Loupes question: how's the DFV light?

[Incis0r]

D1 here.

I'm pretty certain I want to go with DFV EF 3.5X. However, I'm wondering whether I should pay an extra $500 and get my light from them as well or if I should go Lumadent for that (heard tons of great things about their lights).

Would appreciate any advice you can share!

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[Screwtape]

Go lumadent. 100% sure on this one.

 

[O Gaúcho]

I am in a similar situation as you. But, I am pretty sure I will go with the Surgitel Prism 3.5x with the Oakley frames. The DFV EF seemed pretty bulky and the frames didn't fit me well.

 

[Incis0r]

Go lumadent. 100% sure on this one.

Price seems comparable to DFV. Did you get Lumadent? Were you able to set up a group order with your classmates for the discount?

My DFV rep told me that if I get just the loupes from DFV and not the light, I won't get the free carrying case to transport my loupe + light anymore though.

Edit: just noticed that the DFV lights are all wireless unlike Lumadent, which has a wire.

 

[Incis0r]

I am in a similar situation as you. But, I am pretty sure I will go with the Surgitel Prism 3.5x with the Oakley frames. The DFV EF seemed pretty bulky and the frames didn't fit me well.

When are you buying your set?

 

[Screwtape]

Price seems comparable to DFV. Did you get Lumadent? Were you able to set up a group order with your classmates for the discount?

My DFV rep told me that if I get just the loupes from DFV and not the light, I won't get the free carrying case to transport my loupe + light anymore though.

Edit: just noticed that the DFV lights are all wireless unlike Lumadent, which has a wire.

I got my lumadent for $300 if I remember. In my opinion much better quality and better customer service. Everything fits in my “loupes only” box from DFV (loupes and light). You just have to do some rearranging. I also just leave them in my office now...

But yes if wireless is a necessity then lumadent is a no go.

 

[O Gaúcho]

When are you buying your set?

November 13th

 

[Incis0r]

I got my lumadent for $300 if I remember. In my opinion much better quality and better customer service. Everything fits in my “loupes only” box from DFV (loupes and light). You just have to do some rearranging. I also just leave them in my office now...

But yes if wireless is a necessity then lumadent is a no go.

Have a few follow-up questions for you:

1. You mentioned your box is from DFV. Are your loupes from DFV? What magnification? Expanded Field or no?

2. How long does your Lumadent light last on a single charge? Their website advertises 30 hours but I want to hear from you what your experience is with the actual charge.

3. Are the DFV loupes too heavy in your opinion?

I'm looking at the "Best Value" package from Lumadent- $495.00 retail ($425 if it's a group order with classmates).
It includes two battery packs, each of which can last "up to 30 hours."

Seems like a way better deal than the DFV light (up to 10 hours battery, and that too only 1 pack).

 

[Roy Williams]

Has anybody gotten the lumadent 3.3x loupes? I really like those but i'm considering those as well as something from DFV...

 

[Screwtape]

Have a few follow-up questions for you:

1. You mentioned your box is from DFV. Are your loupes from DFV? What magnification? Expanded Field or no?

2. How long does your Lumadent light last on a single charge? Their website advertises 30 hours but I want to hear from you what your experience is with the actual charge.

3. Are the DFV loupes too heavy in your opinion?

I'm looking at the "Best Value" package from Lumadent- $495.00 retail ($425 if it's a group order with classmates).
It includes two battery packs, each of which can last "up to 30 hours."

Seems like a way better deal than the DFV light (up to 10 hours battery, and that too only 1 pack).

DFV 3.5 EF.
I got the group deal when lumadent came to my school.
My light lasts I would say about 3 clinic days, so like 24 ish hours. I do use it on high or close the whole time. It’s also not on the straight 8 hours all day... but length is very good.

I don’t think they are too heavy but when people try them on they always say “wow those are heavy”. So... I dunno ha.

 

[Incis0r]

DFV 3.5 EF.
I got the group deal when lumadent came to my school.
My light lasts I would say about 3 clinic days, so like 24 ish hours. I do use it on high or close the whole time. It’s also not on the straight 8 hours all day... but length is very good.

I don’t think they are too heavy but when people try them on they always say “wow those are heavy”. So... I dunno ha.

Awesome. Thank you for all of your help and input, Screwtape.
Also, a belated congrats on your graduation Hope dentistry is treating you well!

 

[577455]

I ordered the DFV micro3.5 EF. It's much lighter.

 

[Greyangel6]

I used Orascoptic 3.8x for pre-clinic. Now I get by with 2.5x Heine in clinic. I still use 3.8x when I'm doing competencies though. Lumadent for light!

 

[Incis0r]

I ordered the DFV micro3.5 EF. It's much lighter.

Nice. Gonna try this one out too. Which frame did you get?

 

[blablabla1]

Lumadent’s the way to go. I use them with my Q-optics 3.0x and it works wonderfully

 

[yappy]

Great when it works but overall terrible. Myself, and many friends, have reported that the cord between the battery and the light keeps becoming damaged during normal use and the light no longer works. I have replaced it twice and it's breaking again.

 

[FanOfCostco]

Kinda off topic but I got ultralight with my dfv nikes.
No matter what kind of "deal" you get, it's not worth it. They try to sell you by offering you "discounts".
The light itself is alright. It does the job, but it's mediocre at best. Everything feels cheaply made, especially the battery. I would avoid ultralight.

 

[PreDentTechySon]

We have DFV because our school has a contract with them and we were required to buy loops through them (Kinda stupid). Anyways, they're alright loops, but a guy in our class got a pair of Q-Optics and they are AMAZING. I know know if you've looked at those loops but if I had a choice in the matter, I would have chosen Q-Optics in a heartbeat.

 

[blablabla1]

We have DFV because our school has a contract with them and we were required to buy loops through them (Kinda stupid). Anyways, they're alright loops, but a guy in our class got a pair of Q-Optics and they are AMAZING. I know know if you've looked at those loops but if I had a choice in the matter, I would have chosen Q-Optics in a heartbeat.

Absolutely. Q-Optics gets underrated too much. They’re the newer kid on the block but their loupes are fantastic because of how light they are and they’re much better priced (atleast for student pricing) than their competitor. Pairing up one of their loupes with a lumadent is a great combo

 

[Incis0r]

We have DFV because our school has a contract with them and we were required to buy loops through them (Kinda stupid). Anyways, they're alright loops, but a guy in our class got a pair of Q-Optics and they are AMAZING. I know know if you've looked at those loops but if I had a choice in the matter, I would have chosen Q-Optics in a heartbeat.

Thanks for the input. Gonna take a closer look at Q-Optics.

 

[Incis0r]

Absolutely. Q-Optics gets underrated too much. They’re the newer kid on the block but their loupes are fantastic because of how light they are and they’re much better priced (atleast for student pricing) than their competitor. Pairing up one of their loupes with a lumadent is a great combo

Have you compared with the DFV?

 

[blablabla1]

Have you compared with the DFV?

I’ve tried on DFV loupes at VCU’s loupes fair and actually like them the least of all the vendors I tried (Q-Optics, DFV, Surgitel, Orascoptic). While the optics themselves were nice and clear, they were extremely heavy and large for the magnification given as were the frames. The light was a bit heavy as well from what I remember. They had limited magnification options and were not very competitively priced. Out of our 98 person class, I think only 2-3 people bought from DFV. About 40-45 people bought from Q-Optics and the rest were split between Surgitel and Orascoptic.

Price and comfort are the two biggest things I looked at when I was buying loupes and with that, I found Surgitel and Q-Optics to be best. The only reason I didn’t go with Surgitel was because their frames were a bit large for my small face and I didn’t like the idea of having plastic Oakley frames (it’s actually some synthetic flexible material but I liked having purely titanium alloy frames like Q-Optics does due to increased durability). If you’re willing to splurge, then I think Orascoptic offers the clearest/best optics. But for having spent only 1200 on my loupes and lumadent light, I’m extremely happy with the comfortable loupes I was able to get.

 

[Incis0r]

I’ve tried on DFV loupes at VCU’s loupes fair and actually like them the least of all the vendors I tried (Q-Optics, DFV, Surgitel, Orascoptic). While the optics themselves were nice and clear, they were extremely heavy and large for the magnification given as were the frames. The light was a bit heavy as well from what I remember. They had limited magnification options and were not very competitively priced. Out of our 98 person class, I think only 2-3 people bought from DFV. About 40-45 people bought from Q-Optics and the rest were split between Surgitel and Orascoptic.

Price and comfort are the two biggest things I looked at when I was buying loupes and with that, I found Surgitel and Q-Optics to be best. The only reason I didn’t go with Surgitel was because their frames were a bit large for my small face and I didn’t like the idea of having plastic Oakley frames (it’s actually some synthetic flexible material but I liked having purely titanium alloy frames like Q-Optics does due to increased durability). If you’re willing to splurge, then I think Orascoptic offers the clearest/best optics. But for having spent only 1200 on my loupes and lumadent light, I’m extremely happy with the comfortable loupes I was able to get.

Thank you for the detailed reply. Really appreciate it

Hope school is treating you well man.

 

[hopefuldentist123]

Do you suggest going prismatic or Galilean for DFV loupes? $500 difference. looking to get either:
3.5x Galilean – Steam frame -$1095
3.5x prismatic – 3.5x micro frame – $1595

Q-optics is $895 for their Galilean 3.5x which seems like a good deal, and surgitel 3.5x prismatic is $1500 and I liked those too. Should I give q-optics a chance before I go with DFV or surgitel or orascoptic? Anyone have any suggestions as to how to decide? There are so many choices, I can't decide!

 

[PreDentTechySon]

Do you suggest going prismatic or Galilean for DFV loupes? $500 difference. looking to get either:
3.5x Galilean – Steam frame -$1095
3.5x prismatic – 3.5x micro frame – $1595

Q-optics is $895 for their Galilean 3.5x which seems like a good deal, and surgitel 3.5x prismatic is $1500 and I liked those too. Should I give q-optics a chance before I go with DFV or surgitel or orascoptic? Anyone have any suggestions as to how to decide? There are so many choices, I can't decide!

I think a lot of what will be the best choice for you is personal preference. But in my opinion, I have DFV prismatic 3.5x and I compared mine to a classmate who has 4.5x Q-optics and the Q-optics were better. The frame had a better fit, the magnification was great, the shield covered more of my eyes (DFV just has regular glasses frames, not super safety oriented in my opinion) and my classmate said he likes the angle of declination better on his Q-optics.

If my school didn’t force us to get DFV loupes, I would have gone with Q-optics.

 

[hopefuldentist123]

Thank you for the response, I'm leaning towards Q-optics (I think they just won a big award too) Did your classmate have a Lumadent or Q-optics light? any recommendations on that?

 

[blablabla1]

From my experience, lumadent light is much brighter and lasts longer than q-optics light

 

[PreDentTechySon]

Thank you for the response, I'm leaning towards Q-optics (I think they just won a big award too) Did your classmate have a Lumadent or Q-optics light? any recommendations on that?

I'm not sure which light my classmate has. I think it was Lumadent because he didn't buy his light and loupes at the same time but I don't know for certain. Someone else might have a better idea on what light would be best. I would suggest cheapest with decent battery life. Most hand-pieces have lights on them and your overhead light can supplement if needed.

 

[lemoncurry]

If you are getting DFV loupes, or any TTL loupes, be ready to deal with a higher risk of neck issues. You simply won't get the angle of declination that you can get with flip-up loupes. Surgitel flip-ups are one of if not the best in terms of ergonomics, and the optics are great as well. I am a Surgitel user and am not remunerated in any way by recommending them.

In terms of the light, I have used Ultralight Optics and have been pleased. Lumadent is good but I have seen some quality issues some of my colleagues have had with lights ~3-4 years old. Not deal breakers but smacks of cost-cutting.

 

[Incis0r]

If you are getting DFV loupes, or any TTL loupes, be ready to deal with a higher risk of neck issues. You simply won't get the angle of declination that you can get with flip-up loupes. Surgitel flip-ups are one of if not the best in terms of ergonomics, and the optics are great as well. I am a Surgitel user and am not remunerated in any way by recommending them.

In terms of the light, I have used Ultralight Optics and have been pleased. Lumadent is good but I have seen some quality issues some of my colleagues have had with lights ~3-4 years old. Not deal breakers but smacks of cost-cutting.

What's the angle of declination you've got on your surgitel flip-ups?

The concern I'm having with flip-ups over TTL is that there are just more moving parts/pieces in flip-ups. Things can get loose over time. One of the dental students while talking to his patient kept having his flip-ups "fall" down into the loupe position.

How much was the ultralight?

 

[blablabla1]

What's the angle of declination you've got on your surgitel flip-ups?

The concern I'm having with flip-ups over TTL is that there are just more moving parts/pieces in flip-ups. Things can get loose over time. One of the dental students while talking to his patient kept having his flip-ups "fall" down into the loupe position.

How much was the ultralight?

Not to mention is that more moving parts = more ways for failure.

My q-optics have such a steep angle of declination that I barely even need to tilt my head downwards to see things, the optics are literally next to my nose on either side

 

[lemoncurry]

On the flip side, the more things are integrated into one piece, the bigger the repairs when anything breaks down.

Everything degrades over time. Yes, sometimes the hinges get loose. I have gotten new screws for free from Surgitel. I rarely ever flip them up, though. I basically use them as I would TTL, so I actually tighten the hinges so I can't really flip them up.

I don't remember exactly how much the light was. When I bought it as a student it was in the $350 range.

 

[Incis0r]

Talked to my Surgitel and Q Optics reps about angle of declination because I think @lemoncurry brought up an important point with steep angle of declinations - we def want to protect our necks. Here’s what each rep told me.

Surgitel: For flip-ups they can do 25-55 degrees, but usually don’t go past 45 since most people have difficulty adjusting past that

Q-Optics: For TTL they measure everyone individually/digitally but the typical declination for the model I’m looking at (prismatic) is around 45 deg. The rep told me they CAN drill steeper and that it’s all dependent on the individual.

So bottom line is: it looks like both companies offer steep angles of declination. Maybe other companies might not offer such angles.

 

[lemoncurry]

Surgitel is not the only company, for sure. I just can't remember the other company/companies. I recently took a CE course on dental ergonomics and the instructor spent quite a while on loupes, angle of declination, etc. Q Optics may have been the other company she mentioned. She also mentioned that the sales reps who come to schools are not (gasp) always completely honest about angles and all that.

EDIT: I just checked my CE notes and it is Q-Optics. The instructor's name was Dr. Bethany Valachi and she wrote "Practice Dentistry Pain Free." Certainly worth a look.

 

[Incis0r]

EDIT: I just checked my CE notes and it is Q-Optics. The instructor's name was Dr. Bethany Valachi and she wrote "Practice Dentistry Pain Free." Certainly worth a look.

Appreciate you looking this up. Thank you.