Job listings...

[scubadoc78]

I will confess that sometimes when I get too worried about exams, licensing, residency selection, politics, and so on I look through online job listings to find listings in locations I enjoy that reassure me I won't graduate and get an 80 hour/week job for $5/hour.

Where I am in the midwest, I commonly see listings for 4-day workweeks, no OB, no call (or call from 1:4 to 1:13) and earnings usually starting between $160,000 - $200,000. As someone who's never made more than $20,000/year that seems way too good to be true considering how much everyone says family docs are suffering. And what do docs do with the 5th day? Paperwork?

Is there a catch I'm missing here? Are these listings just recruiter golden apples that turn into horrible jobs at midnight? Is it really that each day of the 4-day workweek is seeing 50 patients over 15 hours? Does "starting" mean for someone who's been practicing for 10 years already or could somebody get that out of residency?

I realize it's largely region specific so I'll limit my questions to the midwest (i.e. Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Illinois).

Thanks for any thoughts...

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[leeolivesingh]

Wow! You and I frequently do the same thing!

I, too, would love to hear what people have to say!

 

[andwhat]

I will confess that sometimes when I get too worried about exams, licensing, residency selection, politics, and so on I look through online job listings to find listings in locations I enjoy that reassure me I won't graduate and get an 80 hour/week job for $5/hour.

Where I am in the midwest, I commonly see listings for 4-day workweeks, no OB, no call (or call from 1:4 to 1:13) and earnings usually starting between $160,000 - $200,000. As someone who's never made more than $20,000/year that seems way too good to be true considering how much everyone says family docs are suffering. And what do docs do with the 5th day? Paperwork?

Is there a catch I'm missing here? Are these listings just recruiter golden apples that turn into horrible jobs at midnight? Is it really that each day of the 4-day workweek is seeing 50 patients over 15 hours? Does "starting" mean for someone who's been practicing for 10 years already or could somebody get that out of residency?

I realize it's largely region specific so I'll limit my questions to the midwest (i.e. Wisconsin, Minnesota, Iowa, Illinois).

Thanks for any thoughts...

Family Docs do not get compensated fairly, compared to other specialties. This absolutely has to change.

 

[scubadoc78]

Family Docs do not get compensated fairly, compared to other specialties. This absolutely has to change.

does that mean these jobs aren't reflecting reality? i've also looked at cardiology, gastroenterology, etc and i've seen those jobs going for $300,000 to $700,000! i just assumed those guys (or gals )are either working like dogs or are 20 years into practice.

 

[andwhat]

does that mean these jobs aren't reflecting reality? i've also looked at cardiology, gastroenterology, etc and i've seen those jobs going for $300,000 to $700,000! i just assumed those guys (or gals )are either working like dogs or are 20 years into practice.

working like dogs.. actually Gastro is a great lifestyle, and pays very well.... Cards is tough, but they love the job.. Starting Cards is like $500 at many places, and starting Gastro is that $300 K.

 

[deleted87716]

Gastro is a great lifestyle

Only if you like the view.

[YOUTUBE]_N0w2rORwSc[/YOUTUBE]

 

[scubadoc78]

working like dogs.. actually Gastro is a great lifestyle, and pays very well.... Cards is tough, but they love the job.. Starting Cards is like $500 at many places, and starting Gastro is that $300 K.

so you guys think these jobs could be legit then?

 

[Doctor Grim]

so you guys think these jobs could be legit then?

These FM opportunities you've described are legit. Most of the jobs would also guarantee the base salary for 1-2 years + a bonus based on your productivity. Important questions you really want to know is how many patients you will have to see per day. And it's normally 20-25.

I've been on a few interviews before I decided academia is right for me at this time and I found the recruiters pretty honest, as least in my case.

 

[scubadoc78]

These FM opportunities you've described are legit. Most of the jobs would also guarantee the base salary for 1-2 years + a bonus based on your productivity. Important questions you really want to know is how many patients you will have to see per day. And it's normally 20-25.

I've been on a few interviews before I decided academia is right for me at this time and I found the recruiters pretty honest, as least in my case.

Thanks Doctor Grim...

 

[ForamenMagnumPI]

Anything that sounds too good to be true probably is. That being said, places that have a harder time drawing physicians (rural areas, underserved areas, etc) will likely need to pay more to attract good family doctors. However, it is important that when you look into these opportunities, you inquire about the average salaries of family doctors in the community after the income guarantee period lapses.

 

[DrJosephKim]

Don't believe every recruitment brochure you read. They will often use convincing words like "guaranteed income," or "minimum salary plus bonus," etc. It's critical to really understand how some of these salary structures are designed. Some may use the model of a forgivable loan (or non-forgivable loan).

In essence, you may make $200k the first year (guaranteed income), but then if you don't earn more than that in your 2nd year by seeing a very high volume of patients, then you may find yourself earning much less to "pay for" that first year of high income. It's quite complex and difficult to explain in a few lines, but the bottom line is that if you speak with attorneys who review medical contracts, you'll hear all sorts of stories that will open your eyes.

 

[Peter Benders]

i agree with dr grim. many of the jobs are legit. people can try for jobs in gastro as it pays well. cardio is also a good option but there is lot of work to do.

 

[secretwave101]

Be wary of independent recruiters, and their claims of fortune. They have ways of justifying what they say...but typically their jobs are inflated about 20% (my opinion).

It isn't ALWAYS a farce. There's just stipulations that you often don't see right away.

Take home point: Base all decisions on the actual contract. If there is ANYTHING in that contract that you either don't understand, or find too boring to actually read...get a lawyer to review it with you. And make sure the lawyer has experience with these contracts. A little searching will lead to a lawyer who specializes in reviewing physician contracts. They'll usually read it for about $400.

My bro's a lawyer, so I had him read over mine. The contract was a mere 3 PAGES, and he made the damn thing so complicated it blew my mind. I didn't want to pay anyone to review 3 pages, but I was glad my bro checked it out. Even the simple stuff isn't so simple and can lead to some serious money loss or resentment for you.

Here's an example: My contract said I was to work 4 days per week, with a rotating day off. I was set on a salary of 135,000/year.

Cool. Sound fine. How is there a problem in that? Nothing to talk about, right?

My bro calls back and asks, "What happens when there's a holiday? Do you still get your scheduled day off? If not, then they shouldn't be able to count the holiday as your day off unless they pay you. Do they have a pay contingency for weeks where one of the days is a holiday?"

Uhhhh.

To the OP: The jobs are "real". But expect LOTS of stipulations that are impossible to know until you have a real contract in your hand and translated by a lawyer.