Listing Military Experience on Application

[AnotherLawyer]

Greetings,

What are your thoughts on listing military work experience, where jobs often change? Suppose someone is in the military for 10 years and during those ten years they've had five jobs, ranging from 1-3 years each. If these are all clearly distinct jobs, would you break it out into five entries?

My gut reaction is yes. But at the same time I don't want to look like I am trying to excessively milk the goodwill shown to military/veteran applicants by adcoms.

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[Unico]

What are you writing it for? Medical school app, CV, etc?


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[AnotherLawyer]

What are you writing it for? Medical school app, CV, etc?


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Sorry, I guess I was kind of ambiguous. I'm asking about the work/activities section of the AMCAS/TMDSAS primary application.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

The couple of people I've talked to said to list it under one work experience with a brief description of your duties. If you have one or two experiences that are super relevant and/or meaningful, I'd say you could list those separately. But you don't want to take too much space away from the other aspects of your app.

 

[AnotherLawyer]

The couple of people I've talked to said to list it under one work experience with a brief description of your duties. If you have one or two experiences that are super relevant and/or meaningful, I'd say you could list those separately. But you don't want to take too much space away from the other aspects of your app.

Well AMCAS gives you 1325 characters, TMDSAS gives you 300, and AACOM gives you 700. 1325 is just over one single spaced page. 300 is about a five line paragraph. I think it would be challenging to fit a 10 year career encompassing several distinct jobs into the AMCAS limit, and impossible for AACOM and TMDSAS. But I don't know the answer, which is why I asked. Thanks for your input and thank you for your service.

What does @Goro think?

 

[darknecrosforte]

You can freely list distinct billets or MOS-related functions. Like if you are fire-direction control but then get sent to the chow hall for two months, you could describe very different skill sets or experiences. Duty stations can also be separate entries, especially if comparing Okinawa to a state-side duty station or combat deployments. And yes, combat deployments should be included as its own thing, especially if you're comfortable talking about it during an interview. It will not be seen as milking the V card. It will pique curiosity in adcoms who may not be fully aware of how often military service massively deviates from your job description and displays adaptability (which, if mentioned during an interview, is highly desirable in medical students and residents).

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Well AMCAS gives you 1325 characters, TMDSAS gives you 300, and AACOM gives you 700. 1325 is just over one single spaced page. 300 is about a five line paragraph. I think it would be challenging to fit a 10 year career encompassing several distinct jobs into the AMCAS limit, and impossible for AACOM and TMDSAS. But I don't know the answer, which is why I asked. Thanks for your input and thank you for your service.

What does @Goro think?

Yeah, I have a number of distinct jobs. Two of them I could probably combine, but the other two are completely different. I've also been to a few commands. I hear you on fitting everything. I'm planning on putting my military service down in one slot with a short blurb about my two less exciting things, then putting all my clinical experience in one slot with a bunch of detail and my two biggest collaterals in their own slots because they have a lot to do with leadership and volunteerism. I dunno if that's the best thing to do, but that's the only way I can think of to highlight those experiences.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

You can freely list distinct billets or MOS-related functions. Like if you are fire-direction control but then get sent to the chow hall for two months, you could describe very different skill sets or experiences. Duty stations can also be separate entries, especially if comparing Okinawa to a state-side duty station or combat deployments. And yes, combat deployments should be included as its own thing, especially if you're comfortable talking about it during an interview. It will not be seen as milking the V card. It will pique curiosity in adcoms who may not be fully aware of how often military service massively deviates from your job description and displays adaptability (which, if mentioned during an interview, is highly desirable in medical students and residents).

Good to know. My only concern wouldn't be milking the V card, but crowding the whole app with that stuff and leaving out the other stuff like research, volunteering etc.

 

[AnotherLawyer]

Good to know. My only concern wouldn't be milking the V card, but crowding the whole app with that stuff and leaving out the other stuff like research, volunteering etc.

If you have so many truly meaningful experiences that picking just 15 is a challenge, that's a good problem to have!

Luckily for me, I don't have that problem. I can put down my shadowing, volunteering, and clinical experience, and still have plenty of room to discuss my time in the military.

 

[JustPlainBill]

I can tell you that I held multiple jobs in between being laid off from engineering and getting into medical school -- listed every one. I would think that if it's within the same MOS but a slightly different set of responsibilities you could get away with listing it as a "bullet" item. If it were 2 separate MOS' with the requisite different training/responsibilities, I'd list it separately.

Oh, don't forget to get your picture taken in your class A's -- my MCAT teacher at Kaplan was an LT in the 82nd and used his picture in class A's -- got in and for all I know is now a happily practicing cardiologist somewhere -- of course he did his undergrad at Hopkins.....

 

[HMtoDO]

I listed all of them as separate. All of my combat deployments were separate and commands were separate as well. I also put my military awards (CAR's, NAM's, PUC's etc). I don't feel I was milking anything. I've been all over the world during my 8 years and have seen and done things most never will. It goes to life experience and maturity.


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[trev5150]

Wherever I'm enumerating the skillsets acquired from my time in the Marine Corps and used I'd always break out the militarese/corporate babelfish. You need to ensure that people understand it in plain terms. That said, you just want to hit the highlights. Don't overload with all the nitnoid stuff, because Those That Read The Application might get the idea you're trying to make too much out of nothing.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

I listed all of them as separate. All of my combat deployments were separate and commands were separate as well. I also put my military awards (CAR's, NAM's, PUC's etc). I don't feel I was milking anything. I've been all over the world during my 8 years and have seen and done things most never will. It goes to life experience and maturity.


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Good to know. I've been straight blue side. Would you still list deployments separately? They aren't combat deployments (they were C5F deployments on a small buoy, but it was still great experience (clinical or otherwise).

 

[HMtoDO]

Good to know. I've been straight blue side. Would you still list deployments separately? They aren't combat deployments (they were C5F deployments on a small buoy, but it was still great experience (clinical or otherwise).

It depends on your role during the deployments. If it changed with something of significance then I would. I imagine after your first one your second one would probably be increased leadership which is huge on a deployment (I myself went from a line corpsman to a senior line so my responsibility increase was dramatic). I listed them separately and identified unique points from each one so it wasn't repetitive (let's be honest we see sick call everyday no matter deployed or in the rear so listing it on everything is a moot point haha). I think if you can identify bullets that show growth in experience and/or leadership/responsibility it is beneficial to list them separately given you have enough space.



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[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

It depends on your role during the deployments. If it changed with something of significance then I would. I imagine after your first one your second one would probably be increased leadership which is huge on a deployment (I myself went from a line corpsman to a senior line so my responsibility increase was dramatic). I listed them separately and identified unique points from each one so it wasn't repetitive (let's be honest we see sick call everyday no matter deployed or in the rear so listing it on everything is a moot point haha). I think if you can identify bullets that show growth in experience and/or leadership/responsibility it is beneficial to list them separately given you have enough space.



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Yeah. I was planning listing sick call stuff underway and in port all in the same bullet point. It is good to know that I can list deployments separately. I had much more responsibility on deployment and after than I did before.

Also, for some reason I thought we only got 10 slots on AMCAS. Good to know it's 15. That opens it up a lot.

 

[HMtoDO]

Don't know about AMCAS as I did not even bother filling it out but I will mention that for any unit awards you can use the first few sentences of the write up for it under you awards. I did this for my PUC and NUC. It was worded in a much more concise manner than I would have been able to describe it. Good luck man. The Navy needs more good mustangs to help guide the enlisted. If it wasn't for my mentors, who were also mustangs, I wouldn't be where I am today waiting to start medical school. I can't go back in but I will be sure to pay it forward!

Yeah. I was planning listing sick call stuff underway and in port all in the same bullet point. It is good to know that I can list deployments separately. I had much more responsibility on deployment and after than I did before.

Also, for some reason I thought we only got 10 slots on AMCAS. Good to know it's 15. That opens it up a lot.

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[GnothiSeauton]

Only one school asked for a CV, in which case I uploaded it. My CV lists my billets sequentially. I also listed special training, a few exercises, and a meaningful personal award in the Work/Activities section, which taken together had enough detail to outline my military work. Some secondaries also provide a prompt along the lines of "What were you doing between graduation and now if you took time between undergrad and medical school", where I wrote out my military service in brief.

I've noticed that interviewers have commented on or asked about little details from throughout my application, some stuff I only put in the secondary prompts, some only in the Work/Activities, some in my personal statement, etc. Even if you don't get the opportunity to write a CV for a secondary, the people reviewing your application can piece together the story if you spread the details around where they're relevant.

 

[esob]

What is a V card and how do I milk it?

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

What is a V card and how do I milk it?

 

[68PGunner]

Take your pic in Class A and go to your interview in Class A. If you do this, you would improve your acceptance rate from 30% to 70%.

 

[AnotherLawyer]

Take your pic in Class A and go to your interview in Class A. If you do this, you would improve your acceptance rate from 30% to 70%.

Is this true? I really have mixed feelings about this. Maybe it's my own insecurities because I am a JAG and always feel like I don't merit anywhere close to as much respect as those Soldiers doing the real work of fighting wars. With that said, if wearing my ASUs doubles my chances, then I'll swallow my pride and do it.

 

[68PGunner]

Is this true? I really have mixed feelings about this. Maybe it's my own insecurities because I am a JAG and always feel like I don't merit anywhere close to as much respect as those Soldiers doing the real work of fighting wars. With that said, if wearing my ASUs doubles my chances, then I'll swallow my pride and do it.

I kid you not. Wear that Class A uniform to interviews Strong and Proud.

 

[BombsAway]

I do not condone such tomfoolery.

But hey, somebody has to ask for that free bloomin onion I guess.

 

[BombsAway]

Like, just wear a pin on your suit. like, an army pin, some jump wings, a purple heart. whatever you got going on. more classy.

 

[68PGunner]

That advice was given to me by multiple medical officers along w/ PDs at one of the med centers for the Army.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

That advice was given to me by multiple medical officers along w/ PDs at one of the med centers for the Army.

I got told by an adcom here to wear my blues.

 

[BombsAway]

If you're still active duty, you may have an excuse, but it still screams "I want attention". If you're interviewing at USUHS, go for it. military residency, go for it.

If you aren't still serving, you can only wear a dress uniform under these conditions:

1) When attending military funerals, memorial services, weddings, inaugurals, and other occasions of ceremony.

(2) When attending parades on national or state holidays, or other patriotic parades or ceremonies in which any active or reserve United States military unit is taking part.

A med school interview is not an occasion of ceremony. It would only serve to garner personal attention.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

If you're still active duty, you may have an excuse, but it still screams "I want attention". If you're interviewing at USUHS, go for it. military residency, go for it.

If you aren't still serving, you can only wear a dress uniform under these conditions:

1) When attending military funerals, memorial services, weddings, inaugurals, and other occasions of ceremony.

(2) When attending parades on national or state holidays, or other patriotic parades or ceremonies in which any active or reserve United States military unit is taking part.

True. I'm AD so that's probably why they told me to do that. If you're not active, definitely don't. I'd say go with a pin like you said. Classy.

 

[68PGunner]

If you're still active duty, you may have an excuse, but it still screams "I want attention". If you're interviewing at USUHS, go for it. military residency, go for it.

If you aren't still serving, you can only wear a dress uniform under these conditions:

1) When attending military funerals, memorial services, weddings, inaugurals, and other occasions of ceremony.
(2) When attending parades on national or state holidays, or other patriotic parades or ceremonies in which any active or reserve United States military unit is taking part.

A med school interview is not an occasion of ceremony. It would only serve to garner personal attention.[/B]

This is one of those times where standing out among other suits in that interview room will do more good to you than harm.

Also, I want to highlight "other occasions of ceremony," which can be open to multiple interpretations.

 

[BombsAway]

Also, I want to highlight "other occasions of ceremony," which can be open to multiple interpretations.

So you interpret a professional school interview to be on the same level of pomp and circumstance as a military funeral? I imagine it leaves it open to things like retirement ceremonies, or to attend your family member's ____ school graduation (ranger, SF, airborne, redeployment...). Anywhere where others would be wearing the uniform to the credit of the greater whole, not their own.

You don't get to decide when/where/how to wear a uniform. Regulations do. Especially for a "leg up". Shameless.

 

[esob]

I contemplated wearing blues for my salute induction ceremony a while back at school, but decided against it. I was under the impression you could only wear them if you were retired (medical or years of service). And granted the regs are open to interpretation and TBH, the whole 1st amendment issue really probably means anyone, including a non-veteran could legally wear them (they've already decided you can wear medals you didn't earn as a statement of free speech last time I checked) but it seems more than a little out of context to wear a dress uniform to an interview, even if you are on AD.

 

[68PGunner]

So you interpret a professional school interview to be on the same level of pomp and circumstance as a military funeral? I imagine it leaves it open to things like retirement ceremonies, or to attend your family member's ____ school graduation (ranger, SF, airborne, redeployment...). Anywhere where others would be wearing the uniform to the credit of the greater whole, not their own.

You don't get to decide when/where/how to wear a uniform. Regulations do. Especially for a "leg up". Shameless.

Get off your high horse. I'm not the one deciding on the regs. I'm just quoting the portion of the reg that could be open toward interpretation.

Based on that interpretation, you could literally wear Class A to dinner parties if that's your wish.

 

[68PGunner]

So you interpret a professional school interview to be on the same level of pomp and circumstance as a military funeral? I imagine it leaves it open to things like retirement ceremonies, or to attend your family member's ____ school graduation (ranger, SF, airborne, redeployment...). Anywhere where others would be wearing the uniform to the credit of the greater whole, not their own.

You don't get to decide when/where/how to wear a uniform. Regulations do. Especially for a "leg up". Shameless.

What's the reason for pay day activity then? It certainly isn't for any grand noble ceremonial reason other than your commander telling you to be there at the right time in the right uniform. They put that last portion in in order to calm stickler like yourself from being too crazy.

 

[68PGunner]

I contemplated wearing blues for my salute induction ceremony a while back at school, but decided against it. I was under the impression you could only wear them if you were retired (medical or years of service). And granted the regs are open to interpretation and TBH, the whole 1st amendment issue really probably means anyone, including a non-veteran could legally wear them (they've already decided you can wear medals you didn't earn as a statement of free speech last time I checked) but it seems more than a little out of context to wear a dress uniform to an interview, even if you are on AD.

Plenty of medical officers have worn Class A to medical school uniforms. Some of them are retired O-6 or O-7.

Honestly, if I was AD, I could probably comb through the regs and find something that could justify wearing Class A to interviews. However, I am done and have better things to do with my time.

I'm just giving people a leg up on the process if they're interested. During my interview trail, I have met at least one adcom member who's affiliated with the military in some way for every school.

 

[BombsAway]

What's the reason for pay day activity then? It certainly isn't for any grand noble ceremonial reason other than your commander telling you to be there at the right time in the right uniform. They put that last portion in in order to calm stickler like yourself from being too crazy.

Payday activities is on active duty, the regs I posted are for (Wartime) veterans. Retirees have similar, but slightly different regs.

I'm not on a high horse, I'm saying no veteran should be wearing a dress uniform to a medical school interview.

You may be getting hung up on the word "ceremony". A dinner party (or a med school interview) is not a ceremony.

 

[68PGunner]

Payday activities is on active duty, the regs I posted are for (Wartime) veterans. Retirees have similar, but slightly different regs.

I'm not on a high horse, I'm saying no veteran should be wearing a dress uniform to a medical school interview.

You may be getting hung up on the word "ceremony". A dinner party (or a med school interview) is not a ceremony.

I'm done w this topic considering that I have better things to do w my time after finishing my first semester of medical school. Do whatever you want.

 

[Froggy25]

I lumped my activities, because I wanted to ensure that I had room to write about other things. It just wasn't feasible to break out all billets, deployments, duty stations, etc. For instance - I lumped all my time as an infantry officer into one, 700-word experience, including multiple deployments. I broke out my other MOS with multiple deployments into a separate activity also. However, I also broke out one of my deployments because of relevancy. The overall theme I was going for is that I wanted to ensure that I covered the breadth of my experience, but did so in a manner that allowed me to provide and focus in on highlights.

As far as uniforms go, I am in the "suit with pin" crowd. I wore my ASUs to USUHS because that's a different category of school and they specifically mention doing it. Even there, I was with more than one service member who was in a suit.

There was plenty of .mil experience discussion in my application, and my civilian school interviews centered around those experiences despite me wearing a suit. Personally, I'm more comfortable wearing a suit to civilian schools, regardless of any bump a uniform may provide in the admissions process. Nothing to do with regs; I don't think anyone would question on Service A's (full dress with medals is probably a different story).

To me, it would just feel...... strange. It's that whole "know your operational environment" thing, I suppose.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Plenty of medical officers have worn Class A to medical school uniforms. Some of them are retired O-6 or O-7.

Honestly, if I was AD, I could probably comb through the regs and find something that could justify wearing Class A to interviews. However, I am done and have better things to do with my time.

I'm just giving people a leg up on the process if they're interested. During my interview trail, I have met at least one adcom member who's affiliated with the military in some way for every school.

If you're AD, you can wear them whenever you want, so long as there isn't a different prescribed uniform of the day. At least that's how it works in the Navy. I'm definitely wearing my blues to my USUHS interview (because it's required), but I've been seriously thinking about wearing them to civilian schools. If you served, and the regulations allow it, I don't see the problem. I wouldn't go against regs though just for an interview.