Minimum GPA question

[ABridgeTooFar]

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Howdy,

First, I'd like to thank you for taking the time to read this.

I would like to know if the minimum GPAs listed for DO schools is actually a "hard" minimum or a "soft" one.

I'm applying to Nova Southeastern, Des Moines, PCOM, UMDNJ, and Western. Of those, as far as I can tell, UMDNJ, Nova, and Des Moines have 3.0 cGPA and sGPA minimum requirements.

I have a good cGPA but my sGPA is around ~2.85, but that is directly caused by my inability to perform academically due to a serious injury I sustained and was affected by for two trimesters [that happened to occur when I was exclusively taking pre-med classes... FML]. As in, if those two trimesters were excluded, my sGPA would probably be somewhere near a 3.2. I explained this in my personal statement.

Will the aforementioned schools even consider me with my sGPA or will they automatically screen me out? If it helps, I went to a top three university and have a 30 on the MCAT.

Thanks for your help; I really appreciate it.

-A Bridge Too Far

 

[Iliketoytles]

Generally, GPA minimums are solid where if you don't meet the minimum GPA requirement, the school won't send you a secondary. Unfortunately, even though you feel you have a legitimate reason for your GPA drop, I don't think schools care.

However, people who have been slightly below have received secondaries. Maybe they could chime in on this. If you get screened out pre-secondary, you might be able to call the school or email them to indirectly "beg" for one. Doesn't hurt. Application season is certainly not for the prideful.

 

[UpwardTrend]

What are you Sci grades? Do you have anything below a C in the sgpa? You may want to retake a science or two until you break the 3.0 range. Is there any reason you couldn't switch around some courses to get a science or two in this spring (before app)?

 

[ksmajmudar]

That people still get in with 2.95 sGPAs is a testament to the fact that this is not a hard rule. I had a 3.08 sGPA, and I got a secondary (and accepted) to a school that posted a "minimum" 3.25 sGPA on their website.

Go ahead and apply! Don't fret too much about numbers, show your strengths in other aspects of your application. Good luck!

(just to clarify: you're applying next cycle, right?)

 

[Prncssbuttercup]

I was below the KCUMB limits, but they state they may give secondaries anyway. You should speak to the school admin people directly and ask. You might be able to say 'special circumstances' but a friend of mine had cancer and failed an entire semester and none of the schools gave a rats ass...

 

[ABridgeTooFar]

Thanks for your input, guys. My app was recently verified so I'll see what happens. Also, to answer a previous question, I've already graduated so I can't take any more classes. My poor grades were not in pre-reqs, so it wasnt necessary to retake the classes. Thanks again.

 

[FutureDrB]

Thanks for your input, guys. My app was recently verified so I'll see what happens. Also, to answer a previous question, I've already graduated so I can't take any more classes. My poor grades were not in pre-reqs, so it wasnt necessary to retake the classes. Thanks again.

Why could you not retake classes even though you've graduated?
Hopefully you get in somewhere, but if not, you need to retake the classes you did poorly in, even though they weren't pre-reqs.

 

[emtthink]

Thanks for your input, guys. My app was recently verified so I'll see what happens. Also, to answer a previous question, I've already graduated so I can't take any more classes. My poor grades were not in pre-reqs, so it wasnt necessary to retake the classes. Thanks again.

Unfortunately this late in the game your chances for acceptance are low. But your 30 on the MCAT, will help you a ton🙂

 

[DrWily]

Thanks for your input, guys. My app was recently verified so I'll see what happens. Also, to answer a previous question, I've already graduated so I can't take any more classes. My poor grades were not in pre-reqs, so it wasnt necessary to retake the classes. Thanks again.

You need some edumacation and I'm here to deal it to you straight.

You are very late in the cycle now, especially for your sGPA. It's not impossible, and not unheard of, but your chances are dramatically reduced. Just be prepared.

You can retake classes at your old school, or at a different school. It doesn't matter where you retake them at, as long as the new class is very similar to the class being replaced (has to be equal or greater semester hours). You want to retake grades that are C or lower in order to raise that sGPA up to competitive levels. Doesn't matter if they are in pre-reqs or not. A C is a C is a C for your GPA. DO THIS

Chances are you're not going to get in this cycle. Good news? You can apply again May/June. Get your application in ASAP with everything (transcripts, etc) submitted by June 1st. Early is KEY for Underdogs (you are an underdog with your GPA). If you apply early, you will get lots of love and interview invites due to your 30 MCAT.

Your school choices should be wide and broad. You need to apply to more than 5 schools with a low sGPA. You also applied to probably the top D.O. schools in the nation as well with high averages in GPA and MCAT. While what happened to you is unfortunate, a lot of schools will just look at your numbers and not really care. They have tons of applicants who don't have unfortunate events and score high GPA/MCAT. You need to make yourself stand out in other ways to show the schools that they are missing out if they don't invite you to an interview.

tl;dr take it from me, 2.96 sGPA, 3.14 cGPA, 33Q MCAT. I applied June 28th and got 6 interview invites. You stand very little chance this cycle. Do it right next cycle and retake classes to boost your sGPA.

 

[FrkyBgStok]

I am sorry but I think this let in the game, you don't have a chance at all. At this point you are competing against 3.6/30 students that aren't having luck woith MD, and being that the average gpa for matriculants is 3.4ish, you are a number of standard deviations away.

The good news is that you have an easy fix. Retake some of your lower science grades next semester as a guest student and raise your sgpa above 3.0 and apply june 1st next season.

 

[FrkyBgStok]

Eegggaaaddds. Beaten to it. Argh.

 

[MD for me]

Since your MCAT score was pretty high then you probably still have a chance, a small chance but something is better then nothing ! ��

 

[se20001984]

People get in with 2.9s
Bc they have 4.0 the last 2 years and or a master

1.0s the 1st 2 years

4.0 the next to

 

[DrWily]

People get in with 2.9s
Bc they have 4.0 the last 2 years and or a master

1.0s the 1st 2 years

4.0 the next to

They also apply June 1st, and not December 16th.

 

[dntke1518]

They also apply June 1st, and not December 16th.

👍

 

[deleted357625]

Howdy,

First, I'd like to thank you for taking the time to read this.

I would like to know if the minimum GPAs listed for DO schools is actually a "hard" minimum or a "soft" one.

I'm applying to Nova Southeastern, Des Moines, PCOM, UMDNJ, and Western. Of those, as far as I can tell, UMDNJ, Nova, and Des Moines have 3.0 cGPA and sGPA minimum requirements.

I have a good cGPA but my sGPA is around ~2.85, but that is directly caused by my inability to perform academically due to a serious injury I sustained and was affected by for two trimesters [that happened to occur when I was exclusively taking pre-med classes... FML]. As in, if those two trimesters were excluded, my sGPA would probably be somewhere near a 3.2. I explained this in my personal statement.

Will the aforementioned schools even consider me with my sGPA or will they automatically screen me out? If it helps, I went to a top three university and have a 30 on the MCAT.

Thanks for your help; I really appreciate it.

-A Bridge Too Far

good mcat and I'm assuming you have a decent cGPA like you said. if you have a few C's regarding the sGPA, you can retake and that will replace those grades. Other than that your good.

 

[MedPR]

IMO the minimum GPA statements are "soft" and there mostly as a way to reduce work for ADCOMS (e.g, discourage people with 2.0GPAs to not even apply and waste everyone's time). If your GPA is close to their minimum, and you make up for it in other areas, I think you should apply. The worst they can do is not send you a secondary.

I got a secondary (no interview, and obviously no acceptance) last year from LECOM with a 2.88 cGPA, 2.85 sGPA, and a 28 MCAT. I have decent ECs, but still haven't shadowed a DO (will do that soon). Now, unless LECOM doesn't screen and sends secondaries to everyone, I think my experience is a good enough reason for all of you (us) who are CLOSE to minimum requirements to give it a shot.

 

[UpwardTrend]

People get in with 2.9s
Bc they have 4.0 the last 2 years and or a master

1.0s the 1st 2 years

4.0 the next to

This, This, and This. It's called an upward trend. It's where alot of us have dug ourselves out from. I am sorry you had an injury that caused your period of poor grades. Your comeback should have been higher than the average of 3.2, though. Honestly, I wouldn't bother mentioning this in my personal statement unless it was going to be more significant, like a 3.6+. There is no reason you can't take classes as a post-bacc. There are others (myself included) commenting in this thread who have retaken many classes both sci and non-sci in an effort to become a better applicant. If you research around here, you'll see alot of advice that says you should you should do everything in your power to get both of the gpa's above the 3.0 mark. If I were you I would retake two science courses this spring.
You would have been better off with a sub 3.0 cgpa and a 3.x sgpa. You're applying to get into programs that are all sciences. The Adcoms want to see that you can master science courses. Again, I am sorry to hear about your health issues. I just don't want you to waste your time and I hope you can take advantage of the little time between now and next app season. Good luck.
I almost forgot, if you want an almost guarantee into medical school you could pursue a 1 yr post-bacc and prove that you can handle the sciences. But, retaking two courses at A's would probably also work.

 

[Iliketoytles]

It's called an upward trend.

Clever. 😉

 

[Goro]

These people are rare. People win the lottery too, but nearly all players don't. There's some good advice in this thread, so follow it.

I want to follow up on one comment, that this time of year things get even more competetive. This is very true at our school. Between now and the end of March, we see a LOT of people with high GPAs and MCATs, because they're the ones who are just below the cusp for admission to MD schools, and/or are (shhhhhh!); using DO as their backup for their medical career.

So, perversely, the best candidates interview either early on, or late in the cycle.

So, you do have plenty of time in the next two years to fix things, and good luck.

People get in with 2.9s
Bc they have 4.0 the last 2 years and or a master

1.0s the 1st 2 years

4.0 the next to

 

[ABridgeTooFar]

Thanks once more for everyone's input. Believe me, I am well aware of my chances. There is no naive optimism here. However, because the rest of my app is pretty stellar, I thought I would give it a go.

Keeping that in mind, what other DO schools should I consider applying to? I don't have a DO LOR, so that is a limiting reagent haha [though I do have an MD letter]. I saw ATSU KCOM and SOMA are possibilities. Am I right to consider those, or would it be better to go to SGU in the Caribbean?

 

[FutureDrB]

Thanks once more for everyone's input. Believe me, I am well aware of my chances. There is no naive optimism here. However, because the rest of my app is pretty stellar, I thought I would give it a go.

Keeping that in mind, what other DO schools should I consider applying to? I don't have a DO LOR, so that is a limiting reagent haha [though I do have an MD letter]. I saw ATSU KCOM and SOMA are possibilities. Am I right to consider those, or would it be better to go to SGU in the Caribbean?

No. No. and No.
Just wait 6 months for the next cycle to roll around. Retake some science classes this spring and shadow a D.O. in the meantime. Problem solved.

 

[JESSFALLING]

a friend of mine had cancer and failed an entire
semester and none of the schools gave a rats ass...

Why couldn't they get a medical withdrawal? Are they pursuing grade replacement?

 

[MedPR]

Thanks once more for everyone's input. Believe me, I am well aware of my chances. There is no naive optimism here. However, because the rest of my app is pretty stellar, I thought I would give it a go.

Keeping that in mind, what other DO schools should I consider applying to? I don't have a DO LOR, so that is a limiting reagent haha [though I do have an MD letter]. I saw ATSU KCOM and SOMA are possibilities. Am I right to consider those, or would it be better to go to SGU in the Caribbean?

Carib school = you'll be an MD a year or two sooner, but are much, much more likely not to match to any US residencies. Therefore, you'll have a degree, lots of debt, but no job.

DO school = maybe you take a few more years to start med school, but once you're out you're basically gauranteed to match somewhere (unless you fail USMLE/COMPLEX or fail out or something dumb).

 

[UpwardTrend]

Thanks once more for everyone's input. Believe me, I am well aware of my chances. There is no naive optimism here. However, because the rest of my app is pretty stellar, I thought I would give it a go.

Keeping that in mind, what other DO schools should I consider applying to? I don't have a DO LOR, so that is a limiting reagent haha [though I do have an MD letter]. I saw ATSU KCOM and SOMA are possibilities. Am I right to consider those, or would it be better to go to SGU in the Caribbean?

Look around for a thread from the past two weeks about the Caribbean. It's a last resort. That means try reapp, SMP, Post-Bacc, Retakes, etc before you ever resort to Carib. You sound like you're trying to sprint your way to med school. Slow down and give yourself a reasonable chance next app season. Shadow and get a letter from a DO, retake a sci or two, get your app in as early as possible.

 

[ABridgeTooFar]

I really would just like answers to my questions. The majority of replies have not been straight answers but individuals' opinions on how I should go about getting into med school. I see the underlying attempts to be helpful, but I don't need that kind of advice. For instance, of course it would make sense to retake some classes and apply next year. However, there are several factors at play that virtually necessitate I begin med school in 2012. Let's leave it at that.

Moreover, I'm tired of the vitriol being spewed against Caribbean schools. The pervasive myth-making and fear mongering is ridiculous. The success rate of their graduates is more a reflection of the students' intellectual ineptitude than of the school's crappiness. If you accept lesser students it naturally follows that they will usually perform worse. Everyone I know that attended SGU or AUC has not had a problem matching. If you are a hard-working, intelligent individual, you can start a successful career in the Caribbean. Not that that represents the optimal pathway to a career in medicine, but you have to remember neither does the DO path represent that. For instance, it is more challenging for a private practice DO to build a successful practice because patients expect an "MD" and not a "DO" behind their doctor's name.

edit: I apologize for possibly coming off as a jerk in this post. I think the stress of this whole process is getting to me... 😳)

 

[FutureDrB]

I really would just like answers to my questions. The majority of replies have not been straight answers but individuals' opinions on how I should go about getting into med school. I see the underlying attempts to be helpful, but I don't need that kind of advice. For instance, of course it would make sense to retake some classes and apply next year. However, there are several factors at play that virtually necessitate I begin med school in 2012. Let's leave it at that.

Moreover, I'm tired of the vitriol being spewed against Caribbean schools. The pervasive myth-making and fear mongering is ridiculous. The success rate of their graduates is more a reflection of the students' intellectual ineptitude than of the school's crappiness. If you accept lesser students it naturally follows that they will usually perform worse. Everyone I know that attended SGU or AUC has not had a problem matching. If you are a hard-working, intelligent individual, you can start a successful career in the Caribbean. Not that that represents the optimal pathway to a career in medicine, but you have to remember neither does the DO path represent that. For instance, it is more challenging for a private practice DO to build a successful practice because patients expect an "MD" and not a "DO" behind their doctor's name.

edit: I apologize for possibly coming off as a jerk in this post. I think the stress of this whole process is getting to me... 😳)

We're trying to help you. The straight forward answer to your question is what we've said above. It is HIGHLY unlikely that you will get into a medical school with a 2.85 science GPA. Some schools may send you a secondary if you specifically request one, citing your individual hardship/situation, but many will not send you one automatically if you apply with a science GPA that is below their cutoff. It appears by the information you stated in your original post that you have done some research.

Another straight forward answer: None of us can tell you if a school will send you a secondary.

I understand that there may be pressing circumstances that you would like to apply to med school ASAP, but unfortunately in your situation, even though you have a good MCAT score, you need to do some GPA repair. Waiting until next cycle won't kill you. Trust me, there are people here, myself included, who have spent years, MANY YEARS, just retaking courses and doing GPA repair. We'd like nothing more than to be in medical school now, but you have to understand that the road to medical school cannot and should not be rushed.

Now for the "vitriol being spewed against Caribbean schools". Again, the majority of us on here know what we're talking about. There is also a handy search function that allows you to browse through topics pertaining to Caribbean schools. Attending a Caribbean school is ALWAYS a last resort. While yes, it does have to do with the quality of education you will receive, it more-so has to do with being able to land a residency spot. We're not bashing Caribbean schools for the fun of it. Do your research. The numbers don't lie when it comes to Caribbean schools and residency matching.

Lastly, the fact that you insinuate that a D.O. will have more trouble building his or her practice because of the "D.O." behind their name, instead of having "M.D." is just ludicrous. The majority of Americans now know what a D.O. is, but more importantly don't care. If you go to the ER, do you ask the physician about his/her credentials? Your ability to communicate with your patients, answer their questions and resolve their medical problems will be your concern. If you're able to do this, you'll have no problem building a practice if that's what you so choose. But I will add this, and no I'm not bashing Caribbean schools again, but if I found out my physician graduated from a Caribbean school, I would immediately find another doctor. I could care less about the M.D. letters after his/her name.

 

[MedPR]

I really would just like answers to my questions. The majority of replies have not been straight answers but individuals' opinions on how I should go about getting into med school. I see the underlying attempts to be helpful, but I don't need that kind of advice. For instance, of course it would make sense to retake some classes and apply next year. However, there are several factors at play that virtually necessitate I begin med school in 2012. Let's leave it at that.

Moreover, I'm tired of the vitriol being spewed against Caribbean schools. The pervasive myth-making and fear mongering is ridiculous. The success rate of their graduates is more a reflection of the students' intellectual ineptitude than of the school's crappiness. If you accept lesser students it naturally follows that they will usually perform worse. Everyone I know that attended SGU or AUC has not had a problem matching. If you are a hard-working, intelligent individual, you can start a successful career in the Caribbean. Not that that represents the optimal pathway to a career in medicine, but you have to remember neither does the DO path represent that. Lol, seriously? Another MD snob? The reason why CaribMed is a bad decision is you will never get the benefit of the doubt from a US residency program. As you alluded to in the first part of this post, the assumption of CaribMed students is that they are intellectually inept, and not as capable as a USmed student. In other words, an average USmed student has a better shot than a CaribMed student. For instance, it is more challenging for a private practice DO to build a successful practice because patients expect an "MD" and not a "DO" behind their doctor's name. Most people want to see a "doctor," not a "MD."
edit: I apologize for possibly coming off as a jerk in this post. I think the stress of this whole process is getting to me... 😳)

Howdy,

First, I'd like to thank you for taking the time to read this.

I would like to know if the minimum GPAs listed for DO schools is actually a "hard" minimum or a "soft" one.

I'm applying to Nova Southeastern, Des Moines, PCOM, UMDNJ, and Western. Of those, as far as I can tell, UMDNJ, Nova, and Des Moines have 3.0 cGPA and sGPA minimum requirements.

I have a good cGPA but my sGPA is around ~2.85, but that is directly caused by my inability to perform academically due to a serious injury I sustained and was affected by for two trimesters [that happened to occur when I was exclusively taking pre-med classes... FML]. As in, if those two trimesters were excluded, my sGPA would probably be somewhere near a 3.2. I explained this in my personal statement.

Will the aforementioned schools even consider me with my sGPA or will they automatically screen me out? You won't be screened out based on GPA/MCAT. But if your ECs suck, your GPA/MCAT aren't good enough to get you inIf it helps, I went to a top three university and have a 30 on the MCAT.

Thanks for your help; I really appreciate it.

-A Bridge Too Far

Thanks once more for everyone's input. Believe me, I am well aware of my chances. There is no naive optimism here. However, because the rest of my app is pretty stellar, I thought I would give it a go.

Keeping that in mind, what other DO schools should I consider applying to? I don't have a DO LOR, so that is a limiting reagent haha [though I do have an MD letter]. I saw ATSU KCOM and SOMA are possibilities. Am I right to consider those, or would it be better to go to SGU in the Caribbean? Any US Medical school is better than Carib.

🙄

 

[Iliketoytles]

Moreover, I'm tired of the vitriol being spewed against Caribbean schools. The pervasive myth-making and fear mongering is ridiculous. The success rate of their graduates is more a reflection of the students' intellectual ineptitude than of the school's crappiness.

Look at you with your big vocabulary. You sho shmart!

 

[MedPR]

But I will add this, and no I'm not bashing Caribbean schools again, but if I found out my physician graduated from a Caribbean school, I would immediately find another doctor. I could care less about the M.D. letters after his/her name.

Completely agree.

 

[ABridgeTooFar]

Lastly, the fact that you insinuate that a D.O. will have more trouble building his or her practice because of the "D.O." behind their name, instead of having "M.D." is just ludicrous. The majority of Americans now know what a D.O. is, but more importantly don't care. If you go to the ER, do you ask the physician about his/her credentials? Your ability to communicate with your patients, answer their questions and resolve their medical problems will be your concern. If you're able to do this, you'll have no problem building a practice if that's what you so choose. But I will add this, and no I'm not bashing Caribbean schools again, but if I found out my physician graduated from a Caribbean school, I would immediately find another doctor. I could care less about the M.D. letters after his/her name.

First, I'd like to note that typing responses on a tablet is pretty much the worst computing experience imaginable.

Now this: "The majority of Americans now know what a D.O. is." You must be joking. You're joking, right? I would venture to guess that no more than 5% of Americans know what a D.O. is, and that is a generous estimate. I am obviously not bashing the DO route, since as you can see I am applying to DO schools... but I am also not naive to think my career in medicine is going to be as smooth as a DO as it would be as a U.S. MD.

On a similar note, here is the plain and simple truth: the overwhelming majority of students applying to DO schools are doing so because they believe they cannot gain acceptance to a U.S. allopathic school. I have no problem with that. If you want to follow your dream and become a doctor, you need to do what is necessary to make that dream a reality.

Completely agree.

Please inform me why you wouldn't want to be treated by a graduate of SGU or AUC. I don't understand. Isn't a physician's residency and board certification the most accurate assessment of their competency? Do you honestly believe that SGU and AUC grads were not taught medicine correctly or sufficiently?


Finally, if someone could help me out with my previous request: "[...] What other DO schools should I consider applying to? I don't have a DO LOR, so that is a limiting reagent haha [though I do have an MD letter]. I saw ATSU KCOM and SOMA are possibilities. Am I right to consider those[?]"

 

[DrWily]

Here's a question for you:

If getting into medical school for 2012 is so imperative, why the f*ck did you wait until til now to apply?

A D.O. letter is not required at any school except for maybe a handful of them (LECOM mostly). A high-quality letter from an MD is perfectly acceptable at a LARGE number of schools, practically 80% of them. Many "prefer" a D.O. letter, but you can certainly get in without one. Look it up in the CIB that can be found on the AACOMAS website.

Also, there's a large regional factor when considering how many Americans know what a D.O. is... and it's a lot larger than 5%. D.O.s may not have a huge presence where you live, but please do not spout off bullsh~t when you make up statistics. D.O.s are large in the Northeast and possibly the Midwest. The farther you go out West, the less "presence" D.O.s have. This may be due to the fact that in California in the 1960s, 2400 D.O.s paid $65 to have their license changed from D.O. to M.D. Bet you can't figure out who's who now. My own mother's primary care doctor is a D.O. and she didn't even care what it was. Only that the man was her doctor, and he cared for her like any other doctor she's ever known. Only when I started being interested in the D.O. path did she recognize that her very own doctor whom she had been seeing for years was a D.O.

There's a ton of help in this thread. If you want to be an M.D. then do whatever it takes to be an M.D, even if that includes going to the Caribbean. Just FYI though, GME cuts are on the horizon and guess who's gonna get the shaft first? IMGs and FMGs.

Also when comparing match lists, look at where CarribMed's match. It doesn't matter IF they match, but where they match. Are they matching into the top programs? Are they matching into competitive specialties? There will always be outliers; the 1-5 SGU students who match awesomely, but what about the rest? Can you really compare SGU's match list to a US D.O. school's match list? It is "harder" to match into certain specialties DO vs MD, but DO's have the advantage of the AOA Match and the ACGME Match.

Seriously, do not rush this process. It's a gd marathon, not a sprint. You don't want to go 4 years into huge debt and regret it. You can be a physician for 30+ years, but take the extra time now to make sure you don't suffer later. I cannot think of one possible reason for you to HAVE to be in medical school next year. Not a single one.

 

[UpwardTrend]

I really would just like answers to my questions. The majority of replies have not been straight answers but individuals' opinions on how I should go about getting into med school. I see the underlying attempts to be helpful, but I don't need that kind of advice. For instance, of course it would make sense to retake some classes and apply next year. However, there are several factors at play that virtually necessitate I begin med school in 2012. Let's leave it at that.

Moreover, I'm tired of the vitriol being spewed against Caribbean schools. The pervasive myth-making and fear mongering is ridiculous. The success rate of their graduates is more a reflection of the students' intellectual ineptitude than of the school's crappiness. If you accept lesser students it naturally follows that they will usually perform worse. Everyone I know that attended SGU or AUC has not had a problem matching. If you are a hard-working, intelligent individual, you can start a successful career in the Caribbean. Not that that represents the optimal pathway to a career in medicine, but you have to remember neither does the DO path represent that. For instance, it is more challenging for a private practice DO to build a successful practice because patients expect an "MD" and not a "DO" behind their doctor's name.

edit: I apologize for possibly coming off as a jerk in this post. I think the stress of this whole process is getting to me... 😳)

What is your big secret? Why can't you let us know the reason that you must enter medical school in 2012?

 

[dbizzy]

What is your big secret? Why can't you let us know the reason that you must enter medical school in 2012?

Yes, I am intrigued by this as well.

Finally, if someone could help me out with my previous request: "[...] What other DO schools should I consider applying to? I don't have a DO LOR, so that is a limiting reagent haha [though I do have an MD letter]. I saw ATSU KCOM and SOMA are possibilities. Am I right to consider those[?]"

Download the AACOM Information Book at

http://www.aacom.org/resources/bookstore/cib/Pages/default.aspx

and under each school, under "Supplemental Application Requirements," it will list what LORs are required for that school. Also, you can search the forums as there have been many discussions about this very topic in the past

 

[Iliketoytles]

It doesn't really matter why he "must" enter medschool in 2012. The point is that your chances are low, mainly because it is so late in the cycle. It'd be interesting to know the why's behind you applying so late... but you can keep it to yourself if you want.

All the answers and advice in this thread are great. If you MUST matriculate in 2012, then apply to DO and Caribb schools, since that's your only option.

Good luck.

 

[dbizzy]

Though his chances are lower by the minute, OP still has a chance. He has a "good" cgpa, a low sgpa, and an above average MCAT (by DO standards). According to the folks over at the underdog thread, he wouldn't even qualify as an underdog.

The "apply early" thing is a rule of thumb that people should definitely try to abide by in order to maximize their chances of gaining admission, but it is by no means an absolute rule.

If you've got nothing to lose and must get in this cycle, then go for it. I hope you've got other things on your app to be able to "wow" the adcoms.

 

[DrWily]

Though his chances are lower by the minute, OP still has a chance. He has a "good" cgpa, a low sgpa, and an above average MCAT (by DO standards). According to the folks over at the underdog thread, he wouldn't even qualify as an underdog.

The "apply early" thing is a rule of thumb that people should definitely try to abide by in order to maximize their chances of gaining admission, but it is by no means an absolute rule.

If you've got nothing to lose and must get in this cycle, then go for it. I hope you've got other things on your app to be able to "wow" the adcoms.

He *would* have a *slight* very slight chance if he broadened his applications to other schools. Of the 5 that he's posted, he's trying to get into the top competitive DO schools in the nation (by popularity). Also, he IS an underdog by the underdog formula.

MCAT/2 + sGPA*10 = Score.

Average Matriculant score is like 45.. He's a 43.5

Like I said above, he may have a chance, and if money is no concern, then definitely go for it.. but just be prepared to re-apply next June.

 

[MedPR]

Please inform me why you wouldn't want to be treated by a graduate of SGU or AUC. I don't understand. Isn't a physician's residency and board certification the most accurate assessment of their competency? Do you honestly believe that SGU and AUC grads were not taught medicine correctly or sufficiently?


Finally, if someone could help me out with my previous request: "[...] What other DO schools should I consider applying to? I don't have a DO LOR, so that is a limiting reagent haha [though I do have an MD letter]. I saw ATSU KCOM and SOMA are possibilities. Am I right to consider those[?]"

If, as you said, you must get in this year, you should apply to every single DO school -- your chances aren't good due to not having shadowed a DO, your GPA, applying so late in the cycle, and your obvious distaste and poor attitude towards the DO route -- and the more you apply to the better chance you have of getting one to take you.

Why wouldn't I want to be treated by a Caribmed graduate? The vast majority of students that go there are students who couldn't get into US med schools. Now, that's not a big deal, since US med schools are competitive, but the other reason people go to Caribmed schools is because they are in a rush to start med school asap and are unwilling to improve their application (improve gpa, mcat, ecs) to go to school here in the US. In general, I like to think of them as lazy people who care more about being a 21 year old med student than getting a good medical education. EVERYONE knows that those schools provide substandard education compared to the US schools. The most accurate assessment of a physician's competency is their day to day work with patients. Do you honestly think being board certified makes someone a good physician? And yes, as previously stated, I believe that the education provided by the caribbean schools is not equivalent to what is provided in the united states. Like the MCAT, anyone who puts in enough time and studies the right material can perform well on Step 1.

 

[Jnet389]

Just making sure I have the timeline straight:
1. OP asks for advice
2. SDN honestly gives advice
3. OP does not like the sound of the advice so attacks SDN for not pleasing his/her advice needs
???? 😛

 

[FrkyBgStok]

We're trying to help you. The straight forward answer to your question is what we've said above. It is HIGHLY unlikely that you will get into a medical school with a 2.85 science GPA. Some schools may send you a secondary if you specifically request one, citing your individual hardship/situation, but many will not send you one automatically if you apply with a science GPA that is below their cutoff. It appears by the information you stated in your original post that you have done some research.

Another straight forward answer: None of us can tell you if a school will send you a secondary.

I understand that there may be pressing circumstances that you would like to apply to med school ASAP, but unfortunately in your situation, even though you have a good MCAT score, you need to do some GPA repair. Waiting until next cycle won't kill you. Trust me, there are people here, myself included, who have spent years, MANY YEARS, just retaking courses and doing GPA repair. We'd like nothing more than to be in medical school now, but you have to understand that the road to medical school cannot and should not be rushed.

Now for the "vitriol being spewed against Caribbean schools". Again, the majority of us on here know what we're talking about. There is also a handy search function that allows you to browse through topics pertaining to Caribbean schools. Attending a Caribbean school is ALWAYS a last resort. While yes, it does have to do with the quality of education you will receive, it more-so has to do with being able to land a residency spot. We're not bashing Caribbean schools for the fun of it. Do your research. The numbers don't lie when it comes to Caribbean schools and residency matching.

Lastly, the fact that you insinuate that a D.O. will have more trouble building his or her practice because of the "D.O." behind their name, instead of having "M.D." is just ludicrous. The majority of Americans now know what a D.O. is, but more importantly don't care. If you go to the ER, do you ask the physician about his/her credentials? Your ability to communicate with your patients, answer their questions and resolve their medical problems will be your concern. If you're able to do this, you'll have no problem building a practice if that's what you so choose. But I will add this, and no I'm not bashing Caribbean schools again, but if I found out my physician graduated from a Caribbean school, I would immediately find another doctor. I could care less about the M.D. letters after his/her name.

Quoted for truth. The fact is you could have a crappy gpa and an adcom could read your personal statement and say "holy crap we need this person." you could have phenomonal numbers and a crappy ps meaning an automatic rejection. Moreover, you could score an interview and the adcom could say, "this dude is an assbag." the point is, we are giving you information based on statistics and your numbers, but ultimately, none of us can tell you for certain how you will do. And we are trying to help you go against carribean so you aren't regretting it later, but if you are certain it is based on intellectual ability alone, go for it. Prove everyone here and statistics wrong, it won't affect me. So go for it.

 

[Jnet389]

quoted for truth. The fact is you could have a crappy gpa and an adcom could read your personal statement and say "holy crap we need this person." you could have phenomonal numbers and a crappy ps meaning an automatic rejection. Moreover, you could score an interview and the adcom could say, "this dude is an assbag." the point is, we are giving you information based on statistics and your numbers, but ultimately, none of us can tell you for certain how you will do. And we are trying to help you go against carribean so you aren't regretting it later, but if you are certain it is based on intellectual ability alone, go for it. Prove everyone here and statistics wrong, it won't affect me. So go for it.

+1

 

[dntke1518]

Quoted for truth. The fact is you could have a crappy gpa and an adcom could read your personal statement and say "holy crap we need this person." you could have phenomonal numbers and a crappy ps meaning an automatic rejection. Moreover, you could score an interview and the adcom could say, "this dude is an assbag." the point is, we are giving you information based on statistics and your numbers, but ultimately, none of us can tell you for certain how you will do. And we are trying to help you go against carribean so you aren't regretting it later, but if you are certain it is based on intellectual ability alone, go for it. Prove everyone here and statistics wrong, it won't affect me. So go for it.

As DrWilly would say... the straight MF truth!!

 

[DrWily]

As DrWilly would say... the straight MF truth!!

👍

 

[DrWily]

Sorry, I was actually quoting the following scoring method. I've always thought the front page underdog scoring method was overly simplistic and flawed since it never took into consideration cgpa and other factors.

Nevertheless, yes, definitely do have a backup plan to improve those statistics in the event that no adcoms bite.

Even with the improved formula, he's still below average:

(cGPA *10) + (sGPA *10) + MCAT = Score

Average Matriculant = 95.5
Underdog Threshold = 92.9

I can't image him having over a 3.4 cGPA "good" with a 2.85 sGPA so these are the numbers I'm using.

34 + 28.5 + 30 = 92.5

If you want to add in the modifiers, there's -3 points for having a 2.85 sGPA so 89.5, but he has an above average MCAT so we can add +1-2 for this, which puts him around 91. (this is pretty subjective though...)
Still an underdog.

(threadjacked!)

 

[dbizzy]

Even with the improved formula, he's still below average:

(cGPA *10) + (sGPA *10) + MCAT = Score

Average Matriculant = 95.5
Underdog Threshold = 92.9

I can't image him having over a 3.4 cGPA "good" with a 2.85 sGPA so these are the numbers I'm using.

34 + 28.5 + 30 = 92.5

If you want to add in the modifiers, there's -3 points for having a 2.85 sGPA so 89.5, but he has an above average MCAT so we can add +1-2 for this, which puts him around 91. (this is pretty subjective though...)
Still an underdog.

(threadjacked!)

Yeah, we'll never know what cgpa he has. Did everyone scare the OP away?

 

[Iliketoytles]

Even with the improved formula, he's still below average:

(cGPA *10) + (sGPA *10) + MCAT = Score

Average Matriculant = 95.5
Underdog Threshold = 92.9

I can't image him having over a 3.4 cGPA "good" with a 2.85 sGPA so these are the numbers I'm using.

34 + 28.5 + 30 = 92.5

If you want to add in the modifiers, there's -3 points for having a 2.85 sGPA so 89.5, but he has an above average MCAT so we can add +1-2 for this, which puts him around 91. (this is pretty subjective though...)
Still an underdog.

(threadjacked!)

I found you, Wily.

 

[DrWily]

At least you found one of my good photos 😉

 

[UpwardTrend]

Damn Wily you are hot. Any man that carries a sky blue sharpie in their front pocket is a 10/10.

I found you, Wily.

 

[DrWily]

All joking aside, this is the real me:

 

[FutureDrB]

Well, if we're posting real photos of ourselves, I guess I'll share...