Moonlighting Gig: Share with colleagues or keep to self?

[twospadz]

Real situation. I found a good psychiatry moonlighting gig before 3rd year started in July. Ill be making 12000+ both months of July and August each from moonlighting alone. Other residents in my program are looking for moonlighting jobs. I found this one by cold calling. There are barely any left over shifts at the end of the month at this place. I talked to other residents and attendings at my program who said its better to share or help other residents if they wanted to work at this place too. I feel that if another resident was working at a place, it would only respectful not to try to work at the same place unless it was internal moonlighting or really associated with the residency program. Am i wrong to feel this way or no? I want to help my fellow residents but not to my detriment.

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[rokshana]

Real situation. I found a good psychiatry moonlighting gig before 3rd year started in July. It pays 140 hr. Ill be making 12000+ both months of July and August each from moonlighting alone. Other residents in my program are looking for moonlighting jobs. I found this one by cold calling. There are barely any left over shifts at the end of the month at this place. I talked to other residents and attendings at my program who said its better to share or help other residents if they wanted to work at this place too. I feel that if another resident was working at a place, it would only respectful not to try to work at the same place unless it was internal moonlighting or really associated with the residency program. Am i wrong to feel this way or no?

If the place needs help, then it doesn’t hurt to tell your co residents...if you are afraid that by telling your co residents about this place you will get less shifts, then don’t.

 

[twospadz]

If the place help, them it doesn’t hurt to tell your co residents...if you are afraid that by telling your co residents about this place you will get less shifts, then don’t.

They already know about the place sort of because I told them since most people are curious about me moonlighting. One resident at my program already contacted the psych director at this job to get a position but he is having issues with our residency program director so he knows he wont get the sign off to moonlight so he stopped pursuing. There are a few others who have shown moonlighting interest. Im just saying. I have been obscure about some details from this point on. But it still is annoying

 

[Merely]

Were you the one that wanted to rat on your co resident because he was moonlighting too much?

 

[gutonc]

Were you the one that wanted to rat on your co resident because he was moonlighting too much?

Yup.

 

[Merely]

Yup.

LOL I feel like he’s trolling at this point

 

[Mass Effect]

Real situation. I found a good psychiatry moonlighting gig before 3rd year started in July. It pays 140 hr. Ill be making 12000+ both months of July and August each from moonlighting alone. Other residents in my program are looking for moonlighting jobs. I found this one by cold calling. There are barely any left over shifts at the end of the month at this place. I talked to other residents and attendings at my program who said its better to share or help other residents if they wanted to work at this place too. I feel that if another resident was working at a place, it would only respectful not to try to work at the same place unless it was internal moonlighting or really associated with the residency program. Am i wrong to feel this way or no? I want to help my fellow residents but not to my detriment.

You're either breaking duty hours (which applies to moonlighting) or you are wrong on the amount you're going to earn. You'd have to work 90 hours/month to make that much at $140/hour.

 

[twospadz]

You're either breaking duty hours (which applies to moonlighting) or you are wrong on the amount you're going to earn. You'd have to work 90 hours/month to make that much at $140/hour.

I wouldn't "have" to be breaking duty hours. You can't work more than 80 hours per week per ACGME rules. In third year psychiatry, we work max 40 hours a week and have weekend call only once a month for 16 hours. So 3 weeks 40 hours and one week 56. Which means I can work technically over 120 hours moonlighting without breaking duty hours. And Im not wrong on how much Im gonna make. This month Im making over 12000+ but Im not gonna post the amount because people will freak out saying Im working too many hours.

Also, everyone this situation is real. Im not trolling. I promise. That previous post of the ratting was uncalled for. Im sorry about that. But this situation is 100% real.

 

[rokshana]

I wouldn't "have" to be breaking duty hours. You can't work more than 80 hours per week per ACGME rules. In third year psychiatry, we work max 40 hours a week and have weekend call only once a month for 16 hours. So 3 weeks 40 hours and one week 56. Which means I can work technically over 120 hours moonlighting without breaking duty hours. And Im not wrong on how much Im gonna make. This month Im making over 12000+ but Im not gonna post the amount because people will freak out saying Im working too many hours.

Also, everyone this situation is real. Im not trolling. I promise. That previous post of the ratting was uncalled for. Im sorry about that. But this situation is 100% real.

That’s approx 86 hours a month meaning >20 hrs/week...yeah you may not “technically “ be breaking duty hours but still a lot of time...does your PD know that you are working that much time?

 

[Mass Effect]

Except that according to your last post, your residency forbids you from working moonlighting gigs on weeknights, which means the 90 hours a month has to be during weekends. So how are you raking in 90 hours worth of work during 7 days (total number of weekends minus the one 16-hour shift) without breaking duty hours, which by the way, includes one day off in seven averaged over 4 weeks.

 

[rokshana]

Except that according to your last post, your residency forbids you from working moonlighting gigs on weeknights, which means the 90 hours a month has to be during weekends. So how are you raking in 90 hours worth of work during 7 days (total number of weekends minus the one 16-hour shift) without breaking duty hours, which by the way, includes one day off in seven averaged over 4 weeks.

And 10 hours between working shifts...have to be violating that .

 

[emergentmd]

Rat on Others = NEVER

Keep a good moonlighting gig as a resident = I probably would if this was a diamond in the rough. If this really is a unicorn, this place will be flooded with residents and rate will go down.

 

[twospadz]

I can work on Fridays nights which is allowed. Also working 24 hr is allowed too because during pgy 2 we have had to work those on call.

 

[twospadz]

Rat on Others = NEVER

Keep a good moonlighting gig as a resident = I probably would if this was a diamond in the rough. If this really is a unicorn, this place will be flooded with residents and rate will go down.

This is so far a unicorn job.

 

[twospadz]

That’s approx 86 hours a month meaning >20 hrs/week...yeah you may not “technically “ be breaking duty hours but still a lot of time...does your PD know that you are working that much time?

As long as I get my work done and dont break the 80 hr rule, why would my PD care? He or she shouldnt especially when there are others things more important.

 

[Mass Effect]

I can work on Fridays nights which is allowed. If I work a 24 hr, friday night and saturday morning then work sunday morning that is 37 hrs in one weekend. Each shift is approximately 13.5 hours each. So 3 weekends would be over 90s hours. So yes, i can do over 90 hrs and not break duty hours. Also working 24 hr is allowed too because during pgy 2 we have had to work those on call.

And those 4 days you're supposed to have off in a month? Hey, you seem pretty sure of yourself, so run it by GME and let them tell you what's up.

 

[twospadz]

And those 4 days you're supposed to have off in a month? Hey, you seem pretty sure of yourself, so run it by GME and let them tell you what's up.

I rather just do this quietly, make my money, I definitely not trying to mess this up for me by getting anyone involved.

 

[rokshana]

As long as I get my work done and dont break the 80 hr rule, why would my PD care? He or she shouldnt especially when there are others things more important.

80 hours is not the only part of
Duty hours...as mentioned, there is the 4 days off per month and 10 hours between work...that one is the one that many violate more than the others.

 

[Piebaldi]

I rather just do this quietly, make my money, I definitely not trying to mess this up for me by getting anyone involved.

I would be wary of this - and this is coming from someone who wants to moonlight during their fellowship but is not allowed to. Is it really worth having your program find out, and potentially getting put on probation/reprimanded, etc? It seems that things have tightened up more recently, and that there is close monitoring of certain things. i would not risk my position in a program over moonlighting. sure the money is nice but unless you are truly struggling (and this is not a judgment) you really have to weight the pros and cons of what you are doing.

think what would happen if the program finds out? we don't want you to be coming back in a few months asking for advice on how to find a new position after your program put you on probation or fired you.

as always prevention is key!

 

[Mass Effect]

I rather just do this quietly, make my money, I definitely not trying to mess this up for me by getting anyone involved.

Pretty sure ANY moonlighting gig needs to be approved by your PD/GME. If you choose to forego that step, don't be shocked when you get into a ton of trouble and risk your job, especially when you've already made a point of trying to get your colleagues in trouble for the same thing.

 

[twospadz]

My moonlighting position was approved by my PD. As part of the credentialing process, they actually had to fax over documents attesting to my clinical skills to my moonlighting job twice. Im just saying that every little step I make with this job does not have to be informed to my program director. If Im not breaking the 80 hour work week limit, then I will just moonlight in peace even if Im working a lot of hours. I don't even think its really possibly to moonlight nowadays without your PD approval.

But lets re-focus on the question at hand. I really think I will try to keep this position to myself. Its only right. I will pass it on once I leave residency to a junior resident.

 

[twospadz]

Pretty sure ANY moonlighting gig needs to be approved by your PD/GME. If you choose to forego that step, don't be shocked when you get into a ton of trouble and risk your job, especially when you've already made a point of trying to get your colleagues in trouble for the same thing.

I wasn't trying to get my colleagues in trouble. I already disclosed in the previous post that wasn't the case.

 

[hamstergang]

Pretty sure ANY moonlighting gig needs to be approved by your PD/GME. If you choose to forego that step, don't be shocked when you get into a ton of trouble and risk your job, especially when you've already made a point of trying to get your colleagues in trouble for the same thing.

That thread was clearly him asking about what others might think about him.

 

[ThoracicGuy]

Real situation. I found a good psychiatry moonlighting gig before 3rd year started in July. Ill be making 12000+ both months of July and August each from moonlighting alone. Other residents in my program are looking for moonlighting jobs. I found this one by cold calling. There are barely any left over shifts at the end of the month at this place. I talked to other residents and attendings at my program who said its better to share or help other residents if they wanted to work at this place too. I feel that if another resident was working at a place, it would only respectful not to try to work at the same place unless it was internal moonlighting or really associated with the residency program. Am i wrong to feel this way or no? I want to help my fellow residents but not to my detriment.

 

[aafisahar]

That’s approx 86 hours a month meaning >20 hrs/week...yeah you may not “technically “ be breaking duty hours but still a lot of time...does your PD know that you are working that much time?

oh please, I broke duty hours all the time moonlighting. I'd do a 24 then moonlight the next day. Work 30+ days straight, etc etc. As long as nothing was unsafe, it's fine by me. Treat administrators like mushrooms, feed them **** and keep them in the dark.

 

[rokshana]

oh please, I broke duty hours all the time moonlighting. I'd do a 24 then moonlight the next day. Work 30+ days straight, etc etc. As long as nothing was unsafe, it's fine by me. Treat administrators like mushrooms, feed them **** and keep them in the dark.

Dude, we all broke duty hours even without moonlighting...I remember being in the icu long after 30 hours was up because ihad a dufus for an intern that I literally had to make a checklist for...that was then, now programs are far more strict to the rules...prolly because residents today expect a work/life balance...and in this day and age, violating duty hours, especially due to moonlighting work can get you on probation or terminated... the extra money is not worth potentially ending your career.

 

[GonnaBeADoc2222]

The class above me pulled such shenanigans that they nearly ruined the moonlighting opportunities for us below them.

People would pay other residents to pick up their residency shifts so that they could go moonlight.

Another guy actually called out sick to a shift so that he could moonlight externally.

 

[Dr.LeoSpaceman]

Another guy actually called out sick to a shift so that he could moonlight externally.

Well, maybe the extra shift provided more financial security which contributed to his overall mental wellbeing. In that case, let's just call it a "mental health day" which precludes second-guessing.

 

[Mass Effect]

oh please, I broke duty hours all the time moonlighting. I'd do a 24 then moonlight the next day. Work 30+ days straight, etc etc. As long as nothing was unsafe, it's fine by me. Treat administrators like mushrooms, feed them **** and keep them in the dark.

Great way to get yourself terminated, then come here to whine about how you were unfairly targeted by your malignant program.