Med students have it easier...?

[1Path]

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Oh, and 1Path, I really wish you'd stop telling me how grad schools work. One of my best friends [we're talking groomsman at my wedding this summer] is in the #1 PhD program in the country [if not the world] for what he does. He received all the fancy research scholarships in undergrad, etc. etc. etc. He's funded out the a$$ in grad school, he's published, etc. etc. etc. I fully understand the whole process involved with top grad programs.

MS? PhD?

I'm not trying to waste my time telling you what grad school is about. But I find your position as "watcher" of the PhD funny when folks can claim the same thing of a person with an MD and be totally dismissed for not having experiecned ALL the pains of matriculating, earning, and using the degree. There are no vicarious MD's on SDN!🙄

 

[Wizard of Oz]

🙄 🙄 This argument is ridiculous

AGREE! 👍

In all honesty, I don't care that much about which is harder. I left grad school because I didn't want to become a Ph.D. scientist anymore.

I can't believe that I got myself into the middle of this...

Honestly, I know a lot of postdocs. None of them has ever said some grade they got impacted their research ability. True, I'll grant you that I am not on the east or west coast where I'm sure that everything is more competative.

Did my grad school grades matter to med school adcoms? Nope. They all told me so. Grad grades do not correlate with success in med school, so they told me.

Lackluster med school app with a 3.5 GPA and a 90th percentile? Yeah sure. It was good enough to get me some money and one of the first spots at my state school out here in the sticks where we don't have top research programs (sarcasm). That's enough for me. I'm an old man, I just don't care that much about what is harder or better. I just didn't want to be a scientist anymore.

Here is ALL that I am saying. THIS is my only point: Right now, I spend a LOT more time studying in medical school than I ever did working on my Ph.D. That's it. Easier, harder, less coffee, fewer dates, better earning potential, whatever. It just doesn't matter to me anymore. Like I said, I'm too old.

As for this entire thread, I think that is the take home message. People, in general do what they want to do within their means. In general, more people want to become MD's than any sort of other "doctor." You can factor in admissions seats and average GPA and thinking ability and tendency to acquire a spouse, etc., but the debate here is moot. It's just part of our society that more people are going to want to be physicians. I don't agree that such SHOULD be the case or anything like that. It's just the way people think.

 

[1Path]

I also agree that a lot of the points don't matter much to the average med student, grad student, or med/grad student but I doubt that what's the OP was thinkng in starting this thread. I have VERY strong memories of seeing PhD applicants who also admitted being CURRENT applicants to med school, interiewing at a top 3 research school .😕

So what's the point? A PhD program is a terrible idea for a back up plan to med school, especially at a top notch school unless you are truly committed to being a Scientist because contrary to popular belief, earning a PhD isn't "easy".

 

[kkc620]

i know that this is a somewhat different topic but i am unable to start my own thread at the moment. i have the physiology shelf tomorrow morning and was wondering if anybody has any recommendations on what topics i should focus my studying on. any help would be appreciated.

 

[Pinkertinkle]

You'll notice that I'm responding to his statement that he's never heard of any vet students saying their backup plan is medical school. Which for me, isn't true, most pre-vets I know say that med school is their back up (whether or not that's a wise thing is up for debate). So I'm just pointing out that just because his experience with pre-vets leads him to think one thing... that isn't true across the board.

Though I notice you didn't jump on his anecdotal evidence, just mine. Perhaps because he agrees with you... Hmmm....

I didn't argue against his point of view because there's statistical evidence to support med harder than vet point of view. However, I do agree that his hearsay adds as little to this argument as your hearsay.

Bottom line, please provide some statistical evidence supporting your point of view.

 

[Anastasis]

I didn't argue against his point of view because there's statistical evidence to support med harder than vet point of view. However, I do agree that his hearsay adds as little to this argument as your hearsay.

Bottom line, please provide some statistical evidence supporting your point of view.

Did I say Vet was harder? No.

And there's evidence to support that med is harder to get into, not that med is harder altogether.

 

[Pinkertinkle]

And there's evidence to support that med is harder to get into, not that med is harder altogether.

Great, that's just the myth I wanted to dispell.
Vet is not harder to get into than med, despite what veterinary school's pamphlets like to claim.

Now if there's evidence to support vet school being harder than med school, I'd like to see it.

 

[45408]

When you commit to a pet you are committing to all of the health issues that go along with them, just as much as if you adopted a child. I recently had an issue with my cat that might have required a $3000 surgery, and I was more than prepared to pay that price even while living on my student loans because he is my responsibility and it was a condition that could be cured through surgery with no impact on his quality of life.

I disagree. I decided to have my chinchilla euthanized when I found out it was going to cost at least $600 to start caring for her, with no guarantees that she'd get better. I think your pets should be treated humanely, but I don't think they obligate you to shell out thousands (of course, if you want to, be my guest).

 

[DoctorFunk]

I disagree. I decided to have my chinchilla euthanized when I found out it was going to cost at least $600 to start caring for her, with no guarantees that she'd get better. I think your pets should be treated humanely, but I don't think they obligate you to shell out thousands (of course, if you want to, be my guest).

I think the difference between our situations comes in the prognosis given with the condition. My cat had a simple urinary blockage that could easily be corrected through surgery if it was refractory to the special diet they prescribed to us. He is also a young guy and probably has another 15 years of life ahead of him. Had the vet told me that they could do a $3000 procedure with no guarantees or idea of how successful it might be and there was also a cost associated with upkeep, I certainly might have reconsidered, as I might have if the cat was older and already on its last legs.

 

[Azawakh]

I didn't argue against his point of view because there's statistical evidence to support med harder than vet point of view. However, I do agree that his hearsay adds as little to this argument as your hearsay.

Bottom line, please provide some statistical evidence supporting your point of view.

Unless there is scientific research that has accessed the difficulty of entering medical school versus PhD programs versus veterinary school then no one, yourself included has any "evidence" to claim that one program is more selective or difficult.

Citing websites hardly qualifies as hard evidence. It's anecdotal as well. You are interpreting data out of the context for which it was intended. It's not grounds for comparison. I am surprised they don't the teach basics of statistical analysis in medical school.

 

[Pinkertinkle]

Unless there is scientific research that has accessed the difficulty of entering medical school versus PhD programs versus veterinary school then no one, yourself included has any "evidence" to claim that one program is more selective or difficult.

Siting websites hardly qualifies as hard evidence. It's anecdotal as well. You are interpreting data out of the context for which it was intended. It's not grounds for comparison. I am surprised they don't the teach basics of statistical analysis in medical school.

I have more evidence than that joke of a myth-buster flyer you posted. If anyone jumps the gun on claiming one's harder it's vet schools and their inferiority complex. I'm surprised they don't teach the basics of spelling to you wherever you go.

 

[Azawakh]

You're arrogant and and insolent and I have an inferiority complex. Evidence is evidence and anecdotal is anecdotal whether it's from an AVMA website or out of the garbage can.

 

[Pinkertinkle]

You're arrogant and and insolent and I have an inferiority complex. Evidence is evidence and anecdotal is anecdotal whether it's from an AVMA website or out of the garbage can.

If you think applicants:seats ratio is an anecdote, you are wrong.

 

[Azawakh]

Using that airtight logic I suppose it's more difficult to become a Bloomfield, CT firefighter.

Opps I guess you're right.

 

[Pinkertinkle]

Using that airtight logic I suppose it's more difficult to become a Bloomfield, CT firefighter.

Opps I guess you're right.

It's the logic that your flyer used. So you do agree there's no evidence to suggest vet is harder to get into than med?

 

[Azawakh]

It's the logic that your flyer used. So you do agree there's no evidence to suggest vet is harder to get into than med?

I agree there is no evidence that vet is harder to get into than med or visa versa.

We can make anecdotal arguments either way but until there is a scientific method based research to say definitively one way or the other, we don't really know.

Either way I would be elated. I respect physicians, dentists, veterinarians, and nurses and secretaries as well. All perform important services and I think medical professionals (dentists, physicians, vets) tend to be haughty which is unfortunate.

 

[Pinkertinkle]

I agree there is no evidence that vet is harder to get into than med or visa versa.

I'll agree with you there then.

 

[Wizard of Oz]

So what's the point? A PhD program is a terrible idea for a back up plan to med school, especially at a top notch school unless you are truly committed to being a Scientist because contrary to popular belief, earning a PhD isn't "easy".

I can certainly agree with you there! 😀

 

[Azawakh]

I'll agree with you there then.

Glad we could find some common ground.

Kind regards.

 

[45408]

I think the difference between our situations comes in the prognosis given with the condition. My cat had a simple urinary blockage that could easily be corrected through surgery if it was refractory to the special diet they prescribed to us. He is also a young guy and probably has another 15 years of life ahead of him. Had the vet told me that they could do a $3000 procedure with no guarantees or idea of how successful it might be and there was also a cost associated with upkeep, I certainly might have reconsidered, as I might have if the cat was older and already on its last legs.

but you did avoid the $3000 surgery?

 

[tncekm]

or not.

 

[DoctorFunk]

but you did avoid the $3000 surgery?

Oh hellz yes I avoided the surgery. Little guy loves his new food, and his pH has finally been normalized.

 

[vtucci]

law school was much easier than medical school.

 

[freelow]

No way dental school is harder than medical school...We had a dental school professor give us a lecture in histo in which he crammed 7 dental school lectures into one powerpoint in 2 hrs of lect. I swear all together it was over 400 slides. Any 1st year at LSUNO can tell you about that.