Money shouldn't be a motivation.

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krnkimsung

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As I was shadowing different dentists, I was constantly told a shared comment from all of them, and that was "money should NOT ever be your #1 motivation pursuing this GREAT profession"

I'm a non-traditional applicant with about 2.5 years of corporate experience. So based on what I saw in two different companies (High Tech and Retail industries that I was employed in), I did a VERY ROUGH number crunching to get the real 'FEEL' of this wise advice that I've got from those wonderful dentists.

As far as the position and corresponding salary for corporate job concern, I would have to say it's FAIRLY reasonable. It varies by company, but I worked for two companies from the top 20 in fortune company list, so the numbers might be overstated. 401K, Stock Option, and other benefits (health insurance, discount, vacation) were NOT considered.

Assuming that we retire at the age of around 58-60, dentists have a pretty similar net-payment to a typical corporate job out there. Like I said, the calculation is VERY Rough, based on many unrealistic assumptions (e.g. no one stays in a single company for THAT long without being laid off)

The reason why I'm posting this is to have a discussion around YOUR motivations behind pursuing the field of dentistry and I hope that not a lot of pre-dents out there are solely going for the money, even though they say they are NOT.

I welcome any criticism/feedback here. Like I said, this is for us to openly discuss and share our ideas.

BTW I would love to hear from someone with non-bio backgrounds.



View attachment Dentist vs Corporate Job comparison2.xls
 

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I'll be willing to bet that if dentists/doctors/pharmacists/etc didn't make as much money as they do...NO ONE WOULD DO IT. Money really is the driving force behind everything.
 
um....of COURSE i'm doing it for the money!!!!! it's called SURVIVAL


that being said, id rather be making six figures doing dentistry than any other lucrative profession i can think of. i do enjoy it, but would i do it if i didnt make any money doing it? hielz no!
 
komradrobot said:
um....of COURSE i'm doing it for the money!!!!! it's called SURVIVAL


that being said, id rather be making six figures doing dentistry than any other lucrative profession i can think of. i do enjoy it, but would i do it if i didnt make any money doing it? hielz no!
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This. +1. I want to also live comfortably....is that a crime or something? 😀
 
I'd say for most people MONEY IS THE MOTIVATION. You want to like what you do, but at the same time, you want to be able to feed your family!
Now, there are four different groups of people in life:

1-People who love what they do and make great money doing it. Unfortunately, the number of lucky people who fall under this category is rather small. They enjoy work and the money they make. Good for them!!

2-People who don't really have a passion for what they do, but they do it anyways, because it pays well, and they can use the money to do the things that they like in life. Since they still have some satisfaction in life, I don't think lack of passion for what they do will make them miserable. They may never become the best in their field, but most likely they'll continue with a decent performance to keep the cash flowing.

3-People who love what they do, but it hardly pays for the rent. I never wanted to fall under this category, because no matter how much you love your work, at the end of the day, you need a roof and a place to crash, and you'll be super miserable if these two are missing in life.

4-People who hate what they do and who hardly make ends meet doing it. Now these are the people I really feel bad for.

Given that life is not perfect and not many people fall under category #1, I think anyone who can fit under category #2 should still consider himself/herself lucky!
 
Healthcare in America = Business First

Dentistry is a profit first profession (>90% of dentists are small business owners).

Too many dentists are forgetting that they are health professionals, not tooth technicians. Who cares if you are in pain if I can make enough for the day by doing a few veneers in the morning? Sad but true. Very few people in the world are trained with the power to heal, and it should be every dentist's duty to do so.

There are quite a few dentists out there that don't care about the health disparity in the country, as long as they are making $$$. This has led to the push for mid-level providers, which in a way was the result of the dental profession not doing enough to solve the problem. Honesty I think dental schools need to evaluate each applicant's motivation more closely. $$$ and lifestyle will always be a motivation, but it should not be anyone's primary motivation in going into dentistry.

I haven't met a dentist who's not living comfortably. The question is after that are you going to use your skills to help those in need or only do the procedures that will make the most $$$.
 
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working hard to help ppl out and do something meaningful while getting paid good money is what attracted me, and probably most others, to the medical field.
 
I don't see why helping others and getting paid well would necessarily contradict one another?!
Why can't one have both?!

 
before you go to dental school, you really cant even predict what its going to be like..the stresses and joys, whether you'll like it or not. one of the reasons im glad im in dental school now is because i'll be able to make a good living and take care of the people i love.

i would rather have a GOOD dentist who is working on me and motivated by money than a lazy cow who isnt motivated by anything.

i keep telling myself to remember not to feel bad when im making a huge salary because i had to put up with this psychotic girl in my class as a roommate, who was a lazy cow. all of my friends who didnt go to dental school are getting married or buying brand new cars while im just going to be a kid in school for four years. people should be reward for deferred gratification.

to say that doctors shouldnt be compensated for their work and enjoy it is ignorant. go be a dentist with all of the people stress it offers then come back and tell me how right i am. do you see any dentists out there working for a salary of $20,000 a year like a social worker, who also helps society????? i dont think so. we invest a LOT of money to become dentists, it is reasonable to expect a return. perhaps you come from the sunny side of town and havent been exposed to a lot of societal ills that you will see in a public service occupation yet. just wait until someone chews you out because THEY have periodontal disease.
 
Your numbers seems like very bad guesstimates.

+if you work for companies dont forget to think about the stress of being outsourced etc...
 
peanutb123 said:
Your numbers seems like very bad guesstimates.


+if you work for companies dont forget to think about the stress of being outsourced etc...
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that rarely happened from my experience.

Like I said my numbers are ROUGH estimates, but I would REALLY appreciate if you can provide me with more specifics on your statement "VERY BAD GUESStimates."
 
I started a practice right out of d. school. Bad mistake.
With little working experience, I wasn't that good of a practitioner and an even worse businessman. I barely made enough to eat.
I sold the first shop for practically pennies and worked for the military and a community health center before opening a shop again.
With the added experience, clinical and business, I had all start up costs covered after 4 1/2 months.
It was 10 years before I started making serious money. The only reason I stayed in was because I really didn't know how to do anything else. Plus the money wasn't all that bad working in those other places.
 
krnkimsung said:
that rarely happened from my experience.

Like I said my numbers are ROUGH estimates, but I would REALLY appreciate if you can provide me with more specifics on your statement "VERY BAD GUESStimates."
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Well lets see... you are comparing someone w/ MBA w/ an undergrad Salary.
2. every 2 years or 5 years you are automatically assuming a promotion. Lets see thats highly unlikely. Especially with all the outsourcing etc assuming you talking about business analyst... Forgive me i am not going into too much details. Since you worked in a top 20 company out of all the people you should know that people tend to stay in their jobs for LONG TIME. And they are before you for a promotion.
You are also estimating salary of an average dentist after 20 years of practice to be ~120k which is highly unlikely. Rough estimates huh?

By the way you layout you excel sheet it gives people false hope that if they work like 50 years in a company they might become CEO... i am not trying to attack you just saying that your ROUGH GUSTIMATES are too rough.

ps. many people here have the experience too working in big companies.
 
krnkimsung said:
As I was shadowing different dentists, I was constantly told a shared comment from all of them, and that was "money should NOT ever be your #1 motivation pursuing this GREAT profession"
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There's your key phrase right there, "your #1" motivation. Now, when they say this, people usually interpret it as them saying money shouldnt be a factor, but theyre just saying it shouldnt be your one and only factor. For example, say on a scale of 1-100 in importance, money shouldnt be a 99 while happiness, helping others, etc. are 1 each.

Anyone who says money is not a factor in why they want to become a dentist is lying out of their blowhole. There are countless people posting on predent forums about how money wasn't even an afterthought of why they are becoming a dentist only to pop up in the dental forums 4 years later and complain endlessly about how little they are gonna make or are making after they graduate. Usually peope who say money is not a factor has this misconception that dentists will make 300k/yr right out of school and therefore they believe the money aspect will take care of itself, so the only problem you will have is whether you enjoy your job or not. Reality will crash hard when they realize this is far from the truth and suddenly this job they "love" doing doesn't seem so enjoyable anymore when the pay doesnt meet their expectations. I remember recently contributing to a thread in the dental forums that a recent dental grad made about how he is "only" making 100k a year right out of school. Go figure huh?

total cost of attending dental schools is higher than 300k nowadays, with some schools reaching 400k+. On a short loan term of 10 years and decently low interest rates, this is around 25k in interest per year alone, and more if your term is longer/rates are higher. I know schools like NYU and BU are increasing their tuition 9% annually which is gonna make things even tougher for hs students and college lower classmen who are contemplating on going to dental school. If you're naive enough to disregard this huge financial burden in making your career decision, this profession is not for you.

Stick to working in the peace corps if you truely want to help people and don't care about money. This way, you are helping people while not screwing over yourself and your family with hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of student loans.


P.S. If a garbageman made 2 million a year, I'd be happy as heck being a garbageman and love my job. If a garbageman man made 20k a year, I don't think I'd be as happy. Money has a way of making your job more tolerable/enjoyable.
 
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peanutb123 said:
Well lets see... you are comparing someone w/ MBA w/ an undergrad Salary.
2. every 2 years or 5 years you are automatically assuming a promotion. Lets see thats highly unlikely. Especially with all the outsourcing etc assuming you talking about business analyst... Forgive me i am not going into too much details. Since you worked in a top 20 company out of all the people you should know that people tend to stay in their jobs for LONG TIME. And they are before you for a promotion.
You are also estimating salary of an average dentist after 20 years of practice to be ~120k which is highly unlikely. Rough estimates huh?

By the way you layout you excel sheet it gives people false hope that if they work like 50 years in a company they might become CEO... i am not trying to attack you just saying that your ROUGH GUSTIMATES are too rough.

ps. many people here have the experience too working in big companies.
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The lateral movement of your job title really depends on the quality of your work. I assumed that if all these pre-dents work as hard as they will during first 4 year of dental school, I don't see a problem with getting a promotion every 3-4 years. For example, the average age of directors in our dept was around 34-37 (as a matter of fact they are younger than my estimated time frame for director position).
Do people really tend to stay long in one company? From what I've seen, there were A LOT OF turnovers in our dept for lateral move in somewhere else. I thought I was talking about American Corp.
I never mentioned that after working for 50 years, you will be a CEO. but being a SVP or even VP when you're 50-55 years... that's pretty standard.

I don't really know whole a lot about the average salary of dentists, but I thought 165K a year when you're 36-40 (which means 5-10 years after graduation) was pretty reasonable estimates. ~120K was after tax and health insurance being deducted. I could be wrong...

"many people here have the experience too working in big companies" -->

anyone? please jump in and let me know if I am horribly mistaken making those statements. I really appreciate your feedback, I do really. But I'm not still convinced if dentists make THAT much more money over the long run taken into account of a huge loan plus piling up interests PLUS opportunity costs while you're in dental schools.

BTW, if you can download my "FAULTY" spredsheet and punch in numbers that YOU think it's right, we can compare and see where the discrepancy is coming from.

Thanks!
 
americanpierg said:
There's your key phrase right there, "your #1" motivation. Now, when they say this, people usually interpret it as them saying money shouldnt be a factor, but theyre just saying it shouldnt be your one and only factor. For example, say on a scale of 1-100 in importance, money shouldnt be a 99 while happiness, helping others, etc. are 1 each.

Anyone who says money is not a factor in why they want to become a dentist is lying out of their blowhole. There are countless people posting on predent forums about how money wasn't even an afterthought of why they are becoming a dentist only to pop up in the dental forums 4 years later and complain endlessly about how little they are gonna make or are making after they graduate. Usually peope who say money is not a factor has this misconception that dentists will make 300k/yr right out of school and therefore they believe the money aspect will take care of itself, so the only problem you will have is whether you enjoy your job or not. Reality will crash hard when they realize this is far from the truth and suddenly this job they "love" doing doesn't seem so enjoyable anymore when the pay doesnt meet their expectations. I remember recently contributing to a thread in the dental forums that a recent dental grad made about how he is "only" making 100k a year right out of school. Go figure huh?

total cost of attending dental schools is higher than 300k nowadays, with some schools reaching 400k+. On a short loan term of 10 years and decently low interest rates, this is around 25k in interest per year alone, and more if your term is longer/rates are higher. I know schools like NYU and BU are increasing their tuition 9% annually which is gonna make things even tougher for hs students and college lower classmen who are contemplating on going to dental school. If you're naive enough to disregard this huge financial burden in making your career decision, this profession is not for you.

Stick to working in the peace corps if you truely want to help people and don't care about money. This way, you are helping people while not screwing over yourself and your family with hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of student loans.


P.S. If a garbageman made 2 million a year, I'd be happy as heck being a garbageman and love my job. If a garbageman man made 20k a year, I don't think I'd be as happy. Money has a way of making your job more tolerable/enjoyable.
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Thanks for your input. You really nailed down the points that I was trying to make. I've been kind of displeased by the fact that a lot of SDNers just assume the loan $$ will be paid off easily once they graduate from DS. To be more precise, the breakeven point for them is unrealstically too early.

The original intention for me to open this thread was to discuss the motivation besides the money. But overwhelmingly, many people so far listed $$$ as their primary driving motivation and I'm confused.

Once again, thanks for your input. It's really nice to hear a realistic comment from the real dental student.
 
aloysious said:
I started a practice right out of d. school. Bad mistake. With little working experience, I wasn't that good of a practitioner and an even worse businessman. I barely made enough to eat. I sold the first shop for practically pennies and worked for the military and a community health center before opening a shop again.
With the added experience, clinical and business, I had all start up costs covered after 4 1/2 months.
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Your problem may not have been so much starting a practice out of ds as having opened up a "shop" while claiming a questionable level of expertise and "business sense".
________
If the all mighty is the only motivation, there are plenty of other avenues that are significantly more rewarding than dentistry.
 
Agreed - money and being able to live comfortably is always at least somewhat of a motivation, but there are many other careers one can pursue and still make big money... and without having to dedicate weeks (or months) studying for the DAT, going through 4+ more years of school, and paying a couple hundred thousand for dental school. If one is willing to put that much time into studying, applying, and going through dental school, there has to be a passion there and a motivation that is much beyond the $ factor. No?
 
1. You did not account for inflation.
2. ADA reports the average general dentist salary to be $200k. Your excel did not even reach $180k at the peak of its dental career (which would be higher than $200k due to #1).
3. You did not account for the number of work hours per week.
 
Blue Panther said:
1. You did not account for inflation.
2. ADA reports the average general dentist salary to be $200k. Your excel did not even reach $180k at the peak of its dental career (which would be higher than $200k due to #1).
3. You did not account for the number of work hours per week.
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Dont bother the dude is set w/ his rough calc. I have also told him... He strongly believes that anyone can get to VP in a big company w/ just 20 years of experience or something like that.
 
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this thread is stupid..this kimsung guy has no idea what he's talkin about...i know dentists DO NOT take in around only 120K as his dumb excel sheet shows..dentists make much much more except in the starting stage...unless of course u are a lazy dentist who never learns new skills, makes absolutely horrendous biz decisions...the OP probably is just trying to discourage other ppl from applying to dental school so he has a better chance...no one needs to respond to this thread anymore..oh and if u say money isn't at least part of a factor of u being a dentist than u sir are a LIAR!!
 
Some might take around that much money w/ good amount of exp. if they dedicate themselves to working in charity dental clinics.
 
Money shouldnt be a motivation? listen to yourself........does it even sound right?
your dentist are supposed to say "money shouldnt be a motivation." its their job to say such things but they never ever mean it....
 
The only way that money motivates me is knowing that I will be able to pay off my loans. As a hygienist, I found my job very repetitive and wanted to go back to school to expand my options. Since I made $90,000 the last year I worked in hygiene most research or teaching jobs would have been a lateral move but with more debt.

As for the pre-dents who see general (not cosmetic) private practice dentists driving Porches and living in McMansions... Don't expect that unless you have someone paying your way through school. Also, some dentists achieve such success through questionable diagnosing (the slippery slope of a money-motivated practice).

And keep in mind... in this economy it's really hard to sell cosmetic procedures.
 
Money is always a factor, and many times it is THE factor. Especially when the education costs over $250,000

Your excel is flawed for two reasons:

1. The income numbers for the dentist are too low..the averages for owner GP's are roughly $200k a year.

2. You can be in the corporate world for decades and NEVER reach higher than a middle manager...let alone a VP or CEO.

Most dentists are owners of their own business. You set your own hours and make the rules.

You can't ever have that in the corporate world.

The CEO is answerable to the Board of Directors, and the Board is answerable to the share holders.
 
krnkimsung said:
As I was shadowing different dentists, I was constantly told a shared comment from all of them, and that was "money should NOT ever be your #1 motivation pursuing this GREAT profession"

I'm a non-traditional applicant with about 2.5 years of corporate experience. So based on what I saw in two different companies (High Tech and Retail industries that I was employed in), I did a VERY ROUGH number crunching to get the real 'FEEL' of this wise advice that I've got from those wonderful dentists.

As far as the position and corresponding salary for corporate job concern, I would have to say it's FAIRLY reasonable. It varies by company, but I worked for two companies from the top 20 in fortune company list, so the numbers might be overstated. 401K, Stock Option, and other benefits (health insurance, discount, vacation) were NOT considered.

Assuming that we retire at the age of around 58-60, dentists have a pretty similar net-payment to a typical corporate job out there. Like I said, the calculation is VERY Rough, based on many unrealistic assumptions (e.g. no one stays in a single company for THAT long without being laid off)

The reason why I'm posting this is to have a discussion around YOUR motivations behind pursuing the field of dentistry and I hope that not a lot of pre-dents out there are solely going for the money, even though they say they are NOT.

I welcome any criticism/feedback here. Like I said, this is for us to openly discuss and share our ideas.

BTW I would love to hear from someone with non-bio backgrounds.



View attachment 15011
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Im sorry to burst your bubble, but money IS EVERYTHING. It may not be the #1 motivator for the very few but trust me, it ranks at least #2.

You can't compare a corporate job vs dentistry. The 2 MIGHT make the same amount per year (say both are pushing $150,000 per year salary) but the differences between them are as comparable as day and night. As a corporate person, you prolly worked your ASS off for 10+ years to reach that high position, okay fine, what happens when the company starts to do bad and they start laying people off? and you end up being layed off? What happens to your income? Thats right, you'll be collecting unemployment until you land a new position and STRONG CHANCES ARE you woun't land a new position with that old salary, you'll probably go MUCH lower just to land the job.

As a dentist, the freedom of owning your own practice (while it has its own challenges from time to time) is an EXTREMELY rewarding situation both in salary and self-relieve (you won't feel the corporate pressure of doing things "their way"). If you choose to not own your practice, thats fine, you can work at some practice and get salary. If you get fired, no problem, you can land another job EASILY. I don't care what statistics you show me, a jobless dentist looking for a job WILL FIND A JOB very quickly. There is alot of need

I've also talked to MANY physicians and dentists and surgeons and whatever you can think off and when they are being honest, they say it the way it is "we went into it cause it was the surest way to pull a 6-figure+ income"..... Obviously they don't say it in those words, but same meaning

If tomorrow, if a new law comes out that regulates dentist's salaries to no more than 60-70k a year (typical salary of an engineer) MAJORITY of you "true we are not doing it for the $$$ pre-dents" would switch careers before the end of the week EVEN if the same law dramatically drops dental school tuition. Don't kid yourself folks, money is a HUGE motivator.
 
dentalWorks said:
Im sorry to burst your bubble, but money IS EVERYTHING. It may not be the #1 motivator for the very few but trust me, it ranks at least #2.

You can't compare a corporate job vs dentistry. The 2 MIGHT make the same amount per year (say both are pushing $150,000 per year salary) but the differences between them are as comparable as day and night. As a corporate person, you prolly worked your ASS off for 10+ years to reach that high position, okay fine, what happens when the company starts to do bad and they start laying people off? and you end up being layed off? What happens to your income? Thats right, you'll be collecting unemployment until you land a new position and STRONG CHANCES ARE you woun't land a new position with that old salary, you'll probably go MUCH lower just to land the job.

As a dentist, the freedom of owning your own practice (while it has its own challenges from time to time) is an EXTREMELY rewarding situation both in salary and self-relieve (you won't feel the corporate pressure of doing things "their way"). If you choose to not own your practice, thats fine, you can work at some practice and get salary. If you get fired, no problem, you can land another job EASILY. I don't care what statistics you show me, a jobless dentist looking for a job WILL FIND A JOB very quickly. There is alot of need

I've also talked to MANY physicians and dentists and surgeons and whatever you can think off and when they are being honest, they say it the way it is "we went into it cause it was the surest way to pull a 6-figure+ income"..... Obviously they don't say it in those words, but same meaning

If tomorrow, if a new law comes out that regulates dentist's salaries to no more than 60-70k a year (typical salary of an engineer) MAJORITY of you "true we are not doing it for the $$$ pre-dents" would switch careers before the end of the week EVEN if the same law dramatically drops dental school tuition. Don't kid yourself folks, money is a HUGE motivator.
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dentalWorks Nailed it... I mean money makes world go around right. If you dont reward the talented people w/ talents to cure cancer or even help one another they wouldnt be so motivated. Just like you said op... if you work your ass off you dont see why you cant achieve promotions and you want the promotions to make more money and thats the motivation that the company/corporate has set upon you.
 
doublepost
 
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hopefullyadent said:
this thread is stupid..this kimsung guy has no idea what he's talkin about...i know dentists DO NOT take in around only 120K as his dumb excel sheet shows..dentists make much much more except in the starting stage...unless of course u are a lazy dentist who never learns new skills, makes absolutely horrendous biz decisions...the OP probably is just trying to discourage other ppl from applying to dental school so he has a better chance...no one needs to respond to this thread anymore..oh and if u say money isn't at least part of a factor of u being a dentist than u sir are a LIAR!!
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Thanks for your input 🙂

I meant more like money shouldn't be #1 driving factor. Of course money should be what we work hard for...
 
Money is REALLY important but obviously it's not my number 1 motivation, but I would say it's number 2 or 3.
Reason to this is that in the future term, I wouldn't want my family to struggle with money issues. Which for this reason, this made me decide so far toward dentistry than medicine.
The "idealistic" view is to help people for both areas. But realistically speaking I considered the money, the time and the stress it would put to me and to my future family. Also through shadowing the dentist, I saw the stress level is way less than a medical doctor, with the help of good dental assistant team.
So I guess in this case money=life style enough reason to pursue this career.
 
peanutb123 said:
dentalWorks Nailed it... I mean money makes world go around right. If you dont reward the talented people w/ talents to cure cancer or even help one another they wouldnt be so motivated. Just like you said op... if you work your ass off you dont see why you cant achieve promotions and you want the promotions to make more money and thats the motivation that the company/corporate has set upon you.
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hahaha yea, if there was no financial gain in finding the cure for cancer, no one would look... its just way too expensive (same as no one would put the money into becoming a dentist if it didnt pay well). Sure people might be working on a cure for cancer becuase they wan't to see the disease eradicated, but the #1 reason they are working on it is money money money... why else are these drug companies worth billions of dollars. It takes millions and billions of dollars to do this kind of research, but whoever deveops the jackpot drug will be making billions of dollars back. i cant even imagine how much money woud be made if a company developed some universal cancer cure. first trilion dollar corporation.
 
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doc toothache said:
Your problem may not have been so much starting a practice out of ds as having opened up a "shop" while claiming a questionable level of expertise and "business sense".
________
If the all mighty is the only motivation, there are plenty of other avenues that are significantly more rewarding than dentistry.
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I have a shop now (chop shop) with an unquestionable level of expertise and pretty good business sense.
Last year my net was a little over $500,000.
If you think running a practice is not running a business, join the army and be an unmotivated, lazy career army dentist.
 
OP: interesting thread but it seems your numbers are off. You're very conservitive with the GP salary and not at all conservitive with the corperates.
Lets get real - what does it take to make it to the top of a highly competitive, volitile, and changing field like business? One very talented & lucky person. Even then as others have stated the length of time you will hold that position is dependent on alot of factors outside your control.
Also it seems the dentist salary was pretty low. I think 2008 ADA stated average net earnings were 208k/yr. If we were to assume this dentist had as much luck, and intelligence as your business man we could assume his salary would be much more as this is the average.
I think money is a large motivating factor but I think it is wise to at least enjoy the idea of what you do or better yet have some sort of passion for oral health and the impact you're able to have in other peoples life. I think dentistry is a great privilege.

But yeah... most dont make it past middle management, much less VP.
 
dentalWorks said:
Im sorry to burst your bubble, but money IS EVERYTHING. It may not be the #1 motivator for the very few but trust me, it ranks at least #2.
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I can tell you this for 100% certainty - money IS NOT EVERYTHING! To most people who have not experienced life, who don't have families or who were raised in wealthy families - you might think money is everything. (before you say it, I already know you are or are about to turn 29 - so you don't need to bring the I've experienced life...blah...blah..blah card out). But there are PLENTY of people who will disagree - I am one of those. To me it isn't in the top 5. If money was a major factor - I would have chosen to go to medical school where the potential is greater. Now, that I am a father, all I really care about is that I am able to take care of my kids. Money doesn't drive happiness. You may think so, but I have personally seen what money can do to happiness of a family. I've seen more families who barely squeak by live happy lives and not regret where there lives led them than I have seen families that are well off. Money can buy you toys, a nice house, nice clothes, etc., but never happiness! It can make you not have to worry about how you are going to pay for bills, how you are going to put food on the table, etc, but money won't make you appreciate life.
 
NAVY DDS 2010 said:
I can tell you this for 100% certainty - money IS NOT EVERYTHING! To most people who have not experienced life, who don't have families or who were raised in wealthy families - you might think money is everything. (before you say it, I already know you are or are about to turn 29 - so you don't need to bring the I've experienced life...blah...blah..blah card out). But there are PLENTY of people who will disagree - I am one of those. To me it isn't in the top 5. If money was a major factor - I would have chosen to go to medical school where the potential is greater. Now, that I am a father, all I really care about is that I am able to take care of my kids. Money doesn't drive happiness. You may think so, but I have personally seen what money can do to happiness of a family. I've seen more families who barely squeak by live happy lives and not regret where there lives led them than I have seen families that are well off.

Mr. experience have you seen how broke families look like w/o money. you ask them they will tell you money will only bring happiness to their life.
Money can buy you toys, a nice house, nice clothes, etc., but never happiness! It can make you not have to worry about how you are going to pay for bills, how you are going to put food on the table, etc, but money won't make you appreciate life.
Click to expand...

Dont take this personally, i can prove money can bring you happiness...

lets take this scenario (i hope this never EVER happens pure example nothing personal) you kids get really sick to the point where both of them need a major operation which costs 100k each. But you only have a mealy hourly wage job, you and you wife both work hard to save like 10$k over um... say 3 years... now YOU DO NOT HAVE HEALTH INSURANCE as do most hourly wage workers... now you are set back 200k$. then you file for bankruptcy b/c you cant pay any of your bills... now then same thing happens AGAIN where you gonna get the money are you going to be happy being stressed out not being to pay any bills? so does money actually = happiness? well you tell me.
 
peanutb123 said:
Dont take this personally, i can prove money can bring you happiness...

lets take this scenario (i hope this never EVER happens pure example nothing personal) you kids get really sick to the point where both of them need a major operation which costs 100k each. But you only have a mealy hourly wage job, you and you wife both work hard to save like 10$k over um... say 3 years... now YOU DO NOT HAVE HEALTH INSURANCE as do most hourly wage workers... now you are set back 200k$. then you file for bankruptcy b/c you cant pay any of your bills... now then same thing happens AGAIN where you gonna get the money are you going to be happy being stressed out not being to pay any bills? so does money actually = happiness? well you tell me.
Click to expand...

This is true for many Americans, not to mention countries that doesn't even have health insurance. However, this person in your example would be happy to take a corporate job any day instead of going through many years of school to be a dentist for money.
 
Money =/= Happiness

However.....LACK of money will almost definitely cause misery
 
"Ever seen someone frown while riding a jet-ski?" -Daniel Tosh

Didnt think so.
 
IMO, if you are a driven individual doing something that you are strongly interested in and feel passionate about, you will make out just fine. i don't care how much $$ you make, if you don't enjoy the one activity that you must perform 9 hours per day, five times a week, for THIRTY years, you will NEVER be happy.
 
OP, Department of Labor only accounts for employee dentist most are Professional Associations PA or Sole proprietors these statistics are not kept by the department of labor. Also, your charts do not account for dentist having a 4 day and some 3 day work weeks. You are correct that money should not be the main motivation but that goes the same for corporate America. Illicit behavior should not be tolerated anywhere I would hate the dentist who sold me something I didn't want just as much as I would hate the lender who gave me a mortgage with hidden fees and rate hikes. Also one of the greatest benefits of working as a dentist is the sky is truly the limit you can franchise into corporate chains if you want to and have the perseverance. A corporate job will always have a cap. If you start out in Rank n File you will only climb so far but if you start out in R&D that is a different story(but this is not what you are speaking of). You will never be CEO from a humble rank n file unless you bring something to the company and those top spots will always go to graduates of ivy business schools. Corporate America is like climbing up a mountain made of dead bodies with a constant avalanche of crap coming down on you.
 
Money sure is not everything in life but without the monetary restrictions, things are much better off.

I don't want to have millions of dollars saved up in my bank account, but I want to have enough so that I can do whatever things whenever I want. Basically, money allows you to LIVE YOUR OWN LIFE. With money, you are answerable to no one.

Dentistry can do that for me while doing the work I like.
 
That's funny because the last 7 dentists I talked to mentioned that dentistry is a good career because it pays well.

I've even had physicians tell me they would have done dentistry if they did it again because they have the possibility to make more money.

It's refreshing to see that people on here have the maturity to admit that money is an important motivator.

Plumbers, janitors, and trash-men all help people too.
 
NAVY DDS 2010 said:
I can tell you this for 100% certainty - money IS NOT EVERYTHING! To most people who have not experienced life, who don't have families or who were raised in wealthy families - you might think money is everything. (before you say it, I already know you are or are about to turn 29 - so you don't need to bring the I've experienced life...blah...blah..blah card out). But there are PLENTY of people who will disagree - I am one of those. To me it isn't in the top 5. If money was a major factor - I would have chosen to go to medical school where the potential is greater. Now, that I am a father, all I really care about is that I am able to take care of my kids. Money doesn't drive happiness. You may think so, but I have personally seen what money can do to happiness of a family. I've seen more families who barely squeak by live happy lives and not regret where there lives led them than I have seen families that are well off. Money can buy you toys, a nice house, nice clothes, etc., but never happiness! It can make you not have to worry about how you are going to pay for bills, how you are going to put food on the table, etc, but money won't make you appreciate life.
Click to expand...

whoa....lets take these one step at a time...

" But there are PLENTY of people who will disagree"
True, but MAJORITY of people (whether they admit it or not) believe money is a huge motivator for pursuing a career in dentistry

"I would have chosen to go to medical school where the potential is greater"
simply not true.... the potential for both is pretty high. Your making this HUGE argument about how money isn't important to you, yet you are mentioning how much more "potential" money is in medicine vs dentistry. Looks like there is something eating you up inside.

"Money doesn't drive happiness"
Hmm... when did I ever mention anything about happiness? My post was mostly directed towards the motivator for this field, in none of my posts did I ever mention happiness being equated with money.



and Lastly, you simply can't make the argument that money will have family members not speak to each other lol, this is just silly. Have you seen what happens to family who need money and both parents are working $10 hour jobs and aren't able to afford essential needs? I have, and it tears up families apart. Money does NOT buy you happiness... but it sure makes living in this world a better experience.
 
Money may not buy happiness, but Id rather be sad while driving an M3 than while driving a Corolla.
 
Being the son of a pharmacist it has been cool to have a parent that can help you when you can't get to the doctor. His profession was a real asset to his family. Everyone's gotta go to the dentist, why not go to your dad.

That being said here are the reasons why I picked dentistry
1) You can own your own business
2) You can plan your own hours
3) You can make really good money
4) Job security: People will always need dental care
5) I can be home at a decent time to be there for my wife and kids
6) You don't have to work on Sundays

Money is definitely on the list, but there are a lot of factors.
 
Blue Panther said:
1. You did not account for inflation.
2. ADA reports the average general dentist salary to be $200k. Your excel did not even reach $180k at the peak of its dental career (which would be higher than $200k due to #1).
3. You did not account for the number of work hours per week.
Click to expand...

If i remember correctly, the $200K figure refers to Independent Practice Owners (including both general dentist owners and specialist owners and averaging their net earnings together) and not associated dentists. To get to the 200K marker, the dentists would need to purchase into a PP adding a practice loan on top of their student loans.
 
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