If the quality of education (clinical + didactical) is the sole question, which one would be better? Not considering military life-style/service obligation, what are some pros/cons of each? (especially ortho/omfs/aegd) thanks! 
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military vs civilian residency
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If the quality of education (clinical + didactical) is the sole question, which one would be better? Not considering military life-style/service obligation, what are some pros/cons of each? (especially ortho/omfs/aegd) thanks!
1) You will make about $75-85k/yr during residency in the Army (regular Army pay). If you were to do a civilian program you would either pay money (depending on the program) or make a stipend between $25k-50k/yr depending on the specialty.
2) Higher acceptance rates - I believe your chances of getting in will be higher in the military (any branch) then in the civilian world
3) Procedures - your procedures are not dictated by the ability of the patient to pay. Especially true in OMFS where you can do cosmetic procedures more frequently (Lafort, rhinoplasty, etc...) that would be more difficult to find in the civilian world. Same is true with the AEGD and other programs. Your treatment plan is not dicatated by $$
4) Military programs are accredited by the ADA just like the other programs
5) Board certification rates tend to be higher in the military than in private practice. That may be because there are financial incentives for passing the boards - or just that they prepare you better.
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AEGD I would say is way better in the military because all your mentors are specialists. There aren't nearly as many AEGDs as there are GPRs on the civilian side, and the GPRs tend to be run by general dentists. Many of the AEGDs I have heard of are also staffed by mostly general dentists. So huge advantage there for the military. The pay advantage of the military would be wiped out once the civilian out of the residency and making twice as much as the military dentist. The acceptance rate for the Army AEGDs is very high, not sure about civilian AEGDs or GPRs.
Ortho would be better at a civilian program because the military training program is geared more towards adult ortho. The military program does get the residents experience with teenagers, but not to the extent that a civilian program does. In my opinion this is huge because civilian orthodontists treat very few adults in comparison to the number of teenagers they treat. Military orthodontists don't see dependents in the US, so the majority of their patients are adults. It is also very hard to get into the Army ortho program, and I imagine the Navy and Air Force programs as well. I know of three different people that all had AEGD training and four years of active duty service that could not get into the Army ortho program. Essentially to get into either a civilian or military program your resume has to be top notch.
There is an OMFS thread in which ArmyJawBreaker details Army OMFS very well. I would check it out and ask him any questions you still have.
Ortho would be better at a civilian program because the military training program is geared more towards adult ortho. The military program does get the residents experience with teenagers, but not to the extent that a civilian program does. In my opinion this is huge because civilian orthodontists treat very few adults in comparison to the number of teenagers they treat. Military orthodontists don't see dependents in the US, so the majority of their patients are adults. It is also very hard to get into the Army ortho program, and I imagine the Navy and Air Force programs as well. I know of three different people that all had AEGD training and four years of active duty service that could not get into the Army ortho program. Essentially to get into either a civilian or military program your resume has to be top notch.
There is an OMFS thread in which ArmyJawBreaker details Army OMFS very well. I would check it out and ask him any questions you still have.
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I don't know about that statement. If you look at an Army dentist...making about 85k/yr. They will make this in the 2 years of residency, then in the 2 years following...then about 170/yr after that with a multiyear retention bonus. If we look at a 6 year layout, that is 680k...or about 115k/yr
In the civilian...I am not sure what they make in a residency...let's say 40k while in residency for 2 yrs is 80k...then about 125k for each of the next 4 years (again...looking at a 6 year plan)...you get about 580k...which is less than 100k/yr..
I know these numbers are pretty ballpark estimates...but even adding/taking away some here and there...it is going to be pretty close...
As far as training..you may be right about ortho...but that would be the only residency I would agree with...AEGD are better, hands down...endo does more endo tx than any civilian program...OMS, Pros..perio...all are top notch in the military...
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Your straight out of school pay is about $10k too high, the $170 with the retention bonus is way too high. Right out of school one would make about $77k if you do the math using $1500 as BAH. Doing the 2 year at Ft Hood, BAH would be $1080 per month, at Hawaii it would be $2319, Ft Bragg is $1230. The person right out of school is far more likely to end up at Hood or Bragg than Hawaii, so there is no way they are making $85k per year, they are probably making $75k. I didn't even break $80k in any of my four years in the military, much less come close to the $120k plus $50k retention bonus at year 4 you say he could make. Also, after a 2 year AEGD I would think that one would be making a lot more than $125k per year, especially in this case since the original poster would be getting an extra $30k from the Guard. Before I started residency I was on pace to make $150k/yr working at a crappy Medicaid mill practice that only paid me 28% of production and I was doing mostly operative and exams with only a few endos and a few crowns. If the person were to buy into a practice it opens the doors to make $200k/yr+. Everyone career military guy on here posts these "attainable" salaries that one can make once they are in for a number of years and get a retention bonus, but the truth is that very few people that enter the military stay beyond their minimum commitment or residency payback and ever see those salaries or retention bonuses, that is why there is a lot of CPTs and COLs in the Army but very few MAJs and LTCs. When I was in my AEGD the director said the retention rate for CPTs after their initial 3-4 years was up was 5% and that his goal was to have one of the 8 residents stay beyond their minimum commitment (he was successful as one guy stayed in to do a specialty residency). I am guessing that the retention rate is better now that the war is slowing down and the economy is bad, but I'd love to know what the current retention rate is.
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I said that the military AEGD was way better, so I guess you agreed with me on that one too
It's a little ridiculous to say that the Army residencies are the best, you do more surgeries, more endo cases, etc than any civilian program. There is no way to back up claims like that, and while everyone has a right to their opinion, in the end all they are are opinions. No one is going to talk bad about the programs they are in because it lowers their value as well as that programs. For example: Army endo residents at Bragg do see a ton of patients, because Bragg is a large post with high endo needs patients. The residents at Gordon don't do nearly as many as at Bragg because Gordon is a much smaller post with a patient population that needs much less endo than Bragg. The Gordon program has a reputation as being better didactically than Bragg and doing a lot more lit review. The main downside of doing endo residency in the Army that I heard is that they don't get as many super hard cases because their patient population is primarily in their lower 20s. A nice perk is that you get a full-time assistant, while most civilian programs share 1 or 2 assistants among all the residents. I had an endo mentor in the Army from both programs, they were both very open about the strengths and weaknesses of their program with me because I was looking into doing the Army endo residency. So to say that at an Army endo residency you will do more endo than any civilian residency is misleading. One of the civilian programs I interviewed at had a resident that did over 700 RCTs in residency, and their average per resident was around 500. I would have been happy to do an endo residency at either Bragg or Gordon, because I knew they were both good programs and I knew the strengths and weaknesses of both. I didn't just go off a post on a message board saying that Army residencies are better than any civilian one. I am guessing the original poster was looking for concrete reasons why military or civilian programs are better, not blanket statements of the military programs being better than any civilian program. My point would apply to other residencies as well. It is tough to compare military residencies to civilian ones because there are so many civilian ones and they vary widely in quality. I think it would be more helpful and productive to say that "X" military residency is poor/good/great and then list why. It would be great to have a thread that listed each military residency and the strengths and weaknesses of each.
