Landmark: Provider status continues to never pass

[Deja]

So you'd rather continue this downward trend then work hard?

wagrxm seem to want this... all you guys are just bunch of lazy pharmacists that doesn't want to work hard

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[wagrxm2000]

wagrxm seem to want this... all you guys are just bunch of lazy pharmacists that doesn't want to work hard

Sounds about right

 

[Modest_anteater]

Anyone else tired of these provider status updates?

"85% of Congress supports our bill for the tenth year in a row but still doesn't make it a law!"

I'm sure that comforts our friends working for Kroger, Publix, Walgreens, and everywhere else that continues to cut pay and hours.

Dude i'm sorry you fell for it. "Provider status" was never a real thing. It was a carefully disguised pipe dream dreamed up by pharm school Deans to sell more warm bodies in their school so they could bill bill BILL the federal government. Even if it was to happen tomorrow that LUNCH has already been consumed by PAs and NPs. There is not much money left in provider status. I've noticed now the schools have been pushing "PGY1 PGY2 and PGY3" so that you can be a CLINICAL PHARMACIST aka REAL DOCTOR (TM). It's just all vapor marketing bro. Don't take it personally. I would do the same thing if I was a pharm school dean.

 

[Secret_Informant]

Dude i'm sorry you fell for it. "Provider status" was never a real thing. It was a carefully disguised pipe dream dreamed up by pharm school Deans to sell more warm bodies in their school so they could bill bill BILL the federal government. Even if it was to happen tomorrow that LUNCH has already been consumed by PAs and NPs. There is not much money left in provider status. I've noticed now the schools have been pushing "PGY1 PGY2 and PGY3" so that you can be a CLINICAL PHARMACIST aka REAL DOCTOR (TM). It's just all vapor marketing bro. Don't take it personally. I would do the same thing if I was a pharm school dean.

The argument about a PGY3 circulated for some time, but it is far-fetched:

Is PGY3 the Future of Clinical Pharmacy Training?

We need more PGY1s before we can even THINK of having a PGY3. I think the individual who posted the first article in the form of a question is what I call: jumping the gun. This means the individual is proposing a strategy to increase to a PGY3 before everyone in pharmacy can achieve a PGY1: a premature strategy for one that has credentialed training. There simply are not enough PGY1 programs to accommodate every PharmD and it is hard to get into a PGY1 or PGY2 as it is.

Reconsidering the Idea of PGY3 Subspecialty Training in Clinical Pharmacy

I agree with the second article on this one for the reasons mentioned in the article. I am not convinced that a PGY3 is what we need right now. We need to address the oversaturation first before educational expansion is even possible, and some people still are not convinced that oversaturation even exists. Furthermore, the requirements for the PGY3 are not established yet.

These articles generate more questions rather than provide answers. For instance: Will a pharmacist need 5 years of experience in the area of interest before applying to bypass the PGY-2 requirements? Will there be a grandfathering process if you worked within the same hospital system for so many years? Is the PGY3 another means of exploitation for student pharmacists and deferring salaries? If you are not credentialed as a PGY1, could you even rebut the existence of a PGY3 or even a PGY4 for that matter?

Time will tell the story, but I feel we have been exploited enough by pharmacy schools. We do not need more grief to facilitate the medical model of education.

 

[BidingMyTime]

The argument about a PGY3 circulated for some time, but it is far-fetched: We need more PGY1s before we can even THINK of having a PGY3. I think the individual who posted the first article in the form of a question is what I call: jumping the gun. This means the individual is proposing a strategy to increase to a PGY3 before everyone in pharmacy can achieve a PGY1: a premature strategy for one that has credentialed training. There simply are not enough PGY1 programs to accommodate every PharmD and it is hard to get into a PGY1 or PGY2 as it is. Time will tell the story, but I feel we have been exploited enough by pharmacy schools. We do not need more grief to simply facilitate the medical model of education.

I hate to speak for ModestAnteater, but I'm pretty sure he was being sardonic. Nobody seriously thinks a PG-3 is necessary, the talk of it is clearly just a ploy by interests that would keep pharmacists forever working at a student salary. Some unemployed clinical pharmacists are latching onto this, thinking it would surely guarantee them a job (it won't.) We don't need more PG-1's, because we already have plenty of unemployed/underemployed PG-1's working retail.

 

[jjcayce123]

I dont want provider status...unless it comes with physician pay.

 

[projektreverb]

I dont want provider status...unless it comes with physician pay.

Landmark status will come with decreased or identical pay with additional responsibilities.

 

[sozetone]

Thank god it hasn’t passed.

Then it would be....answered phones, counseled patients on new fills, verified scripts, entered DUR notes, helped customers at drive thru, helped customers at pic up, trained new techs, answered doctor calls, listened to voicemail, checked in CIIs, assisted customers in finding toilet paper in the aisles, called doctors for refills, faxed doctors for refills, checked the PDMP, checked stock of CIIs on sketchy CII scripts coming in, declined fill for CII scripts where patients were clearly doctor shopping, called the ER or provider to verify they checked the PDMP and are aware patient is on higher Xnarcotic dose, double checked if X person could fill their Xcontrolled med today, asked to diagnose strange rashes at the counseling window, asked to fill out-of-country scripts at counseling window, asked to identify X name of drug from X country, verified scripts coming in from neighboring urgent care clinic, gave shingle shots, gave flu shots, gave TDap vaccines, gave hepatitis A/B vaccines, mixed antibiotics, answered questions from technicians, called over to drive thru and/or pic up for urgent questions, handled customer complaints.......

I am sure I am missing additional tasks, but what is it now that I will be asked to do without additional pay, should this bill get passed?

You forgot bearing the responsibility of being the PIC on ALL that! the over-all business and driving results....lol

 

[sozetone]

i estimate 3-5 years before the field collapses entirely, so enjoy what you can.....

 

[lane one]

The argument about a PGY3 circulated for some time, but it is far-fetched:

Is PGY3 the Future of Clinical Pharmacy Training?

We need more PGY1s before we can even THINK of having a PGY3. I think the individual who posted the first article in the form of a question is what I call: jumping the gun. This means the individual is proposing a strategy to increase to a PGY3 before everyone in pharmacy can achieve a PGY1: a premature strategy for one that has credentialed training. There simply are not enough PGY1 programs to accommodate every PharmD and it is hard to get into a PGY1 or PGY2 as it is.

Reconsidering the Idea of PGY3 Subspecialty Training in Clinical Pharmacy

I agree with the second article on this one for the reasons mentioned in the article. I am not convinced that a PGY3 is what we need right now. We need to address the oversaturation first before educational expansion is even possible, and some people still are not convinced that oversaturation even exists. Furthermore, the requirements for the PGY3 are not established yet.

These articles generate more questions rather than provide answers. For instance: Will a pharmacist need 5 years of experience in the area of interest before applying to bypass the PGY-2 requirements? Will there be a grandfathering process if you worked within the same hospital system for so many years? Is the PGY3 another means of exploitation for student pharmacists and deferring salaries? If you are not credentialed as a PGY1, could you even rebut the existence of a PGY3 or even a PGY4 for that matter?

Time will tell the story, but I feel we have been exploited enough by pharmacy schools. We do not need more grief to simply facilitate the medical model of education.

4 years undergrad
4 years pharmacy school
3 years post-graduate training.

11 years of school for a salary of 120K/yr and 200K in debt.

Barring any setbacks, you start making actual money and paying back loans at 30. Who in their right mind would pursue that as a career. Might sound like a good idea to someone who already has a PGY2, but if you look at it from 30,000 ft it's ludicrous.

 

[gwarm01]

4 years undergrad
4 years pharmacy school
3 years post-graduate training.

11 years of school for a salary of 120K/yr and 200K in debt.

Barring any setbacks, you start making actual money and paying back loans at 30. Who in their right mind would pursue that as a career. Might sound like a good idea to someone who already has a PGY2, but if you look at it from 30,000 ft it's ludicrous.

120k for a non-dispensing, non-management hospital job is probably a little high to start in most regions too.

 

[ValeRx]

If MTM is any sign....provider status will be a total slap in the face. Walgreens/big corporations are the only ones that will benefit from this. Oh yeah that 30$ you made on that one MTM case where you spent like 30 mins calling the pt back and forth...show me that it got desposited in your paycheck....no.

What's that? You have no time to fit MTM into your workflow? I'm gonna need a weekly action plan on that until it gets solved.

Also, pharmacists are totally not trained to be diagnosticians.

Back when Kroger was first starting their big Outcomes/Mirixa push about 5-6 years ago, we had intern training talking it up. "Oh, you counseled a Medicaid patient on an OTC product? Guess what, you can bill for that! Wrong dose? You can bill for that, too!" So I raised my hand and asked, "So who gets that money? Us? Do we get that in addition to our paychecks?" The response: "well, no, Kroger does.. but still, you get to bill for that!"

 

[Secret_Informant]

I was literally saying if you were continued to be paid ~$60/hour to be a pharmacist and then this was in addition to that - like a bonus for completing MTM

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk

Thanks for clarifying that this compensation was (possibly) in addition to the hourly rate/salary depending on the organization.

My post was also removed before you quoted it. Would you kindly remove it so it does not mislead the thread? Thank you.

 

[txpharmguy]

Back when Kroger was first starting their big Outcomes/Mirixa push about 5-6 years ago, we had intern training talking it up. "Oh, you counseled a Medicaid patient on an OTC product? Guess what, you can bill for that! Wrong dose? You can bill for that, too!" So I raised my hand and asked, "So who gets that money? Us? Do we get that in addition to our paychecks?" The response: "well, no, Kroger does.. but still, you get to bill for that!"

I don't believe you can bill for any of those services anymore. I just cleared out (read: unable to reach x 3) my MTM queues.

 

[sozetone]

An EXIT STRATEGY is all we should be thinking about at this point. We got ourselves into this, we can surely get ourselves out. It's time to admit this is simply a "dead" profession. Not worth the investment anymore. Hyped up doctoral degree, now turning into 3 year residency? We cant even prescribe drugs. Did anyone else contemplate why when they were in pharmacy school earning a DOCTORATE of pharmacy, that we have no prescribing rights? Right there I knew this degree was bogus. But as per usual, it was too late.

 

[Secret_Informant]

An EXIT STRATEGY is all we should be thinking about at this point. We got ourselves into this, we can surely get ourselves out. It's time to admit this is simply a "dead" profession. Not worth the investment anymore. Hyped up doctoral degree, now turning into 3 year residency? We cant even prescribe drugs. Did anyone else contemplate why when they were in pharmacy school earning a DOCTORATE of pharmacy, that we have no prescribing rights? Right there I knew this degree was bogus. But as per usual, it was too late.

Not at the Federal level, no. However, each state is working it out themselves. Ohio was approved for Provider Status, but only questions remain:

1. How will those pharmacists get paid?
2. What healthcare outcomes will be assessed?
3. What training will be provided to those who wish to pursue this?
4. What options are available for those that could care less?
5. Will this approval create more jobs in Ohio for pharmacists and overtake the oversaturation we put ourselves in as a profession?

Pharmacist provider status legislation signed by Governor Kasich!

No answers are known yet.

Side note: If USFCOP wants to be the next Northeastern Ohio Medical University (NEOMED), then they are going to have to step up their game: A LOT. Insane positivity and no tolerance for negativity (the new philosophy of USFCOP 2019) will not be enough; true evidence-based data based on NAPLEX scores, MPJE scores, and job placement outcomes in the pharmacy field for EVERY GRADUATE will demonstrate that proof.

 

[WalSlave]

I’m a proponent of pharmacists having prescriptive authority for various reasons, but I fear the reality is that retail pharmacies will 100% use and abuse you moreso than they already do. You’ll be billing for counseling alright, but you won’t see a dime of it unless it’s in the form of a RVU-based bonus. And even if CVS does offer a RVU bonus where you get a cut after seeing x amount of patients, it’ll no doubt be some insane standard that is nearly impossible to obtain without tripling your current workload.

Protect yourselves!

 

[samven582]

What other entry-level careers are out there where a PharmD is useful besides retail and hospital? I Can't think of any

 

[alpha12]

4 years undergrad
4 years pharmacy school
3 years post-graduate training.

11 years of school for a salary of 120K/yr and 200K in debt.

Barring any setbacks, you start making actual money and paying back loans at 30. Who in their right mind would pursue that as a career. Might sound like a good idea to someone who already has a PGY2, but if you look at it from 30,000 ft it's ludicrous.

They should have just kept the requirement to be a pharmacist as bachelors instead of making a pharmd.

 

[PharmtoCS]

They should have just kept the requirement to be a pharmacist as bachelors instead of making a pharmd.

...said no pharmacy school ever.

 

[Reirrac]

Ohio now considers pharmacists providers. Thoughts?

Pharmacist provider status legislation signed by Governor Kasich!

 

[BenJammin]

The comments on the OPA Facebook page are hysterical.

 

[AlwaysContrary]

The comments on the OPA Facebook page are hysterical.

Blows my mind just how toxic those physicians are.

 

[projektreverb]

The comments on the OPA Facebook page are hysterical.

I just went thru and skimmed. Man, the comments never disappoint lol

 

[PieRoller]

B’bye pharmacy. It was great while it lasted. Why did we give it away?

 

[BidingMyTime]

Blows my mind just how toxic those physicians are.

Isn't everyone who comments on social media toxic? Facebook always succeeds at bringing out the absolute worse in people. Or maybe half the posters are spam robots, no way to know.

 

[gwarm01]

Isn't everyone who comments on social media toxic? Facebook always succeeds at bringing out the absolute worse in people. Or maybe half the posters are spam robots, no way to know.

Facebook, Reddit, most of the internet actually. It can be frustrating when you assume the other party is arguing in good faith, only to realize they are either 1. insane, 2. ignorant and/or stupid, or 3. just flat out trolling.