Minimal ortho research during medical school?

[Contr0lz]

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[agiraffe999]

I'm a nobody but I feel like some PIs would be impressed but then raise an eyebrow seeing you didn't publish anything in the last 4 years. A few pubs here and there wouldn't hurt and still show that you are interested. I'd wait to see if someone else has any real insight. Also that research resume is amazing, good job to you!

 

[Dr. Doctor MD]

Hey all! Excited incoming M1 here!!!

I'm a kind of a late bloomer who recently decided on medicine (although I was a little interested years back). After I mastered out of an engineering PhD to pursue medicine, I spent the next two years working in a clinical/translational lab at an academic hospital, where I did research at the interface of artificial intelligence (AI) and orthopedics. Initially, I didn't pick this lab because I was interested in ortho, but because I had the opportunity to do AI work in a medical field - AI being a bread n' butter skillset of mine.

After essentially killing myself in the lab over 2 years (>6500 hrs), I co-authored 35+ peer-reviewed pubs (6+, 1st author) in some great ortho & radiology journals and will co-author another 10+ (5+, 1st author) in the next 8 months. Also, >100 poster and podium presentations at international ortho conferences (total research experiences ~150-170).

Now, my question is: over the next four years, if I am aiming for a residency at a top ortho place like HSS, can I chill in medical school and focus on other the dimensions of a competitive app such as high Step 2, AOA, clerkship honors or would I still need to demonstrate a consistent publication track record all throughout medical school? I'm in my mid-20s now, and I want to do as much social stuff with my peers while working just enough to achieve the three aforementioned items.

Has anyone been in a remotely similar situation or have insight from PDs regarding an applicant's publication track record?

Also, I apologize to anyone who may feel this is a humblebrag; that is not my intention. I put in rough numbers to illustrate magnitude.

You will be more than fine putting research on the backburner throughout medical school. You arguably have the most research heavy background of probably any orthopedic surgery applicant in the last 10 year. Sure, it would look very weird if you never did any more research at all the next 4 years, but even then you'd probably still be fine.

My recommendation is to keep up a small/manageable amount of research for the next 3 years, but focus primarily on grades, AOA, social life, networking, etc.

And seriously congratulations on all your hard-work, you have a very impressive background!

 

[slowthai]

@OrthoTraumaMD

 

[Contr0lz]

I'm a nobody but I feel like some PIs would be impressed but then raise an eyebrow seeing you didn't publish anything in the last 4 years. A few pubs here and there wouldn't hurt and still show that you are interested. I'd wait to see if someone else has any real insight. Also that research resume is amazing, good job to you!

Thank you! I would still try to publish a few papers here and there to make some strong connections with faculty for LORs, but there is no way I would be able to keep the track record up in medical school. At the same time, I don't want PDs to think I was lazy or disinterested.

 

[Lawpy]

Looks like surgery + AI stuff is the way to go to maximize the pub count @Spetzler-Martin

 

[AzBasRad]

I know of a person from a mid tier MD school who matched HSS. Had >50 papers (mostly fluff) published + in press, including AOA, strong clinical grades, LOR. Your research sound very legit and cutting edge, so you already have the box checked. Get excellent grades, LORs, crush your away rotations and you will be a shoe in for top 5.

 

[FindersFee5]

Looks like surgery + AI stuff is the way to go to maximize the pub count @Spetzler-Martin

Alternate skillsets in medical research have always been the way to go. There are a ton of med student chart review monkeys just as good and hardworking as you, but if you can bring another skill (ex: AI, database analysis, graphic design skill), residents will actively seek you out to be on projects with them.

 

[Dr. Anonymouss]

Honestly that’s incredible. These are just my 2 cents because I am a student myself, not a program director. I think you should still do research, but to an extremely light degree. Publish 2-3 papers while in medical school just to show you are still involved. By no means make it a priority, but I would still add a couple more over the next 3 years just to show continued interest and involvement in the field.

As someone else mentioned, this is also a great way to meet mentors who will advocate for you which is an extremely important aspect to ones application.

 

[Yhwach]

Idk much but i feel like you are good. Research can be deemphasized for you. Just publish 1-3 papers I guess.

 

[Contr0lz]

Lol. I don't think he's met me. I'm coming for you Contr0lz. Although, I'm applying nsg though, so probably not.

I know a current nsg resident who applied with 70 papers. I might be able to match or slightly pass it. I currently work with a spine fellow who jokes about how easy the peer review process is for ortho and neurosurgery. I'm not sure why it's that easy though.

In terms of OP, I've heard that some programs will see through the PhD and he or she will not necessarily be viewed on equal footing as someone who went on the more traditional route

Come at me bro XD.

After publishing all of these papers, I've come to learn along the way that, even if your topic is not particularly novel (as a whole) within the field, most of the better known Q1 journals will still accept your work provided you have (1) good sample sizes with respectable statistical power, (2) written well (concisely) with adequate citations, (3) pretty images (which is a sharp contrast to the many published papers that are littered with only text and tables ad infinitum), and (4) some aspect of clinically useful originality. Most peer-reviewers aren't out to get you and if the only problems with your studies are related to either novelty or sample size (but hopefully not both) then they will be hard-pressed to reject you right away and are likely to ask you to augment the paper with additional data in a major/minor revision. If these criteria can be met, then the peer-review process can be quite easy (not with best of the best journals in a field per say, but most of the well-known, reputable ones that PDs/residents/fellows will instantly recognize).

Also, I mastered out, so only MS in ChemE :/

 

[OrthoTraumaMD]

I'm a nobody but I feel like some PIs would be impressed but then raise an eyebrow seeing you didn't publish anything in the last 4 years. A few pubs here and there wouldn't hurt and still show that you are interested. I'd wait to see if someone else has any real insight. Also that research resume is amazing, good job to you!

Agree with this.
Also, HSS is really not the end-all of residencies. Go somewhere where you’re not constantly competing with fellows.

 

[OrthoTraumaMD]

I know of a person from a mid tier MD school who matched HSS. Had >50 papers (mostly fluff) published + in press, including AOA, strong clinical grades, LOR. Your research sound very legit and cutting edge, so you already have the box checked. Get excellent grades, LORs, crush your away rotations and you will be a shoe in for top 5.

Personally I find this “research” and the increase in these useless papers that clutter the literature ridiculous. I’ve known residents who did tons of papers yet were terrible ethically and physically. I would take a hard, honest worker with average grades and no research over a well-published dipsh*t. The reality of post-residency is that unless you’re planning on an insane academic career (and even most of us in academia don’t do major research), the vast majority of residents go on to practice and never publish anything, and they are perfectly good surgeons.

 

[Contr0lz]

Agree with this.
Also, HSS is really not the end-all of residencies. Go somewhere where you’re not constantly competing with fellows.

It's funny you say that. At the place I worked, both the fellows and the residents competed with the attendings, essentially shadowing them for days on end.