NEED HELP!!! 4.0 amazing EC 21M on first mcat pending 2nd

[kberes]

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alright so I have always been a terrible test taker...I am going as far as getting tested for a testing problem....
I have a 4.0
Leader in 3 organizations (strongest being, I am in charge of scholarship for the fraternities on campus, 1200 people)
I am have been tutoring at least 15 people a semester
I have worked at the hospital when I am home as a phlebotomist(60-70 hr per week when home) since my senior year of high school.
I have shadowed doctors since 9th grade, easily 1000+ hours
I am doing research on orthopedic hardware, as well as doing research with the human DNA project...

one problem
got a 21 M on my first mcat...8...7...6...m
terrible i know....
studied again all summer and tried again yesterday...i know i did better, but it is anyones game to how much better...adverage 12s on both sciences before and a weak 5-10 for verbal...it was all over...

two questions....

first...i would be safe to say i would be disappointed with at least 9s in both sciences. So worst case I get 9 7 9...would i stand any chance?!?

second...should I submit secondaries now or should I wait for my score to come back?!?

 

[Piston95]

I think with a 9 7 9 and that gleaming 4.0, you would def get some interviews. I am in a similar predicament, I didnt have a 4.0, but a 3.78, but got a 26R on my 1st mcat. I think i may have a shot at some interviews, but Im retaking anyways. But, with ur great grades, ECs, I think u should be ok for some interviews with a 25 mcat. Although, I'm a little more optimistic than most on this forum, and I also really hate all the numbers games you have to play. Most others who post will prolly diminish your chances because of your mcat, but I'm one of those who likes to hold out hope that medical schools look beyond a few questions on a standardized test to determine how good of a doctor youll be.

Best of luck, and be proud of your accomplishments.

 

[StIGMA]

What schools are you applying to?

In georgia, a 24-26 has a great shot at mercer (allopathic). A 27 has a great shot at the state school MCG (allopathic).

Other places like california I hear you need a 32+ to get into the state schools.

It really depends on where you are applying. Look into DO (osteopathic) schools if your MCAT is not high, because you are a great candidate otherwise.

 

[kberes]

thanks for the replies, it really means a lot!
I am not worried about the interview, all I want is that interview!

question 2 still hasn't been answered...should i submit my secondaries now or wait till I get my scores back?

 

[ChubbyChaser]

Im suprised it hasnt been mentioned, but consider DO if you can get the MCAT up to 24....Talking to a few deans of admissions an MCAT score that low will definitely, whether true or not, call into question the validity of your GPA, IE major grade inflation.....Pretty much anything lower than a 9 in a section can throw up a red flag for allo schools.

 

[ChubbyChaser]

as far as submitting secondaries...I say submit to your state schools and DO schools...hold onto those reach schools until you get your score back.

 

[Piston95]

Im suprised it hasnt been mentioned, but consider DO if you can get the MCAT up to 24....Talking to a few deans of admissions an MCAT score that low will definitely, whether true or not, call into question the validity of your GPA, IE major grade inflation.....Pretty much anything lower than a 9 in a section can throw up a red flag for allo schools.

I simply dont understand logic like this, but many on these boards seem to subscribe to it. How can you say that one bad score on one test can wipe away or "raise red flags" against an amazing accomplishment that took 4 years of incredibly hard work to achieve? Yet, if someone with a 3.0 gets a 35 on the mcat, we all say that this one test score shows that he or she has the potential to succeed; and not that the 3.0 should "raise a red flag" about his or her mcat score. Ive seen it on these boards so many times. Its unbelievable to me how we can use that logic for someone who got a good mcat score and a poor gpa, but cant use it for someone in the opposite situation. Why cant we say that the 4.0 shows that this person has the potential to succeed, instead of saying that one bad score calls into question such a great accomplishment?

 

[MilkmanAl]

I disagree. I had a 3.12/35, and I got 1 interview out of 28 applications. Both high MCAT/poor GPA and the reverse are very bad for your application. In my opinion, the only reason the high MCAT/low GPA crowd are cut a bit of slack is that they've demonstrated that they do know the material presented in the med school pre-reqs. However, my situation raises a whole new set of red flags. Am I lazy? Am I unable to perform in rigorous, structured environments over a long period of time?

Low MCAT scores, on the other hand, show inability to perform under pressure, poor critical analysis skills, and poor functional grasp of the material. I don't necessarily agree with attaching those labels to people with low MCAT scores, but how else are you going to sort through a stack of 10000 applications? There have to be criteria in place to screen people out by.

As for this:

How can you say that one bad score on one test can wipe away or "raise red flags" against an amazing accomplishment that took 4 years of incredibly hard work to achieve?

Nobody is saying the MCAT score wipes away the 4.0. However, getting into med school is about presenting a complete package. Your GPA, MCAT, LOR's, essays, and EC's all need to be great for you to be a competitive candidate. If any of them is lacking, you're going to take a huge hit since there are thousands of people who do have everything in place waiting to take your spot. In the OP's case, his MCAT score is far below salavageable level at MD schools. A 21 is what? 5 standard deviations below the matriculant average? I mean, that's a huge obstacle to overcome.

 

[kiganga]

my two cents:

look admins sift out people, whittling by all means. low mcat is just another chance to do that. if ones score is low and the ecs are strong then look to the osteopathic school.

 

[Piston95]

Look, I didn't mean to snap at anyone, I guess I'm just sick of the numbers game. But, it is what it is I guess. Congrats on your amazing scores kinga and Milkman.

 

[MilkmanAl]

Well, thanks, but I wasn't trying to brag. Quite the opposite, actually. I just wanted to give you a living, breathing example of why doing well on the MCAT alone isn't enough to make a competitive candidate. Anyway, good luck to you. Longshots get accepted all the time. Believe me. 😉

 

[Tired]

I simply dont understand logic like this, but many on these boards seem to subscribe to it. How can you say that one bad score on one test can wipe away or "raise red flags" against an amazing accomplishment that took 4 years of incredibly hard work to achieve? Yet, if someone with a 3.0 gets a 35 on the mcat, we all say that this one test score shows that he or she has the potential to succeed; and not that the 3.0 should "raise a red flag" about his or her mcat score. Ive seen it on these boards so many times. Its unbelievable to me how we can use that logic for someone who got a good mcat score and a poor gpa, but cant use it for someone in the opposite situation. Why cant we say that the 4.0 shows that this person has the potential to succeed, instead of saying that one bad score calls into question such a great accomplishment?

Because a great MCAT score is a far bigger accomplishment than a high GPA.

 

[kberes]

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[135892]

putting us back on track...we are all saying the same thing, just different ways. we are i think can say the process we don't agree with, that's life


what i am asking is

so this is the process...I want to be an MD, nothing against DO(it is just like PA over NP..there really isnt one but there is a slight favoritism) THUS....

HOW DO I PROVE TO SCHOOLS its not me that is weak, its me with testing...I have always been in the top 5% both in and outside the classroom, but weak only on standard tests... tried everything to fix it, but some things you can't fix...you accept and move on...

how do i get that across?!?

Honestly, unless you drastically improved your mcat the second time around, I wouldn't be limiting myself just to MD programs. You can be just a good of a doctor with a DO, so I wouldn't look down upon it, especially with your mcat (everything else is great by the way). As far as the testing thing goes, if I were you, I really wouldn't try to get that message across to adcoms. Medicine involves a lot of standardized test, so if you can't succeed at them, why would an adcom want to let you in?

 

[hope316]

I hate how people talk about a 4.0 as if it is some universal standardized accomplishment.... it really isnt. Where did u go to undergrad? Is it a less competitive school? What was your major? Were you a science major or a humanities major?

For instance if you went to a less competitive school and were a humanities major I'm not very impressed with your 4.0... and yes, i know that we all have to take the same premed courses but theres a huge difference between someone taking orgo with 3 english classes and someone who is taking it with 4 or 5 other science/math classes.

So that's why an abysmal MCAT score would call your gpa into question. not all gpas are made equal but all standardized test scores are.

i think it'll be important to accept reality as quickly as possible....if you end up with an MCAT score that is less than ~28 you should probably accept that you won't get into an MD school and move on

to answer your other question...hold off on the majority of secondaries until you get your score back.

 

[kberes]

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[iduwanna]

thanks for making day hope...feel like i wasted past 9 years only to be ruined by 4.5 hours...

Start working on correcting your weakness. A 21 is a piss-poor score.

Don't pout about it and don't wait for people to tell you that you're a good aplicant because you're not.

You DID waste an application! Did you take any practice tests? You never should have taken the MCAT without consistently finishing practice tests with a much better score than 21.

So now what do you do? Either beg for a job at Raley's, work on developing competence on the MCAT, or something else...

 

[ButImLETired]

thanks for making day hope...feel like i wasted past 9 years only to be ruined by 4.5 hours...

Whoa stop being so touchy. The issue is not so much that people here are questioning the validity of your GPA, it's that THE MED SCHOOLS will. If you get interviews, be prepared to discuss it quite frankly, as some of the ADCOMS will wonder about how hard your undergrad was. Also, as someone mentioned, it is true that you will have a lot of standardized tests throughout your medical career- the MCAT is just the tip of the iceberg. If this is genuinely an issue for you, it is one that I would address as soon as possible- whether through therapy or anything else you might think of. It WILL be a problem. Med school is not like an Ivy League school, where the toughest part is getting in.

 

[iduwanna]

Med school is not like an Ivy League school, where the toughest part is getting in.

For most everyone it is.

 

[kberes]

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[ButImLETired]

For most everyone it is.

I have actually heard the very opposite from every single med student I know.

its just i have studied my ass off and i have a real problem...gone as far as getting diagnosed by a neuro-psyc....

i understand tests are ahead, one and 2 then your boards...those are a different class of standard tests

so yea i got piss poor results thanks for repeating that i was just wondering for help i dont need to hear that i am a ******* cuz i got that myself...i am looking for advice not critism

1) stop being so touchy.
2) There is little advice to give. Your options are
A-try to do better, get a 30ish, have a great shot at MD schools. Next year. This year seems to be a bust.
B- try to do better, get in the low-mid 20s, apply to DO schools, but you seem to be unwilling to do so.
C- try to do better, get in the low-mid 20s, apply to MD schools and pray like hell. And if this works out,
D- get an interview at an MD school, mention the fact that you cant do standardized tests, and get rejected because they'll assume you can't handle medical school standardized tests.

I don't mean ANY of this as criticism. It's advice. Do with it as you will. There is no magical way for you to turn that 21 into a good score.

 

[kberes]

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[kberes]

thanks for all the advice...just in a big down over it...i know you all mean good

 

[Piston95]

wow, it looks like this got a little bit out of hand, sorry if I was the cause of it.

But hey kberes, look at it this way. You have only ONE flaw in your entire application, everything else is pristine and ready to go. A lot of people would love to be in your situation. And also, your already looking to correct that one flaw. Like its been said already, you just need a better mcat score, I nor the other posters mean no criticism by it, were just saying what you need. Theres not much of another way around it. I'm in the same boat as you, and we just need a better score on that dang thing no matter how annoying and frustrating it might be.

As far as taking it a 3rd time..in my opinion, I don't think its that big of a deal. It shows persistence first of all, and secondly, you're a great applicant other than the mcat score, so why not just go for it.

 

[kberes]

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[Lukkie]

I really hope, OP, that you get a reality check and change your attitude before you start interviews. You've been given solid, realistic advice by just about everyone in this thread yet you lashed out of them for telling you to accept the truth.

 

[MilkmanAl]

so back off...and grow some character...thought people wanting to become a MD means you would go out of your way to help people, but here it is showing me we cant even help out each other? no wonder they say watch for all the backstabbing at med school...some people are heartless

So what did you want people to say? Do you want us to tell you your 4.0 makes you a stellar candidate and that you're a shoo-in at an MD program regardless of your MCAT score? That probably would've made you feel really good...right up until you figured out you got bum advice and wasted a year and several thousand dollars on hopeless applications. Get real. If you don't want frank, sound input, don't ask for it.

 

[iA-MD2013]

I smell fake.
9 + 7 +6 = 22... rather than worry about upping your MCAT, work on your addition.

Nice Floja