Mid-Tier MD/PhDs?

[geeyouknit]

Hey guys and gals,

Everyone says to apply to a few "dream" schools and mainly mid-tier and lower-tier.
I was wondering what would a list of mid-tier MD/Phd schools include or how would you find them? I'm not trying to insult any schools obviously; I'm speaking about difficulty of admissions. Say if Hopkins, UCSF, WUSTL etc are top tier, what are mid-tiers in difficulty of getting in?

Are these mainly the non-MSTP schools or are there MSTP schools you would consider "mid-tier" as well?

Edit: Also, since I'm not expecting a full list, how would you go about classifying a school as mid-tier? Is it just GPA/MCAT requirements?

Thanks for your help.

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[red doctober]

Hey guys and gals,

Everyone says to apply to a few "dream" schools and mainly mid-tier and lower-tier.
I was wondering what would a list of mid-tier MD/Phd schools include or how would you find them? I'm not trying to insult any schools obviously; I'm speaking about difficulty of admissions. Say if Hopkins, UCSF, WUSTL etc are top tier, what are mid-tiers in difficulty of getting in?

Are these mainly the non-MSTP schools or are there MSTP schools you would consider "mid-tier" as well?

Edit: Also, since I'm not expecting a full list, how would you go about classifying a school as mid-tier? Is it just GPA/MCAT requirements?

Thanks for your help.

Any MSTP is going to be crazy competitive, but I'm not going to argue that Hopkins is just as easy to get into as say UIC. I'd say look at US News' research ranking of medical schools and when making your list make sure that you get a good spread in terms of their rank. MSAR might give you a general idea in terms of numbers, but those include all programs that give the MD degree.

 

[K31]

There are absolutely tiers of competitiveness in MSTPs. It is usually a self-fulfilling prophecy to be honest--by and large, the top places have a combination of prestige and a desirable location and are therefore going to be able to attract higher-quality faculty and students. Thus it is going to be more competitive at the Ivy Leagues than Southern or Midwestern programs.

While flawed, I think the US News research med school rankings are pretty good for stratifying MD/PhD programs--they have a significant component of reputation as well as research funding. They're almost certainly better for this purpose than for ranking medical schools.

 

[geeyouknit]

There are absolutely tiers of competitiveness in MSTPs. It is usually a self-fulfilling prophecy to be honest--by and large, the top places have a combination of prestige and a desirable location and are therefore going to be able to attract higher-quality faculty and students. Thus it is going to be more competitive at the Ivy Leagues than Southern or Midwestern programs.

While flawed, I think the US News research med school rankings are pretty good for stratifying MD/PhD programs--they have a significant component of reputation as well as research funding. They're almost certainly better for this purpose than for ranking medical schools.

The USNWR thing has come up before. Would you consider top 25 or top 30 to be top tier? Where would your cut-off be?

Thanks.

 

[kfre2435]

Hey guys and gals,

Everyone says to apply to a few "dream" schools and mainly mid-tier and lower-tier.
I was wondering what would a list of mid-tier MD/Phd schools include or how would you find them? I'm not trying to insult any schools obviously; I'm speaking about difficulty of admissions. Say if Hopkins, UCSF, WUSTL etc are top tier, what are mid-tiers in difficulty of getting in?

Are these mainly the non-MSTP schools or are there MSTP schools you would consider "mid-tier" as well?

Edit: Also, since I'm not expecting a full list, how would you go about classifying a school as mid-tier? Is it just GPA/MCAT requirements?

Thanks for your help.

Personally, I would look at the percentage of applicants per interview slots to gauge competitiveness. I would also look at MCAT/GPA and see where you fall. Safety schools will differ from person to person. It all depends on your stats compared to the average.

Here's a list I posted earlier in the year to help.

 

[red doctober]

The USNWR thing has come up before. Would you consider top 25 or top 30 to be top tier? Where would your cut-off be?

Thanks.

It depends on what you're looking for. Given if your definition is hardest to get into, I'd say top-10 USNWR would be like a plateau for hardest schools. The averages for some of those are pretty ridiculous. I think UCSF advertises a 3.9, 37 average for their MSTP class. Hardly any program gives out their stats, but I'd be surprised if a 11-20 USNWR ranked MSTP has an average that high. It's still going to be really high, mind you, but not that high.

 

[Fencer]

The following are non-MSTP MD/PhD programs with more than 30 MD/PhD students and within CTSA (NIH core grant) institutions:

Boston University, U. Massachusetts, VCU, USC, Penn State, UT SOM San Antonio, UT SOM Houston, Oregon Health, UT Medical Branch, and Utah.

These are the institutions that within the next 5-7 years, they have the greatest chance of becoming MSTPs.

Why?

CTSA = research intensive environment for faculty
30 students = critical mass of MD/PhD students

Notice that 3 of them are within Univ. of Texas institutions (AMCAS MD/PhD programs) which are financially stable and in a state that is pumping 1 billion for Cancer research over 10 years.

My 2 cents...