MS4 with too much time on my hands. Ask anything.

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.

boaz

shanah alef
10+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Joined
Dec 31, 2007
Messages
1,373
Reaction score
25
...and go

Members don't see this ad.
 
Members don't see this ad :)
What type of curriculum does your school have for the pre-clinical years? Is it traditional, PBL, organ system? And how did you feel about it?
 
What type of curriculum does your school have for the pre-clinical years? Is it traditional, PBL, organ system? And how did you feel about it?

My school's curriculum is currently changing to organ system, which I think is better than how it used to be.

I imagine you asked because you want to know if certain curricula are better than others. In my opinion, most medical students are self motivated and will learn the material no matter how it is presented. The type of curriculum has little to do with success on the boards. I wouldn't rank that factor too highly when deciding between medical schools.
 
As someone who is seeing the light at the end of the tunnel (doing surgery as my last clerkship), make MS4 sound as delicious as possible.

:( that's unfortunate, I have a buddy who's on inpatient surgery right now and it sounds like the pits.

OP, do you think that time as a second semester m4 would be well spent doing hard rotations to get the most experience before you hit intern year? I remember someone saying something about how they got to do a bunch of procedures because they stuck around and the residents weren't so busy trying to pump up their numbers. Also they were into the groove of things so had more time to teach.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Anything you would recommend to first years? Any study habit you found particularly useful but took you a while to discover? Did you do research, if so when? Do you look back on pre-clinical years with happiness? Does it feel like 4 years flew by?
 
:( that's unfortunate, I have a buddy who's on inpatient surgery right now and it sounds like the pits.

OP, do you think that time as a second semester m4 would be well spent doing hard rotations to get the most experience before you hit intern year? I remember someone saying something about how they got to do a bunch of procedures because they stuck around and the residents weren't so busy trying to pump up their numbers. Also they were into the groove of things so had more time to teach.

In principal it's a good idea and a lot of people do it. But I'm really over being in the awkward role of the med student, so I decided to take it easy. There will be plenty of opportunities to do procedures in intern year.
I'll have to admit, though, that I've been reading Cecil Medicine for fun the past few months :-/
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
My school's curriculum is currently changing to organ system, which I think is better than how it used to be.

I imagine you asked because you want to know if certain curricula are better than others. In my opinion, most medical students are self motivated and will learn the material no matter how it is presented. The type of curriculum has little to do with success on the boards. I wouldn't rank that factor too highly when deciding between medical schools.

Thanks. I'm more curious about what's more "enjoyable" and I guess like a lot of things it varies from person to person. I just like to hear pros and cons about each curriculum type from people that have gone through it.
 
In principal it's a good idea and a lot of people do it. But I'm really over being in the awkward role of the med student, so I decided to take it easy. There will be plenty of opportunities to do procedures in intern year.
I'll have to admit, though, that I've been reading Cecil Medicine for fun the past few months :-/

We're in the process of designing our MS4 schedules now, and I decided to go with a "end with a bang" approach. I'll be going into psych, so I'm doing a month-long rotation on the C/L service in May prior to graduation. I really, really want the time off, but as it is I'd basically do zero clinical work starting in February or March through graduation. I'd hate to walk into intern year that... "rusty," I suppose.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
Step 1? Research during med school? If so, what kind? Do you attend an MD or DO school?
 
Members don't see this ad :)
I'm ending with Peds and our peds rotation is notorious for being filled with passive aggressive residents. Lord help me. M4 literally could not come any sooner. 2 more months...The very fact that you have so much time on your hand makes me quiver in excitement.
 
Roughly how much debt will you have after medical school?

Was your curriculum P/F?
 
Thanks. I'm more curious about what's more "enjoyable" and I guess like a lot of things it varies from person to person. I just like to hear pros and cons about each curriculum type from people that have gone through it.

I would say the organ-system curriculum, where you learn everything pertaining to each organ (physio, pathophys, pharm, histo, etc.) is more enjoyable.

Step 1? Research during med school? If so, what kind? Do you attend an MD or DO school?

My Step 1 was 253. I did a month of translation research during my fourth year. Nothing big, just to get my feet wet. MD school.

Roughly how much debt will you have after medical school?

Was your curriculum P/F?

1. Well below average :)
2. Preclincal were P/F, 3rd year was H/HP/P/F
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
I would say the organ-system curriculum, where you learn everything pertaining to each organ (physio, pathophys, pharm, histo, etc.) is more enjoyable.



My Step 1 was 253. I did a month of translation research during my fourth year. Nothing big, just to get my feet wet. MD school.



1. Well below average :)
2. Preclincal were P/F, 3rd year was H/HP/P/F
Wow. Great step score. How do you suggest we plebeians study for step 1 (aside from doing well in class)?
 
My Step 1 was 253. I did a month of translation research during my fourth year. Nothing big, just to get my feet wet. MD school.

That's great!! Now you just have to get into a top IM program. :p
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
how often do you eat tacos?
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
What do you know now that you wish you knew before you started medical school?
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
I'm just bumming around. Literally.



Internal Medicine with future plans for Cardiology or Pulm/Critical Care

I'm assuming that critical care medicine is more "hours heavy" than other IM specialities.

Again, thanks for doing this thread!
 
I'm starting M1 this summer. What advice do you have for studying, free time, and keeping your sanity?
 
Is there anything you wish you had done differently now that you are a wise M4?
 
M/F? Are you in a relationship? If so, were you in the same relationship when you began med school? Is romance in med school possible? I don't want to get married post 30 :(
 
I'm assuming that critical care medicine is more "hours heavy" than other IM specialities.

Again, thanks for doing this thread!

The hours are harder (e.g. lots of night call), indeed. Cardiology is like that too.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
What do you know now that you wish you knew before you started medical school?

I wish I'd have taken to heart the advice I was given to keep up my hobbies. When things got super busy (e.g. during anatomy), I thought it would be like that for the rest of med school. Then I realized that it's really on and off. Sometimes it's busy, other times there was plenty of free time.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
Congrats on the awesome Step 1 Score!

What would you have done differently during undergrad if you had the chance to?
 
I'm starting M1 this summer. What advice do you have for studying, free time, and keeping your sanity?

Like most other M1 students, you will probably freak out about the sheer volume you need to learn. But you will figure out a way that works for you. Everyone does.
Try to use some of your free time for things that nurture mental health. Whatever it is that works for you. For me, it was cycling and running outdoors during M1 and M2. During M3 I somehow got into hard partying and the club scene (on off weekends, obviously). I wouldn't necessarily advise doing too much of that ;-)
 
Is there anything you wish you had done differently now that you are a wise M4?
I would have been more savvy about who's @$$ to kiss during clerkships and who to ask for evaluations so as to get better clinical grades. But that's a whole different skill level that I was not born with.
 
M/F? Are you in a relationship? If so, were you in the same relationship when you began med school? Is romance in med school possible? I don't want to get married post 30 :(

Male, single
Romance is totally possible. I went through a few relationships during med school. None of them ended for the reason that I have comparatively less free time. That was never an issue. I can't common on marriages or otherwise very serious relationship because I wasn't in one during my time in med school.
 
What studying techniques did you use for the high volume of information in med school?

Also, how many hours on average do you sleep a night?

Did you have a better time in medical school or undergrad?

Lastly, did you feel like you fit in better during medical school than in undergrad?


Thanks!
 
Congrats on the awesome Step 1 Score!

What would you have done differently during undergrad if you had the chance to?
You mean in terms of success during med school itself or getting into med school? If it's the former, I really can't think of anything. Undergrad really doesn't prepare you for med school beyond the foundations science background needed for biochem, genetics, and physio.
 
Male, single
Romance is totally possible. I went through a few relationships during med school. None of them ended for the reason that I have comparatively less free time. That was never an issue. I can't common on marriages or otherwise very serious relationship because I wasn't in one during my time in med school.

Bench press?
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
What studying techniques did you use for the high volume of information in med school?

Also, how many hours on average do you sleep a night?

Did you have a better time in medical school or undergrad?

Lastly, did you feel like you fit in better during medical school than in undergrad?


Thanks!
1. I just kept reading it over and over. And over. Sometimes I would transcribe a lecture in my own words so I remember them better. Some people like to draw out graphics on paper. I never did that. Like I mentioned above, different strokes for different folks.
2. It really depends on the time. During a heavy rotation there were times when I'd sleep just 6 hours. Rarely less than that. Unless I was on call late and had to be back very early. Sleep is very rarely an issue.
3. Honestly, I had a better time in undergrad. I could choose to take whatever class/professor I wanted to. In grad school you gotta do what you gotta do. Having said that, I really did enjoy my time in med school. It's just that there's less freedom to choose what you want to do.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
1. Do you do research? If so, what kind?

2. Is there time to do research during medical school?

3. What is the difference when shadowing in MS1 and MS2 compared to shadowing as an undergrad? Are you allowed to help as a medical student?

4. What was the hardest course you took in medical school?

5. Did you develop a good relationship with friends in your class?
 
How did you schedule interviews with residencies during your 4th year? Did you have to ask your school for time off or the specific departments where you were doing the rotations? Do you know if someone would be penalized if they went to a lot of interviews and had to take numerous days off?

Thanks for taking the time out to answer our questions. They've been very enlightening so far.
 
1. Do you do research? If so, what kind?

2. Is there time to do research during medical school?

3. What is the difference when shadowing in MS1 and MS2 compared to shadowing as an undergrad? Are you allowed to help as a medical student?

4. What was the hardest course you took in medical school?

5. Did you develop a good relationship with friends in your class?

1. I did a month of translation research in immuonology during my fourth year. Collected samples from patients in clinic and worked with it in lab.
2. Yes, there is definitely time. For something more involving like a serious lab project, most students take a year off.
3. Typically you do get to do a little more. If you've already learned how to take a history and perform a physical exam, you can do that (assuming the doc has time for it). This is in the voluntary setting. There are mandatory courses you take during M1/2 in most schools, in which you are expected to do those things.
4. For me the hardest was anatomy. It's just pure memorization of cold hard facts. Not my cup of tea.
5. I have lived most of my life in the same city as my med school is in, so my social network was outside of school. I didn't really socialize with my class.

How did you schedule interviews with residencies during your 4th year? Did you have to ask your school for time off or the specific departments where you were doing the rotations? Do you know if someone would be penalized if they went to a lot of interviews and had to take numerous days off?

Thanks for taking the time out to answer our questions. They've been very enlightening so far.

Interviews take place within a span of 3-4 months. I was able to schedule either vacation or electives during those months. During electives there is an implicit understanding that you can take off for an interview day. Pretty much everyone abides by that understanding.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
I would have been more savvy about who's @$$ to kiss during clerkships and who to ask for evaluations so as to get better clinical grades. But that's a whole different skill level that I was not born with.

I heard about this from other MS3 and MS4 as well. So do you just ask the clerkship directors in advance about my evaluators? Or is it anonymous and usually you figure it out through word of mouth? I am curious on how exactly it works.
 
Any regrets about your decision to go into medicine?
 
Was it hard getting the away rotations that you wanted?

What was your favorite part about medical school?

What did you do during your free time?

Are the professors generally caring? Or do they just teach and leave?

Are you at your first choice school?

What qualities did you look for in a residency program?
 
I heard about this from other MS3 and MS4 as well. So do you just ask the clerkship directors in advance about my evaluators? Or is it anonymous and usually you figure it out through word of mouth? I am curious on how exactly it works.
That's pretty much it
Any regrets about your decision to go into medicine?
Not at all. Med school is tough and there are lots of frustrations, but I never regretted my decision. When I'm working in the wards and loving it, I know I've made the right decision.
Was it hard getting the away rotations that you wanted?

What was your favorite part about medical school?

What did you do during your free time?

Are the professors generally caring? Or do they just teach and leave?

Are you at your first choice school?

What qualities did you look for in a residency program?

1. I only applied for one away rotation and it was not at all difficult to get. Having said that, I'm in IM and away rotations aren't really needed. I can't comment on the more competitive things, like getting an away rotation in derm at the Brigham.
2. My favorite part of med school was my subinternship. It's because it's the closest thing to practicing medicine in med school.
3. I used to bike around the city a lot (great stress relief), and I'd frequently go out at night when it wasn't busy. I caught up on lots of movies and TV shows during MS4.
4. A lot of the lecturers were research people, so they would come give the lecture and leave. However, there are also small group leaders (MDs or PhDs), and you definitely get the opportunity to get to know them. They lead small groups because they like teaching, which usually means that they'd be glad to get to know you and help.
5. Yes, I am at my first choice.
6.
-Tertiary care center. You get more interesting and complicated cases than at a community hosp.
-Learning culture, i.e. is the hospital and program oriented towards residency education, or are we just employees doing the bidding of various private attendings?
-Geography. Residency is already pretty isolating, so you want to be in an area where you can have a life outside of work.
-Some residencies have a reputation for malignancy and you want to avoid those at all costs. It can make life really difficult.
-Prestige. Sure it's nice to be able to tell family and friends that you are training at Brigham, but in practical terms it's not that valuable unless you see yourself going into a hardcore academic research career.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2 users
That's pretty much it

Not at all. Med school is tough and there are lots of frustrations, but I never regretted my decision. When I'm working in the wards and loving it, I know I've made the right decision.


1. I only applied for one away rotation and it was not at all difficult to get. Having said that, I'm in IM and away rotations aren't really needed. I can't comment on the more competitive things, like getting an away rotation in derm at the Brigham.
2. My favorite part of med school was my subinternship. It's because it's the closest thing to practicing medicine in med school.
3. I used to bike around the city a lot (great stress relief), and I'd frequently go out at night when it wasn't busy. I caught up on lots of movies and TV shows during MS4.
4. A lot of the lecturers were research people, so they would come give the lecture and leave. However, there are also small group leaders (MDs or PhDs), and you definitely get the opportunity to get to know them. They lead small groups because they like teaching, which usually means that they'd be glad to get to know you and help.
5. Yes, I am at my first choice.
6.
-Tertiary care center. You get more interesting and complicated cases than at a community hosp.
-Learning culture, i.e. is the hospital and program oriented towards residency education, or are we just employees doing the bidding of various private attendings?
-Geography. Residency is already pretty isolating, so you want to be in an area where you can have a life outside of work.
-Some residencies have a reputation for malignancy and you want to avoid those at all costs. It can make life really difficult.
-Prestige. Sure it's nice to be able to tell family and friends that you are training at Brigham, but in practical terms it's not that valuable unless you see yourself going into a hardcore academic research career.

Thank you for your comments. I had a few follow-up questions.

1) I was curious on how you apply for away rotations. You just go online, fill out away rotation application for each school/hospital, and you hope for an acceptance?

2) Let's say someone is from a low-tier medical school but went to a competitive hospital/institution for residency training. Does it mean he has a good chance to go into academic medicine even though he did not come from a relatively well known medical school?
 
1. I'm not familiar with subinternships, what was it like and did you get it? Are they hard to get into or are they popular?

2. I'm not sure if you mentioned this, but how did you perform so well on the step 1?

3. Did your step score play a big part into your acceptance to your residency?

4. What shows did you watch/catch up on during MS4.

5. How much time where you alloted to study for your step 1?

6. If the future would you prefer going into private practice or stay with a hosital?

7. Are you interested in academic medicine?
 
Outside of lecture/lab, how many hours a day did you study during pre-clinical years?
 
Rosie O'Donnell, Shia Labeouf, Hitler.

Gotta marry one, **** one and kill one, go.

I think the last guy is taken.

hitlstal.jpg
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
To the OP, what was your favorite thing about the pre-clinical years, if anything at all?
 
Thank you for your comments. I had a few follow-up questions.

1) I was curious on how you apply for away rotations. You just go online, fill out away rotation application for each school/hospital, and you hope for an acceptance?

2) Let's say someone is from a low-tier medical school but went to a competitive hospital/institution for residency training. Does it mean he has a good chance to go into academic medicine even though he did not come from a relatively well known medical school?
1. There's a website called VSAS that most (there are a significant number of exceptions) schools use and that makes it a seamless process. It could be a bit more cumbersome for the schools that don't use VSAS, but I can't imagine that it's a big deal.
2. Correct. That holds for residency as well as fellowship. You have opportunities to work with serious researchers and that can get you plugged into a solid academic career.
1. I'm not familiar with subinternships, what was it like and did you get it? Are they hard to get into or are they popular?

2. I'm not sure if you mentioned this, but how did you perform so well on the step 1?

3. Did your step score play a big part into your acceptance to your residency?

4. What shows did you watch/catch up on during MS4.

5. How much time where you alloted to study for your step 1?

6. If the future would you prefer going into private practice or stay with a hosital?

7. Are you interested in academic medicine?

1. A subinternship is a required rotation in most schools. It's basically a level of responsibility that is between a third year med student and an intern (first year resident).
2. I honestly don't know why, but I just tend to do well on standardized exams. I don't have a special secret study method.
3. Yes, though it would have played a bigger role if I was applying into a more competitive specialty and needed an edge.
4. I systematically worked my way through all of Seinfeld. And a bunch of random movies.
5. 6 weeks. I used all of it.
6. I plan to work for a hospital (critical care is by nature a hospital-based specialty)
7. Perhaps, though I'm more interested in the teaching side than the research.

Outside of lecture/lab, how many hours a day did you study during pre-clinical years?

Anywhere from 1 during biochemistry (I was a chem major in college) to 10 during neuroanatomy (memorizing factoids doesn't come easy for me). It really depends on the time. Med school really is a roller coster. Good times bad times, you know I've had my share...

To the OP, what was your favorite thing about the pre-clinical years, if anything at all?

I liked second year pathology the most. That's because it's the most relevant to clinical medicine.
 
1. Would you say that medical school favors students who can memorize better or students who understand better? (I know this sounds like a silly question).

2. What does it take to get into the teaching side of academic medicine?
 
Top