Malignant residency program.

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ninthseat

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Just had to get this off my chest, sorry!


The residency program that I went to is an absolute joke.

The culture is toxic and malignant and I wish I had taken a step out of Jonestown to realize that while I was in it.

Imagine being an impressionable resident, full of ideas for education and how to add to the curriculum, engaged in recruitment, volunteering for things and working on projects that were meaningful to me (albeit not the most “academically flaunt-able” for the department). Chief selection comes around at the end of the year and I think I’d make a good candidate and bring something different to the table. Most people weren’t doing fellowship, so I thought I’d add that perspective, and I thought I had developed a good relationship with most of the residents themselves.

During the chief selection process, I was told by a fellow resident that an APD was loudly saying, why would “my name” run for chief, she’s a new stepmom, she’s not gonna have time for that! Nevermind that I have my own ideas and that two of the other people running were new parents.

Other turnoffs include APDs telling me that it doesn’t matter what the academic impact/question of a paper is, as long as you have a publication/its the quantity, not quality that matters most. Actually, I’m just wondering what happened to innate intellectual curiosity? Other toxic cultural aspects include attendings talking about other residents in the doc box and how “slow they are” to their co-residents instead of addressing specifics / delivering constructive feedback about flow to the resident that they were gossiping about.

Let me preface the next grievances by saying that I have not been perfect - the last year of residency was definitely me biting off more than I could chew - I struggled with balancing my marriage to a coresident and being a chief (trying to remain impartial) and I ultimately was exasperated with being the person my coresidents complained to about my husband and constantly being asked to choose between my residency program and my marriage by my husband. I took this out on a cochief midyear and complained to my coresidents about said cochief when my husband and I were scheduled for different vacation weeks and I was at a breaking point of being so deep in this horse**** and so far away from learning (was this the point of residency?). I seriously regret perpetuating the toxic culture in that moment as my cochief was just trying to do his/her job. That was bad behavior on my end. I take full responsibility.

What hurts the most is that after all the work we put into COVID scheduling (and being slapped around by the medicine department because our department has no backbone in our hospital) and being the good figureheads our institution wanted... after the year was over, I was invited to a group chat of “retired chiefs” which basically had an old conversation about me and how multiple people had thought I was unfit to be a chief and in exact words “multiple people in the room [were] saying that there was going to be a certain disaster of a chief and it fell on deaf ears”, by a prior chief and someone I’ve always regarded highly and looked up to with the response of “I SAID THAT ****” by an APD. What “****” are you trying to “say” if you haven’t even taken the time to try and get to know me? Neither of them ever told me this feedback to my face. The APD was the same who assumed that because I was a new stepmom, I would probably be too idle to come up with any ideas or participate like a normal chief. The only person who had the guts to warn me that the chief year would put a strain on my marriage (and boy were we in for a doozy there) and ask me about my plans as a chief was my program director.

It stings to be told by a program that they basically never believed in you in the first place and assumed you would fail. Especially to hear it from prior chiefs you used to look up to and wanted to be. I frankly worked my ass off last year - making your schedules, calling people who didn’t submit their schedule requests in time (because maybe life got in the way) to see if there was anything little thing I could do for their wellness, checking in on people personally. And one of my cochiefs, when we first found out we were chiefs - the first question out of his/her mouth was “do we get a raise?” ... What? That never even crossed my mind. I signed up for this **** because I believed in this program and the mission of the program and I wanted residents voices to be heard. I wanted to believe that what my spidey sense was telling me about this program was false, but it was all confirmed this week.

The academic institution I went to residency at can only ride on the coattails of the affiliated county hospital for so long. I am forever indebted to the patients and experiences taking care of the patients at the county hospital and grateful for my experience, but the program soured it and I’m embarrassed to be “trained” here.

End rant.

PS: Fellowship is awesome and I am learning a ton and remembering what it was like to focus on patients again!

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You got out, let it fade into the past. Glad you are happier
 
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Just had to get this off my chest, sorry!


The culture is toxic and malignant and I wish I had taken a step out of Jonestown to realize that while I was in it.

Many are.



During the chief selection process, I was told by a fellow resident that an APD was loudly saying, why would “my name” run for chief, she’s a new stepmom, she’s not gonna have time for that! Nevermind that I have my own ideas and that two of the other people running were new parents.

Although they could of kept their opinion to themselves, you did confirm their concerns in this paragraph:

Let me preface the next grievances by saying that I have not been perfect - the last year of residency was definitely me biting off more than I could chew - I struggled with balancing my marriage to a coresident and being a chief (trying to remain impartial) and I ultimately was exasperated with being the person my coresidents complained to about my husband and constantly being asked to choose between my residency program and my marriage by my husband. I took this out on a cochief midyear and complained to my coresidents about said cochief when my husband and I were scheduled for different vacation weeks and I was at a breaking point of being so deep in this horse**** and so far away from learning (was this the point of residency?). I seriously regret perpetuating the toxic culture in that moment as my cochief was just trying to do his/her job. That was bad behavior on my end. I take full responsibility.



What hurts the most is that after all the work we put into COVID scheduling (and being slapped around by the medicine department because our department has no backbone in our hospital) and being the good figureheads our institution wanted... after the year was over, I was invited to a group chat of “retired chiefs” which basically had an old conversation about me and how multiple people had thought I was unfit to be a chief and in exact words “multiple people in the room [were] saying that there was going to be a certain disaster of a chief and it fell on deaf ears”, by a prior chief and someone I’ve always regarded highly and looked up to with the response of “I SAID THAT ****” by an APD. What “****” are you trying to “say” if you haven’t even taken the time to try and get to know me? Neither of them ever told me this feedback to my face. The APD was the same who assumed that because I was a new stepmom, I would probably be too idle to come up with any ideas or participate like a normal chief. The only person who had the guts to warn me that the chief year would put a strain on my marriage (and boy were we in for a doozy there) and ask me about my plans as a chief was my program director.

It stings to be told by a program that they basically never believed in you in the first place and assumed you would fail. Especially to hear it from prior chiefs you used to look up to and wanted to be. I frankly worked my ass off last year - making your schedules, calling people who didn’t submit their schedule requests in time (because maybe life got in the way) to see if there was anything little thing I could do for their wellness, checking in on people personally. And one of my cochiefs, when we first found out we were chiefs - the first question out of his/her mouth was “do we get a raise?” ... What? That never even crossed my mind. I signed up for this **** because I believed in this program and the mission of the program and I wanted residents voices to be heard. I wanted to believe that what my spidey sense was telling me about this program was false, but it was all confirmed this week.

The academic institution I went to residency at can only ride on the coattails of the affiliated county hospital for so long. I am forever indebted to the patients and experiences taking care of the patients at the county hospital and grateful for my experience, but the program soured it and I’m embarrassed to be “trained” here.

End rant.

PS: Fellowship is awesome and I am learning a ton and remembering what it was like to focus on patients again!

I'm sorry third year went so poorly for you. As you found out, being chief sucks. You'll never make neither staff, nor your fellow residents happy with you and you're a glorified secretary mainly in charge of scheduling, and answering whining co-residents who feel like they're being treated unfairly. Take that ish to faculty and see how far you go. If you push, you'll be lucky to still have a job. Ask me how I know. You have authority with no autonomy and will be the scapegoat for both resident and faculty complaints. As you found, you will take the stress home and it will affect your home life.

Your fellow residents not thinking you were up for the job doesn't mean they thought you would be a failure, but we can't be good at everything. I'd love to be an NFL running back but I'm 42 years old and weight 155 lbs. It wouldn't work out so well for me.
 
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I'm sorry third year went so poorly for you. As you found out, being chief sucks. You'll never make neither staff, nor your fellow residents happy with you and you're a glorified secretary mainly in charge of scheduling, and answering whining co-residents who feel like they're being treated unfairly. Take that ish to faculty and see how far you go. If you push, you'll be lucky to still have a job. Ask me how I know. You have authority with no autonomy and will be the scapegoat for both resident and faculty complaints. As you found, you will take the stress home and it will affect your home life.

Your fellow residents not thinking you were up for the job doesn't mean they thought you would be a failure, but we can't be good at everything. I'd love to be an NFL running back but I'm 42 years old and weight 155 lbs. It wouldn't work out so well for me.


Yea, I definitely learned my lesson about biting off way more than I could chew and you are right that I totally confirmed all concerns with that paragraph :oops:. And I've learned my lesson to never be in a leadership role again.


To clarify - I have no concerns with fellow residents not feeling like I was up for the job - my biggest concern is with people in so-called leadership positions (i.e., APDs, old chiefs) who were supposed to be our teachers and advocates... instead of addressing concerns with me head-on (or ever addressing any issues with me directly), gossiping about it behind my back with each other, and to other residents who weren't even involved. I feel like this is such a huge problem in medical training, especially with feedback - I find that people often choose to complain to others about how slow a resident is, or how they think a junior has a deficiency, and instead of just addressing it with that person, they choose to just gossip to others about it. I guess I just thought leadership figures were supposed to model better behavior and it seems like it's not a productive way to fix things.
 
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Yea, I definitely learned my lesson about biting off way more than I could chew and you are right that I totally confirmed all concerns with that paragraph :oops:. And I've learned my lesson to never be in a leadership role again.


To clarify - I have no concerns with fellow residents not feeling like I was up for the job - my biggest concern is with people in so-called leadership positions (i.e., APDs, old chiefs) who were supposed to be our teachers and advocates... instead of addressing concerns with me head-on (or ever addressing any issues with me directly), gossiping about it behind my back with each other, and to other residents who weren't even involved. I feel like this is such a huge problem in medical training, especially with feedback - I find that people often choose to complain to others about how slow a resident is, or how they think a junior has a deficiency, and instead of just addressing it with that person, they choose to just gossip to others about it. I guess I just thought leadership figures were supposed to model better behavior and it seems like it's not a productive way to fix things.

True leadership is an increasingly rare commodity. Gossip and back talk have always been there, but it does seem to be worsening as relationships and communication deteriorate. Resident deficiencies are real. Some are slow and inefficient with knowledge deficits. Some programs are friendlier in their approach and some are pretty cut throat. How you view your role (learning) and how faculty views you (labor), unfortunately, sets itself up for opposition. I wouldn't repeat residency for $1m, cash.
 
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I am sorry you had such a bad time. For me, serving as a chief was an exhausting but valuable experience.

I suspect a number of your grievances are universal to the chief experience, especially as a 3rd year chief. By taking the job you essentially give up any chance of having a normal 3rd year of residency. You stop being "one of the guys/gals" as far as the other residents are concerned-- conversations about the attendings/PD suddenly stop when you enter the room and your jokes seem to get a lot funnier. There seems to be a steady amount of @$$ kissing from people who want something from you and resentment from people you've had to say "no" to. You also learn that your "chief" title carries very little weight with the powers that be in terms of making substantive changes to the program. Following through with new initiatives is possible but every battle is uphill and must be weighed judiciously with your increased work load.

I will Echo @mark v and agree that we are, to a large extent, glorified secretaries--that, and willing punching bags. Both the residents and the administration want a piece of you, which can make one feel like either a figurehead leader or an establishment stooge depending on who you let down that day.

At the same time, it was also a once in a lifetime experience and kinda cool. It sucks that your APD didn't believe in you but so what? They picked you anyway and you ended up matching to fellowship. Along the way you lead during COVID times and I'm sure you positively impacted people's lives too.
As a bonus you got a front-row seat to the seedy, political underbelly of your program which should be a valuable opportunity to learn how real institutions function and how to navigate them. I would not understate these benefits.

Personally, it helped me to have a reliable-as-**** co-chief who I could depend on. We covered each other's backs. I obviously don't know your situation but I wonder if you'd ever consider reaching out to your co-chief about some of this stuff you went through. If people complained to you about your husband you can be certain they complained to your co-chief first. You might be surprised to know what his/her experience was like after the dust settles.
 
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...Personally, it helped me to have a reliable-as-**** co-chief who I could depend on. We covered each other's backs...

Being chief is rough, lots more work, lots of interpersonal stuff. Difficult to manage if you're single, let alone with a family and kids. Thank God for the above in my case as well. I'm burning out already and we haven't even started virtual interviews yet.
 
When you get down to it, being chief sucks. Big time. A lot of residents are entitled and when something doesn't go their way, it's the fault of the chief, the ever-present punching bag.

What former chiefs and APD said about you also sucks, but you were chosen anyway so I wouldn't harp on it. It's over and done with.

With that said, am I understanding correctly that your husband was your co-resident? If that's the case, then I'm not sure you ever should have been chief. Why did you need others beside your program director to warn you it would put a strain on your marriage?
 
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talk about malignant/racist/hateful residency programs, look no further than Wash U/Mallinckrodt Radiology.
This message is part of the #not my program director campaign#. It's well established that Mallinckrodt is an incredibly malignant program. Not because of long hours or busy clinical service-no, not at all. Program malignancy is based upon the weakest faculty (who also happen to be the most malignant) mistreating/abusing residents. The worst part is Dr. Gould enables these malignant faculty to continue their actions and behavior and even enable their abuse many of the time. She faults the resident every single time because they are more vulnerable, and its much easier to punish residents than to seek solutions. She is a part time interventionalist who knows nothing about diagnostic radiology or how the reading room operates. She has not dictated a single diagnostic examination since residency. How it's legal for her to be in charge of a diagnostic residency program is baffling. Imagine if a surgeon were program director of an internal medicine residency program. It simply does not work. This problem is everyone's responsibility, and unfortunately at this time we must remain anonymous because Dr. Gould still has the power to retaliate severely. The best thing about Mallinckrodt are the co-residents-just wonderful people. The worst thing about Mallinckrodt is its program director: incompetent, wholly incapable of leading the program, and frankly, not a radiologist. The Mallinckrodt residents deserve much, much better than Dr. Gould. Many excellent dx rads for new PD. Dr. Wahl, please pay attention to this. Mallinckrodt is already regarded as a second rate training program due to its malignancy and its terrible program director. If you do not take care to resolve this issue, we will no longer be able to support the program-meaning, we will speak the truth to applicants and potential new residents.
 
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