Is residency and medical school worth it?

[whoareyou123]

I’m an older non traditional woman who had her first child btwn my 1st/2nd year. I am struggling with balancing medical school and contemplating the realities of the future (ie residency) and how it will dramatically impact my family in a negative way. Is the pain of residency worth it if you don’t need the income?

For context, becoming a doctor will make 0 impact on my families finances. My husband makes $$ that I don’t need to work and can have anything I want. Becoming a doctor is purely for my personal happiness but it only benefits me. It is a net negative for my family…I also want another child and imagining having one during residency gives me so much anxiety. I know this is such a personal decision. But if you didn’t need the money, is residency worth the pain and sacrifices of being away from your family?

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[DrMetal]

I’m an older non traditional woman who had her first child btwn my 1st/2nd year. I am struggling with balancing medical school and contemplating the realities of the future (ie residency) and how it will dramatically impact my family in a negative way. Is the pain of residency worth it if you don’t need the income?

For context, becoming a doctor will make 0 impact on my families finances. My husband makes $$ that I don’t need to work and can have anything I want. Becoming a doctor is purely for my personal happiness but it only benefits me. It is a net negative for my family…I also want another child and imagining having one during residency gives me so much anxiety. I know this is such a personal decision. But if you didn’t need the money, is residency worth the pain and sacrifices of being away from your family?

It really depends on what you mean by "worth it". What's your definition of worth? It also depends on what specialty (or what kind of physician) you intend to be. Every medical specialty is its own planet, and there can be a world of a difference between them.

FWIW, it has gotten easier for residents to have kids. You're allowed maternity leave (your graduation may be delayed), but if you don't care about that, then it's not an issue. Now, it's still hard to be with your kids during residency; if your spouse works, then you'll have to rely on daycare, nannies, etc. If that's something you can't fathom, then you may have issues.

 

[EthylMethylMan]

The answer to this question varies from person to person based on what's most important to each individual. I obviously don't know anything about you outside of what you posted here, but based on this post, I'd lean towards a "not worth it" in your case. This is not me saying you are incapable or anything, but you bring up anxiety about not being able to expand your family and not having as much time for your kids as you would want. These are totally valid concerns. Med school only gets busier, with a brief respite in the second half of MS4. Then in residency it's a ****show, irrespective of what specialty you're in. As mentioned by DrMetal, the leniency in things like maternity leave has improved for residents in the last couple decades, but you're still going to be away from the kiddos for a strong majority of each week. When you're an attending, things certainly can improve, and you can even work part-time in many specialties. But you still would be missing out on the very early years of your kids' lives. Bear in mind I am not saying you would inevitably be a bad parent, but you would certainly be less present. And it sounds like that kind of thing is troubling for you. From my very limited insight into your situation and perspective, it sounds to me like you would come out the other side with regrets. I cast my vote for "not worth it."

 

[tr]

I’m an older non traditional woman who had her first child btwn my 1st/2nd year. I am struggling with balancing medical school and contemplating the realities of the future (ie residency) and how it will dramatically impact my family in a negative way. Is the pain of residency worth it if you don’t need the income?

For context, becoming a doctor will make 0 impact on my families finances. My husband makes $$ that I don’t need to work and can have anything I want. Becoming a doctor is purely for my personal happiness but it only benefits me. It is a net negative for my family…I also want another child and imagining having one during residency gives me so much anxiety. I know this is such a personal decision. But if you didn’t need the money, is residency worth the pain and sacrifices of being away from your family?

Are you considering dropping out of med school? If so, what is your alternative plan? Full time at-home parent? Alternative/prior career?

I'd try to think about the long term perspective on this. Where do you see yourself in 10 or 15 years?

Babies are tough and demanding and they really make you rethink your priorities. But they do eventually grow up. That 24/7 demand phase only lasts a couple of years.

I had a kid in residency, one in fellowship, and one as an attending. The residency kid was tough, NGL I briefly considered dropping out at that point. Luckily my PD let me go part time, my MIL came to stay and help us out, and somehow we made it through. I love my life now. My job is awesome and super controllable. My kids are fantastic. I'm so glad I didn't drop out of residency. YMMV

But also, consider reading some of the ancient archived posts on MomMD by women who dropped out of medicine when they had babies and were trying to figure out how to re-enter ten+ years down the road. That looks like a nightmare. Much harder than just trying to make it through. So I wouldn't quit unless you are 100% sure you never want to come back.

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

It doesn’t sound like you want it, so I would say not worth it in this case. Though it may be good to have something to fall back on as you never know what could happen. For example SBF founder of FTX net worth 5 days ago: 16 billion net work at the moment: -600 million

 

[gutonc]

I’m an older non traditional woman who had her first child btwn my 1st/2nd year. I am struggling with balancing medical school and contemplating the realities of the future (ie residency) and how it will dramatically impact my family in a negative way. Is the pain of residency worth it if you don’t need the income?

For context, becoming a doctor will make 0 impact on my families finances. My husband makes $$ that I don’t need to work and can have anything I want. Becoming a doctor is purely for my personal happiness but it only benefits me. It is a net negative for my family…I also want another child and imagining having one during residency gives me so much anxiety. I know this is such a personal decision. But if you didn’t need the money, is residency worth the pain and sacrifices of being away from your family?

So first question...do you want to be a physician? If you do, don't quit now, since you won't really have another chance in the future. If, OTOH, you're uncertain about that, then now is the time to quit.

If you're still on the fence, consider what you want your life to be like in 5-10 years when your kids are in school and don't need you around the house all the time and what you're going to do with your day. If going back to a prior career, or a different (non-medicine) career, or not having a career at all and being a stay at home whatever sounds like it will make you happy, then quit med school tomorrow. If you can't imagine not being a physician at that point (or any point between now and then), you have your answer.

Medicine is hard. Parenting is hard. Combining the two are hard. But lots of people do it...one, the other, both of them. But if you're not all in (on either of them), it can be a disaster.

 

[HemeOncHopeful19]

I’m an older non traditional woman who had her first child btwn my 1st/2nd year. I am struggling with balancing medical school and contemplating the realities of the future (ie residency) and how it will dramatically impact my family in a negative way. Is the pain of residency worth it if you don’t need the income?

For context, becoming a doctor will make 0 impact on my families finances. My husband makes $$ that I don’t need to work and can have anything I want. Becoming a doctor is purely for my personal happiness but it only benefits me. It is a net negative for my family…I also want another child and imagining having one during residency gives me so much anxiety. I know this is such a personal decision. But if you didn’t need the money, is residency worth the pain and sacrifices of being away from your family?

If I didn’t need the money no probably not. But how sure are you that you will NEVER need the money?

Is husband a cardiothoracic surgeon who is recession proof or a programmer at Twitter/Meta? How well is he insured? How are divorce laws in your state? How are you doing in medical school so far, would you be a candidate for something like Derm? Would your family even be able to move for residency if hubby is that big of a deal at work?

What is your husband’s opinion? I’m in a dual physician household and my wife could quit tomorrow and we’d probably be fine, but that doesn’t mean I’d be fine with it.

 

[gutonc]

What is your husband’s opinion? I’m in a dual physician household and my wife could quit tomorrow and we’d probably be fine, but that doesn’t mean I’d be fine with it.

I can't emphasize this point enough. It's a major factor in why I'm no longer married. Whatever plan you make, ensure you're both fully onboard with it.

 

[smq123]

I’m an older non traditional woman who had her first child btwn my 1st/2nd year. I am struggling with balancing medical school and contemplating the realities of the future (ie residency) and how it will dramatically impact my family in a negative way. Is the pain of residency worth it if you don’t need the income?

For context, becoming a doctor will make 0 impact on my families finances. My husband makes $$ that I don’t need to work and can have anything I want. Becoming a doctor is purely for my personal happiness but it only benefits me. It is a net negative for my family…I also want another child and imagining having one during residency gives me so much anxiety. I know this is such a personal decision. But if you didn’t need the money, is residency worth the pain and sacrifices of being away from your family?

I would argue that becoming a doctor does not just benefit you. There is a benefit to having your children see you pursue a career that you are passionate about. The key, of course, is that you're genuinely passionate about becoming a physician.

The pain of residency is worth it if you want to be a doctor. The income plays less into it. You can make a reasonable income doing other things - a nurse, a PA, etc.

 

[cerebral edema]

I wouldn’t do it again

 

[Iamnew2]

I’m an older non traditional woman who had her first child btwn my 1st/2nd year. I am struggling with balancing medical school and contemplating the realities of the future (ie residency) and how it will dramatically impact my family in a negative way. Is the pain of residency worth it if you don’t need the income?

For context, becoming a doctor will make 0 impact on my families finances. My husband makes $$ that I don’t need to work and can have anything I want. Becoming a doctor is purely for my personal happiness but it only benefits me. It is a net negative for my family…I also want another child and imagining having one during residency gives me so much anxiety. I know this is such a personal decision. But if you didn’t need the money, is residency worth the pain and sacrifices of being away from your family?

I'll give you my perspective as a woman, a doctor, medical director, and someone whose gone through IVF in order to have kiddos. Question that has been mentioned to you is, first do you want to be a doctor? If the answer is *no* then yes quitting now makes sense. If wanting to be a doctor is someone important to you, then realistically the pains of med school/residency are generally worth it. If you want to be a doctor but are concerned as to when you have kids/more kids, that's a different question to ask. The rest of your plan really depends on answer to question #1.

I was speaking with my husband about this recently in fact, and saying that there really is never a "good time" to have kids per se - particularly for women in medicine. As a med student they say oh it's too hard during med school. In residency, it's tough because of all the responsibilities. In fellowship, it's a short time so dont want to screw that up. As an attending, you'll "screw over" your colleagues if you take time off for kids. So the answer in my mind is to have kids at a time where you and your spouse feel it's the right time. Medicine is busy - whether in med school or as an attending, and there is no perfect time. I think that the pain of med school and residency is temporary - I'm sure it's challenging with a kiddo. But it's also challenging when you are an attending, or in a leadership position. Med school and residency pass, but if you throw med school and/or residency out, as someone else mentioned, that boat will sail and it will be very difficult to get back. Of course if you don't want to be a doctor, that doesn't matter.

If you want to be a doctor, I'd say stick it out with med school and residency and find the support needed to have someone help you in the process - spouse, parents, siblings, nannies, etc. There are plenty of residents who have kids during residency and manage to make it fine. As someone said also think long term - will you be a stay at home mom? Will that make you happy? What happens when the kids are older and don't need the constant assistance? I have step kiddos and the older ones don't require much help. Will you be happy giving up a medical career that will span your life when your kids might be out by 18, 20, etc and have their own life?

What happens if you get divorced - sure your husband makes a good income but if you divorced/he passed, who will provide for you and your kids? If you quit Medicine and stay at home, will your husband be ok with it? Will he be ok with you staying at home? Some husbands are ok, some are not. If he's not ok with it, will that impact your decision?
So I'd say you gotta decide whether being a doctor is important to you, and have a conversation with your husband to see what he feels about this too.

 

[swamzi]

That fact your asking this question -> go to therapy, money isn't everything

 

[IonClaws]

Nope.

 

[deleted721365]

Nope.

Are you practicing man? Or whatever happened with your situation? Hope all is well!

 

[IonClaws]

Are you practicing man? Or whatever happened with your situation? Hope all is well!

Still fighting the board, but looks like I will have a license in 2023 at some point.

 

[Iamnew2]

Still fighting the board, but looks like I will have a license in 2023 at some point.

What board are you fighting and why?

 

[IonClaws]

What board are you fighting and why?

The medical board, because I need a medical license.

 

[michaelrack]

It doesn’t sound like you want it, so I would say not worth it in this case. Though it may be good to have something to fall back on as you never know what could happen. For example SBF founder of FTX net worth 5 days ago: 16 billion net work at the moment: -600 million

it's about zero now

 

[dozitgetchahi]

You have to balance a lot of things to decide if this is “worth it” or not.

As much as we all have our own opinions on midlevels…OP is the sort of person who probably would have been better served going to PA school. You get 80% of the doctor experience for 50% of the bull****. Training is way shorter. (Flip side is that you won’t have the knowledge base or skills of an MD/DO.)

I had several kids during medical school and residency. I’m also now on my second marriage, so that shows you how well that all worked out. Medical school and particularly residency tend to be brutal on relationships. (Perhaps the fact that your husband makes $$$ may make this easier, though-everyone would have been happier in my situation if we could have done things like hire help for the kids, cleaning services, etc, instead of both parents working hard just to scrape by.)

If I was fresh out of college looking for a career path, I’d probably do medicine again - but it is a long, hard road. If I was an older nontrad? ****ing hell no. But your mileage may vary.

 

[dozitgetchahi]

I would argue that becoming a doctor does not just benefit you. There is a benefit to having your children see you pursue a career that you are passionate about. The key, of course, is that you're genuinely passionate about becoming a physician.

With all due respect…I generally disagree with this. I have been in and around enough families of hardworking, extremely busy upper middle class professionals to see that the kids’ perspective on this is often very different from the adults who are immersed in their careers.

As doctors, we seem to think that everyone around us - particularly our children - sees what we are doing, honors it, and thinks it great or at least “motivating”. If you really listen to how the children feel, the answer is usually quite different - the memories are about a daddy who was mysteriously never there because he was “always at work”, the mommy who couldn’t come to events when they were a kid, etc. Kids often don’t remember this fondly. They also don’t actually see what you do all the time you’re working - but they do know that you’re not present. For every kid who follows in the footsteps of doctor parents, you can find several who want to get as far away from the idea of doing medicine as possible.

It’s often very, very hard for us as doctors to acknowledge the impact our training and careers have on the people around us. Sometimes, as in my case, it’s not clear until the divorce papers are served.

 

[Iamnew2]

With all due respect…I generally disagree with this. I have been in and around enough families of hardworking, extremely busy upper middle class professionals to see that the kids’ perspective on this is often very different from the adults who are immersed in their careers.

As doctors, we seem to think that everyone around us - particularly our children - sees what we are doing, honor it, and thinks it great or at least “motivating”. If you really listen to how the children feel, the answer is usually quite different - the memories are about a daddy who was mysteriously never there because he was “always at work”, the mommy who couldn’t come to events when they were a kid, etc. Kids don’t often don’t remember this fondly. They also don’t actually see what you do all the time you’re working - but they do know that you’re not present. For every kid who follows in the footsteps of doctor parents, you can find several who want to get as far away from the idea of doing medicine as possible.

It’s often very, very hard for us as doctors to acknowledge the impact our training and careers have on the people around us. Sometimes, as in my case, it’s not clear until the divorce papers are served.

I will agree with you that medicine is hard on relationships and particularly as women. I am also on my second marriage. A few of my classmates also divorced after residency. But at the same time there are plenty of people who don’t get educated or have non professional jobs who work long hours and are gone just as much or worse. Reality is that parents have to work. In medicine though we at least get paid reasonably well. I don’t think that being away is particular just to doctors - at least for me I can be home at a reasonable time and spend most of the evening w the family, leftover work whether it be notes emails etc gets done after that if I didn’t finish at work. It’s manageable generally. Lawyers, tech people, bankers etc also work and have to be away from their families as does everyone else who doesn’t have a profession and works 6 days a week or whatever and likely brings a lot less. I do think that in general being a doctor contributes more to society than a number of other professions.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

With all due respect…I generally disagree with this. I have been in and around enough families of hardworking, extremely busy upper middle class professionals to see that the kids’ perspective on this is often very different from the adults who are immersed in their careers.

As doctors, we seem to think that everyone around us - particularly our children - sees what we are doing, honors it, and thinks it great or at least “motivating”. If you really listen to how the children feel, the answer is usually quite different - the memories are about a daddy who was mysteriously never there because he was “always at work”, the mommy who couldn’t come to events when they were a kid, etc. Kids often don’t remember this fondly. They also don’t actually see what you do all the time you’re working - but they do know that you’re not present. For every kid who follows in the footsteps of doctor parents, you can find several who want to get as far away from the idea of doing medicine as possible.

It’s often very, very hard for us as doctors to acknowledge the impact our training and careers have on the people around us. Sometimes, as in my case, it’s not clear until the divorce papers are served.

As with all things, it's variable. The poster you're responding to is an FP, so a different career experience than say an OB/GYN. I bring this up because I am also an FP and I miss out on very little in my kids' lives.

Last night I went to a cub scouts meeting with one of the kids. Thursday night and Saturday morning I coach their basketball team. Wednesday night we go to church together. Last month I went to their school's Thanksgiving lunch. Friday I'm going to their 9am Christmas program.

That all being said, it would be way different if I was in training compared to our in practice.

 

[Old_Mil]

I’m an older non traditional woman who had her first child btwn my 1st/2nd year. I am struggling with balancing medical school and contemplating the realities of the future (ie residency) and how it will dramatically impact my family in a negative way. Is the pain of residency worth it if you don’t need the income?

For context, becoming a doctor will make 0 impact on my families finances. My husband makes $$ that I don’t need to work and can have anything I want. Becoming a doctor is purely for my personal happiness but it only benefits me. It is a net negative for my family…I also want another child and imagining having one during residency gives me so much anxiety. I know this is such a personal decision. But if you didn’t need the money, is residency worth the pain and sacrifices of being away from your family?

Medicine as a field generally sucks.
Residency is just the start of that suck.
If you're in a position where you don't need to practice, then just go do an IM year somewhere and call it good.

 

[dgdg]

Becoming a physician even in the shortest 3 yr residency programs is very demanding - study and work.
You will have very little time for your family until your finish residency. Then you will need to have chosen your field carefully, or you will still be missing in action in the hospital.
Decide what is important to you. If you are questioning your drive/motivation to focus on medicine, then you should probably not do it.
PA programs are easier, can require less overnight call, and still provide a great opportunity to diagnose and treat patients. That may be the ideal balance for you.

 

[j4pac]

If you are debating whether it’s worth it this early on the path…it’s probably not. Dropout and go enjoy your kids. But there is no redo on this one. If you are going to have regrets and resent your husband, then keep with it. There are women who have children in medical school…and many have spouses that are professionals. Anyone that tells you that it’s not insanely hard either has poor insight or are full of it. It is hard. It’s hard on you, your spouse, and your children. When you are missing all of your kids school events, struggle to keep up with their homework, struggle to participate in their lives between the hours of 7am-6pm almost everyday of their lives under your roof…yeah, it’s hard. It sucks farming your kids our to a nanny or daycare worker. Most of us do it…but it does suck. I’d only do it if you would struggle to live without it. You really need to want it.

 

[emergentmd]

If you ask 100 attending doctors if they would go to med school if they had $10M in the bank, you would be lucky to have 5 who would. If you have 100 attending female doctors the same question, you may get 2.

If 100 attending doctors hit the $10M lottery, 99 would quit/drastically cut down. If 100 female doctors hit $10M tomorrow, I would be shocked if there is even one working after a few yrs.

This is your answer. Medicine is a business, after a few yrs its not a calling. There is a reason why you rarely see celebrity/uber rich kids go into medicine.

If this isn't enough, play this scenario in your head.

Hubby - Honey, Grace's first basketball game is today
You - I can't make it b/c I am doing my 24 hr shift
Hubby - Honey, Grace scored 20 pts and was the best player
You - Ughhh, sorry I missed it
Grace - Mom, ,I did well and you should have seen me hit the game winner
You - Ugghhh, sorry I have to take care of a butt wound in the ER and then admit a drunk guy with a head bleed

Six months later
Hubby - Basketball game done, radio silence
You - Why hasn't anyone called to give me an update
Grace - Radio silence
You - On the 18th hour call and have to deal with a nursing home with butt ulcers
You - Grace how was your game
Grace - I played well, oh mom.... I have to go now to have dinner with dad. See you tomorrow night after school.

 

[Iamnew2]

If you ask 100 attending doctors if they would go to med school if they had $10M in the bank, you would be lucky to have 5 who would. If you have 100 attending female doctors the same question, you may get 2.

If 100 attending doctors hit the $10M lottery, 99 would quit/drastically cut down. If 100 female doctors hit $10M tomorrow, I would be shocked if there is even one working after a few yrs.

This is your answer. Medicine is a business, after a few yrs its not a calling. There is a reason why you rarely see celebrity/uber rich kids go into medicine.

If this isn't enough, play this scenario in your head.

Hubby - Honey, Grace's first basketball game is today
You - I can't make it b/c I am doing my 24 hr shift
Hubby - Honey, Grace scored 20 pts and was the best player
You - Ughhh, sorry I missed it
Grace - Mom, ,I did well and you should have seen me hit the game winner
You - Ugghhh, sorry I have to take care of a butt wound in the ER and then admit a drunk guy with a head bleed

Six months later
Hubby - Basketball game done, radio silence
You - Why hasn't anyone called to give me an update
Grace - Radio silence
You - On the 18th hour call and have to deal with a nursing home with butt ulcers
You - Grace how was your game
Grace - I played well, oh mom.... I have to go now to have dinner with dad. See you tomorrow night after school.

That's a little much no? Residency is typically 3-4 years and most call is only a few years at worst. Most attending don't take brutal call. What about parents who don't make ends meet and work 6 or 7 days a week for 12 hours? is that any better?
You are right that medicine at the end of the day is a business like any other. If I had 10 million tomorrow, I'd quit. But if I have to work for the next 25 years of my life, my schedule still allows me to come home by 4 at the latest most days, I get most weekends off, I make or buy food dinner and have dinner w the family every day, I get to go to shows, and travel with my family, etc.
So life as an attending is not the bleak monstruosity you make it out to be.

 

[emergentmd]

That's a little much no? Residency is typically 3-4 years and most call is only a few years at worst. Most attending don't take brutal call. What about parents who don't make ends meet and work 6 or 7 days a week for 12 hours? is that any better?
You are right that medicine at the end of the day is a business like any other. If I had 10 million tomorrow, I'd quit. But if I have to work for the next 25 years of my life, my schedule still allows me to come home by 4 at the latest most days, I get most weekends off, I make or buy food dinner and have dinner w the family every day, I get to go to shows, and travel with my family, etc.
So life as an attending is not the bleak monstruosity you make it out to be.

The question was NOT if money vs sacrifice is worth it b/c it is impossible to answer.
The question was if the sacrifice is worth it if money was of no concern. I stand by my answer that very few would sacrifice 7-10+ yrs if they were independently wealthy.

Now as I did not marry wealthy or have wealthy parents, I would 100% still go into medicine b/c the reward is greater than the sacrifice. If My parents left me 10M at 21 YO, you bet I would throw my medical school acceptance in the trash. Even if I didn't, after 1 semester I would surely have quit.

 

[PB2464]

I’m an older non traditional woman who had her first child btwn my 1st/2nd year. I am struggling with balancing medical school and contemplating the realities of the future (ie residency) and how it will dramatically impact my family in a negative way. Is the pain of residency worth it if you don’t need the income?

For context, becoming a doctor will make 0 impact on my families finances. My husband makes $$ that I don’t need to work and can have anything I want. Becoming a doctor is purely for my personal happiness but it only benefits me. It is a net negative for my family…I also want another child and imagining having one during residency gives me so much anxiety. I know this is such a personal decision. But if you didn’t need the money, is residency worth the pain and sacrifices of being away from your family?

NO. Family >>> careerism.

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

NO. Family >>> careerism.

Ya but more than half of marriages wind up in divorce so always need to have something on the back burner in these cases especially in medicine because not like you can just go back to residency

 

[PB2464]

Ya but more than half of marriages wind up in divorce so always need to have something on the back burner in these cases especially in medicine because not like you can just go back to residency

A full medical career to have something on the back burner? What?
No. You choose wisely and marry someone with similar values. Don't you think that takes less work? Honestly maybe more skill in this than getting into medical school for some. I could go into much greater depth here. But what a soulless outlook to predict a possible divorce. I would rather have hope and take the risk than spending 8+ years on a career for a "chance of a divorce".

 

[finalpsychyear]

If you ask 100 attending doctors if they would go to med school if they had $10M in the bank, you would be lucky to have 5 who would. If you have 100 attending female doctors the same question, you may get 2.

If 100 attending doctors hit the $10M lottery, 99 would quit/drastically cut down. If 100 female doctors hit $10M tomorrow, I would be shocked if there is even one working after a few yrs.

This is your answer. Medicine is a business, after a few yrs its not a calling. There is a reason why you rarely see celebrity/uber rich kids go into medicine.

If this isn't enough, play this scenario in your head.

Hubby - Honey, Grace's first basketball game is today
You - I can't make it b/c I am doing my 24 hr shift
Hubby - Honey, Grace scored 20 pts and was the best player
You - Ughhh, sorry I missed it
Grace - Mom, ,I did well and you should have seen me hit the game winner
You - Ugghhh, sorry I have to take care of a butt wound in the ER and then admit a drunk guy with a head bleed

Six months later
Hubby - Basketball game done, radio silence
You - Why hasn't anyone called to give me an update
Grace - Radio silence
You - On the 18th hour call and have to deal with a nursing home with butt ulcers
You - Grace how was your game
Grace - I played well, oh mom.... I have to go now to have dinner with dad. See you tomorrow night after school.

What's made it worse is now that midlevels can basically have minimum training and pretty high pay for far below the sacrifices it requires to be an MD it has been a kick to the to you know where. Imo all MD's in this day and age should be making 500k+ not just specialists for what is required to get there. Insurance and pharmaceuticals are the big winners in this country. Esp for women and men the sacrifice of not having your life start till much later and possibly causing issues with starting a family late due to age, is not at all reflected in the pay.

Medicine in the usa is a big business scam with doctors at the bottom of the totum pole and the masters (pharm/insur) at the top dictating everything. Unless there is a mass revolt and unionization of all docs, all we will see is less trained "providers" doing online only degrees get closer to physician pay. Make your money now and have the option to get out of medicine asap. The masters at the top want
even more " providers " regardless of quality because it only helps their bottom line. It's as simple as that.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

If you ask 100 attending doctors if they would go to med school if they had $10M in the bank, you would be lucky to have 5 who would. If you have 100 attending female doctors the same question, you may get 2.

If 100 attending doctors hit the $10M lottery, 99 would quit/drastically cut down. If 100 female doctors hit $10M tomorrow, I would be shocked if there is even one working after a few yrs.

This is your answer. Medicine is a business, after a few yrs its not a calling. There is a reason why you rarely see celebrity/uber rich kids go into medicine.

If this isn't enough, play this scenario in your head.

Hubby - Honey, Grace's first basketball game is today
You - I can't make it b/c I am doing my 24 hr shift
Hubby - Honey, Grace scored 20 pts and was the best player
You - Ughhh, sorry I missed it
Grace - Mom, ,I did well and you should have seen me hit the game winner
You - Ugghhh, sorry I have to take care of a butt wound in the ER and then admit a drunk guy with a head bleed

Six months later
Hubby - Basketball game done, radio silence
You - Why hasn't anyone called to give me an update
Grace - Radio silence
You - On the 18th hour call and have to deal with a nursing home with butt ulcers
You - Grace how was your game
Grace - I played well, oh mom.... I have to go now to have dinner with dad. See you tomorrow night after school.

Is there any job that if you gave someone a lump sum of their potential lifetime earnings wouldn't result in people cutting back on work?

 

[Splenda88]

@VA Hopeful Dr

I think that's the point of the poster you quote... Medicine is no different than most other jobs. For a very few, it might be a "calling" but the the vast majority it is a nice gig that pays the bills.

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

Is there any job that if you gave someone a lump sum of their potential lifetime earnings wouldn't result in people cutting back on work?

Professional athletes, singers, artists, etc.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

Professional athletes, singers, artists, etc.

I very much doubt that for the majority of them.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

@VA Hopeful Dr

I think that's the point of the poster you quote... Medicine is no different than most other jobs. For a very few, it might be a "calling" but the the vast majority it is a nice gig that pays the bills.

That wasn't my interpretation, but if I'm wrong then I agree with said post.

 

[emergentmd]

Is there any job that if you gave someone a lump sum of their potential lifetime earnings wouldn't result in people cutting back on work?

There are not many. The OP question is it worth it to go through med school/residency if she has more money than she can spend. My correlation is that most would not work, less go through 7+ yrs of max sacrifice.

Everyone going through med school/residency has many days of big lows and wondering if it is worth it, but we keep at it b/c there is really not many good financial options. As a parent with a child plus wanting more, those lows are many magnitudes worse and what is the driver if not fear of financial suicide.

 

[emergentmd]

That wasn't my interpretation, but if I'm wrong then I agree with said post.

You sure did misinterpreted. I have no idea your interpretation otherwise.

 

[Appellatelove]

I’m an IM resident and I see my daughter maybe 5-6 hours total a week? This is in a program where I rarely break duty hours. She’s young so she won’t remember it though it strains our relationship. I do it because I can’t make 200k without residency. It’s the only to pay for her college and upbringing. When I’m done paying those bills, I’m out. I wouldn’t do this if I was independently wealthy. To me, it wouldn’t be worth it. But since I’m not independently wealthy, I get up every morning and get to work.

 

[bedrock]

Professional athletes, singers, artists, etc.

Is there any job that if you gave someone a lump sum of their potential lifetime earnings wouldn't result in people cutting back on work?

When I applied to medical I was truly looking at it as a calling to help others. If I was given 10million dollars at age 20, I still would have gone to med school.

By the time I finished med school, residency, and fellowship if given the same choice I would have taken the 10 million and never treated another patient again.

There is so much to life besides work, life is finite, and can change for the worse at any time. If the OPs husband makes truly good money and she is conflicted, then the answer is no.

You should only become a physician if you just can't imagine your life without being a practicing physician. The rewards arent enough otherwise, and it would be shame to lose your husband or kids from all the time you'll lose once medical training really starts getting tough in your upcoming 3rd year of med school.

 

[NITRAS]

When I applied to medical I was truly looking at it as a calling to help others. If I was given 10million dollars at age 20, I still would have gone to med school.

By the time I finished med school, residency, and fellowship if given the same choice I would have taken the 10 million and never treated another patient again.

There is so much to life besides work, life is finite, and can change for the worse at any time. If the OPs husband makes truly good money and she is conflicted, then the answer is no.

You should only become a physician if you just can't imagine your life without being a practicing physician. The rewards arent enough otherwise, and it would be shame to lose your husband or kids from all the time you'll lose once medical training really starts getting tough in your upcoming 3rd year of med school.

Medical school and residency can be brutal. The worst part is, the more you understand what is going on, the more you realize how so much of what we do is stupid, based on poor data, based on no data, because that is it pays the bills, because it is easier to just do what the people with emotional maturity of a 7 yo want ect.

It is easier as an attending. I think I do get to at least care for people. . . While I am not sure I get to actually help people many days. It is a cool job pays well. It does suck on the regular. Now, my family is happy.

 

[dozitgetchahi]

A full medical career to have something on the back burner? What?
No. You choose wisely and marry someone with similar values. Don't you think that takes less work? Honestly maybe more skill in this than getting into medical school for some. I could go into much greater depth here. But what a soulless outlook to predict a possible divorce. I would rather have hope and take the risk than spending 8+ years on a career for a "chance of a divorce".

I agree.

Going through all the rigmarole of medical training just to have it as a “back burner” career seems super crazy to me. Furthermore, medicine doesn’t work well as a “back burner” career because unless you’re practicing at least part time, you will have difficulty getting and staying licensed. It will be almost impossible to re-enter the field after a certain amount of time off.

 

[Bryan O’Blivion]

This is a fundamentally impossible question to answer because few people have the exact same circumstances.

Medicine for me has been awesome. I felt like I learned a lot of very interesting and fundamentally dry useful information in medical school. Residency, although with long hours and some emotionally difficult times, was actually a pretty interesting time in my life. It did not lack for excitement.

Being in practice has had some extraordinarily difficult moments. But overall, it’s great.

I came from a lower middle class family and my cohort of friends from high school are often struggling with poverty, debt, legal issues, and often work as hard as I do for a fraction of the pay. I feel incredibly fortunate.

I am financially comfortable, completely debt free, I have all the toys I want (I seldom even use my airplane). I buy groceries and eat out without looking at the bill. I have money to give away, and I do. I have great hobbies that I thoroughly enjoy.

I love my job. I am always learning something or finding new ways to improve. I get great satisfaction out of performing procedures efficiently and effectively.

Before medical school I worked and endless string of poorly compensated jobs that felt meaningless. No one gave any consideration to my opinion on any subject. I wasn’t really surrounded by people with drive and curiosity.

So, yeah, it really depends on who you are. If you are independently wealthy, with a dynamic fulfilling career, able to indulge your interests, accustomed to an ostentatious lifestyle, with the freedom to do things as you please, medicine will be awful, constraining and probably a net financial mistake. If you are someone who is looking at 35 more years of delivering pizza/cleaning airplanes/cutting hair, medicine is truly amazing.

 

[dozitgetchahi]

I will agree with you that medicine is hard on relationships and particularly as women. I am also on my second marriage. A few of my classmates also divorced after residency. But at the same time there are plenty of people who don’t get educated or have non professional jobs who work long hours and are gone just as much or worse. Reality is that parents have to work. In medicine though we at least get paid reasonably well. I don’t think that being away is particular just to doctors - at least for me I can be home at a reasonable time and spend most of the evening w the family, leftover work whether it be notes emails etc gets done after that if I didn’t finish at work. It’s manageable generally. Lawyers, tech people, bankers etc also work and have to be away from their families as does everyone else who doesn’t have a profession and works 6 days a week or whatever and likely brings a lot less. I do think that in general being a doctor contributes more to society than a number of other professions.

But what if you didn’t have to work?

I see so many UMC professional types try to defend having big careers for this reason - everyone needs money. Everyone needs to work. However, in many cases this isn’t actually true. OP has a spouse that makes $$$, in her description. That means she doesn’t have to work. A family can live well off one spouse making $$$ - you don’t need two.

What I see happening a lot in these doctor family situations is one spouse making bank, such that the other basically approaches medicine as a “hobby” of sorts - they don’t need the money, so they work part time, or work full time just for the hell of it, or whatever. But while medicine can generally be an OK career if you make the right choices and set the right boundaries, it’s actually a really ****ty hobby for all the reasons listed in this thread and more. If OP just wants to do some job outside the house and doesn’t need lots of money, then there are way better choices than medicine which are less stressful, involve way less training, and won’t lead to her spending so much time away from family for so little in return.

 

[Iamnew2]

But what if you didn’t have to work?

I see so many UMC professional types try to defend having big careers for this reason - everyone needs money. Everyone needs to work. However, in many cases this isn’t actually true. OP has a spouse that makes $$$, in her description. That means she doesn’t have to work. A family can live well off one spouse making $$$ - you don’t need two.

What I see happening a lot in these doctor family situations is one spouse making bank, such that the other basically approaches medicine as a “hobby” of sorts - they don’t need the money, so they work part time, or work full time just for the hell of it, or whatever. But while medicine can generally be an OK career if you make the right choices and set the right boundaries, it’s actually a really ****ty hobby for all the reasons listed in this thread and more. If OP just wants to do some job outside the house and doesn’t need lots of money, then there are way better choices than medicine which are less stressful, involve way less training, and won’t lead to her spending so much time away from family for so little in return.

None of us can predict the future - what if OP and spouse divorced? What if OP's spouse died? What if OP's spouse became disabled?
The future is not guaranteed for any of us - not being morbid, just reality.

If I was a billionaire, I wouldn't work probably. I think that goes for many people. But most people are not in that situation. And given that none of us know the future and what will happen to our partners/spouses, having a dual income family makes sense.
there are stages in life to everything - sometimes one person needs a break, or is laid off, or whatever - but I think medicine in general we can do a lot of good for a lot of people. I wouldn't do it as a hobby. but as a career I think it's certainly worthwhile.
there are a lot of issues in medicine no doubt - but it's the same in other professions

 

[PB2464]

None of us can predict the future - what if OP and spouse divorced? What if OP's spouse died? What if OP's spouse became disabled?
The future is not guaranteed for any of us - not being morbid, just reality.

If I was a billionaire, I wouldn't work probably. I think that goes for many people. But most people are not in that situation. And given that none of us know the future and what will happen to our partners/spouses, having a dual income family makes sense.
there are stages in life to everything - sometimes one person needs a break, or is laid off, or whatever - but I think medicine in general we can do a lot of good for a lot of people. I wouldn't do it as a hobby. but as a career I think it's certainly worthwhile.
there are a lot of issues in medicine no doubt - but it's the same in other professions

These examples don't really support the necessity of a dual income couple. That's what life insurance and disability are for.

Like I stated previously, marry better to avoid a divorce. Since when do we make careers a buffer for terrible life choices?

 

[Iamnew2]

These examples don't really support the necessity of a dual income couple. That's what life insurance and disability are for.

Like I stated previously, marry better to avoid a divorce. Since when do we make careers a buffer for terrible life choices?

I’m not saying that - I’m saying that suggesting that someone doesn’t have to work because their spouse makes money makes no sense. Life changes in the blink of an instant

 

[PB2464]

I’m not saying that - I’m saying that suggesting that someone doesn’t have to work because their spouse makes money makes no sense. Life changes in the blink of an instant

Makes sense to me. Guess that's what I'm saying. I guess we could dive into the benefits of a stay at home mom, but that might push this into taboo realm for SDN.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

These examples don't really support the necessity of a dual income couple. That's what life insurance and disability are for.

Like I stated previously, marry better to avoid a divorce. Since when do we make careers a buffer for terrible life choices?

We absolutely should, although just because you got divorced doesn't mean you made it terrible life choice.