JAOA Watch: COMLEX to USMLE conversion

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.

DrWBD

Full Member
Lifetime Donor
Joined
May 3, 1999
Messages
1,122
Reaction score
144
In the July 2010 issue of the JAOA, two osteopathic physicians commented on the need for a new COMLEX to USMLE conversion formula. Using the formula published by Slocum and Louder (JAOA, September 2006) with current COMLEX scores would lead to a misleadingly low USMLE equivalent score. Given the large number of osteopathic students who apply to ACGME-accredited residencies and fellowships, where the USMLE is considered the "gold standard" medical licensing examination, one can intuitively see the need for the ability to compare COMLEX and USMLE scores in a meaningful way.

However, five years after his study was published, Dean Slocum doesn't see it that way. From his response:

The COMLEX-USA—now more than ever—reflects osteopathic clinical information, while the USMLE clearly does not reflect any osteopathic clinical content. We have not reevaluated the available data for any new correlations between these tests. However, we would expect less correlation now than when we conducted our analysis more than 5 years ago. The American Osteopathic Association's Commission on Osteopathic College Accreditation and National Board of Osteopathic Medical Examiners are obviously concerned that examination content and assessments maintain the distinction between the osteopathic and allopathic medical professions. Each year, the examinations reflect more divergence between these medical professions than was the case during the years we conducted our study. (emphasis mine).​

Having taken both the USMLE and COMLEX examinations, I can indeed verify that, yes, there is osteopathic content on the COMLEX that is not on the USMLE. This is, ostensibly, the reason for the existence of the COMLEX. But has anything really changed significantly in the last 5 years, content-wise? Interestingly, Dean Slocum never actually cites any objective reference to verify his assertion that the COMLEX of today is meaningfully different than the COMLEX of 5 years ago, as if this is a statement that needs no proof of fact.

Indeed, his entire response seems more political than academic. His asserts that the goal of the COMLEX is to "maintain the distinction between the osteopathic and allopathic medical professions". This is a surprising statement. I don't believe that the NBME writes the USMLE to distinguish themselves from osteopathy. I always thought that that the goal of the COMLEX, as well as the USMLE, was to provide an objective assessment of the medical student's clinical knowledge in order to ensure that the student has the knowledge base necessary to practice medicine.

And, in a parting statement quite dismissive of Parikh and Shiembob's letter:

As far as the statistics of our study go, I believe that a quotation attributed to Benjamin Disraeli, prime minister of the United Kingdom in 1868 and from 1874 to 1880 (2) says it best: There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.

In addition to the quotation being mistakenly attributed to Disraeli, this is an extremely anti-intellectual statement to make on the issue. Does Dean Slocum really believe that this trite quotation is an appropriate response to give to these osteopathic physicians and to the readership of the JAOA? If this is the way Dean Slocum really feels about the issue, then why did he and Louder do the study in the first place? I believe that Dr. Slocum, being dean of an osteopathic medical school, is putting osteopathic political correctness ahead of the good of the profession, and that there is a need for an objective comparison of USMLE and COMLEX scores. Hopefully someone else will pick up where Dean Slocum felt content to leave off.

Members don't see this ad.
 
Last edited:
This makes me sick
 
Members don't see this ad :)
My opinion is that the only way that a conversion formula would be meaningful would be if the people in charge of the COMLEX and the USMLE were willing to collaborate with one another and have a mutually agreed upon, formal way of converting their scores into the equivalent of the other (this might also have utility if, down the road, osteopathic residencies were opened to allopathic candidates!)

Another possible option would be if the COMLEX reported scores in terms of percentiles. While that webpage widget is interesting, I don't think most allopathic program directors have the time or interest to bother doing ANY legwork to figure out how to "convert" a COMLEX score into a USMLE scores.
If you want allopathic programs to be impressed by your board taking skills, the best option will probably always be to just take the USMLE. If I were a program director, I'd certainly prefer to be able to compare apples to apples.
I am living proof that DOs can do well on the USMLE *if* they study for it the way MD students do. The time I spent prepping for Step 1 was the hardest I've ever worked for anything in my life, because I knew I had something to prove as a DO.
 
If the tests were so different, then how come people who take them both mainly prepare for USMLE while taking a day to review OMM and they're ready for COMLEX?
 
This discussion is important for current 1st & 2nd years. It shows that taking COMLEX alone is not sufficient if you want to keep your options open. There is no clear COMLEX to USMLE conversion and residency directors probably can't figure out what a 550 vs a 600 means.
So just take the USMLE and avoid all this confusion.
 
And increase the costs with becoming a DO above its already relatively inflated cost.

Well, if it gets you to the residency you want, it's well worth it. The amount of money the USMLE costs is a drop in the bucket compared to the overall cost of medical education (even for state schools), and the cost emotionally of winding up in a residency you don't want to be at!
The reality is that DOs are not entitled to any ACGME residency spots. We're lucky that we frequently do have a realistic chance at ACGME residencies even though DO residencies are off-limits to MDs and FMGs. It's not that much to ask that DOs take the same standardized test that the MDs take if we want to be viewed as the MD's equal.
 
Well, if it gets you to the residency you want, it's well worth it. The amount of money the USMLE costs is a drop in the bucket...It's not that much to ask that DOs take the same standardized test that the MDs take if we want to be viewed as the MD's equal.

I don't disagree with you at all. I just think it's ridiculous we have to pay for the poorly written COMLEX when we can just take the USMLE like everyone else. They can just test OMM via that NBOME subject exam.
 
Is the reason why DOs, who are leaders of these DO organizations or whatever you wanna call it, continue to assert that DO is vastly different from MD so that they don't have to lose their DO organization/leadership/$$$?
 
Well, if it gets you to the residency you want, it's well worth it. The amount of money the USMLE costs is a drop in the bucket compared to the overall cost of medical education (even for state schools), and the cost emotionally of winding up in a residency you don't want to be at!
The reality is that DOs are not entitled to any ACGME residency spots. We're lucky that we frequently do have a realistic chance at ACGME residencies even though DO residencies are off-limits to MDs and FMGs. It's not that much to ask that DOs take the same standardized test that the MDs take if we want to be viewed as the MD's equal.

You keep talking about the whole "take the USMLE if you want to consider yourself an equal" thing as if it guarantees you an ACGME residency. It does not. I seem to recall you not matching psych and scrambled into a prelim program. I don't know if you later got a full residency spot or not (not been keeping track but something I did recall with the whole disappointment thread of this past year's match with ppl whining about not getting their program of choice, etc).
 
Is the reason why DOs, who are leaders of these DO organizations or whatever you wanna call it, continue to assert that DO is vastly different from MD so that they don't have to lose their DO organization/leadership/$$$?

IMO yes. Obviously the people in those positions are not going to admit to that, and will continue to claim education and philosophy differences, but $$$ is a strong political motivator.
 
Members don't see this ad :)
I never said that taking the USMLE would "guarantee" anything. Even US MD students sometimes don't match. It's true that I did not match the first time (I did the next year). It is because I have seen how brutal the match can be that I feel that DOs should not be complacent and should make the effort of doing things like taking the USMLE. The reason I didn't match the first time had nothing to do with my board scores.
 
You keep talking about the whole "take the USMLE if you want to consider yourself an equal" thing as if it guarantees you an ACGME residency. It does not. I seem to recall you not matching psych and scrambled into a prelim program. I don't know if you later got a full residency spot or not (not been keeping track but something I did recall with the whole disappointment thread of this past year's match with ppl whining about not getting their program of choice, etc).

Of course it doesn't guarantee a match. Not speaking for peppy, but I never got that impression from either of the 2 posts on the matter.

Depending on the region and the specialty to which you are applying, not having a USMLE Step 1 score can essentially guarantee that you WON'T match there.

Take the USMLE if 1) you think you may want to do an ACGME residency and 2) you can do well (e.g have done well on NBME exams, etc).
 
I never said that taking the USMLE would "guarantee" anything. Even US MD students sometimes don't match. It's true that I did not match the first time (I did the next year). It is because I have seen how brutal the match can be that I feel that DOs should not be complacent and should make the effort of doing things like taking the USMLE. The reason I didn't match the first time had nothing to do with my board scores.

Sorry to hear about that. It's tough to describe how difficult the whole process can be until you're there. I'm not even to the residency stage yet, but even the transition from pre-med to med school is something that I now personally find difficult to describe to people who aren't there.

Congratulations on sticking with your guys and matching!
 
TAKE THE USMLE !!!!

No matter what you think you want to do residency in, no matter where you think you want to go, no matter how well you know the program director in your chosen specialty in your preferred location.......TAKE THE USMLE :)
 
TAKE THE USMLE !!!!

No matter what you think you want to do residency in, no matter where you think you want to go, no matter how well you know the program director in your chosen specialty in your preferred location.......TAKE THE USMLE :)


Seems unnecessary if you plan on only applying to DO residency programs.
 
Seems unnecessary if you plan on only applying to DO residency programs.

LOTS of people change their plans...It would suck to have to take the USMLE step 1 as a 3rd or early 4th year if all of a sudden you want to go MD
And YES, lots of people get interviews and get in w/o taking the USMLE, but who knows if you meet the love of your life and they end up in Houston, San Antonio or Galveston...:D
 

And YES, lots of people get interviews and get in w/o taking the USMLE, but who knows if you meet the love of your life and they end up in Houston, San Antonio or Galveston...:D


Speaking from experience, Internist?
 
I would like to see the outcome of students who studied just for the COMLEX level 1 and took the USMLE without using any USMLE designed review material.
COMLEX is just a useless and expensive hoop we have to jump through.

I personally think the COMLEX should be eliminated and the USMLE should be the only exam for all medical students. Apples to apples, not oranges.
 
I personally think the COMLEX should be eliminated and the USMLE should be the only exam for all medical students. Apples to apples, not oranges.

I dream sometimes too ;)
 
In the July 2010 issue of the JAOA, two osteopathic physicians commented on the need for a new COMLEX to USMLE conversion formula. Using the formula published by Slocum and Louder (JAOA, September 2006) with current COMLEX scores would lead to a misleadingly low USMLE equivalent score. Given the large number of osteopathic students who apply to ACGME-accredited residencies and fellowships, where the USMLE is considered the "gold standard" medical licensing examination, one can intuitively see the need for the ability to compare COMLEX and USMLE scores in a meaningful way.

However, five years after his study was published, Dean Slocum doesn't see it that way. From his response:
The COMLEX-USA—now more than ever—reflects osteopathic clinical information, while the USMLE clearly does not reflect any osteopathic clinical content. We have not reevaluated the available data for any new correlations between these tests. However, we would expect less correlation now than when we conducted our analysis more than 5 years ago. The American Osteopathic Association's Commission on Osteopathic College Accreditation and National Board of Osteopathic Medical Examiners are obviously concerned that examination content and assessments maintain the distinction between the osteopathic and allopathic medical professions. Each year, the examinations reflect more divergence between these medical professions than was the case during the years we conducted our study. (emphasis mine).
Having taken both the USMLE and COMLEX examinations, I can indeed verify that, yes, there is osteopathic content on the COMLEX that is not on the USMLE. This is, ostensibly, the reason for the existence of the COMLEX. But has anything really changed significantly in the last 5 years, content-wise? Interestingly, Dean Slocum never actually cites any objective reference to verify his assertion that the COMLEX of today is meaningfully different than the COMLEX of 5 years ago, as if this is a statement that needs no proof of fact.

Indeed, his entire response seems more political than academic. His asserts that the goal of the COMLEX is to "maintain the distinction between the osteopathic and allopathic medical professions". This is a surprising statement. I don't believe that the NBME writes the USMLE to distinguish themselves from osteopathy. I always thought that that the goal of the COMLEX, as well as the USMLE, was to provide an objective assessment of the medical student's clinical knowledge in order to ensure that the student has the knowledge base necessary to practice medicine.

And, in a parting statement quite dismissive of Parikh and Shiembob's letter:
As far as the statistics of our study go, I believe that a quotation attributed to Benjamin Disraeli, prime minister of the United Kingdom in 1868 and from 1874 to 1880 (2) says it best: There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.
In addition to the quotation being mistakenly attributed to Disraeli, this is an extremely anti-intellectual statement to make on the issue. Does Dean Slocum really believe that this trite quotation is an appropriate response to give to these osteopathic physicians and to the readership of the JAOA? If this is the way Dean Slocum really feels about the issue, then why did he and Louder do the study in the first place? I believe that Dr. Slocum, being dean of an osteopathic medical school, is putting osteopathic political correctness ahead of the good of the profession, and that there is a need for an objective comparison of USMLE and COMLEX scores. Hopefully someone else will pick up where Dean Slocum felt content to leave off.

Wonderful post. I agree entirely
 
I would like to see the outcome of students who studied just for the COMLEX level 1 and took the USMLE without using any USMLE designed review material.
COMLEX is just a useless and expensive hoop we have to jump through.

I personally think the COMLEX should be eliminated and the USMLE should be the only exam for all medical students. Apples to apples, not oranges.

No kidding. Frankly, I think the best way to do it would be to have everyone take the USMLE and then have the DO students take a small, seperate OMM "rider" exam. Period.

No COMLEX involved.
 
IMO yes. Obviously the people in those positions are not going to admit to that, and will continue to claim education and philosophy differences, but $$$ is a strong political motivator.

This seems to be the opinion of the majority of students I have spoken to. As a side note, last year the president of the AOA visited our campus and had a Q and A. Someone asked him why DO students couldn't just take the USMLE and develop a short, additional test to test osteopathic principles and diagnosis. He replied very clearly that the main reasons there are still 2 tests are political and financial (testing companies, etc.). I was actually shocked by the answer (though I thought that was the truth.....I didn't expect to hear it coming from the AOA president's mouth). He also said the "the COMLEX is a good test" but later recommended students take both the USMLE and COMLEX!
 
As a side note, the so called "conversion" equations would have worked really well for me..... COMLEX 595, USMLE 254

WTF.
 
using the equation 0.24x comlex + 58 from the article a 595 would have scored a 209 on the USMLE. Where did you get 254 from?
 
Simplest solution: require USMLE to enter ACGME residencies.

Conversion problem solved. :cool::thumbup:
 
That might be one of the more brilliant, concise, and fair solutions mentioned yet!
 
Simplest solution: require USMLE to enter ACGME residencies.

Conversion problem solved. :cool::thumbup:

Even more simple would be just using USMLE for all residencies and throwing out the COMLEX.
 
The COMLEX is a complete joke. No exaggeration: 25% of my test was OMM. I had at least a dozen questions on cranial alone. I had very very little pharm and micro and many stupid questions, including one that referenced a private practice HR guideline and and government regulation compliance. Using the .24 x COMLEX + 58 would have given me a conversion USMLE score that was 50 points less than I actually got. Honestly, if you want an ACGME residency, take the USMLE. People who refuse are just admitting that they can't do well on it and they know it. I'm not trying to be an ass about it, but that is what many of my classmates said. They knew they would fail it even after three months of COMLEX study.

If people want to be considered equal to an MD, do what it takes and stop making excuses.
 
The weird part is that I actually felt like comlex was harder in a way because it was so ambiguous and there were so many questions that seemed out of left field. I don't really feel like people couldn't do it; in fact, I know a few people who didn't do well on the MCAT and did awesome on the USMLE. (above average). My impression was that some people started to do uworld and were like "this seems impossible" and just gave up. Who knows..... I should be in bed....
 
Top