something to improve your app during the gap year - so think long and hard about what you think the weakest part of your app is.

so tldr: Reapply, get that MD, and good luck
 
Any old-timers here who remember Truth or Consequences? Would you choose to take the prize or trade it for what's behind door number two?


With all due respect LizzyM, I don’t really think that someone in your position really has a grasp on just how much a student’s career options are changed by choosing a DO school. OP never gave MD a real chance, even with the interviews. OP will get another DO acceptance, maybe not at Goro’s school, but they will almost assuredly get one. It’s a complete myth that they will be blackballed by DO schools.

OP, you asked my opinion and I have given it. Some people will disagree, but if I were in your shoes I would drop the acceptance and reapply to 20 MD schools and 12 DO.

On that note I’m done with this thread. It’s your career and ultimately you will have to live with the result either way. Goodluck with whatever you choose.
 
You know what? I actually agree that OP will probably get into another DO program if he/she reapplies.

What I wonder about is the caliber of the DO program. I bet some of the stronger programs won't bite because of turning down the previous DO acceptance, but the brand new programs that don't have as large or as competitive of an applicant pool might still give him a shot.

So, OP also needs to take into account the caliber of his current DO acceptance. Is it a reputable program that has a history of matching well? If so, it would not be smart to reapply, because the DO programs that might accept him next year would be a downgrade. However, if OP's only acceptance so far is, say, ICOM... that's different. Might be worth the gamble if that current acceptance is at a brand new school.
 
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