Law/Medical School at the same time

[thanecyan]

So I have known of doctors who are also lawyers etc. but in most of these cases they went to each professional school separately.


But recently I have heard of students doing BOTH at the same time. My brother is a 2nd year at a tier1 law school and he says there's a student in his class who is also enrolled in medical school at the SAME TIME he's enrolled in law school.

Naturally, the student is late to law lectures every single day.



Anyone think this is crazy? awesome? tacos?

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[TXDO]

So I have known of doctors who are also lawyers etc. but in most of these cases they went to each professional school separately.


But recently I have heard of students doing BOTH at the same time. My brother is a 2nd year at a tier1 law school and he says there's a student in his class who is also enrolled in medical school at the SAME TIME he's enrolled in law school.

Naturally, the student is late to law lectures every single day.



Anyone think this is crazy? awesome? tacos?

Hi there,
It's not totally crazy, depend on each individual. I have thought about studying of law too, but maybe later. I love both medicine and law. However, I definitely not do both of them at the same time.
It's my 2c😀

 

[MossPoh]

I have a hard time seeing how this works and how one could be good at any thing. Most law students I know spend nearly as much time as med students doing their crap. There is also no real benefit to it at all.....none. Everything you do in one area detracts from another.

 

[TexasTriathlete]

I cannot imagine how this idea is anything other than idiotic.

Especially given the nature of law school, where almost every school ranks you in your class, and that is what is going to determine whether you work at the DA's office, or at a good firm.

Also, what the hell does this guy plan to do during 4th-year and residency? Forget everything he learned in law school? Lawyers often work as much as residents.

One of my old clients, a lawyer, once told me this: "If I could do it all over again, I'd have gone to med school. The only thing worse than law school is practicing law."

She was a tax attorney though, which is probably high on the list of "worst jobs ever"

 

[DrMidlife]

Being late to class probably has nothing to do with it. There are 21 MD schools that offer a combined MD/JD. The JD years don't overlap with the MD years.

 

[MossPoh]

I just can't imagine how useful it would be. I'm sure there are people with more knowledge on this (aka Law2Doc) but it still seems ridiculous. If you want to practice law then go to law school if you want to practice medicine then go to med school. If you realize you hate one then switch. That is a lot of time and stress to put in for no true benefits.

 

[DrJD]

Yea, you truly can't do both at the same time, so I think a few of your facts are mixed up. I don't care how smart someone is, there is no way a human could simultaneously handle the course work. Both law school and medical school require an entire days effort every day.

However, like was mentioned before, there are MD/JD programs which are appealing to some. I was in law school a while ago and considering this option but decided against it. Once you graduate you truly do need to pick one or the other and then go with it. There are a few niche enviroments for the MD/JD and if your goal is to fit into one of these slots, then this may be the degree for you.

However, if you are like me, and the poster above and you just love the law, then later in your career you can attend an evening program or attend full time once you retire. But at this point it isn't for a career, it is just for intellectual stimulation.

So yes, some people do it, but for most it would be a waste and they should just focus on one or the other. Some people argue that they want to be medical malpractice attorneys so they get this, but in reality a JD is all you need, wasting an additional 3 years on a MD is unnecessary! Some people say they want to be able to defend themselves once they are clinicians, also not a good use of time and money though. You are giving up two years of your life, and two years of salary as a physician to get it, which is mroe than you would ever pay the best lawyer in the field through the course of your practice. So moral of the story, possible to get both yes, at the same tie literally, no, worth it, probably not but it depends.

 

[nlax30]

I agree with the majority here in that I don't see a whole lot of purpose in pursuing both, especially at the same time. I'm not familiar with the specifics of those combined programs, what do they do, add on a a couple years?

I watched my wife go through law school (at a good school) I would absolutely be bored to tears if I had to do that. For the most part I think these two fields attract different personalities and there's probably not many to begin with who are truly interested in doing both. I think she said they actually had a pediatrician in her class, but she had already been practicing a while and I think she was pretty much leaving medicine to pursue law.

Ancedotal evidence time...... I only know two DO/JDs, one is a faculty member at my school. He got the JD after he was already practicing (surgeon) and pretty much got it cause he had the time, money and was "curious". He did use it to some degree by doing some work at the state level on some board of medicine. Another is a local DO/JD (again, JD years after the DO). As far as I know he currently uses both, has a private med/law practice and is also heavily involved in politics.

Law school is hard but I don't think it's as constantly insane as med school can be. My wife keeps telling me that I study on a normal basis more than they did during school, and even as much as her final studying push for the bar.

 

[WestcoastMedicine]

One of our deans is a DO/JD/MBA. We have also had several other DO/JDs lecture to us during our first two years. Personally I don't know why anyone would want to go to law school, combined with medical school or not. I would be bored out of my mind 😀 I believe that the ones I met went to law school part time at night once they were already practicing physicians.

 

[thanecyan]

I'd like to clarify that this local kid is NOT at a joint program, none of that MD/JD or DO/JD stuff. He literally does the two programs completely separately.


He is a student at UH Law, which has NO medical school attached.
Being in Houston, this kid has a choice between UT-H or BaylorMed.
(I believe he's at UT)


So, yeah, kinda crazy IMO 😛



This is just a local case. A couple weeks after my brother told me about his classmate my girlfriend, who is a board member for some national scholarship gig, told me about one her recent applicants who is a MS2 applying for first year law school.

 

[nlax30]

Assuming it's true and not some joint program that is crazy..... I'm surprised the schools are even allowing him to do both at the same time.

 

[thanecyan]

Yeah, I was in disbelief for a good while when my brother first told me.

I thought he was bull****ting me. 🙁


He is a URM though, think that plays a role in schools allowing him to do it?

 

[Esquire]

One of my old clients, a lawyer, once told me this: "If I could do it all over again, I'd have gone to med school. The only thing worse than law school is practicing law."

As someone who has been "practicing" law for a while and has worked in some of the top law firms, those are my thoughts exactly.

It doesn't matter how great your grades or law school were or even your experience, at the big law firms, you are treated like a piece of **** by the partners who themselves are treated like **** by their clients. You're not really "practicing" law because you have no clients of your own. You are basically the equivalent of a perpetual med resident until you get laid off.

If you haven't heard, big firms are canning their associates left and right and rescinding offers they made to new graduates. It's brutal.

At small law firms, good luck working for an ambulance chaser 60+ hours/wk for $40k.

 

[19nbj58]

Yeah, I was in disbelief for a good while when my brother first told me.

I thought he was bull****ting me. 🙁


He is a URM though, think that plays a role in schools allowing him to do it?

what, judunno? URM's are allowed to do anything they want.

 

[Law2Doc]

I just can't imagine how useful it would be. I'm sure there are people with more knowledge on this (aka Law2Doc) but it still seems ridiculous. If you want to practice law then go to law school if you want to practice medicine then go to med school. If you realize you hate one then switch. That is a lot of time and stress to put in for no true benefits.

Totally agree. It's not useful at all. There are no jobs that require both degrees, and very very few where it would actually be advantageous. Most people with both degrees end up having to choose to use one or the other. And you won't earn any higher income with both degrees. I can understand folks who are career changers who decide they are more attracted to the other field for whatever reason, and make the transition. But I see no point in getting both degrees at the onset. You cost yourself several years, and tens of thousands of dollars for a second degree you won't use. The only jobs where both degrees are debatably useful are working in public health policy legislation, or teaching medical ethics and health law. Neither of these jobs are as lucrative as being a clinician or practitioner, and neither really require both degrees, but having both could be helpful. There is no benefit to having an MD to do medmal -- 99.99% of medmal lawyers have no MD and do fine. And there is no advantage to having a JD to be a medical expert witness -- plenty of MDs are able to do this just fine without the JD. Really no advantage I can see to having both degrees at the outset. So if you make a career change, that's fine. But to get them simultaneously is not so well thought out. And this is coming from someone who has both these degrees (and will likely just be using one). That's my informed two cents.

 

[thanecyan]

Got an update from my brother!

While his program is officially not a joint program, both schools know of his situation. That being said, they are more lenient with attendance and when he has to take tests I believe.

But that's about it!

 

[Cp22kjer]

Totally agree. It's not useful at all. There are no jobs that require both degrees, and very very few where it would actually be advantageous. Most people with both degrees end up having to choose to use one or the other. And you won't earn any higher income with both degrees. I can understand folks who are career changers who decide they are more attracted to the other field for whatever reason, and make the transition. But I see no point in getting both degrees at the onset. You cost yourself several years, and tens of thousands of dollars for a second degree you won't use. The only jobs where both degrees are debatably useful are working in public health policy legislation, or teaching medical ethics and health law. Neither of these jobs are as lucrative as being a clinician or practitioner, and neither really require both degrees, but having both could be helpful. There is no benefit to having an MD to do medmal -- 99.99% of medmal lawyers have no MD and do fine. And there is no advantage to having a JD to be a medical expert witness -- plenty of MDs are able to do this just fine without the JD. Really no advantage I can see to having both degrees at the outset. So if you make a career change, that's fine. But to get them simultaneously is not so well thought out. And this is coming from someone who has both these degrees (and will likely just be using one). That's my informed two cents.

Great info on the subject. Thanks.

 

[MikeyP DO JD]

There are an enormous amount of things you can do with a dual degree. I myself am in my final year of a 6 year DO/JD program at UMDNJ-SOM and Rutgers Law. I did 2 years medical school, took boards, then did 2 years plus summers of law school, then went back to finish 3rd and 4th year of medicine. Credits are cross counted and it cuts off a year (usually med is 4 law is 3).

Given the increasing legality and complexity of the health care system having a law degree makes you an invaluable asset. Less than 1% of the nation's 600,000 physicians and 900,000 attorneys hold degrees in both law and medicine (approximately 2,000 individuals).

I received a fantastic education and believe a law degree will serve as a great asset to me.
I wish to pursue an anesthesiology residency and use the law degree as a supplement. I want to get legally involved in the American Society of Anesthesiologists. I also want to do consulting and expert witnessing work.

Coming from someone who went through the training myself I think a dual degree is extremely useful. Any questions please let me know and PM me!

 

[bigDinLV]

So I have known of doctors who are also lawyers etc. but in most of these cases they went to each professional school separately.


But recently I have heard of students doing BOTH at the same time. My brother is a 2nd year at a tier1 law school and he says there's a student in his class who is also enrolled in medical school at the SAME TIME he's enrolled in law school.

Naturally, the student is late to law lectures every single day.



Anyone think this is crazy? awesome? tacos?

Mmmmm tacos sound good.

 

[MossPoh]

It just depends on WHY you are doing it. If you are doing it for increased income and job chances then you are wasting your time in my opinion. If you are doing it out of the love and pursuit of knowledge then you are in the right frame of mind. You WILL (in all likelihood) make less by taking a job and/or dedicating your time to being a physician advocate or whatever else. Is someone needed who can bridge the gap in the legislative world? Sure....it never hurts, but most don't pursue it. They rather make 250k+ doing their first love rather than 80k while trying to get your medical counterparts to make more. (The vast majority of law jobs are in the 60-80k range)