MD & DO LM Score 77, Reapplicant

[ShadowGryffin]

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Now that I have your attention 🙂

ORM, Washington State Resident, Applying 2018-2019 Cycle
cGPA: 3.85 -- sGPA: 3.75 -- MCAT: 522 (131/127/132/132)

One quick note about me: I am very late to Pre-Med (was pre-grad for almost all of undergrad). I applied to med school the 2016-2017 cycle with a horrible application and no EC's to speak of. Like, I applied with 10 hours of clinical experience and wrote my PS about how much I loved research. Fortunately I eventually realized how badly I messed up, and was able to withdraw my applications at a few schools. However, I did get Rejected at several schools. I am mostly trying to avoid reapplying to schools if I can, but I have significantly improved my application.

1.) Clinical:

• Currently working full-time as an MA in a small private practice (1000+ hours)
• 300+ hours as a volunteer CNA in a general hospital setting
• 50+ hours volunteering in a free clinic for uninsured/underinsured youth
• Starting to volunteer in a pediatric hospital this week.

2.) Non-Clinical Volunteering: 150+ hours mentoring and teaching underserved kids in an after-school program with the Boy's and Girl's Club.

3.) Research: Three years and multiple summers (2000+ hours) in an organic synthesis/medicinal chemistry lab. No publications. Five poster presentations and one oral presentation. Unlikely to ever be published as my PI has tenure now.

4.) Shadowing:

• Family Medicine (20 hours)
• Pediatrics (20 hours)
• Ortho (30 hours)
• PM&R (20 hours)
• Also have ~50 hours of shadowing with a DO in PM&R.
• Currently setting up shadowing in internal medicine.

5.) Other: I have a good story for going into medicine and a strong personal narrative tying together most of my EC's, mainly related to service, pediatrics and humanism. Primary and secondaries will all be pre-written over the next few months and extensively reviewed. I also have lots of little leadership positions, awards, and smaller (10-20 hour) EC's that are interesting but don't necessarily fit into the narrative of my application. Cheerleading, climbing mountains, volunteering at the medical tent at marathons and music festivals, moderating a fitness forum, ACS Student President, things like that. No family in medicine.

All hours are current as of December 2017 and will go up before applying in June.

The List: (MD)

1. Albany Medical College
2. Albert Einstein College of Medicine
3. Baylor College of Medicine (Rejected)
4. Boston University (Rejected)
5. Case Western Reserve
6. Rosalind Franklin (CMS)
7. Columbia University
8. Creighton University (Withdrew)
9. Drexel
10. Duke University
11. Emory University
12. George Washington
13. Georgetown University (Withdrew)
14. Hofstra
15. Icahn SOM at Mount Sinai
16. Indiana University
17. Temple University
18. Loyola University (Rejected)
19. Medical College of Wisconsin
20. NYU
21. Northwestern University (Rejected)
22. Oregon Health & Science
23. Perelman SOM at UPenn
24. Rush Medical College
25. SLU
26. Thomas Jefferson
27. Tufts University
28. UCLA
29. University of Colorado
30. University of Miami
31. University of Michigan
32. University of Nebraska
33. University of Pittsburgh
34. University of Rochester
35. University of Utah
36. University of Washington (Rejected)
37. Vanderbilt University
38. Wake Forest
39. Washington State University (Withdrew)
40. Washington University
41. Wayne State
42. Weill Cornell

Notes:

• I'd like to narrow this list down to around 30-35 schools, but I'm open to adding more if I'd be a good fit.
• I have strong ties to Indiana and Wyoming, moderate ties to Nebraska and weak ties to Michigan, Utah and Colorado.

The List: (DO)

1. Pacific Northwest COM
2. Chicago COM at Midwestern
3. Rocky Vista COM (Denver)
4. ATSU - SOMA

Notes:

• Looking to add a few more osteopathic schools, ideally in the 5-10 range
• I have a strongly supportive letter from a DO I work with, if any schools require that.
• I'm honestly not as familiar with DO admissions, despite a few months of lurking the PreMed Osteopathic forums.

If you have any questions or comments, please feel free to weigh in!

 

[ShadowGryffin]

did you apply to all 42 in the last cycle?

Oh no, thank god. I've already applied to Boston, Baylor, Creighton, Georgetown, Loyola, Northwestern, UW and WSU.

I withdrew my app pre-secondary at Creighton, Georgetown, and WSU. I was rejected by Baylor, Boston, Loyola, Northwestern, and UW.

 

[seren1051]

Go reapplicant! I'm also a reapplicant who's faring a lot better after beefing up my stats and ECs than past cycle two years ago. Good luck!

I don't think you need any more shadowing hours - thats like 140 hours already. You don't need to shadow every single specialty. You're a stellar MD Applicant, so I don't recommend applying to DOs, unless you really want to. It's not like you're a reapplicant to that many schools out there.

 

[ShadowGryffin]

Go reapplicant! I'm also a reapplicant who's faring a lot better after beefing up my stats and ECs than past cycle two years ago. Good luck!

I don't think you need any more shadowing hours - thats like 140 hours already. You don't need to shadow every single specialty. You're a stellar MD Applicant, so I don't recommend applying to DOs, unless you really want to. It's not like you're a reapplicant to that many schools out there.

Thanks, and congrats on the acceptances! One of the schools I'm reapplying to (UW) has told me that they specifically prefer reapplicants who've improved their application because it shows determination and self-reflection. Go us!

I want to get a bit more primary care shadowing, since I'm a little low on that. Ordinarily my ~50 hours would be sufficient but I want to go into primary care myself, so I want to be able to prove I know what I'm getting myself into, if that makes sense.

As far as osteopathic schools, I actually really do want to apply DO. I've worked and shadowed a lot with DO's and OSM3-4's, so I know how they operate and I like it. But I hear that application fees are higher, and I don't know if my stats are too high for DO schools that yield protect.

 

[bae2017]

Am I missing something like a significant red flag? Why are you aiming so low for a LizzyM 77 with strong research? Seems like you have all the boxes checked that you need - the interesting ECs and leadership are important so try to beef those hours up (10-20hrs is not enough) and write about them eloquently. Otherwise everything looks fine, revise your list to focus on the top 20 MD schools or so + a couple mid-tier privates and your state schools

 

[ShadowGryffin]

Am I missing something like a significant red flag? Why are you aiming so low for a LizzyM 77 with strong research? Seems like you have all the boxes checked that you need - the interesting ECs and leadership are important so try to beef those hours up (10-20hrs is not enough) and write about them eloquently. Otherwise everything looks fine, revise your list to focus on the top 20 MD schools or so + a couple mid-tier privates and your state schools

I was under the impression that publications were necessary for strong research. I certainly do have good research experience (I was gonna go to grad school, so that was sort of a requirement lol), but without pubs I thought my research was moderate at best.

I'm aiming low because, for somewhat complicated reasons, it's very important to me that I get in during the 2018-2019 cycle. I want to maximize my chances of admission, hence not applying to Harvard and Johns Hopkins.

Over a quarter of the schools I'm applying to are in the top 20, which I though was already a little excessive. You're suggesting I add more top 20's and get rid of some of the lower yield schools like Rosalind Franklin?

 

[Goro]

You're a lot more golden for the next cycle.
I suggest:

1. Albert Einstein College of Medicine
2. Boston University
3. Case Western Reserve
4. Columbia University
5. Creighton University
6. Duke University
7. Emory University
8. Hofstra
9. Icahn SOM at Mount Sinai
10. NYU
11. Northwestern University
12. Perelman SOM at UPenn OR WashU
13. Tufts University
14. University of Miami
15. University of Pittsburgh
16. University of Rochester
17. University of Washington
18. Vanderbilt University
19. Washington State University
20. Washington University
21. Weill Cornell
22. Keck
23. Tulane
24. Loyola
25. Stanford

I don't think that you need to have any DO schools, but if you must, to keep you closer to home I suggest

1. Pacific Northwest COM
2. Touro-CA
3. Both Westerns
4. AZCOM
5. PacNW

 

[ShadowGryffin]

You're a lot more golden for the next cycle.
I suggest:

1. Albert Einstein College of Medicine
2. Boston University
3. Case Western Reserve
4. Columbia University
5. Creighton University
6. Duke University
7. Emory University
8. Hofstra
9. Icahn SOM at Mount Sinai
10. NYU
11. Northwestern University
12. Perelman SOM at UPenn OR WashU
13. Tufts University
14. University of Miami
15. University of Pittsburgh
16. University of Rochester
17. University of Washington
18. Vanderbilt University
19. Washington State University
20. Washington University
21. Weill Cornell
22. Keck
23. Tulane
24. Loyola
25. Stanford

I don't think that you need to have any DO schools, but if you must, to keep you closer to home I suggest

1. Pacific Northwest COM
2. Touro-CA
3. Both Westerns
4. AZCOM
5. PacNW

Thanks for the help Goro, especially with the DO schools! I really appreciate it!

With regards to Keck and Tulane, I applied to both in my first ill-advised cycle. I held off on applying to Keck because I thought they didn't like reapplicants, and Tulane because I thought they had a strong focus on tropical medicine (which I have no experience in). Would you still advise I apply to both?

 

[seren1051]

Over a quarter of the schools I'm applying to are in the top 20, which I though was already a little excessive. You're suggesting I add more top 20's and get rid of some of the lower yield schools like Rosalind Franklin?

I was thinking exactly same before this cycle and ended up throwing in a bunch of schools with median GPA/MCAT lower than mine. As a reapplicant you feel insecure! Fast forward four months and majority of the low tiers (incl. Rosy Franklin, MCW, GW etc) didn't contact me.

 

[ShadowGryffin]

I was thinking exactly same before this cycle and ended up throwing in a bunch of schools with median GPA/MCAT lower than mine. As a reapplicant you feel insecure! Fast forward four months and majority of the low tiers (incl. Rosy Franklin, MCW, GW etc) didn't contact me.

Well it's only December, you still have at least three months left in the cycle!

IDK, I just feel like I'm in a weird place where I'm not good enough for the top 20 but my stats might be too high for the lower tier schools. The uncanny valley of med school apps lol.

 

[seren1051]

IDK, I just feel like I'm in a weird place where I'm not good enough for the top 20 but my stats might be too high for the lower tier schools. The uncanny valley of med school apps lol.

You know your LizzyM's still higher than WUSTL's median LizzyM, right? I think you'll be surprised next cycle. Good luck!

 

[bae2017]

I was under the impression that publications were necessary for strong research. I certainly do have good research experience (I was gonna go to grad school, so that was sort of a requirement lol), but without pubs I thought my research was moderate at best.

Publications are not necessary for strong research. Excellence in research can be shown in a variety of ways - research output (pubs and posters/abstracts) is certainly one of them, but so are independent projects and strong PI LORs. I'm assuming if you were interested enough in research to be pre-grad school you must really enjoy research and this should have shown through in your work and will show through in how you will talk about it. Which will be great!

I'm aiming low because, for somewhat complicated reasons, it's very important to me that I get in during the 2018-2019 cycle. I want to maximize my chances of admission, hence not applying to Harvard and Johns Hopkins.

Over a quarter of the schools I'm applying to are in the top 20, which I though was already a little excessive. You're suggesting I add more top 20's and get rid of some of the lower yield schools like Rosalind Franklin?

Each applicant maximizes his/her chances at admission not by aiming low but by crafting a well-rounded and appropriate school list. If you really love and have compelling reasons to apply to certain lower tier MD schools or DO schools, then go for it! However, your stats, interests, and ECs are likely to turn more heads in the Top 20 or so. Goro's list is pretty good - he has removed many schools that would be low yield for you. You said you'd like to apply to 30-35 so there is definitely room in that list to add more schools that you like.

 

[ShadowGryffin]

You know your LizzyM's still higher than WUSTL's median LizzyM, right? I think you'll be surprised next cycle. Good luck!

I didn't know that lol, but now I do! Thank you, I'd wish you luck as well, but you you clearly don't need it!

 

[ShadowGryffin]

Publications are not necessary for strong research. Excellence in research can be shown in a variety of ways - research output (pubs and posters/abstracts) is certainly one of them, but so are independent projects and strong PI LORs. I'm assuming if you were interested enough in research to be pre-grad school you must really enjoy research and this should have shown through in your work and will show through in how you will talk about it. Which will be great!


Each applicant maximizes his/her chances at admission not by aiming low but by crafting a well-rounded and appropriate school list. If you really love and have compelling reasons to apply to certain lower tier MD schools or DO schools, then go for it! However, your stats, interests, and ECs are likely to turn more heads in the Top 20 or so. Goro's list is pretty good - he has removed many schools that would be low yield for you. You said you'd like to apply to 30-35 so there is definitely room in that list to add more schools that you like.

Ok, that gives me a better perspective on research. I'm more used to the "publish or perish" kind of mentality. My research was entirely independent, I was in charge of everything from cleaning the glassware to interpreting two-dimensional heteroatomic NMR data. I also have a good letter from my PI (who is aware I'm no longer gunning for grad school lol). I did have an abstract published but I assumed this wasn't a big deal.

Thanks for the perspective, I guess just adding more low yield schools won't necessarily help. I'll start with Goro's solid list and add a few more mid-low tier schools that I can make a strong case for myself at (family ties, etc.)

 

[Walter Raleigh]

According to @LizzyM, only 25 percent of matriculants at schools like Harvard have publications. Pubs help, but are by no means necessary for top 20s.