med school in germany

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.

MNIkid87

Full Member
10+ Year Member
5+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2007
Messages
135
Reaction score
0
Hi,

I am going to apply to study medicine in Germany (starting summer semester 2008) - What do you guys think are the best programs?
I am probably applying to Mainz, Dresden, Charite, Freiburg and Heidelberg, what do you guys think?

Members don't see this ad.
 
I just finished up med school at the LMU (on of the two schools in Munich). I can definately recommend it- it has some negatives (as all schools do) but in general I am very happy with the education that I received and Munich is a great city!!!

good luck with your decision
 
Members don't see this ad :)
can you guys maybe tell me a bit more about your programs? What you liked and disliked?
 
Do any of these schools that you speak of teach in English?
 
I know German med schools are designed to prepare their students for their own exam/s. But how are German med schools any good in preparing their students for USMLE?

Medicine-wise how is the transition from English to German and vice versa?
 
The transition from Germany to the USA requires a bit of planning but is definately possible. I think that the education in Germany is at a very high level but there are of course some differences (in general Germany med school is very theoretical- although most of the schools here are incorporating very good practical aspects as well). I found the USMLE (I took I and am now preparing for II) similar in difficulty to the German exams but the exam style is more clinically oriented so it requires a bit more preparation.

I am in the process of transferring back to the USA and am surprised at how easy it seems to be- although I am interested in neurology which is not the most competitive field.
 
I dont know about u but neuro is quite competitive here in the states. I think it's 3 yrs general surgery plus two years subspecialty in neuro. getting into surgery alone is not easy.

Haven, I'm sorry but you have misunderstood my question. What I meant was language wise how is the transition from English to German? German med schools' language of instruction is german, how is the transition to english if one is to take the USMLE? Are the medical terms or language used similar to english or are they even close? I'm thinking of going to Germany for medschool but I dont know any german. My plan is to take German language courses at my community college for 2 years and some physics or chem subjects. I do have a Bachelor's degree already..

Hey good luck on the CK and CS
 
I dont know about u but neuro is quite competitive here in the states. I think it's 3 yrs general surgery plus two years subspecialty in neuro. getting into surgery alone is not easy.
I believe you are thinking of neurosurgery, not neurology which is what he stated.
 
my bad..

any reponse to my query?

What I meant was language wise how is the transition from English to German? German med schools' language of instruction is german, how is the transition to english if one is to take the USMLE? Are the medical terms or language used similar to english or are they even close? I'm thinking of going to Germany for medschool but I dont know any german. My plan is to take German language courses at my community college for 2 years and some physics or chem subjects. I do have a Bachelor's degree already..
 
what is this "numerus clausus" policy adopted by german med schools?

what is their grade entry level? does one have to be a Grade A student to be admitted to med school in Germany?
 
Members don't see this ad :)
Sorry that I misunderstood your question.

As far as the language situation..... German is not the easiest language to learn and all classes are taught in german. Medical german is similar to medical english (lots of greek and latin) so it isn't that difficult. The hardest part for me was speaking with the patients (I am in Bavaria where many older people speak with a very heavy dialect).

Transfering back to the states is a bit strange because many of the abbreviations are different. I did a rotation in the US and felt like I had no idea what everyone was talking about but after I few weeks I got used to it.
 
one more thing...

A Bachelor's degree is enough to get in to school over here (although you will also need to take a language exam). As far as "numerus clausus"- that does not apply to foriegn students. You can apply to the university directly- I have heard (on this forum) that is very hard to get accepted although my experience was different (I didn't have perfect grades in college). The admissions office of my university told me that almost all foreigners that fit the requirements and apply also get accepted. Then again, maybe she had no idea what she was talking about (or maybe things have changed)!

hope it helps!!!
 
Thanks for the info Haven.

I sure hope things would be smooth sailing for me when I apply. I dont have the best educational credentials as well, hence the option to go to Germany for med school. Getting admitted for med school in germany is a concern. Any recommendations regarding Universities in Germany that are "easy" to get into?

Im also worried about the eventual transition to practicing here in the US. How IMG's from Germany are faring with the USMLE.

I'm enrolling for German language classes this spring, also looking forward to enrolling at Goethe Institue for intensive German lessons. I speak three languages already and I dont really mind learning a new one.

AGain, thanks..
 
Thanks for the info Haven.

I sure hope things would be smooth sailing for me when I apply. I dont have the best educational credentials as well, hence the option to go to Germany for med school. Getting admitted for med school in germany is a concern. Any recommendations regarding Universities in Germany that are "easy" to get into?

Im also worried about the eventual transition to practicing here in the US. How IMG's from Germany are faring with the USMLE.

I'm enrolling for German language classes this spring, also looking forward to enrolling at Goethe Institue for intensive German lessons. I speak three languages already and I dont really mind learning a new one.

AGain, thanks..
 
one more thing...

A Bachelor's degree is enough to get in to school over here (although you will also need to take a language exam). As far as "numerus clausus"- that does not apply to foriegn students. You can apply to the university directly- I have heard (on this forum) that is very hard to get accepted although my experience was different (I didn't have perfect grades in college). The admissions office of my university told me that almost all foreigners that fit the requirements and apply also get accepted. Then again, maybe she had no idea what she was talking about (or maybe things have changed)!

hope it helps!!!

I don't want to rain on anyone's parade, but times appear to have changed. It's tougher for a non-EU student to get into a German med school, not easier. Most German med schools (including haven's school, LMU) now use a centralized admissions' process for non-EU students and the number of spots set aside for them is limited, just like for their EU counterparts. What makes this especially tricky is that German med schools attract a lot of very good applicants from all over the world. A further challenge is that admission is based solely on academic background. So, unlike in the US, applicants can't make up for lacklustre grades with extracurricular activities or an interview prep course and a killer smile.
 
Interesting thread... I am an American studying in Germany! It has it's ups and downs... here are my thoughts:
I started in Heidelberg (the "Harvard" of Europe). DO NOT GO THERE. IT IS HORRIBLE. The professors scream at you, do not answer questions, they hate foreigners, especially Americans, and most of the other students are arrogant! I wish I were exaggerating, but I am not! They are one of the few schools who get a lot of money for research (Elite-Uni), so if you are into research and don't cry easily, go for it, but be sure your German is PERFECT. (My BA is in german literature and I speak fluently, but during presentations I got heckled)
Now I am in Rostock (Mecklenburg-Vorpommern) in former East Germany (generally much easier to get into!) Smaller groups, much nicer profs, unfortunately not a lot of research money... (you only get the Dr. title here if you do a thesis, but if you take the USMLEs you will get your MD anyway).

It is a great education, though theoretical and long (6 years! though they don't have an internship here, you go right into residency, which doesn't matter if you are coming back to the States after med school anyway...) but the system is VERY VERY different and although I love German culture, it is VERY VERY different-a huge transition! Plan on spending a few months here without school so as to get used to it! That would be the perfect time to do your "Pflegepraktikum" = nursing internship (3 months) which is required before you are allowed to take their first state board exam (Physikum).

Let me know if you have any other questions!!!
 
I am studying at the University of Freiburg and share the same predicament with a couple of people in this forum (having to pass the USMLE when I return to the US for residency). First off, I would like to say that I have not had the same experiences that blondbondgirl has had in Heidelberg. If I had to choose, I would say that the two Munich universities (LMU and TU), Freiburg, Heidelberg, Tübingen and Berlin (Charite) have the best medical programs, in terms of reputation and international renown. Personally, I can highly recommend Freiburg. I came here straight from high school and am very happy with my choice. Although the training here is a bit heavy on the theoretical sciences, you get a thorough understanding of pathophysiological processes. In my opinion, German medical schools are excellent and absolutely on par with US medical schools. If you have any questions feel free to contact me, I'd be glad to be of help!
 
A lot have posted that IMG's have trouble getting into residency programs in the US. Any truth to it from a German MEd School graduate's perspective or experience?
 
Hi everyone, Can't say about how difficult admission is, since I'm sure it changed like someone mentioned already.

I can reiterate the recommendations of other people here about the universities: Munich LMU, Freiburg, Luebeck , Berlin Charite... and would add Muenster and Hannover... but I would really advise to check out your choices in person after gathering all the theoretical info before you decide.

The USMLEs: don't worry about that at all. Of course, German med school doesn't prepare you for it, but it's not a problem to prepare for it yourself with all the books and materials available. of course you should plan to ace those - but since it's totally up to you when you take them, that helps.

I would be more worried about passing the GERMAN exams - you must be fluent in German, esp. reading and understanding!!! If you're not, I honestly don't know how you could make it...?

One nice thing about German Med schools is that you have very long semester vacations during which you can travel and study, and nice is also that you can set up electives and externships pretty much around the world -Fiji anyone? (in most cases must be total self initiative in organization).

If you want to come back to the US though for residency you have to keep several things in mind: a lot of German med students set up their electives and externships in the field they want to go into: for example they do 3 months of ENT (or more) - but you have to approach this differently. For one thing to make sure you don't have problems with state licensure later (f.e. CA) you should make sure you have the minimum full 6 or 8 weeks in the "American Med School core subjects" (psych, ob/gyn, peds, family med)- Germany will have you do rotations in forensic medicine (excellent by the way), occupational medicine, derm, and ALL the subspecialties and allows you to weigh your fields of interest heavier if you like - this is not what most states are interested in for licensure at all.

The other thing is that you must organize some clinical time in the US - and apart from some schools that have set up exchange programs you are on your own with setting that up - and I have the feeling that more and more students from more and more corners of the world want to do externships in the us now, so there may be more and more competition for those.

... and finally, yes, you will be an img, and while German med schools have deservedly a good reputation (with emphasis on the pathophys and theory of everything like people mentioned already) it will be hard if you are competing with american grads for anyhow hard-to-get residency spots in competitive fields! (and again going through the Match will be total self initiative) So for this reason you must be very cautious and plan well when deciding NOT to go to med school in the US!

Good luck!
 
Any reviews on the Medical program at Johann Wolfgang Goethe University, Frankfurt am Main and it's living standards?
 
Any reviews on the Medical program at Johann Wolfgang Goethe University, Frankfurt am Main and it's living standards?

Pepci, I don't know where you're from, but the quality of life in Frankfurt is supposed to be higher than in any American cities.
 
Chicago. I dont know how much more higher is Frankfurt's standard of living from Chicago's. If it's too way high, I dont know how one can afford to study there unless you have supportive and rich parents.

Say, how is sleep medicine in Germany? Where is Germany when it comes to Sleep Med? Sleep labs here are sprouting like mushrooms..
 
@pepci: Frankfurt and Munich are indeed the two most expensive cities to live in in germany and I have a friend that just moved from Frankfurt to northern Germany and pays the same rent here for a 3-bedroom apartement than she did for a single bedroom apartement (with no kitchen) in Frankfurt.

As to the german med schools. It doesn't really matter which one you attend. Since exams are centralized they teach the same basic everywhere. Some schools offer "reformed" classes. I have the experience that smaller universities have to some extend a better relationship between proffessors and students.

Recently some universities were named top universities in Germany (something we never had before) -regardless of individual faculties- these are: Heidelberg, Freiburg, Konstanz, Göttingen, RWTH Aachen, FU Berlin, Karlsruhe (TH), Ludwig-Maximilians-Universität München and TU München.

From personal experience I can recommend Göttingen, but I would not go to Aachen for a medical degree.

@pepci: sleep labs/medicine is a field in germany for different specialties. Mostly and to my knowledge: neurology and ENT (oto), but also internal medicine, psychiatry etc.. It's an advancing fiel of medicine over here too.
 
From personal experience I can recommend Göttingen, but I would not go to Aachen for a medical degree.


What's wrong with Aachen?

Can anybody tell me which Med Schools in Germany are PBL based, if any?
 
What's wrong with Aachen?

Can anybody tell me which Med Schools in Germany are PBL based, if any?

PBL based are as far as I know Berlin Charité, the privat school Witten/Herdecke, Heidelberg, Cologne, Aachen. Hamburg used to have something like that but they were thinking about abolishing it again. Here's a good link about some of the pbl based programs (the links is in german though):
http://www.thieme.de/viamedici/aktuelles/politik/modellstudiengaenge.html

Aachen is a nice city, directly on the boarder of the netherlands and belgium. But the univerity hospital is a nightmare. Actually officially it is a piece of art and is supposed to symbolize the symbiosis of medicine and engineering. That means there are pipes on the ceiling of most floors as well as all over the buildung on the outside. The entire inside is green: green and yellow floors, green walls, green ceilings, yak.
The library of the medical faculty is a joke, although at least you can easily order abstracts from Journals, but not for basic reading as a student. The whole atmosphere is a bit uncomfortable and since they no longer assigne one specialty one floor but rather have standard care wards for all specialities together, it's chaotic to find your way around.

I've been working there 9 month, so I know what I talk about.
 
But the univerity hospital is a nightmare. Actually officially it is a piece of art and is supposed to symbolize the symbiosis of medicine and engineering. That means there are pipes on the ceiling of most floors as well as all over the buildung on the outside. The entire inside is green: green and yellow floors, green walls, green ceilings, yak.

And what is wrong with this ?

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bild:Klinikum_Aachen_2005-03-16_exterior_%282).jpg

or this ?

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bild:Aachen_klinikum_innen.jpg
 
Actually I would recommend Heidelberg. I am in the clinic now and I'm quite satisfied. The organisation is really good. We have a module system (HeiCuMed) that's modeled after the Harvard system and we do the courses in blocks. This means we have exams more frequently, but you can focus on just one subject. I am sorry to hear that you had a bad experience there, Blondbondgirl! I haven't had any major problems. All of the professors I've had have been very nice and respectful to me. My German isn't perfect either. Of course, some profs are scary and you have to hold your own against them; in the Physikum for example, it was a bit rough but it turned out fine. For some reason though, a lot of people hate it here. There is a lot of pressure to excel I suppose. There were two other Americans that started with me but they are gone now, and another one in the semester above me didn't make it. There is a Canadian girl in my year and she is really tough, she is doing fine here.

Some students are really stuck up, unfortunately, but honestly it's not that many. The kids that got a 1,0 Abi flock to Heidelberg and you kind of sense that. I've noticed that if you get them 1 on 1 or in a smaller group they are actually really nice. Some are super intelligent, not just in medicine but overall, and that is quite impressive.

It's not easy studying here, but it gets better with time. I would only recommend coming here to study medicine if you have lived in Germany for at least a year beforehand and really like being here. The cultural differences and attitudes are pretty remarkable and that takes some getting used to.
 
I once asked a friend of mine who graduated from Nursing at Johns Hopkins but took her MD studies in the Philippines and is now doing her residency in New York the pros and cons, and the various differences of studying MD in the States as opposed to studying in the Phils. There was particularly one point she raised that struck me. She said getting into a Medical School in the US is like going thru a needle's eye, terribly hard but once admitted it would be easy. The resources are endless and professors really see to it that you learn and know your craft. That they really help and assist you. Whereas in the Phils the resources are limited and the teachers show little regard for the academic performance of their students. They were basically left to themselves.

I wonder if German Universities have a different approach. It's been said too many often here in the forum that German Universities are good and at par with US Med schools. How are they at par with US universities? Are professors truly helping and assisting their students in their Medical studies? How are they in their teaching skills? How are they in encouraging and inspiring students? Or are students left to their own devices to make the grade or pass the exams?

I dont think how hard admissions to a Med school, how tough it is to pass their medical exams or how many students they drop at the end of the year are true marks of a good medical school like many people here showcase their medical schools to be. Id rather think the mark of a good Medical student/graduate is a reflection of Medical school professors' competency, their drive to help, assist and see their students learn, empathy, and ability to inspire students in the field medicine.

Which Med schools in Germany are at the top when it comes to their professors or teachers?
 
Well the German system differs widely from the US. First of all it's per se not hard to get into med school. All you need is the right grade point average. Which means a lot of students start med school just because they have the grades for it, they are not selceted in any other way (interest, 'talent' or whatsoever).
Second we don't pay for schooling. It used to be just a small administration fee for less than 1000 Euro per semester. Allthough this has changed and many chools charge 500 Euros nowadays, it is still an administartion fee and does not benefit the tutoring.
Therefore the professors teach you to their best, but they are not your personal tutors. You need to learn and inspire yourself. It's you would needs to the work and no professor, teacher or whatsoever will do it for you or take you by the hand. And I see nothing wrong with that.
But still every profesor you approach and ask for advise will give it too you, offer the interrested a position at his lab or an internship in his clinic.
And there is one more difference that probably plays a role too. We go right from high school into med school. Many still need to find their way in live and need to find out that maybe medicine is not what they expected it to be. That contributes to the drop out rates too.
Still in the curiculum of what they teach and the standart of medicine that they teach the german shools stand up to the US.
 
Hi!

I have attended the medical school in Mainz for 6 semesters. I grew up in Germany and now moved to the US (I married a soldier). I am thinking of applying in the US and hope to get in.

I do not know how the application process in Mainz is for international students but I could answer questiosn regarding the curriculum, living standards etc. So feel free to send me a message if you have any questions.

Mainz is a very nice city and it is a lot cheaper to live there, compared to Munich and Frankfurt. Of course, it is Europe, so everything is still very expensive. however, the tuition was only about 180 Euro per semester and I spent around 100-200 more on books. The pre-medical courses (before the "Physikum" were very theoretical und you aminly had to memorize all the details. Most professors were very helpful although there are some "scary" ones who seem rude and a little weird. I knew many international students, mainly from israel, who did not speak German very fluently. Of course, it required a lot more work to be prepared but they still did pretty good. And if you fail a test, you get the chacne to retake it a few weeks later without any major consequences.

People in Mainz are also used to Americans being around due to the Army bases in the area. So you will find that people are a little friendlier than in some other places (at least my husband found this to be true).

Well, if anybody has a question about medical school in Germany, I'ld be happy to help out.
 
is late 20's or early thirties unusual ages for freshmen students in medical schools in germany?
 
Regina Fischer (Bobby's mother) was in her forties when she graduated from medical school in the former east Germany.

When I was at FU Berlin in the early '90s, I met a number of medical students in their thirties. Some had been political prisoners in the east, thus accounting for the late start.

Not sure how common the older medical students are, but certainly not unusual.
 
Generally, not an insignificant portion of med school graduates in Germany are in fact in their thirties (i.e. 30-33), this is mostly because of the relatively strict admission process which requires a pretty competitive GPA (NC) or alternatively, having accumulated several years of "waiting time" for a spot (typically 4-5 yrs), so that many applicants often did something else (i.e. working as paramedics or even something completely unrelated) during that period before finally enrolling in med school.
Given that most med school applicants graduate from school at 18-20, adding ~5 years of waiting time for less competitive candidates and about 7 years for med school itself, will typically result in a graduation age of approx. 30 years, +/- 3 yrs

HTH
 
For foreign students studying med school in Germany, how long was the wait time for admissions when u applied? Even though numerus clausus is now in effect in Germany I do understand that this doesnt apply towards foreign students, and some people did get admission by applying straight to the university.

Did you wait for a year or two to get an admission from a Med school in Germany?
 
Did you wait for a year or two to get an admission from a Med school in Germany?

My understanding is that the waiting game only applies to 'EU domestic' candidates (meaning you graduated from high-school within the EU space) getting their slots through the centralized application system. If you apply as a 'educational foreigner' to the universities directly, you get a yay or nay without the option to get on the waiting list (you do have the option though to increasing your chances for the next semester by upping your GPA through further studies or by improving your command of the german language).
 
Well i am a Medical student in Magdeburg. And one of the few Medical foreignstudent from Africa here in Germany.
Magdeburg University is a young university and to say the truth if not the best in Medicine then one of the best. First of all i got accepted in some of the so called top universities here in Germany but i was only impressed with this one University that is studentFriendly with caring Proffesors.
This is one kind of University where u can meet the Proffesors at any time of the day you wish.....They are not Busy if it comes to there Students. One thing with this University is ,that it is very hard to get the Scheins in oder to do ur firt general exams but once u have these little certificates as i may call then ,then u are a hundred percent sure to pass ur Exams with flying colours.
At my university a lot of reaserch is being done in areas of Immunity, Neurology and many other sectors.In the 2 year of study i have been exposed to how i can apply the theoretical part of my learning to the reality that mean it more of theory as i have read in the Forum. Universities like Freiburg, Heidelberg and so on are also good but for my case i take Magdeburg for foreignstudents to be the better one.
 
Hi,

if any of you guys is actually going to study in Germany, this book might be a good start to learn medical german:

Deutsch für Mediziner (English for doctors) by Schenk Verlag

It's a book recommended to students or nurses whose native language is other than German. It helps you develop language skills concerning history-taking, examination etc and covers all major medical specialties.
A friend of mine who is spanish and also studies in Germany told me it helped him a lot (pronounciation, self-study...).

I hope you'll find your way through german bureaucracy to be able to study there.;)
 
Hi everybody,

if I've got it right some Int American students obtain a BA degree at an American college and apply directly to German Medical schools therby overgoing the "ZVS" selection procedure that is used in Germany.
However, my situation is kind of the reverse of that. I went to a German high school, did my BA in Psychology in the Netherlands and I will graduate this year with a Master's degree in Neuropsychology at a reputable Dutch university.
After I got the American permanent Residency (green card) last year, I was thinking about pursuing a degree at an American medical school. However, every medical school that I looked up requires a BA or at least 60 credits from an American college. I have already invested 4 years of my life into going to university and really don't feel like starting from zero again.:eek:
Is there any possibility, how I could surround the 60-90 undergraduate credits from an American college criterion required by medical schools?:confused:
I hope somebody can advise me!
 
Does anybody know if Pharmacy is taught in English or German if one is to get a degree in pharmacy in a German University? Does it take 3 yrs as well?
 
Does anybody know if Pharmacy is taught in English or German if one is to get a degree in pharmacy in a German University? Does it take 3 yrs as well?

Safe assumption would be that pharmacy is being taught in german. The only degrees taught in english are some MBAs and some engineering degrees.
 
I just finished up med school at the LMU (on of the two schools in Munich). I can definately recommend it- it has some negatives (as all schools do) but in general I am very happy with the education that I received and Munich is a great city!!!

good luck with your decision
Hello,m from India
Can u please provide me info as to how can I get in a med college in germany,What is admission procedure,admission requirements,last date to apply,etc.????
 
Hi,

I am going to apply to study medicine in Germany (starting summer semester 2008) - What do you guys think are the best programs?
I am probably applying to Mainz, Dresden, Charite, Freiburg and Heidelberg, what do you guys think?

Hello,m from India
Can u please provide me info as to how can I get in a med college in germany ,Sweden,etc.What is admission procedure,admission requirements,last date to apply,etc.????
 
Please check the previous posts; there have been other threads on this very same topic. I'm sure you'll come across some important stuff.
 
hi everyone, i'm from indonesia
just finished my MD here
is it true that if i'm taking specialization in german i dont have to pay tuition fees? i also interested in doing research, which one is it? the master degree or the PhD?
Thank u for the reply :cool:
 
That's right..you don't need to pay. It's called a PhD or a postgraduate doctoral program.
 
Top