Low GPA party

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Ok, now you have me confused. You enrolled in a formal SMP program, correct? At my school, and many others, we would *mainly* look at your SMP - and maybe quickly glance at your uGPA for curiosity. Like I said before, the whole point of SMP is to give you a new chance. As long as you have proven to be capable in med-level classes - then you are admission material.

I think stopping your SMP in the middle to go back to undergrad was a big mistake. At MOST, a few schools is never going to forgive you with a bad GPA. Most schools, no matter what your uGPA was, is mainly going to consider only your SMP. You should have saved the time and money and finished that SMP on track with that 4.0, and never looked back on undergrad.

I am skeptical that you really were an adcom. Pretty much everyone on here in the reapplicant forum has had the exact opposite experience where Ugrad GPA ends up being a terrible ball and chain they have to carry around despite an exceptional SMP GPA.

Were it really the case that the SMP GPA was so important, people would have no problem getting into med school after an SMP... that is not the case.
 
Oh, those were just a few classes freshman year. Prolly should have mentioned that. :laugh:

This sem was:
Undergrad research: A
Physiology of Bacteria: A-
Pathogenic Microbiology: B+
German I(5 hours): B+

good work lol.

i quickly glanced at ur profile and i realized we follow the same trend of upward GPA trend lol. mine goes up by .4 every year, 2.9 freshmen, 3.3 soph and then 3.7 junior. i just wish i didt fudge up freshmen year lol. im sure u feel the exact same way.
 
I am skeptical that you really were an adcom. Pretty much everyone on here in the reapplicant forum has had the exact opposite experience where Ugrad GPA ends up being a terrible ball and chain they have to carry around despite an exceptional SMP GPA.

Were it really the case that the SMP GPA was so important, people would have no problem getting into med school after an SMP... that is not the case.

Well, how do most SMP programs advertise that 95, 99, or even 100% of their graduating classes matriculate into medical schools then?

At Temple, we had a linkage program - so we actually only considered your SMP if you went to that particular SMP. If you went somewhere else, your SMP grades trumph all else. From what I knew, this was the case at other regional schools as well.
 
Seeing all the overachievers in SDN made me do it, I swear :laugh:

Oh lawd. You're gonna go far, kid.


good work lol.

i quickly glanced at ur profile and i realized we follow the same trend of upward GPA trend lol. mine goes up by .4 every year, 2.9 freshmen, 3.3 soph and then 3.7 junior. i just wish i didt fudge up freshmen year lol. im sure u feel the exact same way.

Oh ya. We'd be ballers without the Freshman GPA killing the curve.

Nothing says accept me like a strong upward curve though!. :laugh:
 
Well, how do most SMP programs advertise that 95, 99, or even 100% of their graduating classes matriculate into medical schools then?
they don't, and this now makes me question you as well.. i think it'd be in everyone's benefit if you registered as a verified advisor with the site admins
 
they don't, and this now makes me question you as well.. i think it'd be in everyone's benefit if you registered as a verified advisor with the site admins

I may have exagerrated with the 100% quote - I did recall a SMP/post-bac program advertising that almost all of their graduates at one point or another have gotten into medical school.

Here is the one from Tulane website

http://tulane.edu/sse/cmb/ms.cfm
· 90% have been accepted into Medical School , with the remaining all on wait lists
· 100% have been accepted into Dental Schools




My original point still stands - your SMP grades triumph your undergrad grades at many universities. The point of SMP if basically a second chance/fresh start to prove that you can handle medical school classes.
 
Oh, those were just a few classes freshman year. Prolly should have mentioned that. :laugh:

This sem was:
Undergrad research: A
Physiology of Bacteria: A-
Pathogenic Microbiology: B+
German I(5 hours): B+

Wuh you guys get As for research!? Blasphemy we only get Pass/No Passes!
 
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Architecture school 5 years ago - 2.7 gpa, no science classes. Each studio class was 6 credits, and I had numerous profs that would only give 2-3 A's per studio of 12 kids. 2 C's = to 4 C's in regular classes. 👎 My immature stubborn personality didn't mesh with the highly subjective nature of architecture school. I hadn't learned to play the game yet...

just got my post bacc grades - 39 credits 3.96 gpa
I don't even know if that will put a dent in my undergrad work.

waiting on MCAT score...
 
Does anyone have any inspirational Low GPA stories/ threads/ MD apps they have bookmarked? Perferably some that are traditional applicants (nothing against the nontrads, I just already found a few threads). :idea:
 
Okay I will jump in.

3.27 gGPA (M.S. Cell Bio)
2.8 sGPA (Undergrad)
2.7 non sci GPA
2.87 overall


There is an interesting question that came up in this thread however. If one can be accepted into an SMP will the sub 3.0 GPA be a factor? OR will this be negated by a stellar SMP GPA?? It's the difference for me taking the SMP now or waiting a year while taking 22 credits of so of UG classes.

I BELONG!!!😀
 
I may have exagerrated with the 100% quote - I did recall a SMP/post-bac program advertising that almost all of their graduates at one point or another have gotten into medical school.


My original point still stands - your SMP grades triumph your undergrad grades at many universities. The point of SMP if basically a second chance/fresh start to prove that you can handle medical school classes.

wrong. smp does NOT trump ugrad grades.
 
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I don't think anyone can say that all schools put little or no weight on SMP grades. Every applicant has their own situation and with a compelling essay I'm sure that an applicant with not so stellar undergrad grades will at the very least be granted an interview if the adcoms feel this person would be successful at their school.

People do overcome rocky pasts and go on to be successful.
 
I have registered for 18 science credits for Fall '11. I think this will be my first "Low GPA Suicide Run".

I have yet to bring it up to either my adviser, both academic and pre-health one. But I so want to do it because that will leave a big mark towards the 3.xx and more importantly the "Upward Trend" justification.

But I am still a bit hesitant. I am not prescribed to any ADD/ADHD medication nor have I found any dietary supplements that have really given me significant amount of aid besides simply being a placebo effect. And things like coffee and caffeinated stuff has a 50/50 chance of actually providing any sort of benefit. I don't know, I want to say that it is doable...I mean, 18 credits is not that much, but often people who take that many still have GenEd classes they need to take...But I am done with mine, only science left.

🙁
 
I don't think anyone can say that all schools put little or no weight on SMP grades. Every applicant has their own situation and with a compelling essay I'm sure that an applicant with not so stellar undergrad grades will at the very least be granted an interview if the adcoms feel this person would be successful at their school.

People do overcome rocky pasts and go on to be successful.


So it's just like anything else in life. It is 50-50 if you take an SMP or not.
 
I have registered for 18 science credits for Fall '11. I think this will be my first "Low GPA Suicide Run".

I have yet to bring it up to either my adviser, both academic and pre-health one. But I so want to do it because that will leave a big mark towards the 3.xx and more importantly the "Upward Trend" justification.

But I am still a bit hesitant. I am not prescribed to any ADD/ADHD medication nor have I found any dietary supplements that have really given me significant amount of aid besides simply being a placebo effect. And things like coffee and caffeinated stuff has a 50/50 chance of actually providing any sort of benefit. I don't know, I want to say that it is doable...I mean, 18 credits is not that much, but often people who take that many still have GenEd classes they need to take...But I am done with mine, only science left.

🙁

Dam bro Im lookin at doing like 6 lol! Why are you doing them all at once like that?
 
I also was about to squish the bug, but then was like "wait...this is SDN...they're f-ing with me" 🙂

Yes, I am so in this club. 3.1 GPA. I'm a reapplicant, but I actually got in to an MD school last cycle with a 32 MCAT - didn't work out, long story, see my blog. This cycle, I am reapplying with the same GPA but a 36 MCAT and a completed grad program in a hard science. Fingers crossed- last time I'm going through this BS! Good luck all.
 
re: smp discussion, the fact of the matter is that uGPA goes into rankings (a significant portion is "selectivity") and despite what anyone may say outwardly, schools do care about where they are ranked and this affects the kinds of students they accept.
 
I was in this boat as well... but luckily am matriculating in the fall.

3.1X GPA and SGPA 32 mcat
c's in bio, chem, ochem and basically B's in all other prereqs...
no post bacc no smp no grad school
definitely possible to get in.

I did only semesters of 18/19 units from end of soph to first semester of senior year. Which I do not recommend your more likely to kill your gpa then have a positive impact.
 
I was in this boat as well... but luckily am matriculating in the fall.

3.1X GPA and SGPA 32 mcat
c's in bio, chem, ochem and basically B's in all other prereqs...
no post bacc no smp no grad school
definitely possible to get in.

I did only semesters of 18/19 units from end of soph to first semester of senior year. Which I do not recommend your more likely to kill your gpa then have a positive impact.


Where did you matriculate? CONGRATULATIONS!!!
 
Yeah, how'd you do it??? haha Your transcript seems similar to mine...
 
I was in this boat as well... but luckily am matriculating in the fall.

3.1X GPA and SGPA 32 mcat
c's in bio, chem, ochem and basically B's in all other prereqs...
no post bacc no smp no grad school
definitely possible to get in.

I did only semesters of 18/19 units from end of soph to first semester of senior year. Which I do not recommend your more likely to kill your gpa then have a positive impact.

Damn. 😱

*bookmarks post for inspiration*
 
wrong. smp does NOT trump ugrad grades.

really???

Unfortunately, yes SMP grades do not trump ugrad grades. Everyone does undergrad so it is an easy way to compare applicants. So once you have that black mark on your transcript, it is hard to get it off.

SMPs definitely are a way to show you belong. By doing strongly in an SMP you can prove that you belong. Nonetheless, it remains an uphill battle. Even if you get a 4.0 in those first year med school classes (ie the SMP), you will still be competing against kids with 3.8s who didn't need a second chance.

I myself was a re-applicant who had to do an SMP (I think had around 2.9) and had to do an SMP so I gained some experience through the years in SDN. For those interested there is a reapplicant forum (under the premed section) and a post-bacc forum (further down on the main forums page) where there are people who have gone through the SMP process. Many of them are posting in this thread, but it is a great place to get some info.

Once you get in, you will see that if you can crush the SMP, you can also do exceptionally well in med school. The people who did the SMP with me and matriculated to my med school ended up in either radiology (pretty competitive) ENT (very competitive) or their first choice program. I myself ended up in my first choice program at the number one program in the country in the specialty I chose (medicine)

So your slate is clean once you get into med school.
 
My application is definitely a more unusual one:

Things I did not do:
I did not have much leadership, I didn't join many clubs frankly I just didn't care about them I didn't want to spend each week attending meetings. (Leadership is something many schools look for).

Zero Awards: not even a Dean's list to my name, no grants, no scholarships of mention no summer activities. I just wasn't special enough... lol

Things that I did do:
I had an upward trend my first two years was basically a 2.8 (yea quite horrid) then 3.3 3.4 3.5 4.0 (ending strong!!!).

Had continuity in my activities: I just picked things I liked and stuck with them I didn't do a lot of different things just research and teaching and stuck with them. The activities I did do lasted longer then a year and I had different activities linked to them (ie after-school tutor -> high school mentor; research in X lab to research in Y lab).

Get rocking LORS: Don't go to the best professor ie Nobel, Wolf Prize dept Chair. This one goes hand in hand with the continuity point and has other pluses, too. If your willing to put in the work ask for more and be reliable people notice, all my letters came from professors who knew me. This is something you can achieve even without a great GPA.

I had four LORS:
Assistant Prof I: Took his class, OH every week, joined his lab volunteered 2 years.
Assistant Prof II: Volunteered in her clinic, shadowed her, one of the first in last out, 1.5 years. Because I worked hard she helped me find other opportunities to shadow, get paid etc.
Associate Prof: Volunteered in his lab a few years, hired me after college.
Adjuct Prof: Took his class, OH every week I was the only one who went and all we talked about was his past experiements (I really like biochem and VEGF the class was on something entirely different)

Non of these people are the chairs or the deans etc title doesn't matter as much as content of the letters and these letters definitely helped.

Personal Statement/Secondary Essays: Make sure yours shine, I have no doubt in my mind that my secondary essay was the main reason I rocked my interview and got into one school. Make sure its personal simple as that make it emotional make it meaningful to yourself even if it seems like a stupid question; DO NOT write something just to write something don't write something that is I'm balla I did this that and that or a reiteration of everything on CV.
 
Had continuity in my activities: I just picked things I liked and stuck with them I didn't do a lot of different things just research and teaching and stuck with them. The activities I did do lasted longer then a year and I had different activities linked to them (ie after-school tutor -> high school mentor; research in X lab to research in Y lab).


I'm hoping this will help my app, as I have played tennis since I was 5 years old (still play on my college varsity team); I've played violin since I was 8 and piano since I was 12 (though these are only hobbies now); and I've been involved w/my church youth group since Middle School, where now I am often a leader at church retreats, etc. ..So I'm banking on the idea that adcomms will like that I've been dedicated to these activities for so long. Glad to hear you think that worked for you!
 
Every now and again I feel compelled to contribute to these sort of threads. Not so long ago, I was reading these threads, thinking I was either up "that" creek to knee deep in that same creek (no chance without grad or SMP). I had a 3.0 cGPA from a state school. From a half-assed zoology major my sGPA was nearly the same. My BCPM core was slightly better, however, (A's and a few B/B+'s in everything except the labs, which were mostly C's and C+'s haha). My GPA took a distinctly downward trend my last two years of college to boot. I only took the MCAT once and I got a 33 (12/9/12).

I applied to 16 schools in late August and AMCAS processed mid-September. I finished my secondaries ASAFP and I ended up only getting 3 rejections (Stanford, FIU, USUHS). I interviewed at several places during the Fall, and ending up getting acceptances after each interview. After getting accepted to my current school in January (#2 on the list behind Stanford), I notified every other school that I'd be taking my talents elsewhere. So I probably would have gotten more rejections at the end of the process, but it doesn't really matter.

In my experience, having a bad GPA doesn't immediately seat you beside Charon like some of the forum warriors here would have you believe. There is no sliding scale that says "3.1?!? This ****er better have a 37 or I'm wiping my ass with this". I'd rather be in my situation than a 4.0 with a 20 any day (The glass is half full!!!). You DO get a chance - even with poor numbers - to make your case to adcoms, just make sure you hit home runs at every available opportunity.

What won the day for me was being a superstar at interview (modesty: check), and showing that I had distanced myself from previous mistakes. I didn't do ANY post-bacc or grad work. And honestly - and this may seem hard to believe - my GPA/MCAT discrepancy never became a negative thing at ANY interview like I thought it would. Don't obsess over things that are done and gone.
 
i'm in this boat!

3.52 cGPA, 3.58 sGPA
FR 3.1 *epiphany* SO 3.9 JR 3.8 SR 3.4 *had to skip classes*
 
i'm in this boat!

3.52 cGPA, 3.58 sGPA
FR 3.1 *epiphany* SO 3.9 JR 3.8 SR 3.4 *had to skip classes*
Wrong boat.
1241578386-boat%20in%20camper.jpg
 
I think schools are more willing to overlook low GPAs than low MCATs. Just on this thread there are people accepted MD with 3.0-3.2s with 30+ MCATs. I am led to believe that my 30+ MCAT, persistence (re-app/upward trend in grades and MCAT), and INTERVIEW is what landed me my acceptance with a 3.4 cGPA and 3.1 sGPA.
 
To be honest, I hate comparing MCAT and GPA and kind of group them together they are very different things .

MCAT: Raw knowledge, memorization, with very little information about how much effort you put in.

GPA: memorization more effort then knowledge or raw genius (for most people)

I remember one professor's advice to me... to paraphrase:
GPA is a sign of your ability to learn and work hard for a long period of time, it is very hard to change this sign but by you can definitely prove you have that ability by showing your intelligence and ability in other ways. Doing well in the MCAT is not enough, you have to have show it beyond that in academic activities such as research, academic competitions etc. I don't know how adcoms actually feel about this but I felt like it was good advice.

I agree with the point that low gpa is not a death sentence and that you have to take SMP or post-bacc. BUT keep in mind low gpa will definitely not help, doing a post-bacc is a good idea especially if you need to improve other areas of your app as well especially since many of them have linkage programs.

As for low GPA vs low MCAT, low GPA is much harder to fix takes years sometimes and not just months. I would've trade my 32 for a 3.5 anyday
 
I'm here too with a 3.40c and 3.30s. I have pretty solid ECs including research and 2+ years working in a hospital. I'm really hoping that my saving grace will be my 34 MCAT.

My biggest fear is that committees will see my sub 3.5 GPA and automatically not interview me without really looking at my whole application. I feel like if I could just get lucky enough to score a handful of interviews then I could demonstrate in person that my GPA (most damage from Fresh/Soph) is not at all representative of my ability now.

Good luck to us all! May these schools see the value in someone who has faltered in something and then pulled themselves back up.
 
fishbait63, did you take some years off? also, how many schools did you apply to?
 
I took one, this year which was probably best the grades from senior year boosted my gpa and it gave me time to continue working with people so I got better LORs too.

As for numbers applied to...
OK i admit it will sound ridiculous to people but likely close to 50 completely based on geography. I am from California so all of those surrounding states, then it was a lot of North East down to Virginia, and then Chicago. Honestly on some levels I wish I applied to less and worked harder on those secondaries but having gotten into only one school I can't complain. (I got interviews from the schools I had the most time to work on secondaries.... the first secondary and a secondary I got at Thanksgiving...)
 
I feel like if I could just get lucky enough to score a handful of interviews then I could demonstrate in person that my GPA (most damage from Fresh/Soph) is not at all representative of my ability now.

I don't really know anything about you, but I think this statement is pretty indicative that you're going to succeed. Just keep plugging away.

I think the only way to overcome a poor GPA (or poor MCAT) is to show persistence and maturity.
 
Yeah, low GPA might be putting it nicely for me. I graduated from undergrad in '98, and went to grad school and graduated with honors. Since then, there has never been a year when I have not been going to school either just to pick up interesting skills or to go full time for additional training. As a result, I have no idea what numbers medical schools will consider:

'98 cGPA: 2.93
'98 sGPA: 2.51

'11 cGPA: 3.21
'11 sGPA: 2.52 (not many more science courses)
 
Is this party still happening?? If so, I'm ready to rock!!!

cGPA: 3.38
sGPA: 3.46
SMP GPA: 3.70
MCAT: 38Q

Is it true that adcoms focus on the SMP GPA and look at the undergrad GPA as an afterthought?? I've heard this from a few sources, but I'm hesitant to pick my schools based on a 3.7 GPA and a 38 MCAT with an undergrad GPA like mine...
 
Is this party still happening?? If so, I'm ready to rock!!!

cGPA: 3.38
sGPA: 3.46
SMP GPA: 3.70
MCAT: 38Q

Is it true that adcoms focus on the SMP GPA and look at the undergrad GPA as an afterthought?? I've heard this from a few sources, but I'm hesitant to pick my schools based on a 3.7 GPA and a 38 MCAT with an undergrad GPA like mine...

You are in the wrong place. Your stats are good, especially with that MCAT score.
 
My application is definitely a more unusual one:

Things I did not do:
I did not have much leadership, I didn't join many clubs frankly I just didn't care about them I didn't want to spend each week attending meetings. (Leadership is something many schools look for).

Zero Awards: not even a Dean's list to my name, no grants, no scholarships of mention no summer activities. I just wasn't special enough... lol

Things that I did do:
I had an upward trend my first two years was basically a 2.8 (yea quite horrid) then 3.3 3.4 3.5 4.0 (ending strong!!!).

Had continuity in my activities: I just picked things I liked and stuck with them I didn't do a lot of different things just research and teaching and stuck with them. The activities I did do lasted longer then a year and I had different activities linked to them (ie after-school tutor -> high school mentor; research in X lab to research in Y lab).

Get rocking LORS: Don't go to the best professor ie Nobel, Wolf Prize dept Chair. This one goes hand in hand with the continuity point and has other pluses, too. If your willing to put in the work ask for more and be reliable people notice, all my letters came from professors who knew me. This is something you can achieve even without a great GPA.

I had four LORS:
Assistant Prof I: Took his class, OH every week, joined his lab volunteered 2 years.
Assistant Prof II: Volunteered in her clinic, shadowed her, one of the first in last out, 1.5 years. Because I worked hard she helped me find other opportunities to shadow, get paid etc.
Associate Prof: Volunteered in his lab a few years, hired me after college.
Adjuct Prof: Took his class, OH every week I was the only one who went and all we talked about was his past experiements (I really like biochem and VEGF the class was on something entirely different)

Non of these people are the chairs or the deans etc title doesn't matter as much as content of the letters and these letters definitely helped.

Personal Statement/Secondary Essays: Make sure yours shine, I have no doubt in my mind that my secondary essay was the main reason I rocked my interview and got into one school. Make sure its personal simple as that make it emotional make it meaningful to yourself even if it seems like a stupid question; DO NOT write something just to write something don't write something that is I'm balla I did this that and that or a reiteration of everything on CV.

Sounds like your mixed bag is similar to mine, with a few differences. That's rather cheering.

I'm dead certain that my MCAT and any/all writing efforts will be some of the strong points in my app. I also have good contacts with some of the head science profs at my school. I do NOT have a lot of continuity in medical-related volunteering activities, mostly due to a job which scheduled me randomly up through October 2010, and I'm scrambling to make it up. It's really driving me nuts trying to find a regular shadowing experience, I got two doctors to let me shadow them right away but both were resistant to recurrent shadowing. :-( But I *do* have good leadership quals, and some teaching experience, and have worked for some of my professors, so...

Yeah.

Anyway, I was going to graduate with my second bachelor's this summer, but I'm now thinking of taking an extra year with a very light course load + a job, so I can inch my postbac / second bachelor's GPA toward the 3.67 necessary to graduate with honors (it's at 3.61 now.) Hoping it doesn't reflect poorly on me to do that.

My total GPA, numerically calculated, is around 3.3, but it's not going to show as such on AMCAS because I have a bunch of coursework from a college with non-letter-grades. The good news is, my non-letter-grade coursework is top stuff, and it's visible in my written evals (which take the place of letter grades at that college.)

I also have lots of totally weird stuff that could either wow people or put them off. An M.F.A. Poetry publications. Online science articles written for a big how-to site, stuff with titles like "What is the Difference Between Toluene and Acetone" and "Safe Ways to Lose Weight" - not exactly a research publication but it does show my devotion to public health and good information, heh. I'm in my late 20s and have wound up with lots of experiences that could be tagged "people are impressed when I tell this to them, but where the crap does it go in my application?"
 
I was under 3.6 and got my first choice med school. A guy in my class had a 2.7. You guys can and will make it if you try.

How long ago was that though..? Stats do change...😱
 
AACOM:
3.43 cum
3.37 BCPM

AMCAS:
3.38
3.05

postbacc would be the same since all science classes except for a 2 credit class (so far only 11 credits, I still have a few more science classes to take)
3.57 cum
3.55 sci

I have a huge upward trend since freshman year, hoping this means something. I graduated summa cum laude with a 3.9 GPA from undergrad. I have one D+ in A+P from sophomore year which I retook for a B+ and some C's in 2 math classes but an A in statistics.

Hoping that my nursing experience will help me in some way. Not expecting it to make up for bad grades, but hopefully it will be the thing that at least has them read my PS and LOR instead of putting my application directly into the garbage.

To all the low GPAers, we can do it!!!
 
cGPA: 3.53
sGPA: 3.55

Freshman year: 3.0
Sophomore year: 3.64
Junior year: 3.71
Senior year: 3.78

MCAT: 36S (10p,11v,15b)

Applying to:

Einstein, Boston U, RFU, Loyola, MCW, Mayo, Ohio State, OHSU, Penn State, Rush, Brown, Arizona, Iowa, Miami, Minnesota, UNC, Rochester, UW, Wisconsin, VTech, Wake Forest, WVU

Anybody have any opinions on some other schools I should apply to? My mdapps has all my ECs listed. Any more reachy schools you think I might have a shot at?

Was wondering if anybody had anything to comment on this. I got rid of USC and UCLA and added Pitt, Case, Buffalo, and Dartmouth. Do you guys think my list is strong enough in matches & "safeties"?
 
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