md/phd program in psychiatry

[melissa10]

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does anybody know of any good md/phd programs in psychiatry in or near new york??
melissa

 

[OldPsychDoc]

does anybody know of any good md/phd programs in psychiatry in or near new york??
melissa

One wouldn't do an md/phd in psychiatry, per se, as psychiatry comes after the md when you're doing a residency. There are lots of opportunities for MD/PhDs which are psychiatry related, though. Most Mud-phud psychiatrists I've known do their PhD work in neurobiology. There may be schools where it's possible to do the phd in a psychology dept, though. I also know of a medical historian with a md/phd degree. You'd need to check with the individual programs. You'll find many good md/phd programs in the NE, most with good academic psych residency programs attached--NYU, Columbia, Einstein, Yale, Penn, etc...

 

[PsychMD]

Old psych doc, you are talking about docs who already have their MD/PhD degrees though, and then go on to do Psych. residency training, aren't you? Of course, it may also a situation in which somebody has their MD and then goes on to do their PhD, either before entering or after completing a Psych residency training program. I doubt that there are any current Psych residency training programs in which one could pursue also in parallel, at the SAME time, their PhD work, alongside with their residency training requirements! It would be both logistically and time-wise realistically impossible, wouldn't it? Now there are some combined fellowship programs too, in which one pursues a formal post-residency fellowship and in parallel a master's degree in something, typically in Public health/epidemiology, but it's still not a PhD! So bottom line, one either has the PhD before they get into a residency program, or they get it, assuming they get accepted to a PhD level of training, after the residency program, but one cannot possibly realistically acquire a PhD DURING the residency training program. Never say never though. I could envision a realistically possible scenario in which an extremely dedicated person might pursue a half-time residency program and PhD work in parallel, but I don't know of any specific "programs" geared towards such endeavors. It would be a totally individually driven effort, which would involve a parallel acceptance to a PhD program, and acceptance into a part-time residency training program!

I just felt the need to clarify.

 

[OldPsychDoc]

Old psych doc, you are talking about docs who already have their MD/PhD degrees though, and then go on to do Psych. residency training, aren't you? Of course, it may also a situation in which somebody has their MD and then goes on to do their PhD, either before entering or after completing a Psych residency training program. I doubt that there are any current Psych residency training programs in which one could pursue also in parallel, at the SAME time, their PhD work, alongside with their residency training requirements! It would be both logistically and time-wise realistically impossible, wouldn't it? Now there are some combined fellowship programs too, in which one pursues a formal post-residency fellowship and in parallel a master's degree in something, typically in Public health/epidemiology, but it's still not a PhD! So bottom line, one either has the PhD before they get into a residency program, or they get it, assuming they get accepted to a PhD level of training, after the residency program, but one cannot possibly realistically acquire a PhD DURING the residency training program. Never say never though. I could envision a realistically possible scenario in which an extremely dedicated person might pursue a half-time residency program and PhD work in parallel, but I don't know of any specific "programs" geared towards such endeavors. It would be a totally individually driven effort, which would involve a parallel acceptance to a PhD program, and acceptance into a part-time residency training program!

I just felt the need to clarify.

Well, perhaps the OP could clarify what she is looking for precisely. What did you mean, Melissa?

I was referring (as she did) to MD/PhD programs where one earns a PhD concurrently (more or less) with the MD. These are mostly geared to the basic sciences, but one could conceivably find (such as at U of IL) a very liberal range of appropriate PhD programs within the MD/PhD, including psychology, etc.

I agree, aiming to get a PhD in conjunction with a residency would take a HIGHLY motivated individual, and/or a very flexible residency program.

 

[PsychMD]

Right; I was thrown off by the mention "MD/PhD in psychiatry", knowing there is, of course, no such thing as a PhD in "psychiatry". Psychiatry is, of course, a clinical medical specialty one trains for via a "regular" postgrad. residency training program.

There are, of course, PhD degree granting programs in more or less potentially connected or connex domains, such as indeed, neuroscience, epidemiology, genetics, psychology, public health, etc., and such PhD programs may be completed either:

* pre-MD school (assuming one has a pre-existent connected domain Masters degree allowing someone entry into the desired PhD program), or
* during Med-school via the currently existent numerous and very popular MD/PhD degree granting programs (this is by far the most common and most realistic option), or
* separately, after the MD-degree (either before entering residency training or after completing residency training, for the ones so inclined).

I also submitted the hypothetical theoretically possible scenario of someone doing their Psych. residency part-time and also working on a PhD in parallel, at the same time, but I do not personally know anyone who is doing something like this, and I doubt that there are any specific programs that would even encourage something like this in a "formal" inter-departmental collaborative manner. Most MD/PhD's already have a pre-med school PhD degree or have acquired the dual degree via the MD/PhD degree programs. One assumes that most MD's who might be interested in getting a PhD degree anyway would typically be people who would have already applied to and gotten into formal MD/PhD programs to start with (prior to any Psych. residency training anyway.) Or if somehow they weren't lucky or prepared enough or eligible to get into such a program, but still very motivated for such a degree, they might be taking some time post MD-school and pre-residency to work on a PhD, but their numbers must be really really small. (I'm thinking that this scenario may be more commonly encountered among a certain category of very motivated FMG's who come to the US, do a PhD first, and then in the meantime also take their ECFMG/USMLE's and enter subsequently into a residency training program too.) (US grads must also realistically start paying off their med school loans after Med school, so I strongly doubt that they would be entering into a PhD program after Med school!)

I also think that, obviously, the pool of people who would still have the interest/motivation/stamina to work on a PhD AFTER completing Psych. residency training is almost insignificantly small, most likely close to zero, but sure, it is possible to do one's PhD after Psych. residency too (but realistically...who's going to pay those med school loans and feed you while you dither, as a perpetual student, with getting a PhD post med school and post-residency?!)
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I hope all this makes sense to Melissa!

 

[slowhazel]

There are programs which incorporate psych training and a PhD. I'm in the Yale integrated child and adult research track program which allows you to do a master's or a PhD while working on your residency. It's a great setup and a neat model to watch. I think there is a similar program out of colorado. If you have any qs., let me know.