Locums Market Temp Check

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Locums rates seem to have stagnated in my part of town (PNW) at the 350-400/hr level while W2 salaries have closed some of the gap as contracts get renegotiated with stipend increases. Locums still seems to be the better option for now though. How is the locums market doing in other areas?
 
Coffee PRN said:
That's barely higher than the CRNA locums rates
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Supply and demand. Crnas are only getting $165-185/hr down in Miami. In upstate New York crnas are getting $250-290/hr. Ain’t no one wants to live in upstate New York my crna friends tell me. She’s a snowbird in Rochester New York. Comes down to Florida for winter for $200/hr cause her winter house in on the gulf side of Florida’s west coast.

I know Florida area very well. Orlando Tampa Jacksonville and south Florida. Locums is hit or miss. The key is to have 4-5 hospitals going at the same time. Be willing to drive 2-3 hrs to every place against each other

My normal rate is $350-375/hr but I’m raking in 100 plus hours a week on my locums weeks. I did 115hr last week.

I got a massive 85k over 10 days end of the month spread between two hospitals 2 hrs apart.

My Memphis friend got caught with his pants down (not sexually) but when they let him go 1099 locums. He didn’t have another assignment. So he’s literally has no work for month of August. I asked around for a couple of surgery center if they had slots but they are filled for August.

That is the one word of advice for anyone doing full time locums. Get credentials at as many places as you can even if you don’t work there. Just to keep it as a backup.

So as long as you are willing to travel a little. There is still plenty of work. But if you are tied geographically to a certain area and are inflexible, there will be less jobs opened for locums.
 
Still getting multiple daily locums spam. Most don't mention rate. The ones that do are all 350-400/hr. Demand doesn't seem to be slowing down at all.

My W2 PP job pay has gone up substantially in the last 2 years because of an increased hospital stipend. In 2023 my total comp / total hours worked out to just about $300/hr for what I think was a reasonable lifestyle. 2024 ought to be modestly better, though I'm taking more vacation this year so I might not earn much more in total.

The locums market and its planes, hotels, and rental cars does not tempt me.
 
pgg said:
Still getting multiple daily locums spam. Most don't mention rate. The ones that do are all 350-400/hr. Demand doesn't seem to be slowing down at all.

My W2 PP job pay has gone up substantially in the last 2 years because of an increased hospital stipend. In 2023 my total comp / total hours worked out to just about $300/hr for what I think was a reasonable lifestyle. 2024 ought to be modestly better, though I'm taking more vacation this year so I might not earn much more in total.

The locums market and its planes, hotels, and rental cars does not tempt me.
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I loved planes and hotels and rental cars when I was younger doing locums. These days. Flying is a pain. And I have one kid in high school and another in middle school so a few years left with them. I don’t really want to travel out of town a lot.
Most professional locums are empty nesters/kids in college or single and no kids.

Most of my locums places are usually 45-50 min drive from my house. I will occasionally do a further out one like I’m doing end of this month. It’s because I was hedging my bet about assignments and didn’t want to be stuck with no work.

I’m about to leave my full time job. Easy job. Probably averages $300-320/hr when benefits (free healthcare worth 20k, retirement 30k) factors into the equation with 36-37 hrs worked a week for 41-42 weeks of actual work. But very little opportunity for extra pay these days since fully staffed. No nights. One daytime weekends once every 2 months.

But I’m looking to work more hours the weeks I’m working and take more time off. And locums will afford me to control that. Ideally I would like 20 weeks off. And I can make 500-550k without benefits plus have 20 weeks off. Which is fine with me. If I want to make more. I can do that.
 
aneftp said:
I loved planes and hotels and rental cars when I was younger doing locums. These days. Flying is a pain. And I have one kid in high school and another in middle school so a few years left with them. I don’t really want to travel out of town a lot.
Most professional locums are empty nesters/kids in college or single and no kids.

Most of my locums places are usually 45-50 min drive from my house. I will occasionally do a further out one like I’m doing end of this month. It’s because I was hedging my bet about assignments and didn’t want to be stuck with no work.

I’m about to leave my full time job. Easy job. Probably averages $300-320/hr when benefits (free healthcare worth 20k, retirement 30k) factors into the equation with 36-37 hrs worked a week for 41-42 weeks of actual work. But very little opportunity for extra pay these days since fully staffed. No nights. One daytime weekends once every 2 months.

But I’m looking to work more hours the weeks I’m working and take more time off. And locums will afford me to control that. Ideally I would like 20 weeks off. And I can make 500-550k without benefits plus have 20 weeks off. Which is fine with me. If I want to make more. I can do that.
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Oh snap. You are about to do this full time? Wow!! Congratulations!!
I like collecting travel points. And I don’t like to be underpaid in a saturated market and smaller hospitals in smaller towns treat me better so I continue to do it!!
 
aneftp said:
I loved planes and hotels and rental cars when I was younger doing locums. These days. Flying is a pain. And I have one kid in high school and another in middle school so a few years left with them. I don’t really want to travel out of town a lot.
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I did it a lot when I was in the military, both to supplement low case load and low income. But now I just value being at home almost every night and weekend more than maximum income.

I love seeing high locums rates though. Nice to see you all putting the screws to hospitals and getting paid - and those high costs are gradually driving up employed salaries and private group stipends too. 🙂
 
aneftp said:
I loved planes and hotels and rental cars when I was younger doing locums. These days. Flying is a pain. And I have one kid in high school and another in middle school so a few years left with them. I don’t really want to travel out of town a lot.
Most professional locums are empty nesters/kids in college or single and no kids.

Most of my locums places are usually 45-50 min drive from my house. I will occasionally do a further out one like I’m doing end of this month. It’s because I was hedging my bet about assignments and didn’t want to be stuck with no work.

I’m about to leave my full time job. Easy job. Probably averages $300-320/hr when benefits (free healthcare worth 20k, retirement 30k) factors into the equation with 36-37 hrs worked a week for 41-42 weeks of actual work. But very little opportunity for extra pay these days since fully staffed. No nights. One daytime weekends once every 2 months.

But I’m looking to work more hours the weeks I’m working and take more time off. And locums will afford me to control that. Ideally I would like 20 weeks off. And I can make 500-550k without benefits plus have 20 weeks off. Which is fine with me. If I want to make more. I can do that.
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Understand this however, liking a locums place is hit or miss... some of these places still have old school mentality - you are locums you are crap because you can't work anywhere else (though this is now very much untrue) we will put you into ****ty assignments (ie GI every day), give you the worst CRNAs or forget about and not relieve you etc etc... or the place will have patients with zero preop... I literally had a patient having a full on Angina in pre-op had to be sent to ED because the cardiologist was so bad... so be careful what you are willing to do money is not everything.

The market is drying up a bit in NY/NJ/PA area..... Florida is just a crappy place when it comes to medical care period (unless its Mayo etc.) so again be prepared to be surprised.
 
How quickly can you get credentialed for average locums job assuming you have state license and clean record?
 
caligas said:
How quickly can you get credentialed for average locums job assuming you have state license and clean record?
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100% depends how bad they need/want you.

Emergency credentials can be pushed through in days.

Or months if they don't care.
 
What works against you (being credentialed at many places at once) are medical staff fees. The group has to pay $300-800 per member to be on staff each year. Although we don't use any locums we cull the per diems every year partially due to this, and partially because making sure they do their compliance courses, billing documentation and other hospital/group requirements is a real pain.
 
I've noticed a decrease in hourly pay for locums recently. A hospital in the South that I am currently working has my contract at $400/hr but for the past month they are offering newly signed locums $350/hr. This gig is through a locums agency. The few locums agencies that do post hourly rates online, I have noticed that these same agencies are dropping their hourly rates for the same jobs that previously they were advertising for higher rates. It's good that those doing locums are letting others know what the current market rate is for locums so that people are aware of the average rates. People should also refuse to accept lower offers so that we can be paid fairly. CRNA locums are getting $180-250/hr. If locums anesthesiologists are accepting lower hourly rates then of course the locums agencies will take more of the profit while charging the hospitals a premium rate. Don't be fooled to think that if the hourly rate is lower that it's because the hospitals are dropping their rates. It's probably the locums agencies fibbing so they can take a higher cut while charging the hospitals a lot more
 
If I find a place 2 hours from home and want to commute, could that work? Could I ask for 8:30 start time? Can I get comp for travel time since they won’t pay housing or airfare?
 
IVdoc said:
I've noticed a decrease in hourly pay for locums recently. A hospital in the South that I am currently working has my contract at $400/hr but for the past month they are offering newly signed locums $350/hr. This gig is through a locums agency. The few locums agencies that do post hourly rates online, I have noticed that these same agencies are dropping their hourly rates for the same jobs that previously they were advertising for higher rates. It's good that those doing locums are letting others know what the current market rate is for locums so that people are aware of the average rates. People should also refuse to accept lower offers so that we can be paid fairly. CRNA locums are getting $180-250/hr. If locums anesthesiologists are accepting lower hourly rates then of course the locums agencies will take more of the profit while charging the hospitals a premium rate. Don't be fooled to think that if the hourly rate is lower that it's because the hospitals are dropping their rates. It's probably the locums agencies fibbing so they can take a higher cut while charging the hospitals a lot more
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There is no such thing as refusing to accept a lower rate... you may refuse the next guy may need this job much more then you do and will not only accept the rate offered but an even lower rate. Again, physicians are the worst in banding together. What should have happened was that a national presence such as ABA for example should manage the overall anesthesia free market, or say a union type organizations. When hospitals put out RFPs for providers and 5 agencies respond they can undercut each other. HOW they do that is a different story. Some agencies (smaller more hungry ones) may accept a lower vig from you and attract more candidates with a slightly higher rate taking a loss per candidate but gaining by having more docs in the facility. Meaning, agencies skim as high as 30% per hour from the physicians hourly rate ie rate offered to you $300 is paid to the agency at $400-450. First thing agencies do is come back to you and say things such as "this facility is very rate concisencous they can only pay $300" you come back and say "$350" they say "we will talk to them and get back to you" They may not be talking to anyone at all jst seeing if they are willing to lower their cut from your money..... sometimes they do ask the facility but again the ask is not $325 the ask is $450-475.. I have seen rates to agency as high as $575 and $625 on overtime rates PER HOUR! which translates to 400-425 to the provider.

Facilities have NO CLUE what rates YOU are getting, agencies do not disclose this to the facility (they don't have to by contract). Under ideal circumstances providers should be able to work with the facility directly. The cost of malpractice is minimal compared to the VIG agencies are shaving. Daily malpractice (part-time) is $125-150 a day..... and if you translate full time rates they are even lower. Agencies negotiate even lower malpractice rates in bulk. Not only that some facilities eat up malpractice rates as well, in addition to flights, cars, gas, hotels etc etc.

Again, if you don't accept the rate someone else will. Certain facilities of course are an exception - ie super remote locations etc. but you can't make someone not take a rate if it works for them. The only solution is to stick together and negotiate AS A GROUP..... this would prevent both lower and high rates and actually will make the market much more mobile as in reality the average rates facilities pay out to agencies is the same. IF we could get it to us DIRECTLY that would be key.
 
northeast. MD market is still relatively good for 1099 locums ($350-$400) but hospitals are starting to wise up a bit more and offer prn W2 work in the $300-$350 range for day work which is enough to entice locals to fill shifts. For those of us not doing a ton of side work and taking advantage of 1099 deductions it is way less complicate to just contract directly with hospitals instead of going through a locum recruiter.
 
The PNW starts at 400 for docs..maybe it's 350 in Seattle. Just look around and how many hospitals and groups have vacancies, most people are tied down due to family/location/group, the new grad hiring is done.
 
Concur with DMV rates above. Docs 300-325 day, 350 night, close-in to DC.
CRNAs 200-250 close in to DC.
If you are a known entity/connected, can get ~50/hr more, if contract direct with group. 425 is max I've heard.
Huge shortage Maryland - USAP, MAPMG, ANCO, Reston and their ASC spinoff divisions.
Hospitals and now good ASCs having to stipend their anesthesia.
Hagerstown I have heard goes up to 500, but that's temporary shortage I undertand as something imploded there.
If you want a sense of the market, chat with the locums cold-calls that ring you. They're bored folks, and often will tell me the hospitals and rates that their agencies are paying their CRNAs and MDs - and they can also tell you the lay of the land in your area.
 
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arsene19 said:
Concur with DMV rates above. Docs 300-325 day, 350 night, close-in to DC.
CRNAs 200-250 close in to DC.
If you are a known entity/connected, can get ~50/hr more, if contract direct with group. 425 is max I've heard.
Huge shortage Maryland - USAP, MAPMG, ANCO, Reston and their ASC spinoff divisions.
Hospitals and now good ASCs having to stipend their anesthesia.
Hagerstown I have heard goes up to 500, but that's temporary shortage I undertand as something imploded there.
If you want a sense of the market, chat with the locums cold-calls that ring you. They're bored folks, and often will tell me the hospitals and rates that their agencies are paying their CRNAs and MDs - and they can also tell you the lay of the land in your area.
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yeah. I know exactly what
The hagertown rate was. I was playing games with recruiter. First offer was $300. Than $325. Than $350/hr.

Than he proceeded to call me out of out saying I was lying . I sent him blurred screen shot of my friends contract there. Crickets from him

These recruiters are dishonest. I know people need to make money. And markets are dynamics. Just don’t lie to me when the going rate was $450/500/hr. Ok. So I won’t get $500/hr since it was acute desperate need. I get it.

But don’t say you never went above $400/hr. Lies
 
Secondhand, but if I understand it correctly it was very lucrative for about 1-2 months for MD and CRNAs. But the locals were really getting upset at all the flown-in mercenaries. NEVER discuss pay with the locals! And now it is stabilizing. Though, I suspect there will always be a need/travellers will always be there, since a much better long-term lifestyle is available in Frederick or MoCo.
 
arsene19 said:
Concur with DMV rates above. Docs 300-325 day, 350 night, close-in to DC.
CRNAs 200-250 close in to DC.
If you are a known entity/connected, can get ~50/hr more, if contract direct with group. 425 is max I've heard.
Huge shortage Maryland - USAP, MAPMG, ANCO, Reston and their ASC spinoff divisions.
Hospitals and now good ASCs having to stipend their anesthesia.
Hagerstown I have heard goes up to 500, but that's temporary shortage I undertand as something imploded there.
If you want a sense of the market, chat with the locums cold-calls that ring you. They're bored folks, and often will tell me the hospitals and rates that their agencies are paying their CRNAs and MDs - and they can also tell you the lay of the land in your area.
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I heard USAP lost a bunch of market share in the dc area… all the asc work is someone else’s now…. Heard from a non-USAP doc In the area so not sure if there’s wishful thinking or ?
 
arsene19 said:
Secondhand, but if I understand it correctly it was very lucrative for about 1-2 months for MD and CRNAs. But the locals were really getting upset at all the flown-in mercenaries. NEVER discuss pay with the locals! And now it is stabilizing. Though, I suspect there will always be a need/travellers will always be there, since a much better long-term lifestyle is available in Frederick or MoCo.
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Rate for gbmc was even higher than $500 for a while. Lol. Try $560/hr plus they gave u a crna for ob. . But that was no travel stipends. But great deal for locals. Locums companies tried to offer docs $300/350/hr

But like I said. Rates are dynamics. I think they are hospital employed now.
 
arsene19 said:
Concur with DMV rates above. Docs 300-325 day, 350 night, close-in to DC.
CRNAs 200-250 close in to DC.
If you are a known entity/connected, can get ~50/hr more, if contract direct with group. 425 is max I've heard.
Huge shortage Maryland - USAP, MAPMG, ANCO, Reston and their ASC spinoff divisions.
Hospitals and now good ASCs having to stipend their anesthesia.
Hagerstown I have heard goes up to 500, but that's temporary shortage I undertand as something imploded there.
If you want a sense of the market, chat with the locums cold-calls that ring you. They're bored folks, and often will tell me the hospitals and rates that their agencies are paying their CRNAs and MDs - and they can also tell you the lay of the land in your area.
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Question is why are Physicians accepting these lowball rates? Doesn’t help the rest of us. Stop it!!
 
makemoney2024 said:
Question is why are Physicians accepting these lowball rates? Doesn’t help the rest of us. Stop it!!
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Supply and demand. Bigger population areas means more anesthesia providers available. The more providers available. The higher the chances the recruiter has of catching fish (or lobster!). It was mini lobster season in Florida a couple of weeks ago.

My former colleague is taking on $225/hr w2 prn pay cause she doesn’t want to far for prn work (10-15 min drive for her)

Even though I told her to come work a few days with me at another locums place 50 min away $350/hr 1099 with guarantee 8 hr shift. You hardly ever work more than 6 hours on this 8 hr shift. But she didn’t want the drive.

We already have another poster a few post above this post asking if he/she can do locums with a 830am start lol. Cause they probably don’t want to mess up their routine of waking up at 6am every morning if that involves a 2 hr drive.

I have a new locums gig 2 hrs away starting soon. I will wake up at 4am shower, make coffee. Be on the road by 430am and be at work 630am. I use plan on staying there Monday -Thursday and driving back home by 7pm. So I’m only gone from home for 3 nights. So you create time when you want to. I’m still home for my kids Thursday night through early Monday morning. They aren’t young young anymore. But still need some parenting.

Places are so desperate these days. But unfortunately they make not be in your metro area.
 
My groups contract just got taken over from another bigger group . Somewhat blind sided but it’s w.e. I am likely not gonna stay and I’ve been checking the market in the Midwest because I’m mobile and most places are not paying more than 400. Usually somewhere between 275 and 350. Some places are two hours away and the pay is 350 max. It’s a tight market in my area and there’s maybe 4 private groups left and the pay sucks. I feel like partnerships are now a scam to buy into. One agent was offering pay for 360 an hour but was mysterious not the group and the hospital parted ways after being there for over 20yrs. I feel like in the Midwest locums can pay the best in remote areas , but metro areas your max is between 250-275
 
aneftp said:
Supply and demand. Bigger population areas means more anesthesia providers available. The more providers available. The higher the chances the recruiter has of catching fish (or lobster!). It was mini lobster season in Florida a couple of weeks ago.

My former colleague is taking on $225/hr w2 prn pay cause she doesn’t want to far for prn work (10-15 min drive for her)

Even though I told her to come work a few days with me at another locums place 50 min away $350/hr 1099 with guarantee 8 hr shift. You hardly ever work more than 6 hours on this 8 hr shift. But she didn’t want the drive.

We already have another poster a few post above this post asking if he/she can do locums with a 830am start lol. Cause they probably don’t want to mess up their routine of waking up at 6am every morning if that involves a 2 hr drive.

I have a new locums gig 2 hrs away starting soon. I will wake up at 4am shower, make coffee. Be on the road by 430am and be at work 630am. I use plan on staying there Monday -Thursday and driving back home by 7pm. So I’m only gone from home for 3 nights. So you create time when you want to. I’m still home for my kids Thursday night through early Monday morning. They aren’t young young anymore. But still need some parenting.

Places are so desperate these days. But unfortunately they make not be in your metro area.
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You’re living the dream aneftp. Do you think it’s your area or your hustle/networking?
 
It’s hustle/networking. It’s more (non clinical) work than private practice but less headache. You have to scout out your area, get your foot in the door. Two years ago I did 3 months in a semi-rural area, they liked me but I didn’t like the area. They came back 3 months after I left at 425, probably could’ve done 500 because I knew how desperate they were. But time away from home takes it toll
 
Dr.Jekyll75 said:
My groups contract just got taken over from another bigger group . Somewhat blind sided but it’s w.e. I am likely not gonna stay and I’ve been checking the market in the Midwest because I’m mobile and most places are not paying more than 400. Usually somewhere between 275 and 350. Some places are two hours away and the pay is 350 max. It’s a tight market in my area and there’s maybe 4 private groups left and the pay sucks. I feel like partnerships are now a scam to buy into. One agent was offering pay for 360 an hour but was mysterious not the group and the hospital parted ways after being there for over 20yrs. I feel like in the Midwest locums can pay the best in remote areas , but metro areas your max is between 250-275
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Dude metro areas still pay 350 at least. 250 is max maybe for a CRNA
 
Dr.Jekyll75 said:
My groups contract just got taken over from another bigger group . Somewhat blind sided but it’s w.e. I am likely not gonna stay and I’ve been checking the market in the Midwest because I’m mobile and most places are not paying more than 400. Usually somewhere between 275 and 350. Some places are two hours away and the pay is 350 max. It’s a tight market in my area and there’s maybe 4 private groups left and the pay sucks. I feel like partnerships are now a scam to buy into. One agent was offering pay for 360 an hour but was mysterious not the group and the hospital parted ways after being there for over 20yrs. I feel like in the Midwest locums can pay the best in remote areas , but metro areas your max is between 250-275
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Damn. You're getting punked out HARD.
 
Dr.Jekyll75 said:
My groups contract just got taken over from another bigger group . Somewhat blind sided but it’s w.e. I am likely not gonna stay and I’ve been checking the market in the Midwest because I’m mobile and most places are not paying more than 400. Usually somewhere between 275 and 350. Some places are two hours away and the pay is 350 max. It’s a tight market in my area and there’s maybe 4 private groups left and the pay sucks. I feel like partnerships are now a scam to buy into. One agent was offering pay for 360 an hour but was mysterious not the group and the hospital parted ways after being there for over 20yrs. I feel like in the Midwest locums can pay the best in remote areas , but metro areas your max is between 250-275
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I'm sorry to hear that. You can get 400+ with no call these days easily.
 
etherengineer said:
You’re living the dream aneftp. Do you think it’s your area or your hustle/networking?
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My area actually sucks for locums. But once you leave the 30-45 min area. A whole new world opens. I don’t think it’s living a dream. I think you gotta be flexible and have multiple jobs going at the same time.

There are two approaches I think
1. Full time or partial full time 0.8 gig with 20 plus weeks off making sure you are getting base 450-500k and work hours 40 hours so not to over extend yourself with Option to work on weeks off locums.

2. Or full time locums. It does suck to be away from family and kids. Or try to cram (4) 12. Leave super early Monday and come back Thursday night if you can live like that.
 
GassYous said:
I'm sorry to hear that. You can get 400+ with no call these days easily.
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That’s what people say but in my area that’s not the case . We have 3 large private equities … one big health care system with **** pay … then some side groups. 400k no call is not common here
 
Dr.Jekyll75 said:
That’s what people say but in my area that’s not the case . We have 3 large private equities … one big health care system with **** pay … then some side groups. 400k no call is not common here
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I agree. I fish around Southern California for a friend of mine. Around $350/hr

Wash dc area proper is $350. U can go to the boonies like Hagerstown 70 miles away. They were making $450/hr and up But that’s Hagerstown.

Same with penn state remote places. Boonies. But higher pay $450-hr

South Florida is low. $300/hr. My friend is settling for $275/hr in Broward county for first 40 hrs and than $300/hr after.
 
aneftp said:
I agree. I fish around Southern California for a friend of mine. Around $350/hr

Wash dc area proper is $350. U can go to the boonies like Hagerstown 70 miles away. They were making $450/hr and up But that’s Hagerstown.

Same with penn state remote places. Boonies. But higher pay $450-hr

South Florida is low. $300/hr. My friend is settling for $275/hr in Broward county for first 40 hrs and than $300/hr after.
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What do you add for cardiac work? How would you value that extra flexibility

PM me at some point, I get some interesting things thrown at me and curious what you think the future of some areas looks like
 
Dr.Jekyll75 said:
That’s what people say but in my area that’s not the case . We have 3 large private equities … one big health care system with **** pay … then some side groups. 400k no call is not common here
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Agreed. Most heavily consolidated and more popular areas are not offering great permanent full time, no-call, or part time jobs. Despite all the hubris on here, 450-500 seems to get you a 55 hr week, 6-8 week vacation, full call taking type job. I’ve poked around out of curiosity and even some of the more desperate places paying $400+/hr locums aren’t willing to budge on their crummy permanent offerings. Maybe I haven’t cast a wide enough net or haven’t been aggressive enough (only doing it out of curiosity), but the permanent job market isn’t all that great right now. You almost know that by taking a permanent job, you are committing yourself to being overworked due to staffing shortages.

It seems to me the hospitals are still betting on the staffing shortage to be solved in the next 5 years. It is true that a lot of CRNA schools have opened up and they are pumping them out and offering free tuition in exchange for work commitments.
 
lotsapain said:
There is no such thing as refusing to accept a lower rate... you may refuse the next guy may need this job much more then you do and will not only accept the rate offered but an even lower rate. Again, physicians are the worst in banding together. What should have happened was that a national presence such as ABA for example should manage the overall anesthesia free market, or say a union type organizations. When hospitals put out RFPs for providers and 5 agencies respond they can undercut each other. HOW they do that is a different story. Some agencies (smaller more hungry ones) may accept a lower vig from you and attract more candidates with a slightly higher rate taking a loss per candidate but gaining by having more docs in the facility. Meaning, agencies skim as high as 30% per hour from the physicians hourly rate ie rate offered to you $300 is paid to the agency at $400-450. First thing agencies do is come back to you and say things such as "this facility is very rate concisencous they can only pay $300" you come back and say "$350" they say "we will talk to them and get back to you" They may not be talking to anyone at all jst seeing if they are willing to lower their cut from your money..... sometimes they do ask the facility but again the ask is not $325 the ask is $450-475.. I have seen rates to agency as high as $575 and $625 on overtime rates PER HOUR! which translates to 400-425 to the provider.

Facilities have NO CLUE what rates YOU are getting, agencies do not disclose this to the facility (they don't have to by contract). Under ideal circumstances providers should be able to work with the facility directly. The cost of malpractice is minimal compared to the VIG agencies are shaving. Daily malpractice (part-time) is $125-150 a day..... and if you translate full time rates they are even lower. Agencies negotiate even lower malpractice rates in bulk. Not only that some facilities eat up malpractice rates as well, in addition to flights, cars, gas, hotels etc etc.

Again, if you don't accept the rate someone else will. Certain facilities of course are an exception - ie super remote locations etc. but you can't make someone not take a rate if it works for them. The only solution is to stick together and negotiate AS A GROUP..... this would prevent both lower and high rates and actually will make the market much more mobile as in reality the average rates facilities pay out to agencies is the same. IF we could get it to us DIRECTLY that would be key.
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Doctors do need to band together more. Pilots are so much better at this that we are. We do t look out for each other near enough
 
GravelRider said:
Agreed. Most heavily consolidated and more popular areas are not offering great permanent full time, no-call, or part time jobs. Despite all the hubris on here, 450-500 seems to get you a 55 hr week, 6-8 week vacation, full call taking type job. I’ve poked around out of curiosity and even some of the more desperate places paying $400+/hr locums aren’t willing to budge on their crummy permanent offerings. Maybe I haven’t cast a wide enough net or haven’t been aggressive enough (only doing it out of curiosity), but the permanent job market isn’t all that great right now. You almost know that by taking a permanent job, you are committing yourself to being overworked due to staffing shortages.

It seems to me the hospitals are still betting on the staffing shortage to be solved in the next 5 years. It is true that a lot of CRNA schools have opened up and they are pumping them out and offering free tuition in exchange for work commitments.
Click to expand...
U gotta expand ur Radius u want to travel.

But I disagree on the 55 hr work week for 450-500k w2 job. The work hours (at least in Florida) are averaging around 40-45 hrs including calls for 450k

You can work more and make more as w2 with built in extra paid shifts. Something like $2000 days to work post call (post beeper call) usually sleep all night cause no ob or trauma). can leave around. 11-12 pm just to get cases going )

So some employer have built in overtime. I think that’s why my friend stays. He “only makes” 425k per salary plus 25k sign on bonus plus 25k metric bonus x 2 years. And with overtime. He makes another 80-90k. Gets 10 weeks off. But he doesn’t feel overworked. And hospital is 8 min from his house which is key.
 
Agree w gravelrider… everyone seems to think the shortage is short term… resolved in a couple years or so. I’ve seen statistics that anesthesiologist retirements outpace graduates by 1000 per year.
Often groups and AMCs have contracts that the hospital has to foot or share the bill for locums while they get permanent people in places. I think they pay “too much” thinking staffing will be someone else’s problem soon. It seemed to work, at least so far, with somnia in Memphis 🤷‍♀️.
 
aneftp said:
U gotta expand ur Radius u want to travel.

But I disagree on the 55 hr work week for 450-500k w2 job. The work hours (at least in Florida) are averaging around 40-45 hrs including calls for 450k

You can work more and make more as w2 with built in extra paid shifts. Something like $2000 days to work post call (post beeper call) usually sleep all night cause no ob or trauma). can leave around. 11-12 pm just to get cases going )

So some employer have built in overtime. I think that’s why my friend stays. He “only makes” 425k per salary plus 25k sign on bonus plus 25k metric bonus x 2 years. And with overtime. He makes another 80-90k. Gets 10 weeks off. But he doesn’t feel overworked. And hospital is 8 min from his house which is key.
Click to expand...

I am in the northeast and I have always tried to keep tabs on the local and regional markets. I am speaking more about permanent jobs. The locums market is still $350/hr floor with easily found $400-450/hr without having to travel to the boonies. The permanent jobs are definitely lagging behind the locums market in terms of offering flexibility, pay, or vacation time despite being severely understaffed. No one wants to take these permanent jobs because they know they are walking into an understaffed job with plenty of “opportunities for overtime.” Sure, you might make 600-650k at these W2 places, but you are going to work for every penny of it.

My point is that the permanent job market has not kept up with the locums market and in my admittedly cursory investigation, they are not that open to being flexible in the permanent jobs either.
 
GravelRider said:
I am in the northeast and I have always tried to keep tabs on the local and regional markets. I am speaking more about permanent jobs. The locums market is still $350/hr floor with easily found $400-450/hr without having to travel to the boonies. The permanent jobs are definitely lagging behind the locums market in terms of offering flexibility, pay, or vacation time despite being severely understaffed. No one wants to take these permanent jobs because they know they are walking into an understaffed job with plenty of “opportunities for overtime.” Sure, you might make 600-650k at these W2 places, but you are going to work for every penny of it.

My point is that the permanent job market has not kept up with the locums market and in my admittedly cursory investigation, they are not that open to being flexible in the permanent jobs either.
Click to expand...
Correct. The only w2 job I’m gonna to take (I actually left a pretty chill day time w2 job) but wanted more time off

So the only w2 job I’m taking next is with massive vacation plus protect my hours to 40 per week that I’m working. Don’t be a sucker and take a 7a-7p trauma one job for 7 days. That’s 84 hrs and get 26 weeks off. Envison pulled that stunt. You are basically working (2 weeks of work ) in one week.
 
Dr.Jekyll75 said:
My groups contract just got taken over from another bigger group . Somewhat blind sided but it’s w.e. I am likely not gonna stay and I’ve been checking the market in the Midwest because I’m mobile and most places are not paying more than 400. Usually somewhere between 275 and 350. Some places are two hours away and the pay is 350 max. It’s a tight market in my area and there’s maybe 4 private groups left and the pay sucks. I feel like partnerships are now a scam to buy into. One agent was offering pay for 360 an hour but was mysterious not the group and the hospital parted ways after being there for over 20yrs. I feel like in the Midwest locums can pay the best in remote areas , but metro areas your max is between 250-275
Click to expand...
You mean Chicago. Not Indiannapolis. Not Milwaukee. Not the twin cities.
Because Chicago sucks. We all know. But not the other cities.
 
aneftp said:
Correct. The only w2 job I’m gonna to take (I actually left a pretty chill day time w2 job) but wanted more time off

So the only w2 job I’m taking next is with massive vacation plus protect my hours to 40 per week that I’m working. Don’t be a sucker and take a 7a-7p trauma one job for 7 days. That’s 84 hrs and get 26 weeks off. Envison pulled that stunt. You are basically working (2 weeks of work ) in one week.
Click to expand...
Hackensack ?
 
aneftp said:
U gotta expand ur Radius u want to travel.

But I disagree on the 55 hr work week for 450-500k w2 job. The work hours (at least in Florida) are averaging around 40-45 hrs including calls for 450k

You can work more and make more as w2 with built in extra paid shifts. Something like $2000 days to work post call (post beeper call) usually sleep all night cause no ob or trauma). can leave around. 11-12 pm just to get cases going )

So some employer have built in overtime. I think that’s why my friend stays. He “only makes” 425k per salary plus 25k sign on bonus plus 25k metric bonus x 2 years. And with overtime. He makes another 80-90k. Gets 10 weeks off. But he doesn’t feel overworked. And hospital is 8 min from his house which is key.
Click to expand...
You seem to know the Fl market pretty good. Wanted to private message you but I’m unable to? I’m full time in Fl but started doing some locums this year
 
ToKingdomCome said:
anyone getting good rates with upmc facilities?
Click to expand...
Don’t focus on big cities. Focus on smaller places 1 hr away. Focus on number of billable hours

Really depends what you are looking for. $3000 for the daytime and home by 3pm? Or 12k for the entire 24 hrs.

I have no clue about Pittsburg but West Virginia was paying big a few months ago but now it’s dropped to the high 300s. Penn state pays well in their smaller places.
 
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