MSPE comments

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soccergirl1234u

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Was wondering how heavily MSPE comments are weighted.

I feel like a lot of the comments are repeated for students - I compared mine with friends who had the same attendings and they all wrote the same things.

Don't admissions committees see this? What makes an MSPE comment stand out?

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They are. As long as it’s good who cares. I rotated with the same doctor five times and had the same thing on all then he finally came out and said something different on the fifth. Pretty good for not showing up at all last rotation. Guess he got his $$& worth and wanted to return the favor
 
Was wondering how heavily MSPE comments are weighted.

I feel like a lot of the comments are repeated for students - I compared mine with friends who had the same attendings and they all wrote the same things.

Don't admissions committees see this? What makes an MSPE comment stand out?

Unfortunately, I think this is especially true for DO schools. A lot of my evals were very short and generic. They would say something like "great student" and not elaborate.
 
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You can get an idea of how important the MSPE is in general for your specialty in the PD survey! Since basically everything else in your MSPE can be found elsewhere in your app, I would say the comments are probably the most important thing they’re looking at. It’s my understanding that in most cases, it doesn’t really help you, but if the comments are bad, it can def hurt.
 
I’m a resident at an university program. Most of my feedbacks that I give to fellows and medical students are like:

Nice guy/gal. Pleasure to work with.
Not a bad person...

LOL... If I find you to be terrible, you will get a detailed eval listing your deficiencies.
 
You can get an idea of how important the MSPE is in general for your specialty in the PD survey! Since basically everything else in your MSPE can be found elsewhere in your app, I would say the comments are probably the most important thing they’re looking at. It’s my understanding that in most cases, it doesn’t really help you, but if the comments are bad, it can def hurt.
Yeah my understanding from what PD and residents have told me or seen them say is that they basically just skim and make sure they are all positive. They are looking for anything bad (particularly anything related to professionalism). They know most attending are gunna just say the same short generic positive stuff. But if there’s something bad then that’s probably gunna hurt you.
 
MSPE letter was, in my experience, more of a means of checking the right boxes to show you're okay to graduate. Like, sure if your comments are amazing that will help. But they're mostly generic. I mean, for crying out loud, the Dean's statement is basically copy pasted in there.

"(Sardonix) was a (student) at my (university). They did (things) and (existed) here for (4) (years). Here are some things (he) wrote about (herself) in fancy language and would like you to (probably) know about:
- Most sandwiches eaten as an M2
- Leader of Underwater Curnfurggling Club
- Secretary of Lard Lovers Club

Its board scores were:
- Adequate

It's rotation comments include:
FM = "It's FM he didn't kill nobody congrats on the new PCP foot soldier, 5/5"
IM = "3/5 pass"
Neuro = 3/5 pass"
Ortho = "Really interested in Lard, 3/5 pass"
Surgery = "Amazing guy, loved yelling at him, deserves honors but I pathologically can't do that 3.000000000001/5 pass"
OB = "Just get him out of here 3/5 pass"
Psych = "Would love to have him as a patient, 3/5 pass"
Away Rotation = "Who? 3/5 pass"
Away Rotation 2 = "Curnfurggling? 3/5 pass"

As (Dean) I have (no) concerns regarding (its) (conduct) and (her) (academic performance) and/or (his) (undisclosed incident at the restaurant involving the Treasury Agency and industrial amounts of lard).

Thank you,
(Dean Deany of Deany Deans)
 
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Sardonix speaks the truth. Dean's letters also use a lot of coded language to let us know if you're a sociopath or hanging out with your two best friends as #174, 175 and 176/176 in your class. The comments from your attendings are typically unhelpful. Unless it says something like "thumbz vomited in an open abdomen" - then it carries some weight.
 
Sardonix speaks the truth. Dean's letters also use a lot of coded language to let us know if you're a sociopath or hanging out with your two best friends as #174, 175 and 176/176 in your class. The comments from your attendings are typically unhelpful. Unless it says something like "thumbz vomited in an open abdomen" - then it carries some weight.

I don't remember disclosing that information to you.
 
@thumbz @Sardonix hahaha i chuckled as i read your comments. thank you for the input! i don't have anything bad in my MSPE comments, but it just seemed boring and generic to me, so i wanted to make sure that wasn't unusual or a red flag.
 
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"X is a great/excellent/superior/distinguished candidate for your residency program"

Stuff like that

Myth. Didn’t have any of that. Doesn’t mean jack anyway.

Plain MSPE with solid board scores, with performances evaluated by multiple people being consistently above average against my peers IN RESIDENCY.

Residency is hard work, but my stress level compared to med school is back to minimal. I’m back to having time again to enjoy my life and actively read stuff pertaining to my interest.

Keys to success in residency:

1) Have a good attitude and don’t be a control freak as in caring only about the results and not gaf about the ways to skin a cat. Just chill and do good work. The only time that I was mildly stressed was when I had three pts on my census actively dying on me. Be calm bc you’re a doc and leader of your team.

2) Embrace the challenge of seeing a ton of pts. You learn a little more about a pathology with each pt

3) Learn to be adaptive and efficient. Goals are to pump out a new clinic pt note in 10-15 mins, inpatient admit note with all orders and med recs in 45-50 mins, and knock out all your progress notes 4-5 in the morning while you’re chart reviewing your pts before your pre-rounds.

Rinse and repeat, and try to read 8-10 pages of MKSAP per night.

Lastly, don’t bother being a gunner during your 4th yr doing these rough rotations in preparation for intern yr. lol. Enjoy your chill time off. I literally took the chillest rotations on the planet with min 3 day weekend on a weekly basis and am doing very well in residency.

Enjoy the process and breathe a little bit guys.
 
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Wait, that’s a bad comment?

They use to to give percentiles for their students.
1599995644517.png

Used to stratify students.

getfat is a "good" candidate for your residency program → Bottom of the class but checks the box
getfat is a "distinguished" candidate for your residency program → Top of the class and will be your best resident ever.
 
Wait, that’s a bad comment?
Myth. Didn’t have any of that. Doesn’t mean jack anyway.

Plain MSPE with solid board scores, with performances evaluated by multiple people being consistently above average against my peers IN RESIDENCY.

Residency is hard work, but my stress level compared to med school is back to minimal. I’m back to having time again to enjoy my life and actively read stuff pertaining to my interest.

Keys to success in residency:

1) Have a good attitude and don’t be a control freak as in caring only about the results and not gaf about the ways to skin a cat. Just chill and do good work. The only time that I was mildly stressed was when I had three pts on my census actively dying on me. Be calm bc you’re a doc and leader of your team.

2) Embrace the challenge of seeing a ton of pts. You learn a little more about a pathology with each pt

3) Learn to be adaptive and efficient. Goals are to pump out a new clinic pt note in 10-15 mins, inpatient admit note with all orders and med recs in 45-50 mins, and knock out all your progress notes 4-5 in the morning while you’re chart reviewing your pts before your pre-rounds.

Rinse and repeat, and try to read 8-10 pages of MKSAP per night.

Lastly, don’t bother being a gunner during your 4th yr doing these rough rotations in preparation for intern yr. lol. Enjoy your chill time off. I literally took the chillest rotations on the planet with min 3 day weekend on a weekly basis and am doing very well in residency.

Enjoy the process and breathe a little bit guys.
The poster asked for an example of coded language. I gave him an example of what that means. It's personally on my MSPE. No one said it had anything to do with performance in residency or whatever that tangent was about.
 
The poster asked for an example of coded language. I gave him an example of what that means. It's personally on my MSPE. No one said it had anything to do with performance in residency or whatever that tangent was about.

Cool. Diff schools do diff things then.
 
MSPE letter was, in my experience, more of a means of checking the right boxes to show you're okay to graduate. Like, sure if your comments are amazing that will help. But they're mostly generic. I mean, for crying out loud, the Dean's statement is basically copy pasted in there.

"(Sardonix) was a (student) at my (university). They did (things) and (existed) here for (4) (years). Here are some things (he) wrote about (herself) in fancy language and would like you to (probably) know about:
- Most sandwiches eaten as an M2
- Leader of Underwater Curnfurggling Club
- Secretary of Lard Lovers Club

Its board scores were:
- Adequate

It's rotation comments include:
FM = "It's FM he didn't kill nobody congrats on the new PCP foot soldier, 5/5"
IM = "3/5 pass"
Neuro = 3/5 pass"
Ortho = "Really interested in Lard, 3/5 pass"
Surgery = "Amazing guy, loved yelling at him, deserves honors but I pathologically can't do that 3.000000000001/5 pass"
OB = "Just get him out of here 3/5 pass"
Psych = "Would love to have him as a patient, 3/5 pass"
Away Rotation = "Who? 3/5 pass"
Away Rotation 2 = "Curnfurggling? 3/5 pass"

As (Dean) I have (no) concerns regarding (its) (conduct) and (her) (academic performance) and/or (his) (undisclosed incident at the restaurant involving the Treasury Agency and industrial amounts of lard).

Thank you,
(Dean Deany of Deany Deans)
I just can’t believe you took the time to write that. What’s more, I TOOK THE TIME TO READ IT! Haha
 
There's only so many different ways we can write evals, and yes, every Attending is different in how they handle it. Some will give straight averages, some will get straight honors. A lot will write just a few choice words, etc. Which sometimes makes the whole thing aggravating for medical students.

Personally, I will try writing nice things that will hopefully end up on your letter. I don't take too many students, so I try to get to know you guys personally. Even when I was a resident filling these out for the attending, if we got along (I didn't have to adore you), I would try to make sure you stood out a little from the pack.

The flip side is, and I only did this ONCE. And I know a surgical resident that did this ONCE to a medical student. Both deserved it, we took the time to absolutely trash someone in their comments. They were stupid and furthermore lazy. Failing them would've been too much work to talk to the dean, etc. But our respective attendings agreed 110% with our assessments and paragraph long trash-talk and signed off on them. So not ALL MSPEs are the same 🙂

I remember one of my sub-i electives didn't write flattering things about me on the eval. Not horrible, just "needs to read up on this more," kind of thing. But I got an email from my school about it. I later matched into that residency. A year or two later he took me aside. He remembered what he wrote. Said actually the nicest thing, "I didn't think much of you when you were a student. As a resident I think you are phenomenal."
 
I just can’t believe you took the time to write that. What’s more, I TOOK THE TIME TO READ IT! Haha

As a future physician, you need to be using your time more wisely. What would Dean Deany say? I hope this has been a valuable lesson for you.

Sincerely,
World's Most Easily Distracted Intern
 
my eval from the surgeon i was with was not even a complete sentence and made no since. It was just like a list of descriptors. At least they were all good. lol
"Was punctual and professional. Passed flatus POD 1. Always well-read for cases. Will pull NG tube. Recommend for surgery. End dictation"
 
my eval from the surgeon i was with was not even a complete sentence and made no since. It was just like a list of descriptors. At least they were all good. lol
Mine literally had the wrong name on it and described things that I never once did. But it was overall positive so I'll take it haha my school just removed the incorrect name and kept it
 
There's only so many different ways we can write evals, and yes, every Attending is different in how they handle it. Some will give straight averages, some will get straight honors. A lot will write just a few choice words, etc. Which sometimes makes the whole thing aggravating for medical students.

Personally, I will try writing nice things that will hopefully end up on your letter. I don't take too many students, so I try to get to know you guys personally. Even when I was a resident filling these out for the attending, if we got along (I didn't have to adore you), I would try to make sure you stood out a little from the pack.

The flip side is, and I only did this ONCE. And I know a surgical resident that did this ONCE to a medical student. Both deserved it, we took the time to absolutely trash someone in their comments. They were stupid and furthermore lazy. Failing them would've been too much work to talk to the dean, etc. But our respective attendings agreed 110% with our assessments and paragraph long trash-talk and signed off on them. So not ALL MSPEs are the same 🙂

I remember one of my sub-i electives didn't write flattering things about me on the eval. Not horrible, just "needs to read up on this more," kind of thing. But I got an email from my school about it. I later matched into that residency. A year or two later he took me aside. He remembered what he wrote. Said actually the nicest thing, "I didn't think much of you when you were a student. As a resident I think you are phenomenal."
good to know, thank you! I know that I've gotten comments like "should read more/expand on knowledge" but I thought as medical students, we are being judged more on our work ethic, professionalism, and general "being a great person to work with," so would this be a 'negative' commentary that wouldnt be the worst negative? ie: "needs to develop more knowledge" vs "is unprofessional and arrives late always"
 
my eval from the surgeon i was with was not even a complete sentence and made no since. It was just like a list of descriptors. At least they were all good. lol
same lol, so many of mine weren't complete sentences and you could tell were copy/paste of a bunch of fancy adjectives
 
good to know, thank you! I know that I've gotten comments like "should read more/expand on knowledge" but I thought as medical students, we are being judged more on our work ethic, professionalism, and general "being a great person to work with," so would this be a 'negative' commentary that wouldnt be the worst negative? ie: "needs to develop more knowledge" vs "is unprofessional and arrives late always"

Whoever puts your letter together will most likely keep those comments off hopefully. A lot of it will depend on context. If they trash your eval and write that, then yes it's a negative. If they write a flowery comment praising you and says it in a way of, "continue to study!" then you're okay.

But yeah.. when the attending starts putting down, "lazy," "always late," "can't be bothered to teach this person anymore." Those are bad.
 
My program told me they looked at it mostly to see the off-service evals. They know that students will put a ton of effort into their own field of interest, but if they do it on a bunch of core rotations and have great evals, then that is probably someone who works hard at everything. Still not sure how much weight it really had, but just don't have glaring negatives. Standing out in a bad way is way worse than just blending in with the pack on MPSE stuff.
 
So we just got to preview our MSPEs, and mine says at the end from the dean in coded language only “I recommend...” and my heart sunk. From talking with classmates, people either got “Recommend” or “highly recommend”, no other variations. I can’t figure out where the line is or how they decided that either. Regardless, I feel very worried this will hurt me a lot. Am I right?
 
So we just got to preview our MSPEs, and mine says at the end from the dean in coded language only “I recommend...” and my heart sunk. From talking with classmates, people either got “Recommend” or “highly recommend”, no other variations. I can’t figure out where the line is or how they decided that either. Regardless, I feel very worried this will hurt me a lot. Am I right?
This seems a bit neurotic...take a deep breath I’m sure you’re fine
 
Is it worthwhile to view your MSPE? Debating if I should make a 3 hour drive to see it.
 
So we just got to preview our MSPEs, and mine says at the end from the dean in coded language only “I recommend...” and my heart sunk. From talking with classmates, people either got “Recommend” or “highly recommend”, no other variations. I can’t figure out where the line is or how they decided that either. Regardless, I feel very worried this will hurt me a lot. Am I right?
Mine said the same so I probably wouldn’t worry that much. I’m more mad about my peds eval because my core hospital consistently gives everyone the bare minimum to pass.
 
Is it worthwhile to view your MSPE? Debating if I should make a 3 hour drive to see it.

100% yes. Several classmates of mine noticed errors. Whether it was spelling or grades (Pass, Honor, High Pass).

Personally, I had a discrepancy that determined my ranking in the class.

3 hour drive may suck but at least you'll be confident in your document.
 
Unfortunately, I think this is especially true for DO schools. A lot of my evals were very short and generic. They would say something like "great student" and not elaborate.
This drives PDs crazy and is one more thing that drives anti-DO bias. My school had to start a program to enlighten preceptors to write specific and useful comments.

This thing seems to be especially a problem with newer DO schools.
 
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